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Topic: Donetsk, Kharkov, Lugansk - way to Russia. - page 337. (Read 734937 times)

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freedomainradio.com
Good. How do you tell Putin now?  Cheesy

No need to tell Putin to do anything. He is ex-KGB and knows his job much better than the other clowns out there such as Obama. He is worried about the added expenses in the form of salaries and pensions, but he is also looking at the revenues from the coal fields of Donbass.
I know, it was a joke.
legendary
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Good. How do you tell Putin now?  Cheesy

No need to tell Putin to do anything. He is ex-KGB and knows his job much better than the other clowns out there such as Obama. He is worried about the added expenses in the form of salaries and pensions, but he is also looking at the revenues from the coal fields of Donbass.
sr. member
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Slovyansk: pro-ruSSian nazis removed his mask and admitted he is from GRU



http://irsolo.ru/boevik-v-slavyanske-snyal-masku-i-priznalsya-on-iz-gru/
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freedomainradio.com
If Donetsk votes for joining the Russia, which I'm afraid it will, and Russia ignores their wish

There is another option. Russia can support a breakaway republic, just like what they have done in South Ossetia, Abkhazia and Transdniestria. And they can issue the Russian passports to everyone living there. Problem solved.
Good. How do you tell Putin now?  Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 3808
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If Donetsk votes for joining the Russia, which I'm afraid it will, and Russia ignores their wish

There is another option. Russia can support a breakaway republic, just like what they have done in South Ossetia, Abkhazia and Transdniestria. And they can issue the Russian passports to everyone living there. Problem solved.
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Bryant, basically you're telling that it's something like... I don't know, a trick question? I get it. But do the people in Donetsk who are under tremendeous pressure really see it like that? If Donetsk votes for joining the Russia, which I'm afraid it will, and Russia ignores their wish (which is a must, you gave pretty obvious reasons), I imagine that lot of people will get very disappointed and perhaps even feel betrayed. That's why few days ago I said that Kremlin should make efforts to improve communication with Russian population in eastern Ukraine and to better explain its position to them. They refused to disarm and to leave state buildings, claiming that Lavrov didn't negotiate in their name in Geneva, I think this is very indicative sign of latent troubles in relationship Moscow-Donetsk.
legendary
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But from everything we saw it is pretty clear that Russia doesn't want to annex Donetsk and it's actually trying really hard to keep its army out of something they're calling internal Ukrainian crisis. Don't you think that these questions are little problematic for Moscow? If the referendum cannot be delayed, could at least the second questions be changed?

The questions doesn't matter. Even if the Donetsk protesters want to merge with Russia, the latter don't have the financial resources to make that possible. They just want more autonomy (federalization) and a larger share of the revenue from the coal mines. Tweaking the questions is just a strategy to make Kiev fall in line.
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I believe that the opposite is true. The separatists are demanding a referendum to be held as soon as possible. If we delay the referendum, it will again result in the upswing in violence. Else, the Kiev junta can promise them a recognized referendum at a later date.

I see, but... if I remember correctly, referendum should have two questions: 1) are you for creation of Donetsk Republic? 2) Do you want Donetsk Republic to be part of the Ukraine or to join Russia? I mean - in this tense situation majority of the people might hastily vote for joining Russia in hope of direct military help coming across the border. But from everything we saw it is pretty clear that Russia doesn't want to annex Donetsk and it's actually trying really hard to keep its army out of something they're calling internal Ukrainian crisis. Don't you think that these questions are little problematic for Moscow? If the referendum cannot be delayed, could at least the second question be changed?
legendary
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There were many messages that eastern citizens won't allow "fake elections" (direct quote) on their territory. Even before all this things happened.
legendary
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I think that the situation must be calmed down before any sort of regional referendum or country-wide elections should be held. Calling people to vote in this circumstances, when armed groups are shooting at each other cannot yield very realistic results. People on all sides are way too agitated or simply scared, and will vote out of pure frustration and fear rather than using common sense.

I believe that the opposite is true. The separatists are demanding a referendum to be held as soon as possible. If we delay the referendum, it will again result in the upswing in violence. Else, the Kiev junta can promise them a recognized referendum at a later date.
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I understand that Nemo, and I am fully aware that general "calming down" before elections/referendum might look like utopia at the moment. In order to achieve that, both sides must comply with what was agreed upon in Geneva: meaning that Kiev should stop military operation and pull back their forces into the bases, and armed pro-Russian rebels should leave occupied objects and disappear from the streets. But truth to be told, this requires good coordination, minimal mutual trust and cool heads, all of which is non-existent as it seems.
legendary
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The referendum (on whether to join Russia or to remain with Ukraine) is scheduled on May 11. The presidential elections are 2 weeks after that. By the time of the presidential elections, Donetsk might be officially a part of Russia.

I think that the situation must be calmed down before any sort of regional referendum or country-wide elections can be held. Calling people to vote in this circumstances, when armed groups are shooting at each other cannot yield very realistic results.

Agree with you there, but is there any other option? It's a chicken and egg problem. The situation cannot calm down until people see a government that they can call legitimate, and which represents also there interests, and a legitimate government is difficult to form with the country in turmoil.

The situation is very much different from Crimea, where the state of people mind was positive, peaceful, and euphoric with the prospect of finally throwing off Ukrainian 60-year long occupation. South-Eastern regions are, on the other hand, almost in a state of civil war, and they've been under the Ukrainian rule for longer - 96 years. There's much more pent up negative emotion there, ready to explode.
sr. member
Activity: 334
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The referendum (on whether to join Russia or to remain with Ukraine) is scheduled on May 11. The presidential elections are 2 weeks after that. By the time of the presidential elections, Donetsk might be officially a part of Russia.

I think that the situation must be calmed down before any sort of regional referendum or country-wide elections should be held. Calling people to vote in this circumstances, when armed groups are shooting at each other cannot yield very realistic results. People on all sides are way too agitated or simply scared, and will vote out of pure frustration and fear rather than using common sense.
legendary
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I guess that neo-fascists regime capitulation will happen again at 8 May (de facto) / 9 May (de jure). It seems that history is repeating.  Cheesy

I really hope so. It looks like this is just the beginning of the West gearing up to invade Russia once again. I'll post my musings in a new topic later. In the meantime, a joke:

- If two battalions of Russian army are sent to Kiev, how many will reach it?
- 10 or 12, in addition to all the local defence forces.
legendary
Activity: 3108
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I guess that neo-fascists regime capitulation will happen again at 8 May (de facto) / 9 May (de jure). It seems that history is repeating.  Cheesy
legendary
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The leader of People's Republic of Donetsk said that they are not going to conduct presidential elections in their region on the 25th of May, saying "How can we participate in elections that takes places at our neighbours' and not in our country"

The referendum (on whether to join Russia or to remain with Ukraine) is scheduled on May 11. The presidential elections are 2 weeks after that. By the time of the presidential elections, Donetsk might be officially a part of Russia.
legendary
Activity: 1680
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The leader of People's Republic of Donetsk said that they are not going to conduct presidential elections in their region on the 25th of May, saying "How can we participate in elections that takes places at our neighbours' and not in our country"
http://itar-tass.com/mezhdunarodnaya-panorama/1143085?utm_medium=rss20
legendary
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Gunmen attack self-defense forces in eastern Ukraine

http://rt.com/news/154472-gunmen-slavyansk-attack-defense/

Quote
Unknown gunmen attack check point near Slavyansk in eastern Ukraine. Two people were killed, local self-defense forces spokesperson told RT.
legendary
Activity: 3808
Merit: 1219
She mean more than zero? Or more than -INF?

Who cares? Consider this as her PR campaign, in preparation for the 2016 POTUS elections. She faces tough challenge from Joe Biden. So she might have thought that it will help her if she acts tough.
legendary
Activity: 3108
Merit: 1359
She mean more than zero? Or more than -INF?
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