Why in the world are everyone talking about the ball-tampering incident all of a sudden? The world has moved on and Smith and Warner got the ban that they deserved and they came back stronger than ever.
Anyway, India and West Indies are about to face off soon in a T-20 series which will be interesting to watch since both teams won their recent matches comprehensively.
Topic: Cricket match prediction discussions - page 237. (Read 599041 times)
Normally the pace bowlers use their towel (or even their trousers) to scratch the ball on one side and then apply their sweat to make that side heavier. This is an open secret and till now no bowler was penalized for doing this. The question is if using the towel is perfectly legal, then how we can say that using sand-paper is illegal? As far as I know, there is no rule which specifically states so.
The bowlers usually use towel and even spit and other tricks to change the shape of the bowl and usually the fielders used to throw the ball on the ground for no reason to change the shape of the ball and that trick is no longer accepted as they will get a direct warning but you cannot use an outside object like a sand paper to change the ball and it is not accepted as these tricks can change the results and it cannot be accepted, the match should be between skills and not about who has the best tricks to win the match. 
You are confusing illegal manipulation with the natural one. Making one side rough by pitching it on the same side isn't illegal. But if you will use sandpapers to rough it that's another story.
Normally the pace bowlers use their towel (or even their trousers) to scratch the ball on one side and then apply their sweat to make that side heavier. This is an open secret and till now no bowler was penalized for doing this. The question is if using the towel is perfectly legal, then how we can say that using sand-paper is illegal? As far as I know, there is no rule which specifically states so.
That said, it is difficult to digest the fact that two batsmen got suspended for ball tampering. Do you believe that their bowlers are all angels and this plan was only known to Warner and Smith?
The decision to tamper the ball will be known by the entire team and the captain and the vice captain has taken the fall and it is not that the rest are angels but the captain and the vice captain took the responsibility and the punishment was harsh as Shakib Al Hasan was did not disclose about a bookie approaching him got two years while ball tampering got a years ban, not sure what is the right punishment for all these things but i find these excessive. 
All this conversation begs the question why was the "2 new balls" rule introduced? Cricket has become a game for batsmen only, Talk about Pitches to Bats, All have been tailored to suit them. For the bowlers nothing much has changed, in fact, it has got worse for them. Things like Powerplays and "2 New balls" are not helping them in any case. The art of reverse swing is close to dead even in test matches. It's a game of nightmare for bowlers these days unless you are an orthodox bowler then you may survive for a bit but your uniqueness will fade away too, Rashid Khan comes to mind as an example. It's just frustrating for fans like me to see the game develop only in a certain way. Anyway, I will end my rant...
You are confusing illegal manipulation with the natural one. Making one side rough by pitching it on the same side isn't illegal. But if you will use sandpapers to rough it that's another story.
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the legendary Pakistani bowlers have themselves admitted changing the condition of the ball, in order to get reverse swing.
You are confusing illegal manipulation with the natural one. Making one side rough by pitching it on the same side isn't illegal. But if you will use sandpapers to rough it that's another story.
I still believe that it was a very stupid move from Cricket Australia to hand out 12 month ban for these two players. What they did was not right, but in my opinion their offense was not as worse as match fixing. In their case, the incident was blown out of proportion by the South African media (and picked up by their Australian counterparts). It is something that everyone does, and they were unfortunate to get caught.
Giving a one year ban for changing the shape of the ball was excessive as they were players who did that in the past and when they were caught they usually get a ban for a few matches and then their match money will be fined but in this incident Smith came out and said what really happened because of media pressure and it was a mess but one year was excessive consider a sportsman has a small window to play and make money. 
^^^^ I am having mixed feelings about this. If they knowingly tampered the ball, then they deserved some punishment for that (still not sure about the quantum of the punishment). But it is a well known fact that a lot of bowlers do engage in these sort of activities. A lot of them try to change the original condition of the ball. Some of them can be called out as illegal, while some other types may be in the grey area.
That said, it is difficult to digest the fact that two batsmen got suspended for ball tampering. Do you believe that their bowlers are all angels and this plan was only known to Warner and Smith?
That said, it is difficult to digest the fact that two batsmen got suspended for ball tampering. Do you believe that their bowlers are all angels and this plan was only known to Warner and Smith?
Warner and Smith are world class batman’s there’s no doubt about it, but it was Warner who hitched the plan and when Smith came to know about it he didn’t stop him which means he gave his consent to it. Though the punishment was a bit harsh in my opinion, I personally felt CA had no other choice but to take a hard stand as their reputation was badly hit by this scandal.
Source: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5554633/David-Warner-led-sandpaper-plot-teaching-Cameron-Bancroft-Australia-ball-tampering-scandal.html
He has a point there. It is difficult to believe that none of the bowlers were aware of the plan. How can Warner came up with this plan, when he is not a bowler himself? Steve Smith being the captain can't escape from the responsibility as well. But there is always a thin line separating what is allowed and what is not allowed. As I had mentioned earlier, the legendary Pakistani bowlers have themselves admitted changing the condition of the ball, in order to get reverse swing. And this is something bowlers all around the world does even now.
^^^^ I am having mixed feelings about this. If they knowingly tampered the ball, then they deserved some punishment for that (still not sure about the quantum of the punishment). But it is a well known fact that a lot of bowlers do engage in these sort of activities. A lot of them try to change the original condition of the ball. Some of them can be called out as illegal, while some other types may be in the grey area.
That said, it is difficult to digest the fact that two batsmen got suspended for ball tampering. Do you believe that their bowlers are all angels and this plan was only known to Warner and Smith?
That said, it is difficult to digest the fact that two batsmen got suspended for ball tampering. Do you believe that their bowlers are all angels and this plan was only known to Warner and Smith?
Warner and Smith are world class batman’s there’s no doubt about it, but it was Warner who hitched the plan and when Smith came to know about it he didn’t stop him which means he gave his consent to it. Though the punishment was a bit harsh in my opinion, I personally felt CA had no other choice but to take a hard stand as their reputation was badly hit by this scandal.
Source: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5554633/David-Warner-led-sandpaper-plot-teaching-Cameron-Bancroft-Australia-ball-tampering-scandal.html
^^^^ I am having mixed feelings about this. If they knowingly tampered the ball, then they deserved some punishment for that (still not sure about the quantum of the punishment). But it is a well known fact that a lot of bowlers do engage in these sort of activities. A lot of them try to change the original condition of the ball. Some of them can be called out as illegal, while some other types may be in the grey area.
That said, it is difficult to digest the fact that two batsmen got suspended for ball tampering. Do you believe that their bowlers are all angels and this plan was only known to Warner and Smith?
That said, it is difficult to digest the fact that two batsmen got suspended for ball tampering. Do you believe that their bowlers are all angels and this plan was only known to Warner and Smith?
I still believe that it was a very stupid move from Cricket Australia to hand out 12 month ban for these two players. What they did was not right, but in my opinion their offense was not as worse as match fixing. In their case, the incident was blown out of proportion by the South African media (and picked up by their Australian counterparts). It is something that everyone does, and they were unfortunate to get caught.
I completely disagree with you here. They cheated and they deserved the ban. Its as simple as that. This move was made to set an example so that other players will realize how risky cheating is in this game. This basically applies to any sport in this world. Don't forget that this is a gentleman's game first and foremost.And it irritated me when the uncultured crowd in England booed these two players whenever they walked in to bat. And even more irritating was the fact that the English players themselves encouraged that sort of crowd behavior. I don't think that they can label anyone as "cheaters" after what they did during the final of the 2019 CWC.
I do agree with you here(Kind of). It makes sense why they boo them so much, but I condone such behavior though Warner and Smith need to live with it. Also, I hated the result of the World Cup 2019 final myself(I still believe its a draw), but both of these scenarios are completely different and should not be compared. Its not matter of believe or not believe its all about cricket when we was kids we have some gold words and these fit perfect the words was Cricket by Luck mean if you have good day then no one can stop you and if you have bad day then you cannot stay on crease so this happen in case of Warner and Smith.
I still believe that it was a very stupid move from Cricket Australia to hand out 12 month ban for these two players. What they did was not right, but in my opinion their offense was not as worse as match fixing. In their case, the incident was blown out of proportion by the South African media (and picked up by their Australian counterparts). It is something that everyone does, and they were unfortunate to get caught.
My guess is that the majority of the test bowlers try to change the condition of the ball, either using external substances (such as sandpaper or Vaseline), or by using their own sweat and towel. Pakistani bowlers were infamous for their "reverse swing", which was helped by increasing the weight of one side of the ball by applying sweat (after removing the smoothness by using a towel).
And it irritated me when the uncultured crowd in England booed these two players whenever they walked in to bat. And even more irritating was the fact that the English players themselves encouraged that sort of crowd behavior. I don't think that they can label anyone as "cheaters" after what they did during the final of the 2019 CWC.
Unforgettable innings !!!
Very difficult to believe that this is the same guy who struggled so hard during the Ashes series. David Warner made a total of 95 runs after playing 5 tests during the Ashes 2019 series. For comparison, Steve Smith played just 4 matches, and scored a total of 774 runs (he could have made 1,000 runs if he got the opportunity to play all the five matches).
Unforgettable innings !!!
Very difficult to believe that this is the same guy who struggled so hard during the Ashes series. David Warner made a total of 95 runs after playing 5 tests during the Ashes 2019 series. For comparison, Steve Smith played just 4 matches, and scored a total of 774 runs (he could have made 1,000 runs if he got the opportunity to play all the five matches).
Broadcasters were the one to profit big out the matches. When a day gets reduced out of the match due to early winning it surely affects the revenue. This can't be undone, because game gets changed at any point. If things are supposed to happen as the broadcasters think then the only way is match fixing.
Nope.. I wasn't talking about match fixing. The duration of the match can depend a lot on the pitch condition as well. If the surface is a flat one offering not much assistance to the bowlers, then we can expect innings totals in excess of 500, and thereby we can make sure that the match will last for 5 days. On the other hand if the surface offers a lot of pace and bounce, then the duration will be difficult to predict. Good batsmen may be able to score runs, but weak teams may get blasted out in less than half a day.
Currently Pakistan 13th time in Australia they already lost 9 time and draw 3 mean they never won any series in Australia.
So it shows that Pakistan won just 4 matches in Australia and the last win was in 1995/96 season and it is a very long time since they tasted victory and it is highly unlikely they will win a match anytime soon with the team they are having and even the world class bowlers could not give them the win because their batsman usually fail in green tracks and all the Asian countries was having this issue but India is playing better now.India's success can be attributed to just one man - Virat Kohli, as he is the only Indian batsman who has performed consistently on green surfaces. All the other batsmen have shown weakness abroad. Not just the Indian batsmen, but the Indian spin bowlers (especially Ravichandran Ashwin) have also shown a lack of form on surfaces outside the sub-continent.
Also, the surfaces have become more batsmen friendly over the years, in part due to the pressure from the TV broadcasters. The broadcasters incur losses when the test matches get finished in two or three days and there is a lot of pressure from them to ensure that the matches last for a minimum of 4 days. But as we have seen, even in good surfaces nowadays the matches are getting finished in less than 3 days (IND vs BAN for example).
Broadcasters were the one to profit big out the matches. When a day gets reduced out of the match due to early winning it surely affects the revenue. This can't be undone, because game gets changed at any point. If things are supposed to happen as the broadcasters think then the only way is match fixing.
Currently Pakistan 13th time in Australia they already lost 9 time and draw 3 mean they never won any series in Australia.
So it shows that Pakistan won just 4 matches in Australia and the last win was in 1995/96 season and it is a very long time since they tasted victory and it is highly unlikely they will win a match anytime soon with the team they are having and even the world class bowlers could not give them the win because their batsman usually fail in green tracks and all the Asian countries was having this issue but India is playing better now.India's success can be attributed to just one man - Virat Kohli, as he is the only Indian batsman who has performed consistently on green surfaces. All the other batsmen have shown weakness abroad. Not just the Indian batsmen, but the Indian spin bowlers (especially Ravichandran Ashwin) have also shown a lack of form on surfaces outside the sub-continent.
Also, the surfaces have become more batsmen friendly over the years, in part due to the pressure from the TV broadcasters. The broadcasters incur losses when the test matches get finished in two or three days and there is a lot of pressure from them to ensure that the matches last for a minimum of 4 days. But as we have seen, even in good surfaces nowadays the matches are getting finished in less than 3 days (IND vs BAN for example).
Currently Pakistan 13th time in Australia they already lost 9 time and draw 3 mean they never won any series in Australia.
So it shows that Pakistan won just 4 matches in Australia and the last win was in 1995/96 season and it is a very long time since they tasted victory and it is highly unlikely they will win a match anytime soon with the team they are having and even the world class bowlers could not give them the win because their batsman usually fail in green tracks and all the Asian countries was having this issue but India is playing better now.Currently Pakistan 13th time in Australia they already lost 9 time and draw 3 mean they never won any series in Australia.
So it shows that Pakistan won just 4 matches in Australia and the last win was in 1995/96 season and it is a very long time since they tasted victory and it is highly unlikely they will win a match anytime soon with the team they are having and even the world class bowlers could not give them the win because their batsman usually fail in green tracks and all the Asian countries was having this issue but India is playing better now. Pakistani bowlers are relatively inexperienced and they had no previous experience of playing in Australia. They could have arrived a few days earlier and played a few more warm up matches to get acclimatized with the conditions. Anyway, lets see how they perform during the second test. Their morale is going to be low, but a few early wickets can change that.
I have not seen Pakistan defeating Australia even when they had world class bowlers like Akram, Akthar and Waqar Younis because their batsman always fails them, i am not sure about the win percentage they have in Australia but i am sure it is pretty low, the present team is much younger and there is no way they will trouble the Australian batsman and their bowling is lethal to any top teams and Pakistan will find it difficult to face them.Pakistan in Australia Test Series 1972/73 Australia 3-0 (3)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 1976/77 drawn 1-1 (3)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 1978/79 drawn 1-1 (2)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 1981/82 Australia 2-1 (3)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 1983/84 Australia 2-0 (5)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 1989/90 Australia 1-0 (3)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 1995/96 Australia 2-1 (3)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 1999/00 Australia 3-0 (3)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 2004/05 Australia 3-0 (3)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 2009/10 Australia 3-0 (3)
Pakistan in Australia Test Series 2016/17 Australia 3-0 (3)
Currently Pakistan 13th time in Australia they already lost 9 time and draw 3 mean they never won any series in Australia.
Pakistani bowlers are relatively inexperienced and they had no previous experience of playing in Australia. They could have arrived a few days earlier and played a few more warm up matches to get acclimatized with the conditions. Anyway, lets see how they perform during the second test. Their morale is going to be low, but a few early wickets can change that.
I have not seen Pakistan defeating Australia even when they had world class bowlers like Akram, Akthar and Waqar Younis because their batsman always fails them, i am not sure about the win percentage they have in Australia but i am sure it is pretty low, the present team is much younger and there is no way they will trouble the Australian batsman and their bowling is lethal to any top teams and Pakistan will find it difficult to face them.Back then they had legendary batsmen such as Saeed Anwar and Inzamam ul Haq, in addition to a young Shahid Afridi who could light up some fireworks during the match. But back then, Australia was very much invincible. They had the best bowlers (McGrath, Lee, Warne.etc) and the best batsmen (Adam Gilchrist, Mark Waugh.etc). On top of that, they had the best captain as well (Steve Waugh). The present Australian team is a shadow of its former self.
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