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Topic: eXch - instant exchange BTC / LN / XMR / LTC / ETH / ERC20 - page 14. (Read 29112 times)

legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 6382
Looking for campaign manager? Contact icopress!
We still have 5 slots available! Smiley


Quote from: paid2
Everyone is welcome to join the 17th Free Raffle to try to win a nice Custom eXch Cryptosteel Capsule!  Grin

[FREE RAFFLE] - Custom eXch Cryptosteel Capsule (#17)!

Actually 4 slots got filled and only one has remained available for now. The moment of choosing a winner is getting close.
Anyone still didn't join the raffle? Last chance for raffle #17!

(Do I have to also write about how great the prize is? I hope the name of it already tells a lot!)
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 1065
Crypto Swap Exchange
We still have 5 slots available! Smiley


Quote from: paid2
Everyone is welcome to join the 17th Free Raffle to try to win a nice Custom eXch Cryptosteel Capsule!  Grin

[FREE RAFFLE] - Custom eXch Cryptosteel Capsule (#17)!
legendary
Activity: 2212
Merit: 7064
So what happens now is that any coins sent from eXch to centralized platforms platforms are more at risk of triggering AML procedures?
Maybe that was the point of whole operation with Genesis Trading, but it all depends what tools are used to check risk for transactions and I don't trust any of this tools.
I am not sure we should blindly trust anything we see on twitter, especially when this news is not reported anywhere else to my knowledge.
legendary
Activity: 3472
Merit: 3507
Crypto Swap Exchange
It seems to be already solved:



Probably just some issue with the ETH node?
Yap, it's back to normal for me too. I guess it's a temporary problem.
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 1065
Crypto Swap Exchange
What is happening here, there is a warning that 'Issues present'.
I did not manage to find any dysfunctionality in the work of exch.



In the system status, the last thing we have is a notification about a Heavy DDoS attack from August 9.
Quote
09-08-2024 Heavy DDoS attack
There is an ongoing DDoS attack targeting our clearnet servers and Tor backend performed by the "Infinity Exchanger" operators. Expect some access issues till the threat actor stops.

It seems to be already solved:



Probably just some issue with the ETH node?
legendary
Activity: 3472
Merit: 3507
Crypto Swap Exchange
What is happening here, there is a warning that 'Issues present'.
I did not manage to find any dysfunctionality in the work of exch.



In the system status, the last thing we have is a notification about a Heavy DDoS attack from August 9.
Quote
09-08-2024 Heavy DDoS attack
There is an ongoing DDoS attack targeting our clearnet servers and Tor backend performed by the "Infinity Exchanger" operators. Expect some access issues till the threat actor stops.
legendary
Activity: 2730
Merit: 7065
Of course it's possible (at least partially) to trace banknotes. They have serial numbers that are registered at several occasions.
Sure, you can do that. Banks and financial institutions do it. If a big bank robbery happens, chances are that the banks and its government know what bills to be on the lookout for based on their serial numbers. But regular people don't do that. Me and you don't take note of our bill's serial numbers. With bitcoin, you have a public ledger and anyone can follow the trail to the point that it goes to a mixer/tumbler/coinjoin service.

The difference isn't in the fact that Bitcoin can be traced easier, the difference is in the legal interpretation. I believe that's because governments have an interest in keeping confidence in their own fiat money, which at the same time gives them an interest in doing the opposite to Bitcoin.
You have got a point there. But I think that it's not just that they don't want confidence in bitcoin being high. It's also their incapability to advance with the times and understand new technologies. World governments are only (relatively) quick in collecting taxes, everything else is a slow and tedious process. 
legendary
Activity: 3290
Merit: 16489
Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021
That's not the case with cash.
Of course it's possible (at least partially) to trace banknotes. They have serial numbers that are registered at several occasions. But it was ruled out by court centuries ago:
First of all I was going to explain what we mean by fungibility before bitcoin and ecash. It's an old legal concept in fact, about paper currency. It's the idea that a one ten dollar note is the same as any other ten dollar note. If you receive a note that was involved in a theft, 10 transactions ago, and the police investigate the theft, they have no right to remove the ten dollar note from your pocket. It's not your fault that it was involved in a previous crime. And so bank notes actually have serial numbers, so it would be possible for a stolen note to be traced back to you.

This first arose, there was a 17th century court case where a wealthy merchant sent a couple of high-value bank notes to a colleague in the post and they never arrived. Before he sent them, he was quite paranoid that they would get stolen. He wrote down the serial numbers and made a mark on them. Sure enough they didn't arrive, so he put in a complaint with the bank, and evenutally the notes turned up at the bank. He tried to get the bank to return the notes to his ownership. The courts sided with the bank. Their reason was that if notes could be returned to their original owner after a theft, it would damage confidence in currency and it would be bad for business, the currency would become unusable because every time you received the paper note you would have to look in the newspaper whether it was reported stolen, or you would have the risk of it being taken, or you would have to rush to the bank to deposit it so that it was the bank's problem.

That became a legal concept and it applies to most countries now.
The difference isn't in the fact that Bitcoin can be traced easier, the difference is in the legal interpretation. I believe that's because governments have an interest in keeping confidence in their own fiat money, which at the same time gives them an interest in doing the opposite to Bitcoin.
legendary
Activity: 2730
Merit: 7065
Too many people take them seriously. Some of the euro bills in my wallet may have been stolen at some point in the past, but none of that is my concern because I didn't steal them.
And many probably have powder residues on them as well. The danger of digital money, and also bitcoin for that matter, is that there is a track of where the money came from. That's not the case with cash. That's why we have such services as blockchain analysis companies, which have declared themselves to be the judges of what goes and what doesn't. Sadly, innocent people get caught in the middle just like you explained. You could get your bitcoin confiscated tomorrow by custodial services, and your only mistake would be being in possession of coins that at one point in time were used or are believed to have been used for something bad.

Since no one in power cares to come up with a better system, we should all stay away from CEXs and custodial services who view the findings of blockchain analysis as the truth and comply with all their recommendations.
legendary
Activity: 3290
Merit: 16489
Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021
The thing is, that money could in fact be stolen, but with an unprofessional and shitty attitude as displayed by that blockchain analysis company and supposed trading/exchange service, who can take them seriously?
Too many people take them seriously. Some of the euro bills in my wallet may have been stolen at some point in the past, but none of that is my concern because I didn't steal them. That's what fungibility is all about. Nobody would trust banknotes if they could be marked "tained" later on, and nobody will trust Bitcoin if that can happen either.
legendary
Activity: 1568
Merit: 6660
bitcoincleanup.com / bitmixlist.org
So what happens now is that any coins sent from eXch to centralized platforms platforms are more at risk of triggering AML procedures?

Blockchain analysis companies have a real power towards the Cex’s, as they can potentially flag some fraudulent behaviour of cryptocurrency users.
If a cex decides not to abide by those warnings, it can find itself in a weak situation in an eventual subsequent trial.
That sounds like extortion (I can't think of a better word in English).

Look up "strong-arm".
legendary
Activity: 2730
Merit: 7065
The whole chain analysis business works based on a "trust me bro" scheme. It's stolen bro, trust me. We have investigated it and wrote a report. What more do you want? Oh, you want evidence and an explanation? What a fascist! Don't you worry about that. It's stolen because we told you it's stolen. You don't need to worry about the details.

The thing is, that money could in fact be stolen, but with an unprofessional and shitty attitude as displayed by that blockchain analysis company and supposed trading/exchange service, who can take them seriously?
legendary
Activity: 3290
Merit: 16489
Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021
Blockchain analysis companies have a real power towards the Cex’s, as they can potentially flag some fraudulent behaviour of cryptocurrency users.
If a cex decides not to abide by those warnings, it can find itself in a weak situation in an eventual subsequent trial.
That sounds like extortion (I can't think of a better word in English). So exchanges buy "services" from companies that "advice" them, and if they don't, they risk problems later on? While this "advice" is based on arbitrary non-published criteria?
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 17063
Fully fledged Merit Cycler - Golden Feather 22-23
Since that communication was apparently targeting centralized exchanges, we (eXch) have sent an inquiry to that company (Elliptic) in order to get clarifications on that situation. The answer we received from Elliptic consisted in them not being able to provide any details on that matter nor proofs of the eventual hack which for us was a solid sign that they have none.
Did you ever get some better response from so-called blockchain intelligence/investigation companies in other more sound cases?

It's quite lame from Elliptic to issue such risk flags without providing actual evidence and solid proofs. Is this "normal" behavior of blockchain intelligence companies?



This is a very good question, and the evidence provided here is quite significant.
Blockchain analysis companies have a real power towards the Cex’s, as they can potentially flag some fraudulent behaviour of cryptocurrency users.
If a cex decides not to abide by those warnings, it can find itself in a weak situation in an eventual subsequent trial.
Given this very high power, I would have expected such firms to be way more responsible in communicating their stance on their own warnings.
Well done Exch for not surrendering to passive execution.
hero member
Activity: 714
Merit: 1010
Crypto Swap Exchange
Since that communication was apparently targeting centralized exchanges, we (eXch) have sent an inquiry to that company (Elliptic) in order to get clarifications on that situation. The answer we received from Elliptic consisted in them not being able to provide any details on that matter nor proofs of the eventual hack which for us was a solid sign that they have none.
Did you ever get some better response from so-called blockchain intelligence/investigation companies in other more sound cases?

It's quite lame from Elliptic to issue such risk flags without providing actual evidence and solid proofs. Is this "normal" behavior of blockchain intelligence companies?


We then have found a lot of contacts of older and actual Genesis Trading representatives by doing some due diligence on that company and sent them a direct question asking to clarify whether the 4000 BTC transfer was a result of an exploit or not. The answer we got is a complete absence of answer, which for us was a solid sign of that company not being too much worried about that transfer suggesting this was not a hack at all.
Absence of any answer could indicate a lot of possibilities: they have no clue what's going on, they don't care when a customer is to blame, incompetence, they want to hide something, ...

Did you ever get a better answer in other cases?


Another key point is that eXch has never received any law enforcement request in regards to these funds which means there is no official investigation ongoing in regards to these funds.
I guess it depends on how competent law enforcement actually is and maybe which country is involved. From your own past experience: is law enforcement really quick enough to contact involved companies/projects to aid a quick incident response?



It would sure be interesting to know what's actually going on if and when truth surfaces.
legendary
Activity: 3472
Merit: 3507
Crypto Swap Exchange
It is unbelievable that someone claims that over 4000 BTC was stolen, but that no one has concrete evidence for this and that there is no official investigation, while at the same time everyone who received the transaction from the disputed address is asked to freeze these funds...

If the services would stop freezing coins even with the smallest excuses, there would probably be fewer dramas like this. Of course, this goes together with all AML checks, it has never been easier to mark some coins as tainted.
legendary
Activity: 3234
Merit: 5637
Blackjack.fun-Free Raffle-Join&Win $50🎲
It is unbelievable that someone claims that over 4000 BTC was stolen, but that no one has concrete evidence for this and that there is no official investigation, while at the same time everyone who received the transaction from the disputed address is asked to freeze these funds...

It is definitely not easy to be in this business, because sooner or later you find yourself in situations like this where you have to defend your reputation because someone is "playing" on social networks.
full member
Activity: 124
Merit: 1129
eXch official statement on recent 4064.37689539 BTC transfer from Genesis Trading
                            
Following two recent tweets of ZachXBT who actively reported these 4000 BTC originating from Genesis Trading as "stolen" based only on a presumption, including a statement from some exchange misleadingly branded "NonKYC" that has confirmed it selectively scams its users:                      


https://twitter.com/zachxbt/status/1825499490956231021


https://twitter.com/zachxbt/status/1830918003724103919

We (eXch) declare, that up to the date of this publication, despite of numerous completely wrong statements in regards to that event coming from both professional and amateur (Twitter-based) researchers, Genesis Trading did not officially confirm they were exploited or hacked, nor they have reached any competent authorities filing a theft complaint, which would be a first step for a supposed victim to define their funds stolen.

While eXch has received and processed a big stash (around 1500 BTC) of these funds in multiple batches, we were acknowledged that Elliptic (a company considered "industry leader" in chain analysis solutions) issued a notice to all their partners informing that the BTC originating from bc1qemvgj4vdk9l9stn4978nf3ce47jw8l9xtzm8am is a result of a theft in the following communication:
 
Quote
Elliptic Customer Advisory
Suspicious transfer of $238 million confirmed as theft

Friday, August 23, 2024: Earlier this week, we reported a suspicious transfer resulting in a loss of $238 million.

The Elliptic team has continued to monitor the situation, and has since been able to confirm that this suspicious transfer was indeed a theft, so all funds should be treated as stolen.

As a reminder, your Risk Rules will cover the identified addresses under the ‘Thief’ category and have already been labelled in our tools as ‘Fraud Incident - 5812609684’ and ‘Fraud Incident - 5812609684 (suspected post-swap)’.

---

What Actions Do Compliance Teams Need To Take?

We appreciate that speed is critical in identifying any fund flows associated with stolen or flagged addresses. Part of our daily work is to keep your risk monitoring tools up to date.

- Your Risk Rules already cover the identified addresses under the Thief category.

- The identified addresses have been labeled in our tools as 'Fraud Incident - 5812609684’ and ‘Fraud Incident - 5812609684 (suspected post-swap)’.
   
- Any transactions or addresses linked to this theft and screened through Elliptic will trigger a risk score.
   
- Over time, our systems may identify additional addresses with exposure to these stolen funds. We recommend using our tools to periodically re-screen wallets and transactions in real-time rather than relying on a static list that may be out-of-date.

We continue to monitor the situation and will add additional addresses to our systems if necessary.

Since that communication was apparently targeting centralized exchanges, we (eXch) have sent an inquiry to that company (Elliptic) in order to get clarifications on that situation. The answer we received from Elliptic consisted in them not being able to provide any details on that matter nor proofs of the eventual hack which for us was a solid sign that they have none.

We then have found a lot of contacts of older and actual Genesis Trading representatives by doing some due diligence on that company and sent them a direct question asking to clarify whether the 4000 BTC transfer was a result of an exploit or not. The answer we got is a complete absence of answer, which for us was a solid sign of that company not being too much worried about that transfer suggesting this was not a hack at all.

Meanwhile, absolutely every blockchain investigation company has marked this address as a "hack reported by community" with a score of critical risk, suggesting every CEX to freeze any deposits associated with these funds.

The "hack reported by community" tag assigned to that address by every major chain intel company obviously suggest that the only source of their information was this single post on Twitter: https://twitter.com/zachxbt/status/1825499490956231021

Another key point is that eXch has never received any law enforcement request in regards to these funds which means there is no official investigation ongoing in regards to these funds.

Based on the mentioned above, we at eXch believe there is absolutely no ground to assume these funds were stolen due to lack of evidence and everyone trying to claim the otherwise is simply misleading the general public.

We at eXch will continue to defend truth and operate based on facts instead of assumptions, thus we deny any allegations targeting our project in that regards on various social media platforms.

To those curious about who Genesis Trading are, we suggest to visit their official website and a Wikipedia page about them at the following links:

https://genesistrading.com
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genesis_(cryptocurrency_company)
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 6524
Fully-fledged Merit Cycler|Spambuster'23|Pie Baker
Everyone is welcome to join the 17th Free Raffle to try to win a nice Custom eXch Cryptosteel Capsule!  Grin

Thanks again paid2 & eXch! I just joined the raffle. I have 3 more chances of winning this beautiful capsule Smiley Congrats to all previous winners!

The raffle is announced also inside the Romanian translation of OP and, thanks to NeuroticFish, also inside the Romanian thread dedicated for contests.



Side note, I made an appeal inside all translation of eXch thread, to all users from the respective local boards, to report those 2 remaining websites impersonating eXch.
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 1065
Crypto Swap Exchange
Everyone is welcome to join the 17th Free Raffle to try to win a nice Custom eXch Cryptosteel Capsule!  Grin

[FREE RAFFLE] - Custom eXch Cryptosteel Capsule (#17)!

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