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Topic: Gigamining / Teramining - page 92. (Read 216459 times)
Okay, I understand that difficulty has gone up a lot since June 12, so there is a lot more competition, but I still can't see any mathematical reason for the share price of any security to go down exponentially when BTC price is going up.
Because you bought a fixed MH bond, aka a turd. As others pointed out, your "dividend" is linked only to difficulty and block reward. Difficulty was always expected to go up, perhaps in the past months it went up faster than most expected, but with ASICs approaching, you havent seen anything yet. I fully expect difficulty to go up >10x in the next 6 months and possibly as much as 100x in the next year. On top of that, blockreward will halve in december, and thus so will your dividends. Well, it will be half whatever is left by then, because by december ASICs will have started mining. Gigamining offers you a free upgrade when they get their asics, but a 4x increase (IIRC?) will do precious little to offset the difficulty explosion you are about to see.
TL'DR, these mining bonds have been overbought since day one by people who didnt understand what they were buying. Im pretty sure they are still grossly overpriced today, so anyone who believes otherwise, lend me your bond, so I can short it. I will give you a nice bonus on your dividends if you let me borrow it for 3-6 months. PM me for details.
Dear Gigavpis,
Thank you so much for answering my questions so patiently. You have DEFINITELY earned a lot of my respect. Also, thank you for the info. I have to go do some research on "shorting BTC price appreciation". When I invested in traditonal stocks, I always avoiding the whole shorting stocks concept because it seemed far too risky. But thank you for taking the time to answer my questions so carefully. I'm going to do some research. I probably won't have any more question. When I understand the answer in your last response, I think that I'll have the whole thing. Cheers!
BLUECHIP
Thank you so much for answering my questions so patiently. You have DEFINITELY earned a lot of my respect. Also, thank you for the info. I have to go do some research on "shorting BTC price appreciation". When I invested in traditonal stocks, I always avoiding the whole shorting stocks concept because it seemed far too risky. But thank you for taking the time to answer my questions so carefully. I'm going to do some research. I probably won't have any more question. When I understand the answer in your last response, I think that I'll have the whole thing. Cheers!
BLUECHIP
You are quite welcome. I personally like asking questions and usually ask a lot of them when I am learning, so if you have more and can't find an answer, don't hesitate to ask.
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Okay, I found this and it helped me to better understand the change in difficulty over time. I understand that difficulty is a function of how many people are mining at a given time, if Bitcoin prices go up, more people want to make a profit, so more people mine. The curve here looks like it started out linearly but has started increasing at a great than linear rate starting around June of 2012.
http://bitcoindifficulty.com/
However, here is the thing that I don't understand, Bitcoin prices have also increased more than linearly during that time, so in theory, a mining operation should become MORE profitable. Wouldn't that make it a more desirable investment? Shouldn't the share pirce go up? Okay, I undertand that difficulty has gone up a lot since June 12, so there is a lot more competition, but I still can't see asny mathematical reason for the share price of any security to go down exponentially when BTC price is going up. If this were the true reason, why hasn't every Mining bond gone down exponentially in price?
I know that I may not get any responses to this. I am not trying to peeve any body off, I would just like honest answers so that I can make informed decisions.
Thanks again!
BLUECHIP
http://bitcoindifficulty.com/
However, here is the thing that I don't understand, Bitcoin prices have also increased more than linearly during that time, so in theory, a mining operation should become MORE profitable. Wouldn't that make it a more desirable investment? Shouldn't the share pirce go up? Okay, I undertand that difficulty has gone up a lot since June 12, so there is a lot more competition, but I still can't see asny mathematical reason for the share price of any security to go down exponentially when BTC price is going up. If this were the true reason, why hasn't every Mining bond gone down exponentially in price?
I know that I may not get any responses to this. I am not trying to peeve any body off, I would just like honest answers so that I can make informed decisions.
Thanks again!
BLUECHIP
Hi tmfp143,
You are purchasing a fixed amount of Mh/s with each gigamining bond. Mining equipment is priced and purchased in USD. So when the value of bitcoin goes up, a single bitcoin can purchase more mining power in USD. This means mining bonds are effectively short BTC price appreciation.
Best,
gigavps
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Hello!
I manage the BLUECHIP mutual fund on GLBSE. The fund owns 40 shares of GIGAMINING. What is the plan to stem the drastic loss that the share price is taking? I recommend buying back shares. I pray that the plan is not to let the share price keep dropping until it reaches 0. Are there any updates on the ASIC upgrade?
If the price of my stock were dropping this fast, I would be more proactive. I would give my investors more frequent updates to build confidence. I am kind of stuck at the moment. I don't want to dump the shares at a loss, but the lack of information makes it hard to make a decision. I recommend addressing this issue, and doing something to restore investor confidence, if possible. I read the earlier comments about not being willing to discuss personal finances. In my opinion, the bottom line is this: if your company is on the verge of failing, there can be no items that are not up for discussion unless you want the enterprise to fail. If GIGAMINING truly is a venerable enterprise (which I thought it was, that's why I invested in it) then DO SOMETHING. SAY SOMETHING. Don't just sit there and let it drop to zero.
It seems like you have not done your reading home work. I manage the BLUECHIP mutual fund on GLBSE. The fund owns 40 shares of GIGAMINING. What is the plan to stem the drastic loss that the share price is taking? I recommend buying back shares. I pray that the plan is not to let the share price keep dropping until it reaches 0. Are there any updates on the ASIC upgrade?
If the price of my stock were dropping this fast, I would be more proactive. I would give my investors more frequent updates to build confidence. I am kind of stuck at the moment. I don't want to dump the shares at a loss, but the lack of information makes it hard to make a decision. I recommend addressing this issue, and doing something to restore investor confidence, if possible. I read the earlier comments about not being willing to discuss personal finances. In my opinion, the bottom line is this: if your company is on the verge of failing, there can be no items that are not up for discussion unless you want the enterprise to fail. If GIGAMINING truly is a venerable enterprise (which I thought it was, that's why I invested in it) then DO SOMETHING. SAY SOMETHING. Don't just sit there and let it drop to zero.
Gigamining is not a company it's a bond
GigaVPS has no obligation to control the price nor do anything about the price falling, this is natural due to the increase in difficulty.
//DeaDTerra
Hi tmfp143,
DeaDTerra is correct that gigamining is a bond and not a share in a company. EskimoBob is also correct in his assessment that mining bonds are long difficulty and short on BTC price appreciation.
As for you request for me to intervene in the free market setting the price of Gigamining, there is not much I would be able to do.
I will faithfully continue to fulfill the terms of the contract.
Best,
gigavps
The bond was always expected to drop in value and eventually approach zero at difficulty rose - just not this fast. The expectation when I bought the bonds was that the combination of BTC appreciation plus the dividends would outpace the drop in value = profit. However, with everything that has happened the actual devaluation has been more and faster than I predicted/expected. Sucks to be me.
Hello!
I manage the BLUECHIP mutual fund on GLBSE. The fund owns 40 shares of GIGAMINING. What is the plan to stem the drastic loss that the share price is taking? I recommend buying back shares. I pray that the plan is not to let the share price keep dropping until it reaches 0. Are there any updates on the ASIC upgrade?
If the price of my stock were dropping this fast, I would be more proactive. I would give my investors more frequent updates to build confidence. I am kind of stuck at the moment. I don't want to dump the shares at a loss, but the lack of information makes it hard to make a decision. I recommend addressing this issue, and doing something to restore investor confidence, if possible. I read the earlier comments about not being willing to discuss personal finances. In my opinion, the bottom line is this: if your company is on the verge of failing, there can be no items that are not up for discussion unless you want the enterprise to fail. If GIGAMINING truly is a venerable enterprise (which I thought it was, that's why I invested in it) then DO SOMETHING. SAY SOMETHING. Don't just sit there and let it drop to zero.
I manage the BLUECHIP mutual fund on GLBSE. The fund owns 40 shares of GIGAMINING. What is the plan to stem the drastic loss that the share price is taking? I recommend buying back shares. I pray that the plan is not to let the share price keep dropping until it reaches 0. Are there any updates on the ASIC upgrade?
If the price of my stock were dropping this fast, I would be more proactive. I would give my investors more frequent updates to build confidence. I am kind of stuck at the moment. I don't want to dump the shares at a loss, but the lack of information makes it hard to make a decision. I recommend addressing this issue, and doing something to restore investor confidence, if possible. I read the earlier comments about not being willing to discuss personal finances. In my opinion, the bottom line is this: if your company is on the verge of failing, there can be no items that are not up for discussion unless you want the enterprise to fail. If GIGAMINING truly is a venerable enterprise (which I thought it was, that's why I invested in it) then DO SOMETHING. SAY SOMETHING. Don't just sit there and let it drop to zero.
Did you miss https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/weekly-loss-of-n-guaranteed-enjoy-perpetual-loss-with-fixed-mhs-mining-turds-98517 ?
If you like to make a bet, that difficulty is going to drop and stay down, buy fixed Mh/s BBN's (Bitcoin Burning Notes aka mining "bonds").
If you think this bet is stupid, do not buy BBN's
Hello!
I manage the BLUECHIP mutual fund on GLBSE. The fund owns 40 shares of GIGAMINING. What is the plan to stem the drastic loss that the share price is taking? I recommend buying back shares. I pray that the plan is not to let the share price keep dropping until it reaches 0. Are there any updates on the ASIC upgrade?
If the price of my stock were dropping this fast, I would be more proactive. I would give my investors more frequent updates to build confidence. I am kind of stuck at the moment. I don't want to dump the shares at a loss, but the lack of information makes it hard to make a decision. I recommend addressing this issue, and doing something to restore investor confidence, if possible. I read the earlier comments about not being willing to discuss personal finances. In my opinion, the bottom line is this: if your company is on the verge of failing, there can be no items that are not up for discussion unless you want the enterprise to fail. If GIGAMINING truly is a venerable enterprise (which I thought it was, that's why I invested in it) then DO SOMETHING. SAY SOMETHING. Don't just sit there and let it drop to zero.
It seems like you have not done your reading home work. I manage the BLUECHIP mutual fund on GLBSE. The fund owns 40 shares of GIGAMINING. What is the plan to stem the drastic loss that the share price is taking? I recommend buying back shares. I pray that the plan is not to let the share price keep dropping until it reaches 0. Are there any updates on the ASIC upgrade?
If the price of my stock were dropping this fast, I would be more proactive. I would give my investors more frequent updates to build confidence. I am kind of stuck at the moment. I don't want to dump the shares at a loss, but the lack of information makes it hard to make a decision. I recommend addressing this issue, and doing something to restore investor confidence, if possible. I read the earlier comments about not being willing to discuss personal finances. In my opinion, the bottom line is this: if your company is on the verge of failing, there can be no items that are not up for discussion unless you want the enterprise to fail. If GIGAMINING truly is a venerable enterprise (which I thought it was, that's why I invested in it) then DO SOMETHING. SAY SOMETHING. Don't just sit there and let it drop to zero.
Gigamining is not a company it's a bond
GigaVPS has no obligation to control the price nor do anything about the price falling, this is natural due to the increase in difficulty.
//DeaDTerra
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To all Gigaminers:
The coupon payment for the week is out.
Enjoy,
gigavps
The coupon payment for the week is out.
Enjoy,
gigavps
To all Gigaminers:
The coupon payment for the week is out.
Enjoy,
gigavps
The coupon payment for the week is out.
Enjoy,
gigavps
Not really sure what difference it makes as ideas stand on their own merit but I could see a possible suspicion of bias.
For what it matters I am long both GIGAMINING and BITBOND (a comparably sized mining bond with 210Ghs issued) and am probably one of GIGAMINING's top 5 investors and therefore I have more of a financial interest in positive movement of GIGAMINING's price than Gigavps.
Aside from a private contract which would be difficult to execute quietly, and I am unaware of any that exist, therefore I think it is safe to assume that the only person who could have a material financial interest in a short position on GIGAMINING is Gigavps.
It really makes no sense for the short to call the long a short and is a complete distraction from the material issues.
For what it matters I am long both GIGAMINING and BITBOND (a comparably sized mining bond with 210Ghs issued) and am probably one of GIGAMINING's top 5 investors and therefore I have more of a financial interest in positive movement of GIGAMINING's price than Gigavps.
Aside from a private contract which would be difficult to execute quietly, and I am unaware of any that exist, therefore I think it is safe to assume that the only person who could have a material financial interest in a short position on GIGAMINING is Gigavps.
It really makes no sense for the short to call the long a short and is a complete distraction from the material issues.
Hi sunnankar,
Please go back a re-read what I said. I was referring to you trying to pump the price of BITBOND in my thread. I have no worries about Gigamining's price.
Thank you Gigavps for professionally answering the first question regarding income capacity.
You are welcome.
Is there any particular reason you are being so evasive on the second question related to liquidity and how many bitcoins you have in your personal possession that can meet GIGAMINING debt service? How long is this nebulous 'foreseeable future'?
I will not divulge my bitcoin holding publicly. I will be traveling for the rest of the week, but when I am back I will have Patrick run an assessment of Gigamining and will pay him for his time. He can then issue one of his credit ratings for Gigamining and we will be done with this.
Best,
gigavps
Wow, if you want to make stuff up or read into other people posts whatever you want, go ahead.
I have recently completed a 3000 coin loan with Gigavps (the latest of several pieces of business). His ability to repay was not linked to BS&T. I don't recall referring to an insurance of Gigamining, but I would stake 1000 of my own coins on gigavps making good on a debt.
Being able to bold words in a post for some implied ulterior meaning isn't clever. I made a statement as to the credit that I would apply to Giga based on what I know. Several people are considering ratings for their GLBSE products, and until such time as information is provided, there is ample information publicly available to make some assessments.
I have recently completed a 3000 coin loan with Gigavps (the latest of several pieces of business). His ability to repay was not linked to BS&T. I don't recall referring to an insurance of Gigamining, but I would stake 1000 of my own coins on gigavps making good on a debt.
Being able to bold words in a post for some implied ulterior meaning isn't clever. I made a statement as to the credit that I would apply to Giga based on what I know. Several people are considering ratings for their GLBSE products, and until such time as information is provided, there is ample information publicly available to make some assessments.
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