Enjoy communism (III) rats eating dead people and people eating rats in NK - page 3.

Sithara007

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Quote from: Gyfts on August 21, 2021, 02:48:57 PM

People do know what's going on in Venezuela for the most part, everyone just ignores it because we're not allowed to talk about how socialist countries fail hopelessly with their economic situation, and how hyperinflation spirals out of control when you put all your eggs in one basket. With Venezuela, the price of oil dropped and their economy crashed because there wasn't enough economic activity to pick up where the oil left off, thanks to the government.

The mainstream media is mostly left-wing (with a few exceptions such as Fox news) and want us to believe that Socialism will result in rivers of milk and honey. But in reality, it results in the slavery of 99% of the population by the 1% elite (similar to the case in North Korea and Cuba). It is very interesting that most of those who praise socialism nowadays are those who have no experience of living in a socialist country. Hopefully these guys will get an experience to enjoy the wonders of socialist rule, when Kamala Harris is elected as the POTUS in 2024.

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Quote from: blckhawk on August 21, 2021, 02:34:37 PM

Quote from: Anonylz on August 21, 2021, 01:57:10 PM

Pardon my ignorance but I really have to ask, is this happening in this 21st century or it is the lifestyle of before in NK? I can seem to wrap my head around people not having access to the basic human stuff! How in the world I'd the people over there able to survive on a daily basis! I really can't imagine a life much harder than what this people are going through if this is what is happening, anyone able to flee from such life should be very thankful. Cry

Yes it's still happening, we just don't see it and it's not documented since people are known to get jailed if they bring or smuggle footages on their cameras, the soldiers of the regimes checks everyone because they don't want anything getting out but they're sometimes unsuccessful so we see a glimpse of the atrocities in this rogue country. They eat anything and the government still provides but not enough.

I have to say I was quite ignorant about North Korea before this topic, I have to admit to that. I thought that NK was a big dictatorship that was fascist in every possible way, sort of like Hitler and Nazi Germany, that is what I believed what was going on there. Turns out, they claim that they are a socialist nation! What an interesting view.

Now, I wonder if people here believe that this was communism failing? I mean is there any human on this topic that believes the fact that there is a fat guy at the top doing everything he wants, eating, dancing, having sex, limitless power, with some less powerful but still quite powerful generals, with death squads, with everything else that is wrong with that nation and people starving under the regime, is... communism? I mean do you know what communism is? Commune, community, communism? I still dislike communism, that is for sure (still a leftist though) but I am pretty sure any person who has ever known what a real communism is would probably know that this is a fascist dictatorship, you are aware of that right?

Gyfts

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People do know what's going on in Venezuela for the most part, everyone just ignores it because we're not allowed to talk about how socialist countries fail hopelessly with their economic situation, and how hyperinflation spirals out of control when you put all your eggs in one basket. With Venezuela, the price of oil dropped and their economy crashed because there wasn't enough economic activity to pick up where the oil left off, thanks to the government.

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Quote from: Anonylz on August 21, 2021, 01:57:10 PM

Pardon my ignorance but I really have to ask, is this happening in this 21st century or it is the lifestyle of before in NK? I can seem to wrap my head around people not having access to the basic human stuff! How in the world I'd the people over there able to survive on a daily basis! I really can't imagine a life much harder than what this people are going through if this is what is happening, anyone able to flee from such life should be very thankful. Cry

Yes it's still happening, we just don't see it and it's not documented since people are known to get jailed if they bring or smuggle footages on their cameras, the soldiers of the regimes checks everyone because they don't want anything getting out but they're sometimes unsuccessful so we see a glimpse of the atrocities in this rogue country. They eat anything and the government still provides but not enough.

Quote from: Sanugarid on August 21, 2021, 01:23:34 PM

Of course that's how it is, communism is just an illusion so the real tyrants can trick the population into believing that they're going to deliver them the paradise that they're asking for when it's really hell that they give to this people, look at Cuba, they're not prospering, they don't even have the Internet because Castro wanted communism. Remember when China destroyed their ancient artifacts as a sign of movement towards a better country, now they're chasing it and they only have fakes in mainland, all the originals are in Taiwan. Communism works in theory and in the mouth of a sweet talker and good public speaker but it won't ever work in practice because only the poor is going to suffer.

Totally agree with this one, communism is like utopia in a sense that they don't exist in real life, they're only ideas meant to drive people to do things to drive themselves towards it trying to achieve it when in reality it's not even going to happen no matter how hard they try, man will always be corrupted when they handle power.

Anonylz

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Pardon my ignorance but I really have to ask, is this happening in this 21st century or it is the lifestyle of before in NK? I can seem to wrap my head around people not having access to the basic human stuff! How in the world I'd the people over there able to survive on a daily basis! I really can't imagine a life much harder than what this people are going through if this is what is happening, anyone able to flee from such life should be very thankful. Cry

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Quote from: Snappycoco on August 21, 2021, 12:30:51 PM

Only their leaders and the rich ones are enjoying this kind of government. The hunger in NK is caused by poor government who's crazy in building weapons rather than producing food added by economic sanctions given by international community. Their leaders are having their best lives while their constituents where hungry and having no opportunities to have a good life. I feel sad for these people.

Of course that's how it is, communism is just an illusion so the real tyrants can trick the population into believing that they're going to deliver them the paradise that they're asking for when it's really hell that they give to this people, look at Cuba, they're not prospering, they don't even have the Internet because Castro wanted communism. Remember when China destroyed their ancient artifacts as a sign of movement towards a better country, now they're chasing it and they only have fakes in mainland, all the originals are in Taiwan. Communism works in theory and in the mouth of a sweet talker and good public speaker but it won't ever work in practice because only the poor is going to suffer.

Snappycoco

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Only their leaders and the rich ones are enjoying this kind of government. The hunger in NK is caused by poor government who's crazy in building weapons rather than producing food added by economic sanctions given by international community. Their leaders are having their best lives while their constituents where hungry and having no opportunities to have a good life. I feel sad for these people.

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Quote from: Leviathan.007 on August 21, 2021, 02:13:26 AM

and will allow the government to rules over people and abuse them and take advantage.

And what exactly is happening in the not communist capitalist world? The Governments don't rule over people? They don't abuse them? They don't take advantage of them? Really? Because I know people who lost jobs and wound up on streets while the governments were bailing out financial institutions back in 2008. Do you know what else I heard of? People losing their jobs and livelihood when accused (falsely or legit) of being communist supporters, and put on trial (U.S. in the 50s). What about monarchies in the Arab world, where they abuse workers that come into the country to work (Looking at you Dubai). 1 in 6 children—12.5 million—live in food-insecure households in the U.S. I was never hungry not once when I lived in a Socialist country and we were lower middle class.

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Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on August 20, 2021, 10:59:18 AM

Capitalism has its problems, of course, but I think even the poorest person in a capitalist society would prefer that system over communism, where their personal situation would probably be even worse.

I very much agree with this. I don't think capitalism is perfect, but it is certainly much better than communism, and in developed countries we have a mix of capitalism (free market, free enterprise) with socialism (regulations, taxes, redistribution).

Quote from: Sithara007 on August 20, 2021, 11:15:28 PM

Like it or not, you have to admit that the communists have the best PR among all the political parties. I have seen a lot of youths in my country idolizing criminals such as Stalin, Kim Jong Il and Che. These guys (mostly in their late teens and early 20s) get so brainwashed by the communist propaganda, that they consider it cool to disregard the national flag and national anthem. Some of them openly insult the army and support the terrorist groups. But this happens only in non-communist nations. I have never seen anyone from Cuba or Venezuela supporting communism. Perhaps they have first hand account of how to live in a communist state and that's why they hate them so much.

That is why I have created this series of threads, so that people are aware and do not forget what communism means. I have seen examples in this forum of that very thing you say.

I would just like to add that in Defector Yeonmi Park on Escaping North Korea.

She explains how she was able to escape from NK when she was 13 or 14 years old but now it is impossible because as people were escaping, the NK government increased the security measures and now there are electric fences, guards shooting to kill and then there are landmines. According to her:

"The entire country became a concentration camp."

It must be remembered that communism is such a wonderful system that all communist regimes kill people if they try to escape from there, lest they go abroad and tell what is there, and everyone wants to go and live in those communist countries (note the irony).

semobo

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Better mention it as dictatorship because every communist country is almost having the dictatorship rule which doesn't care about the people still they are funding the nuclear weapon research. I think Kim also accepted the hindrance of food supplies in their country in the international media which he never did that before itself a proof that how worse the situation of North Korea at the moment.

If there is something called God then please take care of such people.

Leviathan.007

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Communism comes from the lack of knowledge from people's side and will allow the government to rules over people and abuse them and take advantage. Unfortunately, in countries such as North Korea, their government won't allow people to get in touch with other people all over the world and will break them both economically and mentally. There are many theories and thoughts about North Korea, in my own idea if you take people's first needs they such as the ability to have freedom they will look for freedom and will not ask for any second priority needs such as internet connection or strong economic power. Also, they abuse the people's traditions and religions, that's how communism rules over the world. Just like what they do on Venezuela.

Sithara007

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Like it or not, you have to admit that the communists have the best PR among all the political parties. I have seen a lot of youths in my country idolizing criminals such as Stalin, Kim Jong Il and Che. These guys (mostly in their late teens and early 20s) get so brainwashed by the communist propaganda, that they consider it cool to disregard the national flag and national anthem. Some of them openly insult the army and support the terrorist groups. But this happens only in non-communist nations. I have never seen anyone from Cuba or Venezuela supporting communism. Perhaps they have first hand account of how to live in a communist state and that's why they hate them so much.

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Omg, that’s really terrifying and was hard to read. This was shocking to me as well. I knew about the starvation in NK, but the dead bodies, operations without anesthesia, that was an eye-opener.

Communism is terrible, I really want to punch people sometimes when they say that it can bring good. No way. It’s a hypocritical regime, aimed at bringing happiness only to the higher levels of society at the cost of other people’s lives, and that is unacceptable.

I really hate what is happier in NK. Why don’t people stand up and fight against it? I thought they had strong propaganda there and believed that they lived the happiest lives and the West is all rotten. But how can anyone living in such conditions think that there’s something worse, than this? The whole population is suffering, I really don’t get why isn’t anyone doing something about it.

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Quote from: TheNineClub on August 20, 2021, 09:19:35 AM

Let us not forget, calling something communism does not mean it's comunism. There is not one single word in the writings of Marx or Engels where it's noted that a communist regime needs to be a totalitarian dictatorship. And that's what NK is, a totalitarian dictatorship. So were a bunch of other regimes that disguised themselves under the communist flag. But ya know what, there are a bunch of other dictatorships that have nothing to do with communism and are still repressive regimes. I was born in a socialist regime that eventually broke down because of right-wing aspirations disguised under the banner of ''freedom''. As things are going right now, I can tell you for a fact that the situation of an average woman or man was better in socialism (in my country) than it is now and it's constantly going downhill. And what did the so-called seekers of freedom that opposed communism brought to my country? More corruption, thievery, and economic despair, and religious oppression in quantities never seen before in socialism (in my country).

Please, don't mix political theories with real-life adoptions and someone calling something a certain name. I can tell you from my experience, that ''communism'' you are talking about is not communism but rather a monarchy wrapped into a totality regime.

Not communism nor socialism can prevent corruption, thievery, and economic despair from our society. If we do not have an educated and helpful-minded society then there will be problems in our society. We must know that a country can be great by its people not by its ideology. In NK people let this happens after the Korean civil war. They believe in NK propaganda and support their leader with it. Now the whole population is stuck with this dire situation.

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Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on August 20, 2021, 10:59:18 AM

[...] At least not if there are human beings involved; that's been proven over and over, and no more experiments need to be run as far as I'm concerned. Capitalism has its problems, of course, but I think even the poorest person in a capitalist society would prefer that system over communism, where their personal situation would probably be even worse. As long as North Korea isn't planning on nuking any other country, I say let them be. I'm tired of the US or any other country (but it's usually the US) trying to be the global police. [...]

The Pharmacist, you say as if you have something to compare with, as if you have experienced the communist regime on yourself ... it just seems to me not very appropriate to compare the political regime of North Korea with communism as such. In addition, the main difference between North Korea and other communist countries lies in the ideology of Marxism, and this is also the main problem. Since the one-party system can change, but the completely ingrained mentality - no (as it was in the USSR). Even the tough political regime of the USSR was not so tough compared to the Korean regime ... not to mention China, where only a name remained of communism. Besides, North Korea is not a threat to either the United States or South Korea (not in a year or in 50 years).

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Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on August 20, 2021, 10:59:18 AM

I sympathize with the citizens of North Korea and wish them well, but what can or should the world do about their woes? They need to rise up and fight, IMO, if they're tired of being under the thumb of a dictatorship.

I second that, and what I believe is there is no dictatorial regime that began in a day, it is a gradual process when power hungry and brutal people take power, they slowly make things dictatorial, thus the people of North Korea should not have allowed things to get this bad, if it actually is as bad as the person in that interview claims; thus the people of North Korea should have opposed this sort of totalitarianism from the beginning, it seems it has gotten out of hand at the moment, which makes it hard to repress.

Having said that, what the outside world can do is just to to create awareness on what is happening, but I think if there is to actually be any change, then there must be a revolution, and it must stem from within and nowhere else.

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Don't forget the part that anything that is so small and the family and the oligarchs(yes, they have oligarchs, despite being a communist country) find offensive, you will be sent to a prison camp where you are going to be tortured endlessly and you will be having free trial if not real hell in those prison camps, torture for breakfast, torment in lunch and agony for dinner. North Korea is a deplorable place that should never exist. Communism there is only applied to the poor people.

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Quote from: Poker Player on August 20, 2021, 09:39:48 AM

Quote from: TheNineClub on August 20, 2021, 09:19:35 AM

Let us not forget, calling something communism does not mean it's comunism. There is not one single word in the writings of Marx or Engels where it's noted that a communist regime needs to be a totalitarian dictatorship. And that's what NK is, a totalitarian dictatorship. So were a bunch of other regimes that disguised themselves under the communist flag. But ya know what, there are a bunch of other dictatorships that have nothing to do with communism and are still repressive regimes. I was born in a socialist regime that eventually broke down because of right-wing aspirations disguised under the banner of ''freedom''. As things are going right now, I can tell you for a fact that the situation of an average woman or man was better in socialism (in my country) than it is now and it's constantly going downhill. And what did the so-called seekers of freedom that opposed communism brought to my country? More corruption, thievery, and economic despair, and religious oppression in quantities never seen before in socialism (in my country).

Please, don't mix political theories with real-life adoptions and someone calling something a certain name. I can tell you from my experience, that ''communism'' you are talking about is not communism but rather a monarchy wrapped into a totality regime.

The problem with all this is that there has not been any country that called itself communist and that followed at least in the basics the ideas of Marx, that did not end up in totalitarianism, repression and starving the population. Not one.

So, a theory that when applied repeatedly is a disaster in all cases is a garbage theory. It is not that it is badly applied, no, it is that it is a big piece of shit.

Agreed, this is the excuse that it is used to try communism one more time, those other countries were not really communist they say, we have the right formula they say, and despite all of this the results always end up being the same, however in theory communism sounds attractive to a lot of people that are envious that a single person has billions in wealth and they want that wealth for themselves, not understanding that communism does not lift the floor but it lowers the ceiling for everyone, so everyone, except those which are part of the top, will have to make do with almost nothing until the system fails.

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The problem with North Korea is that they're backed by China and Russia to continue living like this and at the same time keeps the Kims in power and hold off US and it's allies to focus on this rogue nation while the other rivals floursih. Communism is good in theory but the problem is that people that taste power becomes corrupt so it can't work on application, the evil in man's heart will always creep in to make things ugly.

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Listened to her weeks ago, I found it abit hard to believe... or better still, I didn't completely trust that because I haven't verified it yet. I guess the best way it can be verified is to have neutral access to the country. You'll probably need to have over 29 honest people confirm this by paying random visits to any community. And this could be allowed to happen for more than a month until many communities are visited and reports compiled.
I have observed people exaggerated things on the internet or media concerning things that happen in places I'm familiar with... I wouldn't totally believe until I get that from reliable/trustworthy sources

What she said that really interests me alot was that she was not used to not being told what to do in here new country like it was done in the country she fled from, and she didn't really like that... so I concluded that they were heavily controlled over that she thought it was ok/better to be controlled.

Topic: Enjoy communism (III) rats eating dead people and people eating rats in NK - page 3. (Read 548 times)