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Topic: Dear synechist, xc, blocknet, and dan metcalf - page 3. (Read 4279 times)

adhitthana

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Quote from: Marlo Stanfield on November 06, 2014, 06:14:09 AM

Lots of people have been observing XC since it was X11coin. And there general consensus always was that it was shady.

Well what more facts do we need. According to you with absolutely no evidence supplied the consensus is it is "shady". Grin

There is a certain irony in that some alt coin supporters are so keen to punish people without supplying any sort of real evidence. There is no respect for due process or any sort of "fair trial".
It's incredibly ironic though I'm pretty sure the irony is totally lost on those who do this. Grin

Marlo Stanfield

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Quote from: synechist on November 05, 2014, 11:53:39 AM

Quote from: Marlo Stanfield on November 05, 2014, 11:32:55 AM

Quote from: infinitechaos on November 05, 2014, 09:45:25 AM

For anyone still wondering about Dan's ability to code, I have had a private discussion with Xander Shepard recently. He does the Linux builds for XC and is listed on the XC team roster on the official website.

He has seen the private github repository and has verified with me that Dan makes very regular commits and that he is indeed a skilled coder with the experience he says he has.

I just wanted to help clarify this matter.

My view of the situation so far is this:

Dan is probably more of a networks guy than an A level crypto developer. Evidence seems to suggest he's paid tens of thousands of dollars for outsourcing. The break down of this exactly we're never going to know. I'd guess a lot of that money has been paid to Christan Howe and that he's done the vast majority of development for XC. With Dan possibly coming up with the ideas about the mixer and such. I'd bet that Dan is in fact very technical and does have a lot of specific domain knowledge in his professional field, but that he's not necessarily the lead developer type. None of this in itself is inherently bad.

We do know that he paid loljosh to create XC. He's never publicly admitted it, but we can see in that screenshot that we have the additional evidence for that now as well.

The problem as I see it is that his image has been cultivated to be some sort of crypto coding god. "One of crypto's best" as everyone likes to throw around. And XC has built a kind of cult of personality around him. This ways parlayed in to his "freelance" work with Prometheus, including the code reviews.

I will say this though: if XC ever actually goes open source, and their mixer does actually turn out to be as good as it's been sold to XC holders as, and Dan was the designer(but not the coder of it) then that would be a positive mark for him. If it's tested by third parties and the code is reviewed by experts, and it does what it says on the tin, then that would be a good thing. Until then though we have no idea, and I don't know why it hasn't been open sourced yet. Because a true decentralised trustless mixer would probably shut a lot of people up and provide some evidence that at least someone was able to design some legit tech.

Read the pastebin of the conversation between the SDC devs and the XC team: https://gist.github.com/atcsecure/cf6a478ef3169cefdc6d

You'll see that Dan is way more than a "networks guy."

He's an "infrastructure developer", who "started back in the 80's[, and] outside of XC most of [his] work is mesh networking/development for IP over RF." He's a "full systems guy, the whole 9, linux through security and windows (ug)" and has done numerous secure systems for government and corporations.

He did not "pay loljosh to create XC". Neither is it true that he's "never publicly admitted it." He has.

He paid loljosh for a standard PoS clone, which Dan then turned into the unique thing that XC is. Loljosh does not have the skills to create anything like XC.

One thing everyone should realise is that two conflicting claims were presented in the smear campaign:
- Dan can't code
- Dan is a master coder and that's why Prometheus valued him so highly, and used him to create so many coins.

So let's just get this nonsense out of the way forever. Dan is a master coder. He's a uniquely skilled and highly experienced systems architect.

Importantly, being a systems architect means you don't have to work on all the low level stuff. You get other devs to create various bits and pieces for you. How else do you think XC has achieved such a ridiculous rate of development? Look at the timeline: it would take more than the 1000+ hours Dan has sunk into XC for one person to create all that.

Ahem... the Rev 1 mixer tech was open sourced. Go and look at it yourself.

He did not "pay loljosh to create XC". Well, what I should have said is that he paid loljosh to create X11Coin(which was what XC was previously named). I wasn't trying to imply that loljosh did anything other than create the initial clone.

One of the problems I have with Dan is that he constantly tries to weasel his way out of admitting things. He's constantly avoiding the questions and making statements that may be technical true in some cases, but often were not the question. It's often transparent exactly what he's trying to avoid answering.

Even with this specific case you can see the standard Dan line of bullshitting with this comment that was posted up thread:

Quote

For LolJosh's involvement, he assisted in some of the original QT work and as you can see he didn't start offering an X11/PoS coin until after x11coin was released

"assisted in some of the original QT work" and saying "he didn't start offering an X11/PoS coin until after x11coin was released" despite the fact that all evidence points to the fact that loljosh did in fact launch X11Coin for Dan. Not to mention the fact that n00bnoxious and yourself both confirm that to be the case right here.

Dan's standard line of BS begins with the answering vaguely but technically true answers. Like when asked if he was the developer for HAL he would answer something like "i have never coded for HAL" which may be technically true, but we also have Prometheus claiming that Dan was behind HAL's anon. Dan could have paid someone to code it while he was the one who designed the concept. Or many other situations that put him behind the scenes of HAL. He's never going to be 100% truthful of course.

I don't think anyone who's followed XC over the months and really taken a look at what's happened can honestly call Dan an ethical person who has the best interests of anyone other than himself at heart. He might have started out ethical and then got lured in by the easy money from selling his reputation to pump groups for reviews. Or maybe he was always that way. I don't know.

I hope you are getting paid enough for your full time job of covering up this shitshow though. Given the fact that you apparently still have some followers despite the Prom chatlogs says something though! Cheesy

Is the v1 mixer a decentralised trustless mixer?

I'll post my comment that Synechist deleted from the blocknet thread here.

Lots of people have been observing XC since it was X11coin. And there general consensus always was that it was shady. As soon as Dan started doing those code reviews that was the final nail the coffin. The premine being drained and now the Prom revelations are just icing on the cake really.

People who are still have faith in Dan, Synechist and other XC connected people are suffering from post traumatic bagholder syndrome and should get professional help. Either that so they are a similar breed of douchebag who wants to prop this thing up as long as they can so they can unload on the next noobs that stumble upon the carefully crafted message of bullshit.

adhitthana

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Quote from: solid12345 on November 06, 2014, 05:46:28 AM

Probably cos they didn't ask him or he didn't have time.
Some how that didn't occur to you?

Someone asks him to review their coins and pay him a pittance to do it and somehow that makes Dan the devil?

solid12345

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I don't know why this all has to be so complex, when there's smoke, there's fire. Every single coin Dan has come running to offer help or do a code review for were prom pump projects. Halcyon, Aero, Key, and Util. Why has he not done code reviews for other outside coins? Whether he coded these coins personally and lied about reviewing someone else's work is irrelevant, the fact is the connection to Prometheus is very much real and that is disheartening.

I'd more give him the benefit of the doubt if had he ever done outside work for any coins with no proven ties to a pump and dump group because I seriously doubt prom was the only one constantly requesting his services but he hasn't. The ties are there, they are/were business partners or friends, you can't explain it any other way. Of course now they will come scurrying to deny it that they are only "acquaintances".

adhitthana

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Quote from: SamTsuedo on November 06, 2014, 04:59:21 AM

The way Blocknet scam was exposed alongside Bitswift scam is one of the most important events in the altcoin history ! Guys this is the beginning of an new era , the community is finding out scammers and calling them out ! They plan more complex and elaborate scams but people are not buying it anymore !
I congratulate you all for doing this for the cryptos ! We need to weed out the scammers and it will happen, it's already happening, and only then will we be taken for serious by the mainstream.

Um...the "mainstream" are taking some aspects seriously, but if you imagine IBM or Goldman Sachs care about the crypto community you are mistaken IMHO.

What we have seen here is not scammers being called but the dumb crypto community eating itself. What we see is people trying to cash in by following coin A and trashing coin B.
Meanwhile IBM ...are building there own "internet of things".

Here we saw something rare in altcoins, a successful developer with a vision for something that was beneficial to many coins not just his own coin...but the community here is often too stupid to even realise what is going on.

The vampire squid can see it.
http://www.goldmansachs.com/our-thinking/outlook/iot-infographic.html?cid=PS_02_89_07_00_00_00_01I

IBM can see it.
https://gigaom.com/2014/09/09/check-out-ibms-proposal-for-an-internet-of-things-architecture-using-bitcoins-block-chain-tech/

And Dan Metcalf can see it.
http://www.coinssource.com/interview-with-dan-metcalf-regarding-recent-blocknet-concerns/

Dan wants the crypto community to get this not IBM or Goldman Sachs. Yet some of the morons here can't see that.

Quote

What do you foresee the future of Blocknet being? How do you plan to progress forward after all these attacks have occurred?
Dan: IBM is about to launch its own Blockchain project and when they do, all of these altchains will have no chance to compete unless people unite together

SamTsuedo

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The way Blocknet scam was exposed alongside Bitswift scam is one of the most important events in the altcoin history ! Guys this is the beginning of an new era , the community is finding out scammers and calling them out ! They plan more complex and elaborate scams but people are not buying it anymore !

I congratulate you all for doing this for the cryptos ! We need to weed out the scammers and it will happen, it's already happening, and only then will we be taken for serious by the mainstream.

We started cleaning our own backyard, and there's only forward now - LONG LIVE CRYPTO !

illodin

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Quote from: ProfX on November 06, 2014, 01:01:24 AM

lol i cant believe you people are not giving up. Half of you think he's running multiple coins, the other half think he cant code at all.

Those two things are not mutually exclusive. Note that "running a coin" does not imply crypto coding ability. He could simply use the same 3rd party contractor(s) he uses with XC to code other coins. Also note, that I'm not saying he is, or that he isn't, just correcting a fallacy you seem to share with many others.

adhitthana

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Quote from: RichardT on November 06, 2014, 01:20:51 AM

Quote from: ProfX on November 06, 2014, 01:01:24 AM

Prom was probably an ethical business person when it came to negotiating terms for code reviews. Thats what it means to be ethical if your doing business with someone. Do you really think he has the time to read over Prom's post history and see if he is an ethical poster?

So negotiating to have Dan code review Hal while he was not an unbiased 3rd party and giving everyone else the impression that he had nothing to do with Hal, was ethical?

You need to get your timeline sorted out

adhitthana

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Quote from: RichardT on November 06, 2014, 12:50:45 AM

Quote from: adhitthana on November 06, 2014, 12:17:52 AM

So if this is the case, then why did Dan say that Prom was ethical in one of his statements?

Maybe because one swallow does not a summer make. If Prom was merely sloppy why would that make him unethical?

Quote

Also, how does Prom saying that Dan is the hal dev,

A more pertinent question might be why you put the word the in front of the words "hal dev". Prom did not say he was the hal dev. Go back and read it if you doubt me.

Quote

after he did a supposedly unbiased code review for Hal, help boost Hal's popularity? And this knowledge was not made public until now. You realize your argument does not make any sense right?

You will have to start again removing the word the

Quote

I'm not sure I agree that we really have to guess a whole lot with a statement such as "Dan is Hal dev".

If we want to get to the truth we should look at all the evidence, not cherry pick facts. Donn't you agree.
And important facts are that Dan was reviewing many coins codes and was never the developer of these coins. The obvious inference is that he reviewed the HAL code , as he did with many other coins.

Quote

You getting "Dan was a dev who was looking at Hal's code" out of that is a bit of a stretch.

Not at all. It is in line with what Dan did on many occaisions. He reviewed coins. Were you aware of that?

Quote

In one of the skype screenshots, Prom said:
"After SDC, would you guys be interested in working on a project with my Dev team?
Metcalf, West, and a few other anon devs"

So Prom talking about Blocknet. Is that surprising?

Quote

This shows that Prom and Dan had a much closer association than just simply Prom asking Dan to look at a code. As stated, they were a team. This is what I meant by "works together".

No it doesn't. And I don't think a reasonable person would jump to that conclusion if they looked at all the facts.
Can you give the context of that chat?

RichardT

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Quote from: ProfX on November 06, 2014, 01:01:24 AM

So negotiating to have Dan code review Hal while he was not an unbiased 3rd party and giving everyone else the impression that he had nothing to do with Hal, was ethical?

Quote

And with your last statement, clearly Prom is talking about BlockNET, he's just trying to make himself seem like a much bigger and important player in the industry than he really is, BlockNET was initiated by Dan, not prom. BlockNET will be a team of devs when all is said and done, although dan will be coding the basic protocol for it.

Okay, so assuming Prom was talking about Blocknet. Then no matter what Prom's role is in Blocknet, he was still included in the project. You're really okay with that and don't see anything wrong with it?

ProfX

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Quote from: RichardT on November 06, 2014, 12:50:45 AM

Quote from: adhitthana on November 06, 2014, 12:17:52 AM

So if this is the case, then why did Dan say that Prom was ethical in one of his statements?

Also, how does Prom saying that Dan is the hal dev, after he did what was supposedly an unbiased code review for Hal, help boost popularity? You realize your argument does not make any sense right?

I'm not sure I agree that we really have to guess a whole lot with a statement such as "Dan is Hal dev". You getting "Dan was a dev who was looking at Hal's code" out of that is a bit of a stretch.

Quote

But again, you could help here by being clear about what you mean by "works together", as that could mean many things.

In one of the skype screenshots, Prom said:
"After SDC, would you guys be interested in working on a project with my Dev team?
Metcalf, West, and a few other anon devs"

This shows that Prom and Dan had a much greater association than just simply Prom asking Dan to look at a code. As stated, they were a team. This is what I meant by "works together".

lol i cant believe you people are not giving up. Half of you think he's running multiple coins, the other half think he cant code at all. Then you have some that think he is directly involved in pump groups. Prom was probably an ethical business person when it came to negotiating terms for code reviews. Thats what it means to be ethical if your doing business with someone. Do you really think he has the time to read over Prom's post history and see if he is an ethical poster? LOL. And with your last statement, clearly Prom is talking about BlockNET, he's just trying to make himself seem like a much bigger and important player in the industry than he really is, BlockNET was initiated by Dan, not prom. BlockNET will be a team of devs when all is said and done, although dan will be coding the basic protocol for it.

RichardT

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Quote from: adhitthana on November 06, 2014, 12:17:52 AM

So if this is the case, then why did Dan say that Prom was ethical in one of his statements?

Also, how does Prom saying that Dan is the hal dev, after he did a supposedly unbiased code review for Hal, help boost Hal's popularity? And this knowledge was not made public until now. You realize your argument does not make any sense right?

I'm not sure I agree that we really have to guess a whole lot with a statement such as "Dan is Hal dev". You getting "Dan was a dev who was looking at Hal's code" out of that is a bit of a stretch.

Quote

But again, you could help here by being clear about what you mean by "works together", as that could mean many things.

In one of the skype screenshots, Prom said:
"After SDC, would you guys be interested in working on a project with my Dev team?
Metcalf, West, and a few other anon devs"

This shows that Prom and Dan had a much closer association than just simply Prom asking Dan to look at a code. As stated, they were a team. This is what I meant by "works together".

adhitthana

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Quote from: RichardT on November 05, 2014, 11:34:43 PM

You're joking right? How can you get "Dan was a dev who was looking at Hal's code" from something as clear as "Dan is Hal dev"? That sure is a lot of blanks to fill in there.

It's
Prom trying to promote his coin by being sloppy at best and deceptive at worst. Having Dan Metcalf connected in any way to a coin was known to boost popularity.

I'd go with sloppy. But, we must remember this was a casual conversation and we have very little context, so we are having to "guess" what was precisely meant.

The thing is there is no other reason to think that Dan Metcalf was the HAL developer and a lot of evidence against this.
It's absurd really.

Quote

Also, it's clear that Dan and Prom works together (Dan said so himself at the end of the interview). I'm very curious how you feel about that.

Of course if Prom asked Dan to look at the code then they must have done some "work" together.
But again, you could help here by being clear about what you mean by "works together", as that could mean many things.

The shame is that Dan actually provided a way where other coins besides his own coin might be able to work together and prosper.
Most of the time we see people just wanting one coin to prosper and other coins to die.

Dan's idea is that unless we band together and stop fighting IBM might steal our thunder,

Quote from: Dan Metcalf

IBM is about to launch its own Blockchain project and when they do, all of these altchains will have no chance to compete unless people unite together

We should stop fighting and work together.

RichardT

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Quote from: adhitthana on November 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM

Quote from: RichardT on November 05, 2014, 07:17:28 PM

It's funny, the line of defense from the start of all this up until now have been:
1. Those skype screenshots are fake. Dan is not working with Prom nor is he the dev of Hal.
2. When the screenshots were confirmed to be true, the defense turned into: Oh, Dan must of have not known that he was engaging in unethical behavior
3. And now you're saying that all evidence were hearsay anyway
What's going to be the next defense now that I've explained why the evidence is not just hearsay?

The defense, as in Dan Metcalf's defense, has always been that he did no coding on HAL.
Dan's defense has never been any of the things you stated above.

In other words you are ignoring Dan Metcalf's own defense.

Here Dan explains his position. You need to deal with that.
http://www.coinssource.com/interview-with-dan-metcalf-regarding-recent-blocknet-concerns/

I'm just saying those are what some supporters keep using as defenses. I'm not saying those are Dan's defense. His only defenses so far is just simply denying everything and calling everything FUD.

Okay, so either Prom is lying or Dan is lying. Are you saying that Prom lied about Dan being the dev of Hal? What do you suggest would be the reason that Prom would lie about that? Also, if Prom lied, then why did Dan claim that Prom was "ethical" in one of his statements? There's a big inconsistency there.

Quote from: adhitthana on November 05, 2014, 10:52:37 PM

One of the hillarious things about the attack on Dan is that we have some people claiming he coded HAL and other people claiming he can't code at all. Grin

I personally don't know if Dan can code or not, but Prom clearly stated that Dan was the dev of Hal in the skype screenshots. I interpreted that as him being the main creator of Hal, regardless of whether he coded it or he had someone else code it for him. Supporters keep saying everything was public knowledge. Dan being the main guy behind Hal was not public knowledge. And he did a "code review" for Hal under the impression that he was a third party who had nothing to do with Hal. You honestly don't see anything wrong with that?

Quote from: adhitthana on November 05, 2014, 11:23:44 PM

The prometheus chat just shows Prometheus saying Dan Metcalf was "hal dev"...what ever that means.
It could mean he was a dev who was looking at HAL's code.
This is the only interpretation that makes any sense, as we know that many coins had asked dan to look over their codes.
Why would they do this? Because they knew Dan was respected as a developer.

You're joking right? How can you get "Dan was a dev who was looking at Hal's code" from something as clear as "Dan is Hal dev"? That sure is a lot of blanks to fill in there.

Also, it's clear that Dan and Prom works together (Dan said so himself at the end of the interview). I'm very curious how you feel about that.

adhitthana

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Quote from: Marlo Stanfield on November 05, 2014, 03:07:33 PM

Of course, just look at the Prometheus chat.

The prometheus chat just shows Prometheus saying Dan Metcalf was "hal dev"...what ever that means.

It could mean he was a dev who was looking at HAL's code.
This is the only interpretation that makes any sense, as we know that many coins had asked dan to look over their codes.
Why would they do this? Because they knew Dan was respected as a developer.

It makes no sense in the light of all the other things we know to twist this snippet to make out that Dan Metcalf was HAL"s developer. Roll Eyes

adhitthana

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One of the hillarious things about the attack on Dan is that we have some people claiming he coded HAL and other people claiming he can't code at all. Grin

adhitthana

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Quote from: RichardT on November 05, 2014, 07:17:28 PM

adhitthana

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Quote from: RichardT on November 05, 2014, 07:17:28 PM

Oh, Dan must of have not known that he was engaging in unethical behavior

There is no evidence that Dan did anything unethical.

There is only people like you saying he did something unethical but not saying exactly what is was.

If he did something unethical then you should be able to state what it was in a sentence or two.

adhitthana

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Quote from: wharfplow on November 04, 2014, 10:02:09 PM

There's obviously some severe fudding happening to you and your community.

But it's nothing personal.

People do not like pr0metheus and bobsurplus. You've just been caught in the middle of a war.

Yes..there has been not one scrap of evidence that Dan has done anything wrong.
What we have is Dan, who has told everyone exactly who he is from the very beginning and been open.

On the other side we have a bunch of cowards posting anonymously on the internet.

RichardT

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Quote from: wharfplow on November 05, 2014, 05:24:25 PM

Quote from: RichardT on November 05, 2014, 02:37:57 PM

Quote from: wharfplow on November 05, 2014, 09:20:28 AM

Yes dan chose to deal with the wrong people and was dragged into this mess.

Can only assume ignorance on dan's behalf. A smart project lead developer would not knowingly associate themselves with a few of the most hated members in crypto.

You really think Dan was ignorant or oblivious to all that?

Consider this: as outsiders, even you and I know about the shadiness of the people Dan worked with. How can Dan not know? He had direct communication and dealings with those people not just once, but on multiple occasions. He is fully aware of the unethical behavior that he is engaged in.

Man, some people are really brainwashed. Throwing all logic and common sense out the window just to support this guy.

I'm not supporting him. I just don't believe a claim can be made againt him. All the evidence is hearsay.

Actually no, the evidence are not hearsay. The skype screenshots in which Prometheus states that Dan is a part of his team and is the dev of Hal has been confirmed to be true (by Prom himself). How is that hearsay evidence?

Hearsay would be if a third party were to state: "Prometheus told me that Dan is on his team and is the dev of hal" without Prometheus confirming that it is true. See the difference?

It's funny, the line of defense from the start of all this up until now have been:
1. Those skype screenshots are fake. Dan is not working with Prom nor is he the dev of Hal.
2. When the screenshots were confirmed to be true, the defense turned into: Oh, Dan must of have not known that he was engaging in unethical behavior
3. And now you're saying that all evidence were hearsay anyway

What's going to be the next defense now that I've explained why the evidence is not just hearsay?