Topic: FREE BITCOINS -- Environmentally conscious mining! - page 2. (Read 13071 times)

A few issues with remote locations in the full force of the nature:
- very hot summer days could create ambient temperatures of over 35C, this is the air that is used to ventilate, you don't want to cook everything inside, especially the batteries
- lead batteries freeze at -15C if they are discharged, you need to know ahead of time if the charge won't go below 20% overnight while you operate at temperatures that converge to -15C, you don't want to freeze anything
- a controller is needed to manually or automatically shut down everything from the main breaker box, including power sources, battery bank and inverters, in case of extreme heat, equipment issues, etc
- same controller needs to be able to power up everything, for example after a power drain, when the sun or wind has charged the battery bank sufficiently to allow minimal operation (this controller needs it's own battery and internet connection, could easily be a small netbook with large battery)
- several sensors, software and calculations, to allow for graceful degradation of compute power or increase in performance if power is over capacity (think overclocking everything and turning the fans to the max)

In theory you only lose your time and equipment value loss, energy is free, NOBODY can be more efficient than you in mining. Currently some people are fudging over the market value because of their devious acts, and taking a good chunk of the honest market down with them. If the situation does not resolve itself (aka, before July the BTC should be above 35$), new mining projects should be put on hold.

I intend to have automated surveillance and a stand-by guard near-by (he already checks the property daily anyway, I could raise his allowance to include the project too). So no, you won't know where the installation will be located, and you won't be able to loot it. And even if you do, you will get 2000-3000$ worth of equipment.

Used vegetable oil is not Bullshit Neutral, I already explained some of the issues:
- diesel generators using petrol would cost 10x the grid cost, not really efficient
- diesel generators using non-designed fuels either decay their engines or require more cleaning and maintenance
- vegetable oil is made from vegetables which besides making these rich carbohydrates count up for a large amount of their mass also produce fiber and cellulose that can't be used and use some of the energy for growth, reproduction and dead tissue, you get less than 10-15% of a plant's mass in oil.
- best vegetables have solar > body mass conversion rates for the photosynthesis process of 2-3%
- solar panels have efficiencies of up to 20-30% compared to vegetables for the same surface
- vegetable oil requires processing costs, transportation and storage

In conclusion, vegetable oil is terribly inefficient (less than 0.2%)  compared to directly sucking the sun rays into a GPU with efficiencies of over 10%.

Not sure if want...

I'll add it to the list of ideas, in case I start a separate project website for this.

Also, is anyone selling Chinese made monocrystaline solar cells for bitcoins? Should be cheap to send to Romania. Do note you have to beat these prices: http://www.okazii.ro/cautare/monocristaline+solare.html (1$/W inc shipping).

Some of us could do with some equipment like that, let us know when you are NOT around, have you added in the cost of potentially having your kit stolen.

Have you thought about using biodiesel from USED Veg oil ( Carbon Neutral )  and a diesel generator, many restaurants will gove you this free since they have to pay to have it disposed of.
Not sure of the numbers but anyone running a serious mining operation might want to look into using waste veg oil and a ( preferably whisper quiet ) Generator.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOFbsaNeZps

This looks very interesting.   I was thinking about something similar over here, given the fact that I pay very little on electricity in general, so I could use the grid as I set up all the solar panels and start mining ASAP, but the aggressive difficulty increase took me by surprise, sadly, and I began to question the profitability of my little project.   Doesn't help much that I wasn't an "early adopter", either. So I decided it was wise to back up. But if this does work, well, it'll be amazing.

I guess it would be wise to set things up in such a way that it's self-booting, just in case some freak weather keeps the energy sources bellow minimum for too long and the whole thing dries off and shuts down; so instead of having to go there in person to pump up the breakers again at risk of being ambushed by raptors, the whole thing will automaticly get back at work as soon as possible.

This sounds like a very cool project! Following.

I can help with:
- Conceptual development
- System design
- Component selection
- Blueprints no, wiring diagrams yes.
- You will need to observe the regulations of your local electrical code and ensure that the end design falls within them. For the most part, these systems would meet local and national electrical codes by themselves.

Does this include designing and helping me make blue prints if needed?

The problem with the generator is it's power is 10 times more costly than grid power. Burning a different octane fuel will require more maintenance. I think I'll pass the generator and instead use graceful degradation (lower power usage by underclocking/stopping the miners/shutting down components) and resume performance when energy is generated. Don't forget if you run out of battery power, you will lose heat from the GPUs and your batteries might freeze (at -15C or lower) because they will be discharged.

Also, another trend is solar panels micro-inverters (for each panel, you get the bonus of smart monitoring) which means you need to add more stuff and decrease conversion rates.

I design these systems for a living. I would trade my services for btc.

I love this idea.I hope to create an "eco-generator" which consists of battery banks,solar,wind turbine plus a diesel backup generator run on used veg oil (as there's no way I'm payin 4 diesel)

I duno how I'm gonna go about it but it'll b complex I think as this intergrates a switcher between solar,wind and a diesel generator to charge the battery banks which then go through an inverter to run my gear.

Nice project! 

Maybe you could even sell your Bitcoins at a premium like "sun-grown" oranges.
"Sure, they cost 50% more than what you would pay at Mt. Gox but mine were mined without releasing CO2!"

To answer your concerns, no property taxes, the internet would be something like 10-20$ a month (GPRS/EDGE 1-5Gb at 2Mb/s), purchase most of the stuff as "used" but still relatively new, including solar panels, wind turbines, equipment, batteries, PC boards and accessories except the PSUs of course. Except for the batteries, everything else that is in good shape can be resold for about 80% of it's acquisition price in less than 2 years. Also the alternative energy equipment can be subsidized and remain in the possession of the owner. As for the costs, solar cells are about 1$/W (make it 2$/W for the extras you need around them), a wind turbine varies greatly from 1$/W to 5$/W and batteries are 3$/Wh. Solar panels offer a great output during the day, none at night, and the wind varies dramatically (luckily it will be present when the sun isn't). The batteries allow me to level off usage and create less stress on the components. Part of why this seems attractive to me is that I won't basically need cooling costs or they will be very little. Some other bitcoin users might participate in trading with me, or use parts of my projects, or I use parts of theirs.

I assume I will get 2.0Mhash/J boards, and with the efficiency losses and common energy drains we can assume 1.0Mhash/J. So for a 1000W solar (output from 500W a day to 2000W a day), 1000W wind (realistically 300W to 700W a day), a battery bank of about 1000Wh, I get to pay 5000$ for an average output of 800-1000W daily. Current power costs are 0.13$/kWh, and are scheduled to increase (thanks e-on). I would be spending 84$ a month to use the power grid, so I need 5 years to recoup the investment, after that I get free energy for the next 15 years. This is of course assuming that the bitcoin project is running and I can sell bitcoins for more than they cost to make. Worst case scenario, I lose 20-30% of my investment and 100% of my hobby time. Best case scenario, the bitcoin parity for market/production ratio remains at 10:1 and I can recoup the investment in half a year.



There are no sell-back plans or arrangements available with the power company, not many people have stable alternative energy sources. There might be funds or programs or bonuses for implementing ecological projects like this. I could use the GPU power for other projects if they have decent rewards. The time when bitcoin will increase the world's power usage significantly will come. I'm also covered in case of a zombie apocalypse or economic meltdown.

All in all I want to be the guy that answers the question: Well bitcoin is just made out of thin air, right? YES, that is correct!

Okay, as long as there are no illusions. 


+1

Realistically, it is not a money making endeavor to supply power with renewable energy. Bomba's calculations may be a bit off in cost and in payback for a system of this scale, but I like to think of it as more of a fun project than a money making one. And honestly, unless you're using homemade solar panels and used/homemade pretty much everything else, you're probably looking at a fair bit more money to set up. To do it properly, at least.

For a more economical solution, you could look at doing a grid-tie system without batteries. This affords you the electricity savings of whatever you generate, plus the convenience of having grid power when your renewables are not producing enough to keep up with the load. The grid effectively "is your battery".

This is an awesome idea and I would love to see it happen. However, I'm not sure it's cost-effective. Definitely would not be in the short term. May not be in the long-term, depending on what the market does, but I guess that's the risk we're all taking here. Assuming Bitcoin doesn't die, and assuming the cost of running this operation really is $0 (no property taxes or internet fees?) then I imagine this operation would eventually become somewhat profitable. May be worth doing it for its own sake. Would have to be if you did it, since you'd see much bigger returns sooner by simply buying bitcoins with the money or investing in a solid company.

On the positive side you'd definitely be able to weather the inevitable mining squeezes.

Seems like an even less profitable endeavor than simply mining in a place that already has walls, internet, and electricity. Not only do you have to pay for the hardware like other miners, but you have to build a place, pay large up front costs per kW to set up solar and wind generation.

If you are efficient, 2kW  will get you around 1,100 (+ or - $200) a month, but that rate will only last for the first 10 days starting now. By the time you got this set up it would probably be more like $300/month in revenue. But you'd have dropped like 5 - 8K in setting it up. It would take you two or more years to break even at today's exchange rate. Then you'd have to pay for internet, and gas to go there every couple of weeks. I'm sure there are other random costs as well that haven't been mentioned yet. The only way this makes any sense is if you plan to hold the bitcoins in hopes that the price increases.

Apparently they are hard to find and cost about 10$/W. I know they are quantum-dot thin layer polymer dyes, but they do not bring the efficiency high enough to explain why the custom built panels cost only 1$/W.

If large hail is really that much of a concern, I suggest using panels like this:

http://www.mostpowerfulroof.com

They have nothing to break with any size hailstone, and are flexible. You can walk on them, you can mount them to a curved surface, and they are easier to install because you can just "stick" them to a surface, as opposed to building a structure or rack specifically for your solar panels.

yep.
pack it with AMD/SUN/HP/Siemens "datacenter in container" concept/products, backup by small termoelectric power[geothermal or nuke-powered], deploy/build/re-cycle underground shelter for it and here you go.