Nice warning on their site. It's almost telling us "YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED"
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/component/users/?view=login&Itemid=124&return=aHR0cDovL3d3dy5oYXJkYml0LmNuL2luZGV4LnBocC9teS1vcmRlcnM=
Topic: Hardbit hardware wallet? - page 2. (Read 4932 times)
How does the backup system work?
Need a dev to tell us how the private key is generated.
Need a dev to tell us how the private key is generated.
Ok so I received two of my hardbits today. I would like to direct people to the users manual which is located here:
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/downloads
As the instructions show you use this device with software installed on another android device. How these two devices communicate are made clear in the users manual if you download the link. All communication is done via QR codes.
The problem I have is this:
1. No way to upload your own private key. You must use the private key that comes with your wallet. This means we need to rely on a third party hardbit.cn to assure us that the private key they generated was either destroyed or is kept somewhere securely.
2. No way to download the private key on the wallet without using their proprietary backup system.
3. No way to via a usb connection transmit data to / from the device.
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/downloads
As the instructions show you use this device with software installed on another android device. How these two devices communicate are made clear in the users manual if you download the link. All communication is done via QR codes.
The problem I have is this:
1. No way to upload your own private key. You must use the private key that comes with your wallet. This means we need to rely on a third party hardbit.cn to assure us that the private key they generated was either destroyed or is kept somewhere securely.
2. No way to download the private key on the wallet without using their proprietary backup system.
3. No way to via a usb connection transmit data to / from the device.
I have been using this wallet for a week, and I had time to explore a bit the device.
As regards your concerns:
1. I agree that it would be much better if there was a way to upload our own private key. However, it seems that the key is generated by the device when you first use it and not pre-loaded. Indeed, I found a way to reset the device (first time it was accidentaly) and each time I got a different bitcoin address.
2. I agree, I don 't like that.
3. I also found a way to connect the device via USB and transmit data to / from the device
Btw, I have also another concern: when I do a payment, I have to wait the transaction to be confirmed and then to sync the device to be able to create another transaction... I don't understand the purpose of this restriction and if a developer is reading the forum I would like to have it deleted.
Here's a related project that I'm working on. It’s called “sigsafe” and it is an electronic key tag that signs bitcoin transactions over a non-exploitable air gap (NFC). The device is probably too simple to be considered a hardware wallet; instead, it’s more like a paper wallet that can produce ECDSA signatures.
I just started a thread in the "Project Development" section: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/sigsafe-a-nfc-key-tag-for-signing-bitcoin-transactions-610453
Here's the white paper: http://www.sigsafe.org
I just started a thread in the "Project Development" section: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/sigsafe-a-nfc-key-tag-for-signing-bitcoin-transactions-610453
Here's the white paper: http://www.sigsafe.org
I just ordered 4 of them .
Payment was accepted and got a mail from them that they will be shipped on Monday .
Will post the unboxing here .
There is not much info on hardbit.cn . I mean no technical data and stuff .
But i hope its open source , or it will be hard to trust them .
Also , open source will help us install some cool wallpapers and BTC receiving and sending sounds , I guess !!
It , looked good , could not resist myself , so ordered 4 of the .
Hope they turn out good .
I paid for 2 plastic Trezors in Sep. last year , have received nothing , and they have asked for 12 more weeks .
And those were 1 BTC each , these are damn cheap with cool display and rugid body .
Though , i wonder , how's its battery life .
Payment was accepted and got a mail from them that they will be shipped on Monday .
Will post the unboxing here .
There is not much info on hardbit.cn . I mean no technical data and stuff .
But i hope its open source , or it will be hard to trust them .
Also , open source will help us install some cool wallpapers and BTC receiving and sending sounds , I guess !!
It , looked good , could not resist myself , so ordered 4 of the .
Hope they turn out good .
I paid for 2 plastic Trezors in Sep. last year , have received nothing , and they have asked for 12 more weeks .
And those were 1 BTC each , these are damn cheap with cool display and rugid body .
Though , i wonder , how's its battery life .
At the time 1 BTC was $100
Ok so I received two of my hardbits today. I would like to direct people to the users manual which is located here:
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/downloads
As the instructions show you use this device with software installed on another android device. How these two devices communicate are made clear in the users manual if you download the link. All communication is done via QR codes.
The problem I have is this:
1. No way to upload your own private key. You must use the private key that comes with your wallet. This means we need to rely on a third party hardbit.cn to assure us that the private key they generated was either destroyed or is kept somewhere securely.
2. No way to download the private key on the wallet without using their proprietary backup system.
3. No way to via a usb connection transmit data to / from the device.
For these reasons I feel that this product will not suit my needs. I will be returning this device because I need a device that fulfills the following requirements:
1. I have control of the private keys not a third party
2. If something were to happen to my private keys outside of the hardbit device then I can export the keys within the device to my computer in a format that can be loaded into any other bitcoin wallet.
3. USB is used to transmit data to the device to allow for the device to receive private keys generated outside of the device. If those keys are lost usb is used to send private keys within the device to an application running on my computer such as blockchain.info. USB is used to receive payment requests and it is used to send sign transactions to a wallet software such as blockchain.info.
If the above is your expectation also then DO NOT PURCHASE THIS PRODUCT.
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/downloads
As the instructions show you use this device with software installed on another android device. How these two devices communicate are made clear in the users manual if you download the link. All communication is done via QR codes.
The problem I have is this:
1. No way to upload your own private key. You must use the private key that comes with your wallet. This means we need to rely on a third party hardbit.cn to assure us that the private key they generated was either destroyed or is kept somewhere securely.
2. No way to download the private key on the wallet without using their proprietary backup system.
3. No way to via a usb connection transmit data to / from the device.
For these reasons I feel that this product will not suit my needs. I will be returning this device because I need a device that fulfills the following requirements:
1. I have control of the private keys not a third party
2. If something were to happen to my private keys outside of the hardbit device then I can export the keys within the device to my computer in a format that can be loaded into any other bitcoin wallet.
3. USB is used to transmit data to the device to allow for the device to receive private keys generated outside of the device. If those keys are lost usb is used to send private keys within the device to an application running on my computer such as blockchain.info. USB is used to receive payment requests and it is used to send sign transactions to a wallet software such as blockchain.info.
If the above is your expectation also then DO NOT PURCHASE THIS PRODUCT.
You are talking about "the private key". Does this mean the device supports only one address?
Very good points. I don't think I can trust a device with a private key I didn't produce myself offline.
Ok so I received two of my hardbits today. I would like to direct people to the users manual which is located here:
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/downloads
As the instructions show you use this device with software installed on another android device. How these two devices communicate are made clear in the users manual if you download the link. All communication is done via QR codes.
The problem I have is this:
1. No way to upload your own private key. You must use the private key that comes with your wallet. This means we need to rely on a third party hardbit.cn to assure us that the private key they generated was either destroyed or is kept somewhere securely.
2. No way to download the private key on the wallet without using their proprietary backup system.
3. No way to via a usb connection transmit data to / from the device.
For these reasons I feel that this product will not suit my needs. I will be returning this device because I need a device that fulfills the following requirements:
1. I have control of the private keys not a third party
2. If something were to happen to my private keys outside of the hardbit device then I can export the keys within the device to my computer in a format that can be loaded into any other bitcoin wallet.
3. USB is used to transmit data to the device to allow for the device to receive private keys generated outside of the device. If those keys are lost usb is used to send private keys within the device to an application running on my computer such as blockchain.info. USB is used to receive payment requests and it is used to send sign transactions to a wallet software such as blockchain.info.
If the above is your expectation also then DO NOT PURCHASE THIS PRODUCT.
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/downloads
As the instructions show you use this device with software installed on another android device. How these two devices communicate are made clear in the users manual if you download the link. All communication is done via QR codes.
The problem I have is this:
1. No way to upload your own private key. You must use the private key that comes with your wallet. This means we need to rely on a third party hardbit.cn to assure us that the private key they generated was either destroyed or is kept somewhere securely.
2. No way to download the private key on the wallet without using their proprietary backup system.
3. No way to via a usb connection transmit data to / from the device.
For these reasons I feel that this product will not suit my needs. I will be returning this device because I need a device that fulfills the following requirements:
1. I have control of the private keys not a third party
2. If something were to happen to my private keys outside of the hardbit device then I can export the keys within the device to my computer in a format that can be loaded into any other bitcoin wallet.
3. USB is used to transmit data to the device to allow for the device to receive private keys generated outside of the device. If those keys are lost usb is used to send private keys within the device to an application running on my computer such as blockchain.info. USB is used to receive payment requests and it is used to send sign transactions to a wallet software such as blockchain.info.
If the above is your expectation also then DO NOT PURCHASE THIS PRODUCT.
Hi ，I'm the R&D leader for Hardbit.
Thanks everyone for your interest in Hardbit.
We've sent 14 Hardbits out .2 already in costomers' hands.
Currently we are busy working on polishing online side software and user's manual.
So please forgive us on slow response of questions.
I think the user's manual will answer most of your questions.
And, the full techincal white paper is already published in Chinese. The English version is only 1/3 of the whole article. We will transate that in a week.
Here I put some core ideas why we develop this product:
1 To make a solution that is best effort for Bitcoin safety for dummies.
(For experienced IT guys, they really don't need hardware wallet.)
(Don't try to teach dummies how to protect their Bitcoins. The more they know, the more possibility they lose their Bitcoins)
so,,convenience is not taking into consideration. Only safety, safety ,safety
So please don't compare convenience with online wallets. Hardbit will perfectly lose.
2 To make a system that online client and offline client can come from different providers. This system is based on a simple communication protocol. (An open-protocol system is much more powerful than an open-source software), this system will help build the offline payment eco system of Democurrency.
3 The hardware must be affordable and portable, and last but not least, not easily recognized as a Bitcoin wallet.
Thanks everyone for your interest in Hardbit.
We've sent 14 Hardbits out .2 already in costomers' hands.
Currently we are busy working on polishing online side software and user's manual.
So please forgive us on slow response of questions.
I think the user's manual will answer most of your questions.
And, the full techincal white paper is already published in Chinese. The English version is only 1/3 of the whole article. We will transate that in a week.
Here I put some core ideas why we develop this product:
1 To make a solution that is best effort for Bitcoin safety for dummies.
(For experienced IT guys, they really don't need hardware wallet.)
(Don't try to teach dummies how to protect their Bitcoins. The more they know, the more possibility they lose their Bitcoins)
so,,convenience is not taking into consideration. Only safety, safety ,safety
So please don't compare convenience with online wallets. Hardbit will perfectly lose.
2 To make a system that online client and offline client can come from different providers. This system is based on a simple communication protocol. (An open-protocol system is much more powerful than an open-source software), this system will help build the offline payment eco system of Democurrency.
3 The hardware must be affordable and portable, and last but not least, not easily recognized as a Bitcoin wallet.
User manual is uploaded.
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/downloads
Hope it can answer most of your question.
For questions unsolved, I will answer them in the coming days.
In 1 or 2 days, the translation of techincal white payper will be finished.
http://www.hardbit.cn/index.php/downloads
Hope it can answer most of your question.
For questions unsolved, I will answer them in the coming days.
In 1 or 2 days, the translation of techincal white payper will be finished.
The only thing that needs additional adoption is merchants offering sending the Transactions for their customers. If this gets traction, you can just pay without having to carry around your own Internet capable device.
[/quote]
+1
why not with your phone?..
Because a phone has a few flaws in in this regard and generally.
First of all, exactly 0 of todays Tracking devices (Smartphones?) are truly open source. Yeah the OS might be open source but things like the baseband software etc are not, and this is where the trouble starts since this is easily used as a backdoor to not only robbing you of your privacy but also your bitcoins.
Secondly, almost all of todays tracking devices are able to establish connections to other things and therefore make it possible for others to access your data, bitcoins, location, habits, messages etc. via WLAN/Internet/Bluetooth etc.
Thirdly, those devices are a major privacy issue in almost all regards, which cang et even worse by using a Currency like bitcoin which links not only the current payment, but different addresses / transaction /purchases to you by just using your Tracing device, which is being monitored by who knows, to pay for something.
A Wallet device like Hardbit can solve most if not all of these issues. Yes it is on a Tracking device with disabled communication abilities and therefore the device is not completely open source but it's a step in the right direction and even tho Hardbit won't be the new thing every bitcoiner wants to have, it's a step in the right direction which can lead to a truly open source device featuring all these things.
Such a custom device then cannot connect to anything because it doesn't have the required hardware, which makes it even safer. It's also not as much of a privacy issue as a Tracking device and therefore stays true to the early bitcoin values that unfortunately seem to fade within the community. However, there are still a lot of us who value their privacy.
The only thing that needs additional adoption is merchants offering sending the Transactions for their customers. If this gets traction, you can just pay without having to carry around your own Internet capable device.
why not with your phone?..
How is the private key generated?
I have one and i love it 
I dont think i can trust these just yet, Not until a reputable company comes out and delivers the goods.
one sync and android update later and the custom software would now be phone and internet enabled.... major risk.
i will treat this PHONE as a prototype until the next gen which we all hope is using a hardware devce that is not a phone. but at most a PDA (no antenna inside) or a custom board.
a step in the right direction, but not quite there yet
i will treat this PHONE as a prototype until the next gen which we all hope is using a hardware devce that is not a phone. but at most a PDA (no antenna inside) or a custom board.
a step in the right direction, but not quite there yet
Interesting, so it doesn't only sync the balance but enables the offline device to function without the Tracking device once it was synced (so it syncs outputs?).
Just want to make sure thats how it works. If yes, I'd like to have another way of syncing it than a Tracking device. Maybe someone from the Developers read this and create something. If not, I can do a web based version that does that if I know how the QR code is build and what information it requires
Just want to make sure thats how it works. If yes, I'd like to have another way of syncing it than a Tracking device. Maybe someone from the Developers read this and create something. If not, I can do a web based version that does that if I know how the QR code is build and what information it requires
For ourputs, the hardbit is generating a QR code (the signed transaction) and you have to scan it to propagate the transaction using your smartphone.
I agree that a web based version would be nice (something like http://www.visualbtc.com/)
I meant output as in output of a previous transaction, not the output of the device.
Like the outputs you need in order to create valid transaction. But I think that got answered as well as you said it can create transactions (instead of just singing them like with an armory offline wallet?).
So what you need is something or someone to take the hardbit created signed Tx and broadcast it? That can be some by a webcam on a computer or the merchant then. Hope this kind of bitcoin storage will become more popular as it's really easy to use and allows for fast payments as brick and mortar stores. I also hope it will become common to take send those Transactions for the customer so people like me who don't carry tracking devices can still pay.
I am looking forward to the translation of the technical details and hope it really works the way I now think it does.
Interesting, so it doesn't only sync the balance but enables the offline device to function without the Tracking device once it was synced (so it syncs outputs?).
Just want to make sure thats how it works. If yes, I'd like to have another way of syncing it than a Tracking device. Maybe someone from the Developers read this and create something. If not, I can do a web based version that does that if I know how the QR code is build and what information it requires
Just want to make sure thats how it works. If yes, I'd like to have another way of syncing it than a Tracking device. Maybe someone from the Developers read this and create something. If not, I can do a web based version that does that if I know how the QR code is build and what information it requires
For ourputs, the hardbit is generating a QR code (the signed transaction) and you have to scan it to propagate the transaction using your smartphone.
I agree that a web based version would be nice (something like http://www.visualbtc.com/)
By this way you can sync the balance of the wallet, propagate a transaction and create a backup of the wallet.
Sync the balance of which wallet? The offline one of the one on your Tracking device (Smartphone?)?If it is the offline device, does that mean you can then create Transactions with only the device without having a Tracking device with you? (As you already have everything needed for creating a Tx then). And do they offer a way to sync it without having a tracking device (a software or a website)?
Sync the balance of the offline device (the device prevents you from creating a transaction if the payment amount is bigger than the balance, so you have to sync the balance when you receive bitcoins on the hardbit address)
1/ Scan the QR code generated by the hardbit with your smartphone
2/ Scan the QR code generated by your smartphone with the hardbit
Interesting, so it doesn't only sync the balance but enables the offline device to function without the Tracking device once it was synced (so it syncs outputs?).
Just want to make sure thats how it works. If yes, I'd like to have another way of syncing it than a Tracking device. Maybe someone from the Developers read this and create something. If not, I can do a web based version that does that if I know how the QR code is build and what information it requires
By this way you can sync the balance of the wallet, propagate a transaction and create a backup of the wallet.
Sync the balance of which wallet? The offline one of the one on your Tracking device (Smartphone?)?If it is the offline device, does that mean you can then create Transactions with only the device without having a Tracking device with you? (As you already have everything needed for creating a Tx then). And do they offer a way to sync it without having a tracking device (a software or a website)?
Sync the balance of the offline device (the device prevents you from creating a transaction if the payment amount is bigger than the balance, so you have to sync the balance when you receive bitcoins on the hardbit address)
http://img11.hostingpics.net/thumbs/mini_288629201405130057171.jpg
http://img11.hostingpics.net/thumbs/mini_604753201405122252051.jpg
1/ Scan the QR code generated by the hardbit with your smartphone
2/ Scan the QR code generated by your smartphone with the hardbit
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