cash remains the only option if there's an emergency - page 9.

Betwrong

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Quote from: Nobitcoin on October 16, 2015, 12:01:16 PM

Wait if there was a flood wouldn't cash in the form of notes be useless and most shops these days only accept a certain amount of small change. In a situation like that maybe silver coins or gold coins would be a valid form of repayment guarantee.

Nah, notes are not damaged by water, you can trade underwater with them. And silver coins or gold coins may sink much faster than paper so notes are still good. )

Nobitcoin

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Wait if there was a flood wouldn't cash in the form of notes be useless and most shops these days only accept a certain amount of small change. In a situation like that maybe silver coins or gold coins would be a valid form of repayment guarantee.

maokoto

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Quote from: countryfree on October 15, 2015, 10:24:54 AM

I have a friend in Cannes, France. You may not know anything about it, but there were terrible floods there 10 days ago.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34443189

My friend told me her landline phone still doesn't work. There are no phones and no Internet in most of downtown Cannes. Electricity has been fixed quite rapidly, but for 2 days, the mobile phone networks were down, so no bitcoin, and no credit cards either! All the shops couldn't handle any transactions.

The only thing which kept on working was the fiber optic network, I guess because that's the newest.

The whole thing was very local. Everything was fine a few km North, but this shall reminds us that if there's a serious emergency, cash is the only safe option.

Good reflection. I think you are pretty much right. Although cash may also become useless in a greater emergency, it is still a step ahead of Bitcoin.

But I think that Bitcoin might become more "physical" if it goes really to mainstream adoption, and people would begin to accept it (paper wallets, physical bitcoins etc).

aakashsangwan

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what you are telling is half correct and half wrong, everything is according to the situation. most of the places if you have got stuck then you wont be able to use cash also. the situation what you have mentioned is their even cash also wont be helpfull as everything is drown in water, only mutual help will be available.

Q7

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If the condition is so bad, cash won't safe you either or even offer safe passage in this desperate situation. It's your inner survival and bartering skills that will get your through. But at least once you managed to crossover to safer location, you bitcoin will still be there regardless of which region or country you are right now.

QUEDOS

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Quote from: countryfree on October 15, 2015, 10:24:54 AM

I have a friend in Cannes, France. You may not know anything about it, but there were terrible floods there 10 days ago.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34443189

My friend told me her landline phone still doesn't work. There are no phones and no Internet in most of downtown Cannes. Electricity has been fixed quite rapidly, but for 2 days, the mobile phone networks were down, so no bitcoin, and no credit cards either! All the shops couldn't handle any transactions.

The only thing which kept on working was the fiber optic network, I guess because that's the newest.

The whole thing was very local. Everything was fine a few km North, but this shall reminds us that if there's a serious emergency, cash is the only safe option.

I'm sure there remained numerous forms of transport out of the downtown area, which your friend could easily have used to get to an area that wasn't effected by the floods... In which case, cash, bitcoin, gold could all still have been used quite easily

Kakmakr

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In most of the disaster areas I have been before, the first thing people are worried about, would be clean drinking water and food and getting the families together. So the emergency services give aid in that regard for the first few days.

Mobile telecommunication stations are moved into the area to provide for people to phone their relatives.

Most of the cellphone towers are situated on the highest possible areas, and will not be affected anyways. It's only the power that might be the problem, but emergency services provide access to power, if you want to charge your cellphone.

Bitcoin is not the ultimate solution, and you can always have some fiat currency stashed with your Bug out bag, if you want to trade for those few days, until the most basic services are restored.

This is not such a big deal, when everything is destroyed around you. You can trade with any item, if it comes down to that. < A watch or a ring or shoes > ^hmf^

AGD

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Quote from: deon on October 16, 2015, 12:35:48 AM

Remember the Boy Scout motto "Be Prepared"? I believe in diversification. Yes, It is good to have some cash ready. But what about a run on banks? If you come walking out of the bank with your cash, there could be robbers or cops (civil forfeiture) following you home and ready to take your cash.

Thats where the Glock comes back into the story.

QuestionAuthority

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Quote from: gentlemand on October 15, 2015, 12:03:22 PM

My tight buns are all the currency I need when the world ends.

Everything other than that needed to defend or sustain life is an abstract irrelevance in a full on collapse. All those gold stackers will get just as much of rude awakening as the space cadets trying to trade their paper wallet for some antibiotics after their cock's gone green.

That's no joke. A tight ass and a closet full of antibiotics are all the money you'll need in a major catastrophe. I'm waiting for the big pandemic to come from Asia or Africa that can't be stopped. Something like a new and improved airborn Ebola or H1N1 with rapid onset and death. When martial law happens and the looting starts, I'm not taking food. I'm going straight to the antibiotic section of the closest pharmacy and wiping them out. I'll work out the exchange rate later. Maybe one 500mg keflex for a case of corn and an hour with your wife. lol

teddy5145

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Quote from: deon on October 16, 2015, 12:35:48 AM

Remember the Boy Scout motto "Be Prepared"? I believe in diversification. Yes, It is good to have some cash ready. But what about a run on banks? If you come walking out of the bank with your cash, there could be robbers or cops (civil forfeiture) following you home and ready to take your cash.

Well maybe you could put the money inside your wallet before walking out of the bank so the robbers won't see how much money you had Tongue

And im pretty sure that nobody is this insane to following you all day
I could be wrong though Roll Eyes

deon

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Remember the Boy Scout motto "Be Prepared"? I believe in diversification. Yes, It is good to have some cash ready. But what about a run on banks? If you come walking out of the bank with your cash, there could be robbers or cops (civil forfeiture) following you home and ready to take your cash.

zencomp

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it all depends on what type of emergency you are facing, the example you gave is even the cash wont be usefull because full places are drown by water then where will you go and shop with cash when everything is in water. so everthing depends on situations.

OROBTC

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...

I think it very much depends on the particular disaster scenario...

-- If traveling, like the Cannes example by OP, then local cash (or $ in the Deveoping World) is indeed likely to be king. Some tiny gold coins maybe, gold may help you get back home... BTC may be OK if the Web and electricity are working (the value of the imperfect blockchain.info wallet and/or a hardware wallet). Your Glock will be of less value in Europe, you may wind up in jail!

-- If at home, I would have a variety of options. Gold/silver. Gun(s) & ammo. CA$H. Beans, lighters, batteries. Water purification devices.

-- Location of your emergency matters! Weather and how many other people are around.

It all depends! That's why "Diversification" is my middle name!

countryfree

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Quote from: LFC_Bitcoin on October 15, 2015, 10:30:34 AM

If there is a real emergency or some sort of epidemic then even cash is useless. I'd be moving with my Glock, that'd be the only way to survive

A gun? What would you do with a gun? You'll go to to a food store and kill the shopkeeper to get his supplies? If there's only one piece of bread left, and there are 9 other people hungry, will you kill all the 9 of them?

At a time, there were several streets with water at knee-level, you don't think about using a gun in that situation.
Besides, in western Europe, very few people own guns.

gentlemand

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Well I take into account possibly for countryside where an emp wouldn't change as much as they're prepared for, think farmers they have wells full of water as do much of the people living there, they have plenty of crops and livestock. They probably would be willing to trade 20 ears of corn for an ounce of gold.

The amish I assume would prosper lol.

Much depends on the time frame and whether it looked like a permanent downfall, but the countryside would quickly be overrun by city dwellers with zero resources looking for juicy farmers. How long would stocks in a city last under the circumstances? Society's only 3-4 skipped meals away from anarchy. If it was a hiccup and the unfried world was on its way to help out I guess it wouldn't be so desperate. It's easy to underestimate how quickly people turn feral when there's a whiff of desperation.

chennan

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Quote from: pereira4 on October 15, 2015, 10:30:42 AM

Quote from: countryfree on October 15, 2015, 10:24:54 AM

I have a friend in Cannes, France. You may not know anything about it, but there were terrible floods there 10 days ago.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34443189

My friend told me her landline phone still doesn't work. There are no phones and no Internet in most of downtown Cannes. Electricity has been fixed quite rapidly, but for 2 days, the mobile phone networks were down, so no bitcoin, and no credit cards either! All the shops couldn't handle any transactions.

The only thing which kept on working was the fiber optic network, I guess because that's the newest.

The whole thing was very local. Everything was fine a few km North, but this shall reminds us that if there's a serious emergency, cash is the only safe option.

Well, I wonder how situations like this would be deal with in the future once the governments finally get rid of physical cash and only issue "electronic" closed source money, so to speak. What will happen then? I wish there was a way to have "physical bitcoins" as an emergency temporal fix like that but it seems pointless.

Well, there are "physical bitcoins" now.. but they aren't really meant to be for spending and trading, just more like a collectors item.

gentlemand

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Quote from: ?? on ??

So an EMP attack? If such thing were to happen I think cash would be the least of the worries since most is digital anyways (bank accounts and what not) and especially few carry cash I think food, water, ammunition and only possibly bullion would be the new monetary trade.

I think anything that wasn't directly involved in keeping you alive would become a total irrelevance. If I had a big bag full of surplus fresh meat and veg and one guy is offering a gold bar and the other guy a pile of lighters, candles and ammunition, gold boy is getting told where to stick it. I'd have to find some other mug willing to play along with the fantasy that it would actually be of use to them.

Corealz

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Yes cash is the easiest way to buy stuff. If shtf then food and wanter would also be valuable.

Cereberus

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Quote from: LiteCoinGuy on October 15, 2015, 11:59:22 AM

good old cash.

Those are some stacks of cash those kids are playing around with Cheesy

In other words: Cash is king! Grin

neurotypical

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: avatar_kiyoshi on October 15, 2015, 01:06:38 PM

Bitcoin wallet for android app is will solve this case https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/offline-transactions-and-bluetooth-278237

Mobile networks were down if you read the OP, now what could solve this could be funded suisses bitcoin notes, I have read that these have been used previously but without the ability to check even the public key it seems very difficult to make transactions or change.

The only thing I see is emergency windup radios, there is a group out of Finland dealing bitcoin over radio and the second is solar and hand crank mobile chargers and doing offline transactions between mobile phones which are charged via non grid methods.

A meshnet could also possibly work if it somehow was able to connect far enough to have someone who also was able to connect to the internet and broadcast the transaction.

Bitcoin notes thing seem cool. Just have a public master key in QR format so you can give it to people and this key will generate a new different key each time someone pays you (so you don't have to carry around 1 note per different address). Even tho I don't understand how the actual transaction would be done.. it's of tricky. You can't confirm anything without electricity.

About meshnet etc.. what if everything (every electronic device) was damaged?

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