Topic: CanaryInTheMine is further abusing the trust system [Fixed] - page 4. (Read 4450 times)

Hmm interesting, I don't have any say in the matter, but I am curious. Why would you not just leave Dogie negative feedback if you didn't trust him, rather than excluding him from being trusted by others? Seems a little bit harsh. I don't know too much surrounding all of the parties involved with all of the hardware producing companies and the recent shenanigans, and I don't make judgements unless I'm involved or have a significant amount of information proving something, but just because you don't trust Dogie, is your reason strong enough that others shouldn't be able to make their own decisions and add Dogie to their trust lists?

Removed my positive rating of Dogie for the same reason.

Basically his use of these boards is merely to further his advertising sales. Inducing flame wars and bump spam in popular threads is part of that game.

Not really seen any overt abuse by CITM of the system he seems to discuss issues with others and resolves them when there are problems. Dogie has no real leg to stand on given his abuses of the trust system.

I do not trust you because of your misconduct with several manufacturers, therefore I added a tilde in front of your name.  That's the reason, I choose not to trust you.

I would agree if it mean excluding peoples trust for your account personally, but when you make exclusions as a highly ranked member you automatically make people untrusted by excluding them. It is way more destructive to a persons trust rating than leaving a negative trust rating. It is a tool of extortion, not a balancing force as currently deployed.

The major problem is that CITM is at depth 1, it gives him power above all else especially when he abuses the system for his own gain by selling seats to 50% of DefaultTrust. And in his persuance of that, no one else can stop him removing others from DefaultTrust. There could be 200 other depth 2s that add someone to their trust, but as long as CITM removes them, that's it.

Lets take a look at who is at depth 1:

The first category is comprised of staff
Theymos - We trust him implicitly as an admin
BadBear - We trust him implicitly as an admin
SaltySpitoon - Global moderator
Maged - Global moderator
HostFat - Staff
dserrano5 - Staff
OldScammerTag - Defunct but just how that 'feature' worked

The second includes escrows and account markers
Tomatocage - Marked 100s of false accounts and acts as an escrow
escrow.ms - Marked many false accounts and acts as an escrow
OgNasty - Acts as an escrow
DeaDTerra - Runs investment securities

Then some left over accounts
dooglus - Runs just-dice, marks many likely HYIPs [arguably conflict of interest]
philipma1957 - Bought and sold some hardware


And finally we have CanaryInTheMine, someone who bought and sold some hardware, and then aggressively abused the hell out of the trust system. That doesn't make any sense.

TL;DR: I was excluded, so this feature should be removed.

It ia really helpful. I could exclude CanaryInTheMine and other, who are trusted by persons I trust, who misuses trust system.


He isn't ready to invest some time on pruning his trust list though it is mist for him if he wants to be in DefaultTrust trust list.

I warned people about this when Theymos introduced this feature. I had the privilege of being the very first user to be paid retribution by Theymos personally for leaving a trust rating he didn't agree with and refusing to remove it. Trust exclusions (~) are a way for the highest ranking users in the trust system to have a back door quiet form of retribution to users that is more destructive than a negative trust rating.

 Not only does the individual user not trust the excluded user, but anyone who trusts that user will also exclude them from their trust by default, always siding with the highest ranking member. So in effect they are destroying already earned trust ratings just by excluding them, not leaving a single rating where they have to explain themselves. Since the exclusion cascades down the trust list, you could have 3 other people trusting you on the 2nd level default trust.  Then if Theymos, or Canaryinthemine, or one of the highest ranking trust profiles excludes you, anyone who trusts the excluded user and also the default trust would no longer see the excluded user as being trusted. It is just a force multiplier for abuse, and this is just one of the first few cases of it. This system allows for honest traders to have their hard earned reputations extorted by people participating in popularity contests, mobs, account farming, and just plain old nepotism.

Canaryinthemine is clearly negligent in maintaining his trust list at the very best if not purposely exploiting it for personal gain and to protect his buddies.

I have tried to, he does not respond. I gave him some time to do so before posting here.

I think every users should create his trust list and add only the people who trust. I have heard that trust list isn't moderated, isn't it? However I think dogie is an helpful user and I want to tell you "thanks" for your numerous fantastic threads.

Understood what you meant. People who uses default trust list won't see your feedback as trusted but if they add any person who trusts you, then they can see your feedback as trusted.

CanaryInTheMine's exclude list:

Actually, you should talk to him. He may not have seen your feedback as relevant and excluded you. In overall, I agree with you! He is misusing his power.

Which CITM is now also abusing *sigh*

I PMed him twice to prune his trust list and gave the links to the discussion. He replied and IIRC, removed 1 user. I also recently PMed him(+few others) to tell about FC and others replied but he didn't. When I did the same to philipma1957, he pruned the list in some minutes after reviewing his trust list anf kept us updated in the thread. CanaryInTheMine told he is doing this to catch scammers fast because he has a HUGE list of people and they are efficient in catching.

Gladly, theymos added a 'tidle' option to trust list and it is really useful.

It is insane, I'm going to post it in full just to demonstrate how silly it is. It is one solution but in the previous thread he was asked to do so and and ignored it. It would remove his own trust at the same time.


Yeah. That was font size 6.

That is a huge trust list...mine is 13 total (counting default and old scammer tag). I think it would probably be wise for him to look through the list and trim it down.

For someone with such a high position to appoint default trust, Canary does need to be removed for 1) not understanding how trust system works, or 2) understands it but deliberately misuse it. The latter is more true.

I've excluded him (and Maidak) from my trust list, not because I have beef against him, but simply because I don't want his massive trust list affecting mine. You can't add everyone and their mom to your trust list, otherwise all these newb's power are mis-appointed.

I suggest anyone who wants to complain about this also add a "~" to his account name. There are a handful of people that have already done this.

You mean the people committing illegal acts and telling me to kill myself? That openly operate using shill accounts and refuse to reveal their main accounts? I am also NOT at trust level 1, nor do I have 180+ people in my trust list simply because they gave me positive trust.

Does this post sound like that of someone trying to protect the interests of AM?


I have had a few deals with Canary, and he has been nothing but upstanding and honest. I have nothing to gain from this.

Interesting...



How many people have you left negative trust for that you've never carried out actual deals with, but rather do not like the way they conduct themselves on this forum?

Also, Canary has openly criticized AM with these recent developments, and has been openly sharing information regarding the development of the BE300 (specifically lack thereof), as well as the management.

What is more concerning is the fact that so many people have left positive trust for FC that are on CITM's trust list that as of now 3 people in the default trust network have now left FC negative trust but FC's trust score is still +150, which is the highest. I ran some tests, and even with 5 negative trust ratings, CITM would still have +150 trust.

I checked a while ago and I think it was everyone that gave positive trust to FC was on CITM's trust list except for maybe one or two, and maybe one or two additional people are both on CITM's list and someone else's list.

As a result CITM was able to make FC and in turn ASICminer much more trustworthy then he really was.

Additionally almost (but maybe all of them) all of the instances where someone in the default trust network turned scammer, or was purchased by a scammer were account's that were on CITM's trust list.

CanaryInTheMine has previously come under fire for misusing his level 1 DefaultTrust position by adding users into his trust list in return for leaving him positive trust. This further increased Canary's own trust score and power, as well as the addition of many accounts added inappropriately to DefaultTrust. This included newbies, those abusing their level 2 trust and others running questionable operations. He has refused to chance his practises and is further now abusing that self given power at the detriment of the forums. When you put some numbers on the trust network, its pretty shocking case of abuse and centralisation of influence.

There are currently 417 accounts in DefaultTrust lists, of which 211 (53%) are from Canary.
181 (100%) of people who left Canary 'trusted' trust are in DefaultTrust because Canary added them to it (+ some overlapers).

What is more, he has started abusing his inappropriately self appointed power. He has ~trusted several accounts, including me, aggressively in order to inappropriately shield his own interests. CITM is heavily involved with ASICMiner.

AirWolf - because he put a bounty on information regarding ASICMiner (to regain his investment)
Silverspoon - because he was critical of ASICMiner
SpanishSoldier - because he was critical of ASICMiner
NotLambchop - because he was critical of ASICMiner (although he is a bit hash)

And... me. CITM has refused to respond as to why he has ~'ed me and does not respond to PMs. Its one thing to buff his own ratings, but he is now directly inhibiting the very reason for default trust's existence for his own personal gain. There are currently 10 phising accounts, scam accounts or PM spammers that I am the only trust rating for, which are now unmarked.


Canary should either be forced to alter his negative practises or face removal from DefaultTrust.

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Edit:
Canary has repeatedly dodged explaining why he has removed me from DefaultTrust, and refuses to be accountable for his actions. He has since left a negative trust rating for creating this thread and highlighting his abuse of the DefaultTrust system. These are the actions of a desperate man, not one fit to be in DefaultTrust.

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Edit2:
Canary has now been removed.