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Topic: Goomboo's Journal - page 37. (Read 281470 times)

sr. member
Activity: 409
Merit: 250
February 28, 2012, 07:27:56 PM
so many people on here have been using the EMA crossover and yet the guru already changed his strategy.  Next time before trading, people should do their own backtesting and not choose a trading strategy based on a few trades of an anonymous person.

I'll help them out and show them the difference as well as explain my reasoning for trading the SMA.

Here's a summary of the data below.  This simple comparison shows the difference in the two strategies.  As you can see, the EMA is almost superior in every way when compared to the SMA.



Not for me, however:

- At this stage of life, I only have the time to trade the daily timeframe in BTC.  
- However, I want to frequently trade.  
- Additionally, I prefer to only trade strategies in which I can do the math of the indicators I am using quickly and easily.
- After all, if you don't know what goes into the colorful things on the screen, what makes you think that you will trust where they are pointing?

Which of the two strategies matches me best?



The EMA and SMA tell the same thing - which way the immediate trend is

- The EMA keeps you in a trade longer, which means that you will have a lower success ratio but a higher payout on trades that really move.

- The SMA gets you in a move earlier, which means that if price doesn't take off, you will more than likely have a profit rather than a loss.


Here is the SMA 10/21 crossover on hourly timeframes:



donator
Activity: 848
Merit: 1078
February 28, 2012, 06:52:57 PM

Especially at the moment with an indecisive market and low volumes.


Does anyone have any theories on why this is happening?


Everybody has run out of secret rockets and the secret submersibles have all sunk. We have to wait for more to be manufactured.
sr. member
Activity: 409
Merit: 250
February 28, 2012, 06:51:38 PM
Some things we've discussed:

Here's a page of stats on the moving average crossover strategy.  We've covered a few aspects of this in a previous post.  The thing I want to draw your attention to is the max consecutive losers row.  Can you handle trading a strategy in which you lose up to 7 (or more) trades in a row?  Now look at the average loss row.  On average, you lose 1.58% (in the normal currency market) on a losing trade.  Multiply that by 7 - do you have the discipline to sit there and trade again when you are down 11% and you have lost 7 trades in a row?  This is in the "normal" currency market...a move of 2% in the currency market in a given day is a _massive_ move in most pairs.

Can you see how BTC is a very difficult market to trade, emotionally and financially?


One last thing before I sign out,

This thread is directed at individuals who are trying to trade bitcoin for a profit (myself included) - not the long term investors / developers / enthusiasts.  My hope is twofold - 1.  Give a reality check to people risking their money and 2.  Give you a way of actively, impartially, and rationally approaching the markets.  It's definitely not the "Holy Grail", but it's a system and if you stick with it, you are miles ahead of most people on the other side of your trades.  You still have a high probability of losing it all - commissions + spread + volatility are really, really rough in this market, let alone the fact that the market can't be explained by technical analysis as well as other, more liquid markets.


Sure thing...day trading BTC can really be brutal with the 1-2% spread + 1% round-trip commission.  Basically this requires price to move 3% for you to break even on a trade.  Trade 1-2 times a day and if the market doesn't go in your favor, your account will be down 20-30% in a week simply from the costs of transacting (assuming no added slippage).

legendary
Activity: 2053
Merit: 1356
aka tonikt
February 28, 2012, 05:20:21 PM
i don't think the actual market has anything to do with this topic.
i think bitcoin is much bigger than your pity speculation investments and the price much stronger than your consecutive inconsequence to follow any strategy you could think of. Tongue
hero member
Activity: 994
Merit: 1000
February 28, 2012, 04:43:26 PM

Especially at the moment with an indecisive market and low volumes.


Does anyone have any theories on why this is happening?


Large groups of people following semi-competing strategies might have something to do with the indecision.

In the game Rock, Paper, Scissors, how often do you think you'd win when the opponent knew what you were going to present, every time?

1000 people blindly following EMA is one thing, but you knowing that 1000 people are blindly following EMA is another, and something you can take advantage of. Low volume allows that.

If you don't like what's happening in a sideways market, switch to a wider view and bet based on that (pick higher numbers than 10/25, for example, for a longer term picture).
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
[#][#][#]
February 28, 2012, 02:29:40 PM
depends:

usualy i ignore them.
i don't ignore them, if MACD-cross-signalline gave a valid signal and divergence/convergence confirm it.

if i whould have sticked to my system and would not have emotions disturb it and would not need to sleep and have the automated trading system already working me and friends are working on, then i would have traded much more profitable Smiley

.. it took me quite some time understanding technical analysis and getting to adjust my system to the bitcoin market.





legendary
Activity: 2053
Merit: 1356
aka tonikt
February 28, 2012, 01:32:59 PM
based on this ?

No, I used the SMA to trigger my entry.

so many people on here have been using the EMA crossover and yet the guru already changed his strategy.  Next time before trading, people should do their own backtesting and not choose a trading strategy based on a few trades of an anonymous person.
you are definitely to impatient, as for dealing with any possible strategy out there Smiley

using this, or any other strategy, of course you will be loosing - the question is 'how much and how often?'
you loose on unnecessary swaps, when the market is still.
but following the trend gives you a great advantage when the market is actually moving...

don't blame the guy for giving you hints.
he doesn't promise you to win anything - nobody knows what the market will do in the nearest future, neither does 'the guru'.

but he doesn't sell a bullshit, and I appreciate anything he's said. thank you goomboo!
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
February 28, 2012, 01:23:51 PM
based on this ?

No, I used the SMA to trigger my entry.

so many people on here have been using the EMA crossover and yet the guru already changed his strategy.  Next time before trading, people should do their own backtesting and not choose a trading strategy based on a few trades of an anonymous person.
legendary
Activity: 1147
Merit: 1001
February 28, 2012, 09:43:57 AM
When the market is moving sideways I prefer to simply wait.
Although my trading strategy is larger cycles anyway (going by investor emotions cycles).
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 502
February 28, 2012, 09:29:05 AM
Ouch, these sideways crossovers are drip-dripping my money away.

Is everybody else bleeding as much as I?

Does anyone have a strategy for pricing their trades after a crossover that would make this less painful?
hero member
Activity: 602
Merit: 508
Firstbits: 1waspoza
February 28, 2012, 09:23:14 AM

Especially at the moment with an indecisive market and low volumes.


Does anyone have any theories on why this is happening?


Because cats don't like mondays?
newbie
Activity: 58
Merit: 0
February 28, 2012, 06:54:02 AM

Especially at the moment with an indecisive market and low volumes.


Does anyone have any theories on why this is happening?
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 502
February 28, 2012, 04:29:08 AM
Question for you guys.
Do you trade a crossover like this? Market is only moving sideways and the crossover is very weak imo.
Don't really see the crossover representing a change in trend here so moving my position on bitcoinica would be a waste of money.

If we're talking about the actual crossover and not the lines touching, and if I understand the system correctly, then yes you should trade it.

The reason is that you cannot tell which crossover is going to be the last one before the market starts following a trend again.  If you're the wrong side of it when it goes then you miss the profit that is available (this happened to me in the 4.5 -> 4.8 jump, I'd paid my dues in terms of losses on sideways moves, but then was the wrong side of it when it came because I followed the reasoning you are offering).

It's painful to keep trading on a sideways market; watching your money vanish as you make loss after loss.  However, that's the only way you can catch the profit when it eventually comes.

I know what you mean about bitcoinica though -- the spread is so huge that a sideways market is really costly.  I'm hoping that when a large movement happens that that profit will cover all the losses and then some.

To be honest, I'm not sure it's possible to profit on Bitcoinica without a huge dose of luck.  Especially at the moment with an indecisive market and low volumes.
sr. member
Activity: 352
Merit: 250
February 28, 2012, 03:33:41 AM
Question for you guys.
Do you trade a crossover like this? Market is only moving sideways and the crossover is very weak imo.
Don't really see the crossover representing a change in trend here so moving my position on bitcoinica would be a waste of money.

sr. member
Activity: 409
Merit: 250
February 25, 2012, 12:11:50 PM
based on this ?

No, I used the SMA to trigger my entry.
sr. member
Activity: 409
Merit: 250
February 25, 2012, 12:02:34 PM

(me?)
yes

yeah there was a crossing there if that's what you mean.
so by your method one should sell/short, the question is did you make that ? yes/no, if you dint sell/short, why ?

No - I trade the daily timeframe since I don't have the time to make 1 trade a day.

In that respect, I've been short for 14 days from around $6.00.
sr. member
Activity: 409
Merit: 250
February 25, 2012, 11:51:26 AM
so Op did you sell ? we got a X there

I think OP means original poster (me?)...and yeah there was a crossing there if that's what you mean.
sr. member
Activity: 352
Merit: 250
February 25, 2012, 06:06:23 AM
Exited my long trade. 12+% profit on this one. Grin
Now in a short trade @ 4.92 on bitcoinica. Will also give the multiplier strategy a try.
This means my trade is now at multiplier 1x. If I make a loss on this trade I will use the 2x on the next one.
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
February 24, 2012, 11:40:12 PM
Also check out The Mathematics of Money Management.  In fact if you google search it then you will find a mediafire link for download.
sr. member
Activity: 409
Merit: 250
February 24, 2012, 07:37:43 PM
Goomboo, there was a book recommendation you made in this thread a while ago.  What was it?

I've been thinking about making a list of great books for interested traders.  This is as good a time as any.

I believe I have only mentioned Trading Systems that Work, Technical Analysis Using Multiple Timeframes, Reminiscences of a Stock Operator, and Technical Analysis: The Complete Resource for Financial Market Technicians.


A list of books I've found to be very good:

Discretionary trading
Technical Analysis Using Multiple Timeframes
High Probability Trading
Technical Analysis: The Complete Resource for Financial Market Technicians

Systematic Trading
Trading Systems: A New Approach to System Development and Portfolio Optimisation
Trading Systems that Work

Psychology of Trading
The Psychology of Trading: Tools and Techniques for Minding the Markets
Trading in the Zone: Master the Market with Confidence, Discipline and a Winning Attitude

All-Time Classics
Reminiscences of a Stock Operator
Extraordinary Popular Delusions and The Madness of Crowds
Market Wizards: Interviews with Top Traders
The New Market Wizards: Conversations with America's Top Traders

Investing
The Intelligent Investor: The Definitive Book on Value Investing. A Book of Practical Counsel
Rule #1: The Simple Strategy for Successful Investing in Only 15 Minutes a Week!


I really wish someone had handed me this reading list years ago - I think it would have taken years off of my learning curve.
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