How about getting some legal advice first? The problem isnt one of technology, the problem is that people seem to think because its related to bitcoin, laws somehow dont apply. Thats horseshit. If you want a credible and lasting alternative to GLBSE, you will need to operate within the confines of the law, like MtGox does, like Tangible Cryptography does, like Butterfly Labs does.
Operating legally may or may not be feasible for a security exchange, but its the first thing you should focus on. If you want to do a truly anonymous underground and illegal site like Silk Road, its doomed from the start. If you thought GLBSE was a scammer heaven, imagine a silk road like alternative.
Topic: GLBSE owners lied to us. How to move forward and fix this? Move to Exchange X? - page 4. (Read 7485 times)
October 06, 2012, 04:37:55 AM
October 06, 2012, 04:35:31 AM
Or maybe something like #assets-otc - Contract Management System https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/assets-otc-contract-management-system-105437
October 06, 2012, 04:33:12 AM
We should basically create a mechanism for issuers to continue doing business and shareholders to prove their ownership securely and without exposing themselves to more parties than they already are. Issuers may decide whether to list somewhere else and exchanges may implement their own automated process to help with this.
Idea: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249491
Speculation: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249521
Older version: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1241728
Idea: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249491
Speculation: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249521
Older version: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1241728
GLBSE must be opened up (no trading) so investors and issuers can sort this shit out and move to new exchange or migrate to Open Transactions environment.
Migration to a different environment is I think secondary. The companies are live now, and we need to access our shares as soon as possible. Otherwise Open Transactions is a good idea, or even one of the proposed blockchain based solutions, but even if the servers were ready it will take a long time for even issuers to adopt. EDIT: And we need to be able to prove ownership anyway. So let's focus on it first.
Also, I suspect that continued involvement with GLBSE will be problematic. If they open the exchange if only for serving as a communication channel, then great. If they continue to list the assets, I will communicate with the issuers, send them my shares in return for a digitally signed contract and be done. But let's assume that they won't do that.
The best course to resolve this, at least for willing issuers, is to create the mechanism to prove ownership and then move from there. We don't need complicated solutions that may break. When we have this, some may list on a different exchange, some may move to a different environment/tool and some may want to manage it themselves. I think the latter is most likely, at least until the dust settles.
October 06, 2012, 04:30:26 AM
Yeah, move to Exchange X. After they rob you, move again.
How many times do you have to get scammed before you wise up?
How many times do you have to get scammed before you wise up?
Open Transactions is designed to eliminate the need to trust the operator of the server.
You always have to trust asset issuers of course, but the "exchange", the "notary server" that notarises the transactions, does not need to be trusted because all transactions are signed by the actual parties to the transactions, the server merely "notarises" their signings, basically.
That is why it is crucial that the users actually do use their own private keys at their end that servers etc never ever see.
-MarkM-
October 06, 2012, 04:28:15 AM
Yeah I want to use Open-Transactions for my asset (RSM) if I can figure out how to and its not too difficult for shareholders.
Things can be made as easy for shareholders as their friendly neighborhood broker cares to make it.
Really the only way to make it easy for them is to make it even easier for hackers/thieves, since you know any security is going to be considered inconvenient and "too hard" and so on. Heck a lot of people complain at simple use of PGP signed messages "too hard" yet it is pretty much the bare minimum needed to prove their identity in a portable manner.
-MarkM-
October 06, 2012, 04:26:04 AM
Yeah, move to Exchange X. After they rob you, move again.
How many times do you have to get scammed before you wise up?
How many times do you have to get scammed before you wise up?
October 06, 2012, 04:22:17 AM
Yeah I want to use Open-Transactions for my asset (RSM) if I can figure out how to and its not too difficult for shareholders.
October 06, 2012, 04:17:50 AM
It might not be a good idea to put all the eggs in one basket... all the "securities" on the same server.
A separate server per issuer of assets/securities might be much better, so that any one of them turning out to be a scam or illegal or unregistered or whatever need not shut down everyone else when they get shut down.
By the way, anyone who is looking just to let people hold and transfer assets could look at the loom system, anyone can issue any assets on loom, so you can just go there and issue your assets, no approval by some snoopy admins needed set up scams or game-money or anything you want.
The same can be done with Truledger but that, like Open Transactions, has signing so needs users to use a client that will sign everything with their private keys for them.
The reason I took the long hard road of going with Open Transactions instead of either of those is because I wanted markets: matching of offers.
-MarkM-
A separate server per issuer of assets/securities might be much better, so that any one of them turning out to be a scam or illegal or unregistered or whatever need not shut down everyone else when they get shut down.
By the way, anyone who is looking just to let people hold and transfer assets could look at the loom system, anyone can issue any assets on loom, so you can just go there and issue your assets, no approval by some snoopy admins needed set up scams or game-money or anything you want.
The same can be done with Truledger but that, like Open Transactions, has signing so needs users to use a client that will sign everything with their private keys for them.
The reason I took the long hard road of going with Open Transactions instead of either of those is because I wanted markets: matching of offers.
-MarkM-
October 06, 2012, 04:17:23 AM
We should basically create a mechanism for issuers to continue doing business and shareholders to prove their ownership securely and without exposing themselves to more parties than they already are. Issuers may decide whether to list somewhere else and exchanges may implement their own automated process to help with this.
Idea: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249491
Speculation: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249521
Older version: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1241728
Idea: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249491
Speculation: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249521
Older version: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1241728
GLBSE must be opened up (no trading) so investors and issuers can sort this shit out and move to new exchange or migrate to Open Transactions environment.
October 06, 2012, 04:08:47 AM
We should basically create a mechanism for issuers to continue doing business and shareholders to prove their ownership securely and without exposing themselves to more parties than they already are. Issuers may decide whether to list somewhere else and exchanges may implement their own automated process to help with this.
Idea: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249491
Speculation: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249521
Older version: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1241728
Idea: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249491
Speculation: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1249521
Older version: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1241728
October 06, 2012, 03:54:03 AM
BTC community got fucked once more. This time it was GLBSE, run by Nefario, Theymos and others.
There is a good opportunity to move all the portfolios and securities to another exchange and keep going. By "keep going" I mean finance projects and earn some coin from that.
Ideas are welcome.
If you want to scream at those assholes, who fucked you over AGAIN! Use different threads here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=83.0
Are we a community or just a punch of lazy fuctards, who can not get over this and build something better so that current GLBSE securities and investors do not get burned. Can we do this?
Thank you for keeping it civilized.
PS! Ideas how to drop this forum with everyone involved (scammers mostly), needs another thread.
There is a good opportunity to move all the portfolios and securities to another exchange and keep going. By "keep going" I mean finance projects and earn some coin from that.
Ideas are welcome.
If you want to scream at those assholes, who fucked you over AGAIN! Use different threads here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=83.0
Are we a community or just a punch of lazy fuctards, who can not get over this and build something better so that current GLBSE securities and investors do not get burned. Can we do this?
Thank you for keeping it civilized.
PS! Ideas how to drop this forum with everyone involved (scammers mostly), needs another thread.
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