Topic: Exchange accidentally sent 512 bitcoins after coding error - page 14. (Read 35497 times)

@bitlane: have you ever heard about tor or vpns?

Yes Mike, Ben (the theif) is located in Oregon hence the pasting of Oregon state law. I'm from the UK so I don't know how you guys handle things over there but from the information above it seems almost perfectly clear Ben has broken Oregon states law.

Yes, me idiot. Are you Caveman typing broken English ?

I know like dynamic ip. Perhaps you study how dynamic ip lease work when start router have another and you restart it and have another. Unless you change MAC address each time you restart router or have ISP that use 1 minute lease time, you are wrong. If you need lesson, please tell me and I provide.

....wow...I'm glad that is over with, as I can go back to typing near-proper sentances that don't read like I just learned English last week.

LMAO.

Let me know how that works out for you. It usually requires sovereign territory and lots of firepower.

Hey, Buddy... are you seriously asking me to not think here? And then asking me in the next breath to think about some law code from (where?) Oregon?

Oh, geez, well, you got me there. Except:

- state law isn't clear at all, ever, anywhere
- state courts are typically shit, approaching justice when they do as likely by accident as by intent
- jurisdiction issues in this case, particularly since the sum involved is only ~US$5k would be more difficult to navigate than they're worth
- evil illuminati lawyers would skim 30% off this easy
- oh, right, and... we always have the opportunity to work our own law

But hey, who am I to argue with someone who might think that the reasoning a bunch of dead, wizened fucks who had fancy offices in Helsinki is pure gold?

Mike, there is no thinking on this one. Ben is clearly in the wrong, hook line and sinker.
See this: http://www.leg.state.or.us/ors/164.html
And below quotes:

Mike, Thank You.

I do not really have aspiration to be a legal guy, judge or mediator, nor I have any formal legal training. (lots of informal though)

It is IMO worthwhile idea to have some kind of mediation service to resolve bitcoin disputes, particularly when seeing threads like this. At least over time it could build some kind of moral authority and possibly influence people who are not malicious but simply misguided and ignorant of law or who maybe have temporary deficit of common sense.

I could potentially participate in your project somehow, because I think it is interesting and useful for the community and if it is compensated somehow (yes I am that egoistical here). In any case it is better to discuss it in private.

At the same time, I have to tell you about what happens in UK if you send bank transfer by mistake to a wrong person/account. In such a case the bank will forward your letter asking to return the money to the owner of "bank error in your favour" account (or ask him on your behalf). If money are not returned promptly, a civil lawsuit can be filed against the "finder keeper" and it is almost certain that court will pass a judgement requiring "finder keeper" to pay back the money, legal costs, and potentially interest.

This is common practice. Usually, though people just return the money when asked first time and this rarely goes beyond first chat of the "finder keeper" with his legal council.

I hope they hang all the brown people who dare become involved in bitcoin. Seriously, this is fucking retarded.

They are making a JUSTICE group 

No, and that isn't what we're talking about here. See you on YOSPOS.

Why did you post what you think when the law is clear?

Vlado, I like your style in this thread. A lot.

On a technical basis here, there is no case: phantomcircuit's system was simply in error. I would find that in terms of pure possession law, the situation is analogous to this. You're a manager for a (very honest, very fair, completely unlike all that exist today) bank with a bunch of gold in the vault and a moldy basement. You issue a clean-up order to the janitorial service, but you make a typo. What you meant to say was "get the mold out and throw it out back", but you typed "g" instead of "m", so all those nice bars and krugers ended up next to the bin in the parking lot. Passersby who scoop up the sparkly should -not- be assaulted, kidnapped and caged for doing so.

On the other hand, those identified as having loaded their pockets due to a simple error -do- have an ethical obligation to return the property if promptly called upon it. I do not want to live in a society where after setting my bag down for a few minutes some guy runs off with it screaming "FINDERS KEEPERS!" and everyone else defends that kind of behavior.

Additionally, I don't want to live in a society where assaulting, kidnapping and caging people is viewed as a reasonable course in matters such as this.

In this -particular- case, I think it's right that BenDavis repay phantomcircuit. If the USD/BTC rate went up or stayed the same since the bogus transactions, BenDavis's debt should be no more than 98% of the value at time of transfer, with any transaction/conversion fees in BenDavis's favor. If the rate went down, BenDavis's debt should be no more than 98% of the current value at time of judgment, conversion/transaction fees disposed the same.

BenDavis has certainly expressed bad faith in his sale of property coming into his hands with questionable title, especially given his response to phantomcircuit's claim. phantomcircuit's speech in trying to exact a legitimate claim may be questionable, but that is a completely separate cause of action not to be considered here.

Should BenDavis fail to abide by such a reasonably-argued order (and I am NOT claiming that the above is), his sanction should be a detailed, public excommunication of the BenDavis nym, at a minimum, combined with an invitation to parties to the court to participate in an investigation into his true identity, so that he might be more efficiently shunned at least until such time as he makes restitution.

Vladimir: I just registered bitcoincourt.com. Would you like to be a Justice and partner in building something like that?

It's in situations like this that the IDIOTS appears.

Woah, ip black list, are you idiot or what? Study how ip work before telling us what to do. Do you know like dynamic IP? I start my router i have an ip. I restart it i have another one. I restart it again, i have another one.

Exactly my point.  Tort conversion is a civil case.  How is anyone going to "go to jail" without a prosecutor pressing charges in a criminal court? There's a lot of crimes that must be prosecuted, this isn't high on the "must" list. 

Prosecutors aren't involved in torts.  Prosecutors go after crimes.  In this case, the crime is felony grand theft.  In many places, the prosecutor must prosecute felonies, by statue, whether or not the victim agrees, or they risk going to prison themselves.

First things first: find a prosecutor that gives a shit what a bunch of internet nerds think about tax evasion, money laundering, ponzi/pyramid schemes, and still chooses to chase down a stupid civil tort case instead of the prior list of felonies.

It really doesn't matter what legal gibberish you can spout or what your briefs say, any judge is simply going to look at it, not understand any of it, and tell you that he totally understands intangible property, and he knows what "interest" means, and that even though you were an involuntary bailee, with only the crudest and most basic standard of care for your possession, you've somehow managed to reach a level best described as "malice aforethought", and that he really needs the bailiff to escort you back to booking so that you can be processed pending your transfer from county jail to state prison.  You may think you're a legal expert, but it turns out that courts don't give a fuck what the dispute is about, they only care about the actions of the parties involved.

Fixed and inverted that for ya.

If you doubt this outcome, go hang out in district court for a while.  Keep track of the number of cases that correspond to fiat money and physical property vs. intangible property and interests in same.

You're not really grasping the simple concepts involved here:
1) Bitcoins are an attempt to flee government oversight.
2) The coins weren't stolen - they were sent by a negligent programmer.
3) You're whining about somebody taking advantage of that negligence on a forum that's founded on taking advantage of other people's ignorance while asking for legal intervention from the very body that bitcoin seeks to undermine?

So if you weren't born stupid, what's your excuse?

To back up my point let me quote a wise bitcoiner, NothinG