CoinLenders Script :: Bitcoin Bank (Borrow+Deposit) Software :: Demo Available - page 22.

btcplayer

newbie

Activity: 20

Merit: 0

I totally agree with you!
We don't know how much he lose in lending service, but even very big, he seem have good opportunity to make big money, he took the hacking as an opportunity to cover CL loss with this settlement. This is very very unfair!

Quote from: CryptoUser01 on November 19, 2013, 03:31:11 PM

This whole thing stinks to me. He's prioritizing higher deposits because that is the liability. The issue is that there may be a lot of small deposits with a large sum of BTC. He's ignoring all of that.

I've e-mailed and heard nothing back.

I'm considering that we start contacting legal authorities on this.

I do believe TF was hacked. I get that. What I don't get is the handling. This hack seems like an excuse to rob everyone and not communicate, etc. It's grossly unfair.

I'm thinking for those in the U.S. we follow this advice:

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_4522.html

I intend to start that tonight.

Based on this USD fiat conversion, I would get back about 18% of BTC I put in. The value of BTC is much higher now, I don't want USD back obviously. The question is where did the other 82% go?

If the 4100 coins stolen where 82% of the funds that means that 5000 coins where on deposit.

According to the thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=328053.0;topicseen more than 6000 coins where deposited.

Even if I assume that all of the loans won't be paid back (which is, I imagine, typical of a lending service) the numbers do not add up. We are all taking a huge loss and there is no explanation of where that loss goes. The BTC didn't just disappear, someone has it. The hacker has some, the borrowers have some, and TF has some. How is it that the borrowers take the cut and TF walks away with 1000's of BTC worth several 100 thousand. I'm not buying it.

CryptoUser01

baracuda

newbie

Activity: 43

Merit: 0

Emailed [email protected] and received an offer...

Quote

Generated for email [cl email] with current balance 2.12854819
Deposit   Time   ~BTCUSD   USD amount
0.07498883 BTC   2013-05-12 23:51:47   $114.02   $8.55
1.01000000 BTC   2013-05-13 04:52:48   $114.51   $115.66
0.82939547 BTC   2013-05-13 11:34:00   $115.17   $95.52
Total Deposits in USD: $219.73
Withdrawal   Time   ~BTCUSD   USD amount
Total Withdrawals in USD: $0.00
Balance remaining in USD: $219.73

Offer was higher of current mtgox or $750. Since mtgox was around $540...

Received $219.73 @ $750 = 0.29297 BTC

https://blockchain.info/tx/fdc768d95699dcf2a416ffa4f66351e815bb1b8caae7cf62feb96ffa71a2fd10

I'm obviously upset that I lost ~1.7 bitcoins. But, glad to have something.

If you consider the peak of $900, he got hacked for $3,600,000... Sad

Guess my share of the losses is less than $1,000...

Thanks for what you could do TradeFortress.

skitchen

member

Activity: 71

Merit: 10

Quote from: tantanbit on November 19, 2013, 08:46:51 PM

if there is more than 6000 coins deposited, then he could earn more than 1000B by making this mistake，

So, make that 5100BTC Grin

mrtchipr

newbie

Activity: 58

Merit: 0

Has anyone from US start talking to a lawyer?

Please PM me.

tantanbit

newbie

Activity: 56

Merit: 0

Quote from: gog1 on November 19, 2013, 07:25:16 PM

being cynical: people with large deposit potentially have a lot in fiat too, may have the connection or means go after him legally. For small depositors, they have no means of making the claim and it's such a complex case from a legal perspective.

Quote from: CryptoUser01 on November 19, 2013, 03:31:11 PM

This whole thing stinks to me. He's prioritizing higher deposits because that is the liability. The issue is that there may be a lot of small deposits with a large sum of BTC. He's ignoring all of that.

I've e-mailed and heard nothing back.

I'm considering that we start contacting legal authorities on this.

I do believe TF was hacked. I get that. What I don't get is the handling. This hack seems like an excuse to rob everyone and not communicate, etc. It's grossly unfair.

I'm thinking for those in the U.S. we follow this advice:

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_4522.html

I intend to start that tonight.

Based on this USD fiat conversion, I would get back about 18% of BTC I put in. The value of BTC is much higher now, I don't want USD back obviously. The question is where did the other 82% go?

If the 4100 coins stolen where 82% of the funds that means that 5000 coins where on deposit.

According to the thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=328053.0;topicseen more than 6000 coins where deposited.

Even if I assume that all of the loans won't be paid back (which is, I imagine, typical of a lending service) the numbers do not add up. We are all taking a huge loss and there is no explanation of where that loss goes. The BTC didn't just disappear, someone has it. The hacker has some, the borrowers have some, and TF has some. How is it that the borrowers take the cut and TF walks away with 1000's of BTC worth several 100 thousand. I'm not buying it.

CryptoUser01

if there is more than 6000 coins deposited, then he could earn more than 1000B by making this mistake，

tantanbit

newbie

Activity: 56

Merit: 0

he loan btc and pay back USD. the btc is 7 times higher now ,so if 4100 b is less than 6/7 of all the loan, he could even earn money with this accident which is his mistake. malevolence . i say he should give back all the btc ,if not put him into the jail

gog1

hero member

Activity: 756

Merit: 500

being cynical: people with large deposit potentially have a lot in fiat too, may have the connection or means go after him legally. For small depositors, they have no means of making the claim and it's such a complex case from a legal perspective.

Quote from: CryptoUser01 on November 19, 2013, 03:31:11 PM

This whole thing stinks to me. He's prioritizing higher deposits because that is the liability. The issue is that there may be a lot of small deposits with a large sum of BTC. He's ignoring all of that.

I've e-mailed and heard nothing back.

I'm considering that we start contacting legal authorities on this.

I do believe TF was hacked. I get that. What I don't get is the handling. This hack seems like an excuse to rob everyone and not communicate, etc. It's grossly unfair.

I'm thinking for those in the U.S. we follow this advice:

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_4522.html

I intend to start that tonight.

Based on this USD fiat conversion, I would get back about 18% of BTC I put in. The value of BTC is much higher now, I don't want USD back obviously. The question is where did the other 82% go?

If the 4100 coins stolen where 82% of the funds that means that 5000 coins where on deposit.

According to the thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=328053.0;topicseen more than 6000 coins where deposited.

Even if I assume that all of the loans won't be paid back (which is, I imagine, typical of a lending service) the numbers do not add up. We are all taking a huge loss and there is no explanation of where that loss goes. The BTC didn't just disappear, someone has it. The hacker has some, the borrowers have some, and TF has some. How is it that the borrowers take the cut and TF walks away with 1000's of BTC worth several 100 thousand. I'm not buying it.

CryptoUser01

skitchen

member

Activity: 71

Merit: 10

Quote from: twitami1 on November 19, 2013, 02:57:43 PM

Why can I not just send my BTC in CL to my wallet?

CL should have been completely seperate from inputs.io. I have an emergency and need my BTC asap. I only have 21BTC in CL as it is, but not being able to withdraw it or get to it is really pissing me off.

Any word on what/if is going to happen with the CL peeps?

Just assume your bitcoin are completely gone. You'll have to find another way to get out of your emergency or strike a deal and take a major loss from TradeFortress via e-mail (if you're lucky).

goodtimes73

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

Quote from: tehelsper on November 19, 2013, 03:39:43 PM

Until TF proves otherwise, we should assume he has assets to pay us all back 100% of our BTC and anything less is theft. The burden of proof should be on him as legal proceedings and investigations move forward. He's in a lot more trouble than being incompetent, securities and banking fraud is very serious.

Sections 80A through 87.

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/vic/consol_act/ca195882/

+1 If you are a relatively small investor (less than 50 btc), unless you are desperate for funds I would strongly resist the urge to settle for a 80-90% haircut.

TF, you have not replied to either of my emails. I would repeat a question asked above. Could you please tell your investors what alternatives there are to settling for a steep haircut now? Can we expect to get a larger percentage if we wait awhile as loans are repaid?

tehelsper

member

Activity: 68

Merit: 10

Until TF proves otherwise, we should assume he has assets to pay us all back 100% of our BTC and anything less is theft. The burden of proof should be on him as legal proceedings and investigations move forward. He's in a lot more trouble than being incompetent, securities and banking fraud is very serious.

Sections 80A through 87.

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/vic/consol_act/ca195882/

stenkross

sr. member

Activity: 330

Merit: 250

A question for TF:
When you get your bitcoin back from your loans/investments during next few months or so.
Will you consider spreading them to all users who lost shitloads during this, or do you consider them to be yours?

CryptoUser01

newbie

Activity: 26

Merit: 0

This whole thing stinks to me. He's prioritizing higher deposits because that is the liability. The issue is that there may be a lot of small deposits with a large sum of BTC. He's ignoring all of that.

I've e-mailed and heard nothing back.

I'm considering that we start contacting legal authorities on this.

I do believe TF was hacked. I get that. What I don't get is the handling. This hack seems like an excuse to rob everyone and not communicate, etc. It's grossly unfair.

I'm thinking for those in the U.S. we follow this advice:

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_4522.html

I intend to start that tonight.

Based on this USD fiat conversion, I would get back about 18% of BTC I put in. The value of BTC is much higher now, I don't want USD back obviously. The question is where did the other 82% go?

If the 4100 coins stolen where 82% of the funds that means that 5000 coins where on deposit.

According to the thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=328053.0;topicseen more than 6000 coins where deposited.

Even if I assume that all of the loans won't be paid back (which is, I imagine, typical of a lending service) the numbers do not add up. We are all taking a huge loss and there is no explanation of where that loss goes. The BTC didn't just disappear, someone has it. The hacker has some, the borrowers have some, and TF has some. How is it that the borrowers take the cut and TF walks away with 1000's of BTC worth several 100 thousand. I'm not buying it.

CryptoUser01

halfawake

hero member

Activity: 490

Merit: 500

Quote from: Lohoris on November 19, 2013, 05:34:20 AM

Quote from: halfawake on November 18, 2013, 04:48:16 PM

Quote from: Lohoris on November 18, 2013, 12:29:41 PM

Quote from: Lohoris on November 18, 2013, 06:00:21 AM

This is much fun: if you find a burglar in your apartment you kindly ask him if he's lost, and if he can kindly put down your laptop, because he must certainly be mistaken: it's yours, not theirs, but that's an understandable mistake.
Lol you're so fun.

I have to reiterate.
I'm seriously worried: if people are so gullible to the extreme, firm in their illusions... we might be doomed.
Not that it wasn't already obvious looking at our polititians, of course.

At least they're proposing possible solutions to this mess. It sucks for everyone except for whoever it was that stole the 4100 bitcoins. What would you propose as a solution, Lohoris? Or are you one of the people who thinks that TradeFortress just absconded with the money himself and is screwing over his investors?

Obviously.
Leaving 4100 BTC in a "hot wallet" makes you have absolutely no clue what you are doing, so either he stole everything (much likely) or he is so incopetent he should be thrown in a jail anyway.

You shouldn't have invested there, all the warnings were up and you didn't listen.

On that note, I will readily agree. I should have trusted my instincts and took my money out when he put up the "This is not an investment, none of this is real" bit like I was originally planning on. Back then, he was offering 90% of my money back, which is a hell of a lot better deal than is being offered now.

Also, TradeFortress, what about those loans you still have outstanding? How likely are they to get paid back? I'd rather wait and get a higher amount of my bitcoins back than get only the US Dollar amount of the initial investment back now.

gravity_boy

newbie

Activity: 7

Merit: 0

Hey TF i sent a couple of email's but no reply. I am guessing u are busy in this fiasco

How long would u need to get operational again. As in I don't mind waiting X number of months for you to get back on ur feet again and bring your business back to normal.

I would Ideally like at least my initial investment back.

Kind Regards

twitami1

full member

Activity: 322

Merit: 102

Why can I not just send my BTC in CL to my wallet?

CL should have been completely seperate from inputs.io. I have an emergency and need my BTC asap. I only have 21BTC in CL as it is, but not being able to withdraw it or get to it is really pissing me off.

Any word on what/if is going to happen with the CL peeps?

btcplayer

newbie

Activity: 20

Merit: 0

This settlement is very unfair, we could estimate that most people deposited at around 1BTC=100USD, but now the price is 700USD, this settlement means the average haircut could be about 85%, does this match the remaining value of CL debts?

Let me make some suggest to modify the settlement, TF and CL investors are welcomed to comment to achieve a fair one.

We need calculate an fair refunding rate...

Refunding Pool: includes two parts - remaining value of CL debts (a), and TF's all or major personal BTC asset (b).

Distribution Base: We could calculate the sum of all USD value of CL investor's BTC when the deposit was made (c) and TF's reasonable original USD value of BTC asset (d).

Then the refund rate is (a+b)/(c+d). People could have an average haircut, including TF.

It would not be related to the current USD/BTC rate, the rate is changing so rapidly. TF and investors all don't need to take the risk.

Simulation:
Refunding Pool:
(a) The remaining value of CL debts is 2000BTC
(b) TF's personal asset is 1000BTC,
then (a+b) the total refunding pool is 3000BTC

Distribution Base:
(c)
investor A: deposited 10BTC at BTC=100USD, then 1000USD
investor B: deposited 5BTC at BTC=300USD, then 1500USD
investor C: deposited 30BTC at BTC=80USD, then 2400USD
....

Sum-up is 800K USD (let me estimate totally all investors deposited 10K BTC at average 80 USD)

(d) TF asset's USD value is 200K USD (let me estimate TF have 1K BTC at average 200 USD cost)

Then the total distribution base (c+d) = 1M USD

Average refunding rate =3000 BTC /1M USD = 0.003 BTC/USD

Refunding cacluation: all people still could take benefit from recent BTC raising to make some profit or reduce loss in term of USD value, though not doubt BTC number will get haircut.

Investor A: 1000 USD * 0.003 BTC/USD =3 BTC (current value= 2100 USD, with 110% increase)
investor B: 1500 USD * 0.003 BTC/USD = 4.5 BTC (current value = 3150 USD with 110% increase)
invstors C: 2400 USD * 0.003 BTC/USD = 7.2 BTC (current value = 5040 USD with 110% increase)
...

TF himself: 200K USD * 0.003 BTC/USD = 600 BTC (current value = 420K USD with 110% increase)

Settle Down:
All people's balance will be converted at one time. People could choose to stay in CL, or quit. CL's remaining value has been adjusted by this calculation, it might not be a bad option to stay, this might help CL, borrowers and TF himself.

Any comment from TF and all people are welcomed!

Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on November 19, 2013, 03:19:18 AM

Quote from: scousesmoker on November 19, 2013, 03:11:10 AM

Still no response to my e-mails either regarding updates on our potential CL balances and also offering a 50% cut on the 5 coins I have in there(5 coins is a lot to me)

Quite sceptical as to wether I'll see any of those coins again and at this exchange rate I'll likely never see 5BTC again Sad

I've responded and processed to all emails where we both agreed on a 100% refund of the USD amount (calculated at time of deposit / withdrawals).

VJain

sr. member

Activity: 305

Merit: 250

Quote from: ChaosFox on November 19, 2013, 09:52:59 AM

Well, either way he seems to be prioritizing over those who had large deposits (100 BTC or more) from what I've seen. My emails have been ignored thus far, even when proposing him a similar deal, AND even when the BTC prices were at 900 USD.

I have well over 100 BTC in there. No replies so far

baloo_kiev

sr. member

Activity: 476

Merit: 250

Why are some talking about 100% fiat refund proposal? I haven't received any. Are the investors supposed to send an email like every day to get information about current state eventually?

C10H15N

legendary

Activity: 948

Merit: 1026

No email has been forthcoming to coinlenders investors.

Equilux

sr. member

Activity: 353

Merit: 251

If I recall correctly TradeFortress was supposed to send and email within the week with updates and such? Has someone received such an email or should I still expect it?

Topic: CoinLenders Script :: Bitcoin Bank (Borrow+Deposit) Software :: Demo Available - page 22. (Read 111290 times)