Topic: Energi [NRG] Cryptocurrency for World Adoption | PoS | MN | No-ICO or Premine | - page 23. (Read 44363 times)

I cannot answer everything but will do my best to help build some understanding.

Regarding deposits, here is one potential issue that could occur due to a chain split. Say you sent some NRG to the exchange and you were both off chain. The exchange accepts the deposit and you trade for a different coin/token then withdraw. After that, you both realize that your transaction wasn’t valid. Since you have already withdrawn the new coin/token, the exchange cannot undo this and because the original transaction was off chain, they don’t get the NRG you sent (you may be good about it and resend but not everyone would). Now the exchange is out those funds with no way to recover them. Multiply this by however many people do their deposits at this time and it could be a massive problem. Setting an arbitrary time for confirmations is not really a solution to this because how do you determine how long it will take for the exchange to realize they are off chain?

With withdrawing, everything is in the exchanges system so if you are both off chain, the exchange still has this information saved and can process the transaction again once they are back on chain.

I cannot say regarding the commits since I am not on the tech side and am not sure on the exact reasons why each commit is done at the time it is rather than waiting longer or doing it sooner.

Sadly for 3, I don’t believe there is much else any of us can do. Personally, I try not to think about it (but of course we are always asked about it so that doesn’t work very well) but I also sit back and consider how I would feel if I sent to an exchange and my coins were lost.

I know this doesn’t add a ton of clarity but I hope it helps explain some.

Wait a second here. This is the second time NRG reveals a blacklisting process without even any announcement on the board !

Ok this might be an obvious reasons, but STILL, where is the voting ? Where the community masternode voting on taking over user funds ?

1st The fired dev ( andrey ) got his coins frozen 90K something
2nd A presumed hacker "bashful" got his coins frozen 200k something

WHERE WAS THIS POSTED ON DISCORD OR ANY OTHER MEDIUM FOR VOTING ?


I used to respect you alot Blackstone but the double standard in dealing with things really raises huge red flags.

As a business man and experienced person, for me this is totally obvious

ENERGI is owned by TOMMY WORLD POWER and he is the sole decision maker in this project, and he added the power to freeze and control any wallet as he pleases.

Good luck to all with this mess I will go ahead and delete my wallet so I don't even think about this anymore.

ominous.shark;

Hello and thank you for your comments.  I do believe you are correct in your statement that Blandin33 was referring to deposits being closed on exchanges, but I did not want to assume anything, as that is how one gets in trouble is by assuming.  

The Medium article you pointed out does mention the security, and stability of our network which is an important criteria when considering opening deposits.  There is further reference in the article as well about the scammer who attempted to steal 200k NRG from our community members  This is an item worth mentioning again for anyone who has not yet seen it.

During the migration to Gen 3, scammers attempted to steal over 200,000 NRG from our community. This would be catastrophic not only for the victims, but for everyone in the Energi ecosystem who would have suffered from major market dumping of these illicit gains.

Personally for this reason alone, I am glad that deposits are closed.  If I was one of our community members who was violated by the scammer,  I would not want them to benefit by being able to sell the stolen coins on the exchange.  For so many of our community members, any amount of Energi, no matter the value, can be life changing for them.

The reason why deposits are closed, does not affect anyone from withdrawing from exchanges - they are free to do so if they like.

As for the "accusations" being tossed around by some, that the Team is keeping deposits closed to manipulate the price - if I personally step back and look at it, it seems like just another far fetched accusation by some. The Team has stipulated  many times, and also in the medium article,  the reasons for them being closed, security, and stability of our network.  

 
I will post the article here for anyone who may want to take a few moments to read it again or for the first time.


https://medium.com/energi/important-update-exchange-deposits-8aad7a120b3e

blandin33 - Please take a moment to read as I am responding to you as to why deposits are closed-  The question has been answered many times- it is for the security and stability of the network.  Please try to be patient.


 

Actually, this did add a little bit of clarity. The explanation about chain-splits and exchange issues is a very sound one.

My only concern is that if we don't see deposits enabled by mid-May, buyer/investor/developer confidence will drop. Now for me personally, this doesn't really matter. I'm more than happy picking up some discounted NRG. However, I think at this point, the team has worked too tirelessly and the support team has been attending to people's troubleshooting and issues far too long for the price to flunk and potential use-case (Developers who want to use Energi) to walk away and take their business elsewhere.

Edit: Just curious Holukai, are you a mod or on the dev team? You seem to be thinking this through with a level-head on your shoulders.

I know this doesn’t add a ton of clarity but I hope it helps explain some.

There is a difference between Wallet to Wallet transactions and Wallet to Exchange transactions. When you send funds from a Wallet to an Exchange, there comes a point in that process where you have to give up some control over the funds; a third party becomes involved.

What does this mean in terms of the deposits being temporarily locked? Code-wise, I'm not really sure. When it comes down to the code, I don't really know what the transaction between wallet and exchange really looks like. My guess would be: it behaves differently than a Wallet to Wallet transaction. So my conclusion is that the team has written the code already, and is watching the behaviour of the Energi3 blockchain. We recently experienced a chain split.

Also, don't forget, NRG just got listed on HitBTC (like or or not) and I'm sure that adds another layer to the over-all security concern that the team has.

My Summary:
I don't believe there is malicious motives behind the actions of the Energi team in regard to locked deposits.

I DO think they need to start answering some questions however.

1) Why are deposits closed. We don't want a copy/paste answer. We want to understand the "why" and that isn't in a "I deserve to know" sort of manner, but rather, "I'm really passionate about cryptocurrency, how blockchains work, how exchanges work, etc.

2) Why is the Github so quiet?
The last commit is one line of code almost a week ago. What's stopping the team from moving forward?

3) What can WE do? Apart from sitting on our hands and trying not to think about our beloved NRG coins?

Tommy, if you're reading this, give us something. This is about a conversation. Respect. and most importantly, Honesty.

Blackstone1, I think you've mis-read Dlandin33's post.


The team has not responded with a technical reason behind the locked deposits. BUT, in the Medium article they say that the deposits being locked is due to security reasons.
So it's up to us, the viewer/speculator/investor to make a personal choice: Either we believe them, or they are lying. I think they have not given us any reason to doubt them. I don't think they've ever given us cause to suspect they are lying.


Blackstone1, basically, if the team wants to make the price of NRG go up (and to be sure, the team probably holds a sizable amount of NRG) then all they have to do is stop deposits so that people can't sell off their NRG. It's artificial inflation. More buying than selling on exchanges. <--- not necessarily true, but Blandin33 is suspicious.

However:
If I'm wrong, and they are lying and there is malicious intent (or monetary gain for the team) behind the locked deposit, the world will find out. This is not something they will be able to cover and recover from. It will be the end of the whole project (which is actually doing really well and has it's feet firmly planted right now). Also, they WILL be liable (and can be sued) regardless of the disclaimers they write "This is just a project we make no promises etc etc".

I choose to believe that they have good intent and that there is serious testing that is being performed.

My issue with BitcoinTalk right now is that there is a big difference between saying:

"I have a concern, and this is what it is, maybe the team/Tommy could address: blah blah blah"

and

"The team is a bunch of crooks, they are stealing our money, they are frauds, their entire project is a sham and has absolutely no worth, the code is glued garbage, they suck because I don't get my demands met every single time."

Huge difference. One is an assessment and the other is a flagrant accusation without merit, consideration, or real evidence.

Blandin33 Hello;

I appreciate that you have your own mind, and of course your own point of view.  I am trying to understand your statement and respond the best I can to it.

The team has been unable to answer three simple questions for almost two months.

Can you give me an example of a question that you need an answer for that has not already been answered?  Keep in mind, sometimes the answer is right in front of us, we just don't like the response that we receive, that does not mean it has not been answered. 

In response to your point: team is engaged in speculation - again I am unclear on what it is you are trying to say exactly.

If you can be a little more clear, I will do my best to respond accordingly.

The team has been unable to answer three simple questions for almost two months.

Can you give me an example of a question that you need an answer for that has not already been answered?  Keep in mind, sometimes the answer is right in front of us, we just don't like the response that we receive, that does not mean it has not been answered.

In response to your point: team is engaged in speculation - again I am unclear on what it is you are trying to say exactly.

I told you that was my point of view. I don't encourage anyone to follow it.
The team has been unable to answer three simple questions for almost two months. From this, I conclude that she does not have these answers. This means that deposits are also safe, and the team is engaged in speculation.

Blandin33, I can't claim to fully understand the nature of this current situation with the locked deposits. However, I don't think gaslighting the team is fair. I think you're creating mistaken concern where there shouldn't be any. In the long run,  if they were manipulating price as you claim, it wouldn't help them out at all and would only create scandal - which I don't think any team of a project wish upon themselves

With that said, I'm not exactly sure what you are expecting from them. Explaining why they have chosen to do this could reveal a security flaw. Things of this nature are not arbitrary. I think if this was a new project with little volume there might be cause for suspicion. But time and time again this team in particular has shown that they mean business and are not giving us the run-around.

Remember: at the end of the day, when this is over and deposits are resumed, the team will be held accountable for this decision. Do you think the team isn't aware that we want answers? We'll get answers and the issue will be addressed. If it's just swept under the rug, then there might be cause for suspicion.

Until accusers try running their own successfully crypto currency without issues, we have no grounds for complaining. Buy the coin and let them make you some easy money.

If you have issues with the team, their philosophy, their project strategies, then sell your coins and move on to the next best thing. Creating fear and stirring the pot over speculation isn't fair to the team nor is it fair to investors.

I for one, will give the team a fair shot.

The fact is that the team has been unable to give any explanation for almost two months, other than that they care about our safety. How does this happen:
transfers from exchange wallets to other wallets are secure.
transfers between other wallets are secure.
but the transfer to the exchange's wallet is dangerous.
My opinion is that they are just speculating on the price of the coin.

I wouldn't rely on the content written here on this forum as leverage against or for the legitimacy of any cryptocurrency. Anyone can say anything and that's not going to help anyone in the long term.

I've been following Energi from the side lines for a while now. They continually deliver on goals and promises. Sure, it's annoying that deposits are currently closed, but lets look at the big picture. They're creating something that has never existed before and I think they're doing a great job.

Hanlon's Razor: Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity. People need to stop going around touting anti-Energi propaganda. Unless you're on the dev team, you can't really say anything about the success or failure of this project. From the beginning, they made it clear that this was an experimental project.

If Energi wins, we win. If Energi loses, we all lose.

Take a look at their github, there are commits that are very recent and they worked around the clock to dispatch 3.0.6 following a DDos attack. If they're isn't dissemination of anti-Energi hate, I'd be worried that this project was failing. The fact that people are writing hateful (untrue) things about the project and the people involved, is proof that Energi is doing something right. (Side note: I anticipate that we see commits very soon as evidence that we're moving forward).

To follow all this however, I think it is time for the team to come forward with a new plan-of-attack. I think if the deposit had been locked for 2 weeks, that would be sufficient time to go without an explanation. If deposits are not open in the next 2 to 3 weeks, I think it is only fair that the team steps forward and provides a bit more explanation and also a timelines so we can be ready for deposits to open so we can resume using this amazing cryptocurrency.

I trust that Tommy has his head screwed on properly. I trust the team IS working right now as I type this to fix the issues at hand. Don't let fear and greed get the best of you.

I wouldn't rely on the content written here on this forum as leverage against or for the legitimacy of any cryptocurrency. Anyone can say anything and that's not going to help anyone in the long term.

I've been following Energi from the side lines for a while now. They continually deliver on goals and promises. Sure, it's annoying that deposits are currently closed, but lets look at the big picture. They're creating something that has never existed before and I think they're doing a great job.

Hanlon's Razor: Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity. People need to stop going around touting anti-Energi propaganda. Unless you're on the dev team, you can't really say anything about the success or failure of this project. From the beginning, they made it clear that this was an experimental project.

If Energi wins, we win. If Energi loses, we all lose.

Take a look at their github, there are commits that are very recent and they worked around the clock to dispatch 3.0.6 following a DDos attack. If they're isn't dissemination of anti-Energi hate, I'd be worried that this project was failing. The fact that people are writing hateful (untrue) things about the project and the people involved, is proof that Energi is doing something right. (Side note: I anticipate that we see commits very soon as evidence that we're moving forward).

To follow all this however, I think it is time for the team to come forward with a new plan-of-attack. I think if the deposit had been locked for 2 weeks, that would be sufficient time to go without an explanation. If deposits are not open in the next 2 to 3 weeks, I think it is only fair that the team steps forward and provides a bit more explanation and also a timelines so we can be ready for deposits to open so we can resume using this amazing cryptocurrency.

I trust that Tommy has his head screwed on properly. I trust the team IS working right now as I type this to fix the issues at hand. Don't let fear and greed get the best of you.

Hello Blackstone we have talked in the discord many times before. Sorry not to be able to introduce my real identity. But how does it feel to be paid via NRG and not being able to cash your salary for two months now ?

Or are employees able to deposit on exchanges as a special treatment from the World Power ?