Good Initiative by Royse777! - page 2.

AB de Royse777

legendary

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Hire Bitcointalk Camp. Manager @ r7promotions.com

I am sorry, everyone had a wrong assumption. I don't deserve the credit but it's Stake manager Carollzinha. I was inspired from his/her post.

Quote from: Carollzinha on February 11, 2023, 02:23:14 AM

Actually not only some of our campaign members were using AI to generate their posts (and they had a payment cut for such behavior) but a lot of other forum members have been found using it as well. As Stake Campaign Manager all I can do is to include it as a rule in our campaign and hope the other Campaign Managers will do the same, for the forum health

As LoyceV said, the idea of rewarding was already existed too. What I did is - learnt from the past experience and mixed it with the new idea to improve the service we provide. It will be challenging but it's needed to appreciate the posters who do good job and genuine.

JoyMarsha

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I think Royse's effort to limit the usage of ChatGPT by forum participants in a signature campaign she manages(Yolmix.io) is a smart move. Since there is no developed or well-known tool for such detection, the issue will now be how to be able to detect anyone using the ChatGPT to make posts. The more confusing aspect of utilizing ChatGPT is that it responds to questions presented to her in a completely different way(What a user asks to get his answer will be different from what other user asked to get her answers)

I'm really interested to see how the forum members report on ChatGPT turns out.

Lucius

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Quote from: suchmoon on February 13, 2023, 09:19:43 AM

If someone makes 20 posts and most of them are labelled as "likely AI" by multiple detection tools and generally sound like vague bullshit, then... you know... it's a duck.

I can agree on that, but considering that the majority will say that any free work is a waste of time, I wonder who will spend their time hunting this new generation of AI posters if we also take into account the attitude of the moderators towards such reports. It seems to me that the majority of such reports could remain unhandled.

Quote from: suchmoon on February 13, 2023, 09:19:43 AM

Just like with any other issue, e.g. plagiarism - you don't rely on a tool 100%, you need to look into the context of how this occurred, what the potential intent was, etc.

Actually, I always rely on some tool that can detect plagiarism, and that tool gives me possible sources that I then check and try to determine if someone has plagiarized their post, whether it is perhaps that someone is the original author and forgot to post the source. I always approach such matters very seriously, and even if I make a mistake, I know that the moderators will not make their decision hastily.

suchmoon

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Quote from: joker_josue on February 12, 2023, 07:17:18 PM

Has anyone ever thought of asking ChatGPT to make a script with the aim of detecting whether the text is written by the chat or not? Roll Eyes

It would be fun to know the answer, and to know if the supposed script would work.

https://openai.com/blog/new-ai-classifier-for-indicating-ai-written-text/

However:

Quote from: Lucius on February 13, 2023, 07:39:22 AM

You can play with these detectors as much as you want, but I don't consider them reliable enough to kick someone out of the campaign based on such detections.

If someone makes 20 posts and most of them are labelled as "likely AI" by multiple detection tools and generally sound like vague bullshit, then... you know... it's a duck.

Just like with any other issue, e.g. plagiarism - you don't rely on a tool 100%, you need to look into the context of how this occurred, what the potential intent was, etc.

Lucius

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Quote from: elevates on February 12, 2023, 10:46:47 AM

~snip~

I think that you are very confused and that you are looking for something that is impossible to achieve at this moment. You can play with these detectors as much as you want, but I don't consider them reliable enough to kick someone out of the campaign based on such detections.

The initiative is good, its implementation is very questionable, and I'm not even talking about the time that the manager will have to spend to assess whether something is original content or AI generated. However, if you think you can help the forum in detecting those who abuse it, you can always click on the "report to moderator" button and give your contribution Wink

libert19

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Sounds spot on, it'd thing to see how people will recognize such texts. Hoping ai users will be revealed in public so other people can also learn how to recognize such texts and also malicious actors learn how to stay undetected Tongue

Hispo

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Good initiative but I am afraid it could be just matter of time before the first wrongly accused campaign participants appear and in the end the campaign manager will have the last word on whether a person stays or leaves with the presented evidence.

I'd wish that detecting AI generated content was as easy as a Bitcoin address signature.
This kind of technology is seemingly going so fast that security measures are staying far behind.

joker_josue

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Has anyone ever thought of asking ChatGPT to make a script with the aim of detecting whether the text is written by the chat or not? Roll Eyes

It would be fun to know the answer, and to know if the supposed script would work.

Volgastallion

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CONTEST ORGANIZER

Quote from: joker_josue on February 12, 2023, 03:41:47 AM

Quote from: drwhobox on February 11, 2023, 06:02:05 PM

Quote from: elevates on February 11, 2023, 11:21:53 AM

What I also fear is that many non English members who use Google translate or any other might get banned. Do guys agree with it?

I can not agree with you here. I doubt that anyone here uses google translate for forum posting, and if he/she needs to translate to post he/she also needs a translator for reading the thread.

I use, what's the problem?
I honestly never felt that this was a problem, to communicate. I believe that sometimes it is not the most beautiful English, but it serves to explain my ideas.

As for the translation of topics, something that is also very easy, since browsers have a translation function.

Im with you on this, and also i add, do you know in every single language do you have diferent ranks between:

- Reading
- Writting
- Speaking

Im really good reading and understading, normal to low in writing (so some things i check with the translator) and very bad speaking because i dont talk with any person.

About the IA related.... yes its ok and i dont wanna see them here, but also we have some bad users who answer to this AI profile, when its clearly an AI.

The most easy way to detect chatgpt its because he is very polite, and so correct.

About programs who detect IA the vast mayority are shit.

NotATether

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bitcoincleanup.com / bitmixlist.org

I hope my J.A.R.V.I.S bot is spared /s

But seriously though, does this rule apply to accounts with are intentionally ran as bots and thus cannot join any sig campaign? I have just figured out how to hook up to OpenAI's API with Python (it will be pretty expensive though without throttling - ChatGPT web would be much better but there will be captchas involved which will also cost money so pretty much the same.), but then some abusive query filter still needs to be made. So I'm just wondering how people would treat bots like ChartBuddy for example - not an AI I know, but a bot nevertheless.

elevates

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Quote from: Lucius on February 11, 2023, 11:16:41 AM

Although some posts may look like they are the work of AI at first glance, how will you prove that they are really the product of an AI Chat? I have tried 5-6 detectors and I am not satisfied with the results, because even very small changes in the entered text can give completely opposite results.

Here is the part of your post that one detector says is even 93% fake.

I am not sure what made you think that an AI text detector can help you identify an AI-based generated text. Sometimes I feel we have become slaves to technology and to prove my point you questioned a human over an AI and then realized it is worthless.

I did a few checks to prove that I am a human and not an AI. I logged into ChatGPT and asked for a reply to your reply. The outcome was elaborate so I edited it and here is the answer.

Then I pasted the highlighted text on the detector tool you used and this is the result.

The score is satisfactory for anyone but I still wanted to get 100% from an AI text detector. I went ahead and used a few rephrasing/rewriting tools and I got a 100%.

Please note the difference between the two images and then rethink whether can you detect an AI-generated text from an AI text detector. The image above proves what I wrote:

Quote from: elevates on February 11, 2023, 10:04:02 AM

I think it is tricky but can get good results.

Synchronice

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I get kinda confused. If an AI uses data from internet, including forums like Reddit and probably bitcointalk too, that means that AI learns our writing style. It learns it to mimic us, right? Then an AI will try to make it as much natural as possible over time. Also, I guess, some people use Grammarly to improve their writing style but Grammarly itself uses natural language processing and machine learning, that can enable a false positive when scanned by AI text scanner.

I understand that according to initiative, claims should be backed by valid arguments if person uses AI and generates content that makes him qualifiable to participate in signature campaign and also gets merits, then let's leave that person in your campaign Cheesy

This initiative is easier said than done.

hugeblack

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Is it difficult to distinguish between the posts of ordinary people and AI? I think that after a little time it will be easy to know if the post was written by a person or an artificial intelligence.
In general, if someone is so lazy, I don't think he would be stupid to waste his account in order to save several minutes.
you need to search for topic, copy it, paste it to AI window, wait 30-40 Minutes.

PX-Z

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Quote from: _BlackStar on February 11, 2023, 10:21:47 AM

there should be a tool that helps users to reveal the AI posts. While I haven't got the tool yet, but maybe someone there knows about it.

OpenAI has a tool related to it actually, it is called AI text classifier^[1]. The thing is, there is a 1000 minimum characters needed before it works. I tried the words quoted in this thread^[2][3] from chatgpt and some of it works.

Also, Copyleak has AI content detector^[4], i tried the words from the thread mentioned and it is not that 100% accurate coz sometime whenever you change some word on the phrase the result change from "AI content Detected" to "This is human text".

[1] https://platform.openai.com/ai-text-classifier
[2] https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.61743309
[3] https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/what-is-bitcoin-openai-chatgpt-edition-5438523
[4] https://copyleaks.com/features/ai-content-detector

Falconer

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Quote from: noorman0 on February 12, 2023, 06:52:43 AM

CMs should explain their thread in what way it is if they have a special type of approach to detect AI. Since this is an incentivized activities, I just think some drama will occur between CPs vs CMs vs incentivized reporters if it uses existing AI detection tools which are generally considered unreliable.

Of course it is, some explanation is expected and that is just to avoid any drama there might be.
As some of the users above have pointed out, the detection tool isn't completely reliable, but I've found that bad posters really can be detected manually. But anyway, CM's idea to prevent AI posts is really good, just need some proper approach before making a decision.

noorman0

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Quote from: sheenshane on February 11, 2023, 07:29:01 PM

IMO it's a good idea but the problem here is how to prove that the forum member uses AI tools upon posting.
A low-quality post considered made by AI?
Can AI possibly have wrong grammar when writing posts?

It might we can report low-quality posts but we can't rely on AI tools to determine or detect suspected AI posts.

CMs should explain their thread in what way it is if they have a special type of approach to detect AI. Since this is an incentivized activities, I just think some drama will occur between CPs vs CMs vs incentivized reporters if it uses existing AI detection tools which are generally considered unreliable.

joker_josue

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Quote from: Flexystar on February 12, 2023, 05:23:48 AM

Don't mix up things guys. We are talking about content writing here. Something that is not made up after mixing millions of data points across the global servers. We are not talking about google translate. If you are using it and expressing on other language board then that's good because at least you are using your brain for that.

That is what is expected here from the posts as well.

I'm not mixing anything. I'm saying that I use google translator to write here, in English. This post was written with the help of google translator.
As @Rikafip pointed out, many use translation tools to communicate across the forum, whether in English or another language.

For this reason, I have already commented that the analysis carried out on texts written by AI must be very careful, to avoid errors.

Rikafip

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Quote from: drwhobox on February 11, 2023, 06:02:05 PM

I doubt that anyone here uses google translate for forum posting, and if he/she needs to translate to post he/she also needs a translator for reading the thread.

Its one thing to read posts in English (and understand them) and entirely different to actually write them at a decent level. You would be surprised how many members use Google translate and some of them are very well known and in the best campaigns on the forum.

Quote from: sheenshane on February 11, 2023, 07:29:01 PM

IMO it's a good idea but the problem here is how to prove that the forum member uses AI tools upon posting.

True, that is the main problem with this idea and decision making shouldn't be relied on using those anti-cheat tools only but also checking prior post history. If you have a member who couldn't write a simple sentence in English and now he suddenly writes essays while anti-cheat tools shows an extremely high chance of plagiarism, you know what's going on there.

Flexystar

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Yup, it is really nice initiative by @Royse777 and one of the needed stuff right now. With the ChatGPT getting stronger every minute there will be posts and mega threads flooded by the AI written content. I am surfing on another forum for the purpose of learning SEO marketing and blogging and guess what, every other person there just talk about the ChatGPT packages, subscription and asking me to join the programs which include learning about AI based writers.

It's really sickening how things are getting out of hand even when forum is something where you come and meet people's thought, learn in the process and also revert the same way.

If an AI is going to do that for us, then the real question is what are we going to do next? Create an AI fight, about who writes the best and be AFK all the time?

Quote from: joker_josue on February 12, 2023, 03:41:47 AM

Quote from: drwhobox on February 11, 2023, 06:02:05 PM

Quote from: elevates on February 11, 2023, 11:21:53 AM

What I also fear is that many non English members who use Google translate or any other might get banned. Do guys agree with it?

I can not agree with you here. I doubt that anyone here uses google translate for forum posting, and if he/she needs to translate to post he/she also needs a translator for reading the thread.

I use, what's the problem?
I honestly never felt that this was a problem, to communicate. I believe that sometimes it is not the most beautiful English, but it serves to explain my ideas.

As for the translation of topics, something that is also very easy, since browsers have a translation function.

Don't mix up things guys. We are talking about content writing here. Something that is not made up after mixing millions of data points across the global servers. We are not talking about google translate. If you are using it and expressing on other language board then that's good because at least you are using your brain for that.

That is what is expected here from the posts as well.

joker_josue

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**In BTC since 2013**

Quote from: drwhobox on February 11, 2023, 06:02:05 PM

Quote from: elevates on February 11, 2023, 11:21:53 AM

What I also fear is that many non English members who use Google translate or any other might get banned. Do guys agree with it?

I can not agree with you here. I doubt that anyone here uses google translate for forum posting, and if he/she needs to translate to post he/she also needs a translator for reading the thread.

I use, what's the problem?
I honestly never felt that this was a problem, to communicate. I believe that sometimes it is not the most beautiful English, but it serves to explain my ideas.

As for the translation of topics, something that is also very easy, since browsers have a translation function.

Topic: Good Initiative by Royse777! - page 2. (Read 860 times)