Topic: first bitmain antminer S10 speculation thread (probably) - page 2. (Read 29575 times)

There is no news because this is a useless speculation thread based on nothing but random guesses from people on the internet. There are no facts to support any of this.

Still waiting.... Is there anywhere to get some news? Not a lot of info from Bitmain these days

this is hard to imagine. I expect not that much increase in efficiency, due to semiconductor technologies you maybe reach 80mJ/TH, does some1 know? the chips are sourced with 3.3V ? I think so, they could find asic runnig at 1.8V, but i dont think this makes the consumption a half, maybe 3 quarter, then theyy could increase the quantity of units, and the density of units in one chip. this will become amazing, then will come the point you can not earn with bitoin because the currency cost is higher than the earnings.

Ok thanks for your information

When TSMC is talking about “high performance” they have e.g. GPUs in mind. NVIDIA and former ATI (now AMD) are TSMC customers. There are lots of high performance networking product e.g. from Broadcom or Qualcom too.
In principle it is everything, which is not battery powered and needs maximum compute performance.

Thanks for your info but about 7 nm nodes TSMC according to their website NOT ACCORDING TO ME has divided the 7nm segment into 2 divisions and on their website it specifically says one for mobile phones and the other for high computing power chips before that they have not divided this into 2 segments, may be these high computing power chips are for some other use also rather than only ASIC MINERS

No offence, but NotFuzzy is right.
If you want to build everything, which is currently mining again, from scratch, you would have to produce less than 60k 28nm wafers (assuming about 100 THash/s per 300mm wafer).
This is the monthly production capacity of a single giga fab. TSMC, GF, Samsung, Intel, UMC, … all the major foundries have at least one 28nm giga fab. There are not so much 14/16nm fabs around, but considering Moore’s law only 30k 14/16nm wafers would be needed in this case.
The theoretical revenue a foundry could make, if it produces all ASICs for 6 Exa-Hash/s in 28nm (or 14/16nm) would be less than $300M. That is about 1% of TSMC’s yearly revenue. I’m not saying, that this is nothing, it’s much more than I was predicting 3 years ago. But it’s probably still not enough to get any special conditions for early access to the currently very rare 7nm production capacities.

Thanks for the update about TSMC it was really informative

 Overall perhaps of ALL of their lines, but NOT on their 12/16nm node line(s).
 NVidia specifically moved to make their GTX 1050 and 1050ti at Samsung because TSMC didn't have the CAPACITY available to make those with all of it's then-current contracts (including the NVidia one for the 1060 and up).

 TSMC DOES have other lines still running on older nodes, like 28 and 40 nm (possibly 22nm but I'm not SURE there) that are kept busy enough to be profitable - AFAIK they still have at least one line running 55nm for older chips that don't NEED the current node but are still practical to use.
 In example, you don't waste the money making a radio/clock/alarm chip on current process because it doesn't NEED the ultimate in efficiency - same for Car "radio" stuff, boomboxes, televisions, and such.

Thanks for your reply I didn't said that bitmain is a bigger customer than APPLE AMD or NVIDIA of TSMC and for your information AMD fabricates it's chips from global foundry and not from TSMC Taiwan.
TSMC is running at 65 % capacity and they are taking mining segment seriously and for your information according to TSMC website they have stratified their chip fabrication into 2 divisions one is for mobile phones and the other for high computing power chips.

I think you know nothing about Bitmain mining machines and you are such a novice to mining machine segment and was not accepting this type of statement from a legendary member that bitmain only manufactures a couple of thousand miners each batch WHAT A JOKE
Bitmain has currently 3 active models S9,L3+ and D3  and if you look at bitmain Chinese website and have a common sense to use a Google translator you will know that in each batch their are around 5000 miners and with 3 to 4 batch released every month for each batch it makes around 45000 miners only for Chinese market and the same quantity  for international market it make around 80k to 90k miners and if you multiply it by 189 and 288 chips for some models you will get a hell lot a figure not as big as APPLE but a substantial number.

You obviously have absolutely no ties to the semiconductor mfg industry.

Ja Bitmain seems to make 'a lot' of miners but at only a couple thousand or so of them per batch even with 189 chips per-miner they are still strictly a boutique customer to TSMC. Apple, AMD and the other REAL major customers are each getting 10's to 100's of millions of chips per-month. Compared to that income from miner chips is pocket change.

As for when lower node miner chips will show up... Maybe mid-late next year if and that is a HUGE 'if' there is a need for it. These low nodes are geared to low-power devices where the effects of temps are manageable. You think running 16nm ASIC's at high power density is iffy -- forget about it at even lower nodes.

Bitmain purchases chips from TSMC foundry Taiwan and by the number of miner batch release dates now bitmain have become one of the major client of TSMC and they to  are taking mining segment very seriously
If you look at TSMC website for the 7 nm nodes segment they have divided that into 2 stratums one for mobile chips and the other for high computing power chips so they are taking mining segment seriously.
Now for the speed for the new model of S9++ or S11 (whatever they name it) we have to calculate the computing power for chips of newer nodes according to TSMC website they have started the tape out of nm 7 nodes in April and by the end of this year they will supply these 7 nm FinFET nodes to more than 10 customers and surely Bitmain is one of them.
Now come to speed of that 7nm miner we know that S9 speed is 14 ths with power consumption of 1372 watts
By looking at the 10 nm nodes efficiency according to TSMC website they are 15 % faster and consumes 35% less power so for a 1300 watt miner the speed would be 14×1.15×1.35 =21.73 Terahash for around 1372 watt miner

And if bitmain decides to skip 10 nm nodes and go straight for 7 nm nodes which I personally think they are planning and to raise funds for that bitmain is also issuing an IPO of 200 million $ in USA the speed of that ultra fast miner would be again according to TSMC website the 7nm nodes are 20% faster than 10 nm nodes and consumes 40% less power so the speed of that miner will be 21.73× 1.2 ×1.4 =36.50 Terahash and that to hypothetically

If it's a small increase it's probably not even worth it for Bitmain to create a new optimized chip at all with their low electrical rates and all. They're likely branching into LTC and X11 just to keep people interested in their brand.

There will never be a "S10". It will most likely be called S11 as their other models have been S1, S3, S5, S7, S9, etc. Although I don't expect a 10 nm chip anytime soon maybe they will increase the current chips efficiency slightly and jam a couple more hashing boards in there.

There are 800 coins to pick from.

And there are delisted coins.

I can find a list of every current coin.

But to consider picking 50 small value coins spending 100 usd on each. You need to find the list of delisted coins to fully know the odds of a three year move.

Ie. If there are 25 delisted coins and 800 current coins your idea may work.

But if there are hundreds of dead delisted coins your idea may be bad.


That is a very simple analysis

One big problem is you cannot foresee witch altcoin will skyrocket to the moon...
Besides, you have to pick a low to enter the market for it not to be too risky.
The middle approach is to mine AND to buy altcoin you think wil do great...

I was talking about a long time investment in altcoins with money intended for buying new mining equipment or a daily speculations on exchanges. As you know, during the last months some alts showed much greater return than BTC. I just wanted to know what experience had others in long term investing in a basket of altcoins - was it positive or not. I get that middle term investment (like a few months) in crypto currencies can get you hurt.

Power control cost.
Getting gear at decent prices

Lastly taking care of the gear so it lasts a long time.

If you can do the three above you can stand a chance to make money mining.

I have power deals with a few people that allow me to mine at profits.

And now most gear has stopped improving as it is smaller chipped

 Because if you set it up right, positive income is a LOT more certain from mining than from the very high risk of speculating.

 Don't take the last 5 months as "the norm", you have to look at more like the last 5 YEARS and the roller coaster pretty much all cryptocoins have been on.

Neither do I. What about not mining, but buying those altcoins instead of buying equipment for their mining?