Topic: Contribute To Bitcoin Economy... - page 5. (Read 4548 times)

Basically .... you can always leave (is this a form of freedom  ?). However this thread is becoming really OT and I don't still understand the real purpose of if. What we're talking about? The buying/selling of forum account or different things?

If you don't like the forum go to the other forum or create your own. 

I am now politely asking you to actually say something that hasn't been said a million times before and shot down every single time.

I am now politely asking you to stop shitting up my thread. Either back what you say with, as a minimum, attempt at rationality, or stop making this thread unreadable for those who sincerely wish to participate.
ty.

A very wise (may be) person has already argued and compared these two things:


Rules are rules just as laws of a country. If one doesn't follow them, they basically are fraudulent people/criminals/psychos. But saying that rules/laws shouldn't be implemented because it will take place in the private/outside the country is completely illogical.  

I don't think I'm the rude one here given your continual condescension, but I and others have already stated why your suggestions are ultimately futile and don't solve anything, you're just not reading my posts:




But your analogy is ridiculously extreme and irrelevant.

irrelevant
ɪˈrɛlɪv(ə)nt/
adjective
adjective: irrelevant

not connected with or relevant to something.

No, you are using rape/murder's lack of 100% enforcement as justification for your point that even if it is unenforcable, you should try. You say, well rapes and murders aren't 100% solved, but there are still laws! Which is 100% incorrect on all levels.

First, selling accounts whether it is against the rules or not is not a crime, nor is it morally indecent to the same extent a violent crime is. You keep claiming that rape and murder are not 100% stoppable, but there are still laws against them. It is enforcable with life in prison or a death sentence, which is enough to disuade most people. Banning an account wouldn't dissuade anyone who is selling accounts. Second, if you kill someone, there is a body, forensic evidence, etc. If people didn't publicly post about account selling, there would be absolutely no way of knowing that it was happening. What you propose is that moderators scattershot ban people in a completely unfair way, again to solve such a miniscule problem, or what you percieve as a problem.

You are missing the forest for a shrub. Trying to enact a ban on account selling will cause far greater problems. I dont know how you aren't understanding this, but at this point I don't especially care. You have your answer, the community has weighed in. I don't see anyone supporting you, not that it would matter anyway. If you don't like account sales create your own forum, fix the problems you percieve here, and if your rules work better, then survival of the fittest will take its course. I can only argue that the sky is blue so much before it doesn't matter if you keep claiming that it is red.

The post was a reply to Salty, I understand that you want to sell as many accounts as possible - you're an account dealer
The reason the "(yes/no)" thingy is stuck in there is 'coz I want to narrow down exactly where Salty [not you] stands on the issue.

If he feels that it's great that accounts are being bought & sold, then all further discussion of plausibility of enforcement is moot, don't you agree?

Hope this clears things up

@Muhammed Zakir: have no idea of what you're trying to say.


That's what this thread is about, changing the forum policy. Posted, appropriately, in the Meta section.

What he is trying to say is

   Illegal
      |
  ____|___________
 |                |    
Rape/murder     Account sale

I hope you understand the structure is long. You have snipped many things to achieve your goal. I really like to say "never stop learning" but I think "think twice or thrice before you do a thing" fits better.

@erikalui: Simple answer, no benefit.

My question: What benefit does the forum get from multiple accounts (especially those accounts created using one IP address)?

Your answer: I said that using alts is indeed helpful for things we need to hide our real accounts.

I don't need any explanation now as you can't understand my question.



No use of the awareness except that members earn by selling/buying accounts.




Hmm...So the final result is, newbies will always get scammed if they don't investigate and they might not even know how to investigate. Preventing account sales can atleast decrease it IMO but nobody wants to even try this method. People who are happy earning money by account sales and newbies are sad that they need to suffer because of that.

It's called an analogy
    a·nal·o·gy
    əˈnaləjē/
    noun
    noun: analogy; plural noun: analogies
        a comparison between two things, typically on the basis of their structure and for the purpose of explanation or clarification.

Never stop learning, friend!
You are welcome.

Exactly. Don't forget CP too. When selling forum accounts becomes against the law we may rethink the policy, but currently it's not.


When he says we, he means I. Not everyone is against the sale of accounts here but even those that are tend to agree with or accept the logic of why they're allowed to be sold here.

I don't see a lot of people saying that we don't want account dealing to happen. Nor have you given any reason or argument backed by facts as to why account trading is bad.

You're seriously comparing rape/murder to selling forum accounts?

>See, the problem is you keep drawing false equivilancies trying to prove your null point.  have absolutely no bearing on anything we are talking about here
Let's take it down to basics:

1. "Rape, murder, etc" - things we do not want to happen. Laws, rules, etc. are created to minimize the occurrence of these these things. (yes/no?)
2. "account dealing" - things we do not want to happen. Laws, rules, etc. are could be created to minimize the occurrence of these these things. (yes/no?)

See the similarity my analogy tries to highlight?


If you are not willing to discuss why these solutions are worthless, responding with invective is simply rude, no better than a child saying NO U!
If you have nothing to add to the conversation, please delete your posts and stop derailing my thread.
ty.

I don't think there was an explanation needed for that statement as you(we) were talking about alts not TerminatorXL's post. I said that using alts is indeed helpful for things we need to hide our real accounts. For example, scam busting, drama, going against a person/community etc... TerminatorXL is doing one of the things and it is clearly seen. I don't think I need to explain this further.


We need to investigate if we are doing a trade. People will be more careful knowing this fact.


Security Log isn't enough. People can't truly know whether an account is sold or not. Only way we can assume is to ask a signed message considering Bitcoin address can be sold.


Because we can't create a list of full bought/sold accounts and who bought it. Another reason is, having an alt is okay.


Don't think so if you think.


Now we can atleast know some of the sold accounts, what if it took outside forum? Higher chance is for "won't".


Newbies always get scammed as they aren't familar with it but this doesn't mean we shouldn't try to prevent it. The answer is we can't but we can reduce it. Banning sold accounts are not the way, though. Even trusted members turn out to be scammers. It doesn't increase nor decrease by a greater percentage. Both are balanced and trying to change one side will result in bigger problem. Scammers scam. Newbies are being victims as they ain't experienced here. Newbies are victims of most scams IRL too. There is no solution other than wiping scammers which is impossible out there.


I don't want to discuss about your alts. erikalui asked why alts are allowed and I answered.


Leaving a wallet in middle of a street and being less careful is different. Besides, virtual and real is different and we can't compare everything.

No, I saw them, but they don't fall under solutions that are actually worth something, and they've all been shot down multiple times time and time again by every single person who has ever proposed them.

See, the problem is you keep drawing false equivilancies trying to prove your null point. Rotten food, rape, murder, etc have absolutely no bearing on anything we are talking about here, and you just keep saying the same ideas over and over, even though they have been proven wrong.

Ok, if we ban the sales in general, you are right, people will stop posting about it here. You are correct.

"Just like we enforce the no drugs/guns/CP" Again, correct, we can remove these things from out site. But what you are asking is that we prevent these things from going on on other sites. If people do shady things through IRC or what have you that has absolutely no effect on this forum. If people sell accounts through IRC or what have you that still effects the forum.

Now we are getting somewhere. "If sufficient evidence exists of a user selling accounts, ban it" Ok, who is going to be the judge? Where do we draw the line as to what is sufficient? If I'm 50% sure that you bought that account you are posting on right now, does that give me the right to ban it? What evidence do we use to prove that someone bought an account? Are we going to use our non existant user identification program, or are we going to listen to trolls posting in meta to decide if an account has been purchased or sold?

your proposition opens a whole new can of worms. "If I think so little of their intelligence" to have to warn people that anonymous online non reversable payments can be dangerous if you don't know what you are doing? Isn't it more insulting to someone's intelligence to try to protect them with futile measures against issues that they can prevent themselves? We have two pages of discussion saying that people scamming with purchased accounts is nearly non existant and there are no proven cases besides someone who posted something out of the ordinary before scamming. Why would you want to open up a way for moderator abuse for a nonexistant issue, other than that its "embarassing" to you for whatever reason.

The only way you are going to understand why you are wrong is if you go manage your own forum and try whatever you want to stop account sales. Let me know how that goes.

Do you read before typing, or is that sort of thing strictly for teh plebes?


Please read the whole thread before posting, otherwise I'll need to repeat points previously covered - unfair to those who are actually following the thread.
ty.

This thread is about accounts being sold, not alt accounts. I have created this account, free of charge.
If you wish to discuss alt accounts, please stop derailing my thread & start your own.


No. A false dichotomy. Covered several times in this very thread.
Knowing that stealing is against the law doesn't make me leave my wallet in the middle of the street. OTOH, since there are IRL cops enforcing laws, I don't sleep with a Glock under my pillow & still get robbed. So I guess I can afford to be less careful.