Topic: Esoteric Investments, LLC (up to 1% earnings) - page 7. (Read 18679 times)

Transparency is not a "project" you are either transparent or you are not. there is no reason why this should be taking this long to "be transparent." Show how many coins were given to you on the blockchain, show those coins going to exchanges, show some sort of history of past trades, show the coins you use for payouts coming out exchanges. If you can't do that without exposing your business, you can't be transparent, so stop saying it.

This is pure semantics, you are supposedly in the business of asset growth using a trading mechanism involving bitcoin and alts to generate profit. How that profit is denominated is irrelevant.
What is relevant to anyone who wants to take your advice "Sit back and enjoy the show, hopefully we can earn you some money along the way" is:
A) You are actually trading, which is why transparency is important, otherwise the ponzi accusations will not stop.
B) If you are likely to be shut down by a regulatory body, which is why your vagueness on that subject is concerning.
C) That your trading system is sustainable and not just a 'flash in the pan'. Hints of "we'll do anything to make money" diversification don't inspire confidence.

You showed poor judgement in botching your launch by ambulance chasing BT survivors. Butthurt sensitivity to people's legitimate skepticism since then hasn't helped your cred either.
I have no idea whether an investment with you would be anything more than a pure gamble and your 'make it up as you go along' approach certainly isn't helping.

We trade bitcoins in alt coin markets and grow your bitcoin deposit by 0-2% daily, at this moment we aren't concerned with making you money in the form of USD or any fiat dollar. If that's what you are looking for then don't use our service because you will be very disappointed. Some people really believe in Bitcoin and want it and more of it no matter its current fiat value. Others are concerned with the fiat value, but also hold a stake just in case bitcoin surges to the 1000s again. These are the people that will be interested in what Esoteric has to offer currently. We are not in this business currently for the people who want more money, (that's in store for the future) we're in it for the people who want more bitcoin.

I think most people understand that if you want to make money trading bitcoins you can't have all your funds in bitcoin all the time. The fact that you don't just makes your claim of earning 1% every day seem even more silly.

Right but at 20 btcs we're not there. At 100btcs we might start seeing the effects of having too much. It's something we are aware of, and at that point either stop taking in deposits or we change the payout model to something more conventional of a private mutual/hedge fund.

Or what'd be amazing is if we are at that point fully accredited, then we'll just use that coin and turn it into USD investments like stocks and commodities. Though again this will probably come with a change to our operations. Adding USD in addition to BTC adds a lot of complexity, or was I the only one puzzled by how BT did it. At that point the sky is the limit for the fund. We don't want to be only in Bitcoin forever. The term esoteric investments in the financial world spans much farther then digital currencies.

In the next year Esoteric Investments is going to change A LOT both the face and the inner workings of it. I'm excited for it! 

Sit back and enjoy the show, hopefully we can earn you some money along the way.

I know for certain that it's possible with a limited amount of funds, but it doesn't scale to very high sums. With a higher sum of invested money the profits measured in percent will fall. That means it would be stupid for anyone who figures out how to give away the profits to random strangers.

We have upwards of 20btc under management right now. Current holdings we aren't sure if we want to divulge, especially right now with so much negativity around us. Could encourage some people to screw that market(s) up. When all holdings are sold off we plan to release the trade history of that coin.

Before any coin began to come into Esoteric, Bitcoin Trader was the big thing which did not feature any transparency. Now that they have fallen it is a major issue for us and you. Hence why its a new project added to our growing list.

Yes, I want to help you and the people you are making money for.

If you want to be transparent, and aren't running a scam, it really shouldn't take any effort at all to know how many coins you have, where they are, and how much you are making. I don't see a valid reason in that wall of text why you can't start being transparent now.

It may take time and effort to automate that, but if that's important, it probably should have been done before you started, and it still doesn't mean you can't do it manually regularly.

If you want to be transparent the question "how many coins do you have?" should be answered by a number, not a wall of text.

Read the FAQ and our materials before you join the groups of people slandering us who have also not read them. We often do trade on holidays and weekends, markets don't take off for weekends and holidays and if there is a good opportunity or bitcoin is in the markets at that time we wont take off either. We just do not process payouts or report the payout on those days.If the market crashes while our eyes aren't on a computer there are automated stop losses and sells in place to automatically sell the coin when it falls below a point or above a point.

Today's payout: 0.01 BTC, how are you supposed to know how much of that bitcoin is yours and not other depositors. Percentages work better there.

Coin is deposited randomly at all times throughout the day, into a deposit wallet that doesn't become active in the trading wallet(s) till the next day, that furthermore we may not even move into the trading wallet if there is no place for it to be invested at that time. There are several trading wallets as it isn't always one person trading nor are we on only one exchange. When we sell off some of our holdings this profits will be moved into the profits wallet and our cut will go into yet another one. Probably one wallet I forgot to mention too. and this system is still being designed to what wallets we really need how many, and then their addresses. Once its design we then will need to code out a way to take all of the wallet balances and add them to display our finances in a clear way to everyone.

Once all of that is in place you will be able to see the estimated pool balance, and the profits that we've collected to ensure they add up with the math that we're presenting in our payouts. And after all of this work, there are still flaws to provide transparency for.

Being transparent in Bitcoin, where even the government with all their resources have trouble following and accounting for things, is a ton easier said than done.

We'll need some time to put together a satisfactory system. All the other nuances being brought to us distract us from that. So if you want to see this in the next week or two. Leave us to our work. Unless you actually have something helpful to say in obtaining these goals.

Why do you need a plan for transparency?

If you want to be tranparent, be transparent. how many coins have people given you? Where are they? how much do you make each day? Why can't you post the results in real numbers instead of percentages?

How are you (and your clinets) protected if the market crashes when you take off for important holidays like Halloween?

Are you dumb, you don't see anyway that it is possible to make over .1% on average daily. In crypto markets moving dozens to hundreds of a percent in hours to days. We have a few dozen under management at the moment. With that little it is easy. As we move to a few 100 I doubt profits will be anywhere where they have been.

Also some updates on the legal front. We are within exemptions of many reporting and registration requirements with both the state(s) and federal government. Paperwork is in the process of filing under these exemptions. We soon may begin having to take down more information about investors to know of their location for AML, CTF, and KYC compliances, but this is after all what you all wanted...Enjoy!

and nope no summons served yet.

And nothing about our site or service is generic lol #CUSTOM

Last to whoever was saying "If only some public ledger of every transaction existed, and could be used to verify what we're doing." If you could read and bothered to really look at us you'd know that's our plan, or one of our plans for transparency. As you can see from our lottery we like using the block chain to prove something is fair. Till we design a system to do it for you, then you all can follow the block chain and keep up with it yourself.

You'll all just have to wait and see. Can't make everything overnight while keeping up with the markets.

Again I say if you trust us you can start earning sooner. If you don't , then don't invest and maybe wait for all the transparency and regulations to develop. WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING MORE THEN THAT!

Even an offer of 0.1%/day would most likely be a scam.

This is a friendly reminder that any "investment program" that offers fixed returns of 1% or more is a HYIP and therefore a Ponzi Scheme.

If you invest in these programs you not only stand to lose all your money but in the event of legal proceedings you may be subject to charges of aiding and abetting criminal activity as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-yield_investment_program

Dear scammer, have you been served yet ?

http://cointelegraph.com/news/112811/us-regulators-one-two-punch-sec-probes-crowdsales-fincen-takes-aim-at-exchanges

Oh wait, you're not allowed to tell us. Wink twice if you got the letter .

Finally, some guidance to go by on this matter:

http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/rp/rulings/pdf/FIN-2014-R011.pdf (October 27th, 2014)
 

FinCEN told CoinDesk that the ruling is meant to be an official opinion to the companies in question, however, and that it may not apply more broadly.

Yea that don't make sense grammatically, what is a "generic web investment funds as well?"

...as well as what? Or in addition to what?

Just asking for clarification. That was also something else that gave me a red flag about BT ...their English sucked for a company claiming to be running in the UK...aka Russians lol in my opinion.

Good point LOL 

ROFL ... BT said the same 

Their #3 client posted the following about that: 


 

Good point, I was going off the investment contract definition used in the Shavers case.

After all this discussion, I can't fathom how any rational person would think the "because... bitcoin" defense would work with the SEC.