Topic: Has BFL found a new way to screw over it's customers, I'll let you be the judge. - page 4. (Read 4900 times)

There is a difference. AM ships right away and the customer knows exactly what he will be making at the time he buys the item. BFL didn't ship for over a year. How the hell can customers estimate their ROI on something that will not ship a year down the road?

Indeed, it will likely be (much) more than 80% before it begins to taper, and when that begins, it wont really matter anymore, either you made your profit or you never will.


LOL. Its only going to get started in 2014. Even if KnC delivers on their promise, thats only a few PH. Nothing compared to whats coming next year.


Yeah, all of 0.5 PH? You wont even notice that, just like no one noticed when CPUs got switched off, or GPUs, and perhaps FPGA;


So how did it manage to do it so far? With basically only 3 or so companies selling asics, 2 of which that may as well be operating from a garden shed (no offense to the skills and devotion of the people in question).  Soon we will have a dozen of providers. Besides, the point is not so much if it will double each month, its were its headed in the short and medium term. 20PH have already been sold and are promised before february. IT doesnt really matter if they get shipped according to an exponential or linear curve. What matter is that/if they will ship.


Nonsense. Sellers are just as likely to convert that back to cash. Last time I checked, TSMC didnt accept bitcoins.


Remains to be seen.  All will depend how fast the best of these asic providers are able to assemble and ship mining rigs. Because that is exactly how fast difficulty will rise and keep rising until we approach 100PH. Price and difficulty are just a result of that execution.

Hypocrites.  When AM was selling overpriced toys it was the consumers fault for being stupid.  Since it's BFL, it's so sad the poor customers are getting &*$#% over.

With 28nm...

Need I say more?

Gen 1 ==> 300Mh/s to 2.4 Gh/s (per chip)
Gen 2 ==> 300Gh/s to 600 Gh/s (per chip)

Notice anything about the jump in each mining machines hashing power??

While I agree that these increases are unsustainable long term, opaque and dishonest vendors such as bfl taking pre-order funds on the backs of people's ignorance will ensure that this mess can continue longer than it otherwise would. People are just now figuring out what a horrendous decision pre-ordering hardware months in advance is. Naturally Hashfast, CoinTerra, knc, etc...already have petahashes of paid gear in the pipeline. Dumb money will ensure that everyone in mining takes a haircut before rationality becomes more widespread.

I think it will continually rise.  KnC will go dark after December to start working on their 14nm or whatever.  Probably launching 10, 20, 30, 40TH machines in April or something crazy at today's prices.  I would expect two generation changes per year now.

You probably don't realize that by May 16 2014 you have difficulty up over 6 billion.  We'd only need something like 54 Petahash to reach that and the total of all estimated preorders today only comes to around 10-14PH.  At that difficulty, anything that cost over $.50 per GH would be unprofitable long term by your table.  But hey, it's not intended to be accurate, it's just BFL you're causing FUD to after all.

These 80% increases month on month are not sustainable.  We're seeing a lot of hash soon, so that makes sense, but by the time we get into 2014, it's going to ease.  Many older miners will become unprofitable and get switched off.  And because you're talking about a compounding of hash every month, you would need to ship almost double the amount of miners month on month.  So that's like saying everyone will ship 10,000 miners in October, 20,000 in November, 40,000 in December, 80,000 in January, 160,000 in February...  The mining market can't sustain that.  If it can, the value of Bitcoin is going to skyrocket as people convert a ton of cash to buy these miners. 

So a lot of these purchases are going to do better than this long term forecasts predict (Although there is always risk)

Not to say BFL is a wise choice to invest in.  There is no value in putting your cash into this until its online and you know what your ROI will really be at the time you make a purchase.  Same with any other service or offering.  Since BFL has a no refund policy, you take a greater risk on losing your money completely than other vendors. 

Why has this company not gone out of business already?

Seriously, can we get some more progress on the class action suit?

Or at least have more people contact their state attorney general and FTC.

We need to shut them down before they scam more people.

They are like a fungus that just won't die.

Hmm.. why would they sell this if they thought it would be profitable?

With a 10 day period of change....wow the Hosting Package 1Th/s....the income pretty much flatlines at around Early February.

Yikes...

(An understatement)

How can BFL sell something which is obviously not even close to profitable? (BTC wise)

They could fix this by making the hosting contract only 1 month long max, or 14 days. They would have to substantially change things around to make it viable.

I dont think it is. The refusal to refund at least:

The Rule, issued in 1975, requires that marketers who solicit buyers to order merchandise through mail or telephone must have a reasonable basis to expect that they can ship ordered merchandise within the time frame they advertise, or, if no time frame is specified, within 30 days. The Rule also requires that, when a seller cannot ship within the promised time, the seller must obtain the buyer’s consent to a delay in shipping or refund payment for the unshipped merchandise.

http://ftc.gov/opa/2011/10/mailorderrule.shtm

With a 10 Day Period.

a last straw, before everyone wants a refund
nobody wants the Monarch Card

how can this shit be legal

I have the strangest feeling their 28nm is further along than we think because they used money that should've been spent on ordering parts for 65nm products.  Which would explain why shit is taking so long.  Although I still don't think they'll make Jan/Feb.

We'll see what happens.  Such a shit company.

They've surely been competing with their customers for some time. Without that motive their actions never made sense.

So much for BFL's claims to never to mine for profit with their own hardware (unless anyone is silly enough to believe they will keep those asics ready and boxed until someone orders the hash rate).

Kinda  predictable, first you sell asics for a huge markup (+screw your customers by not delivering for a year), then you screw them again by self mining, thereby competing with your customers but with vastly cheaper hardware.

 Hosting contract equipment comes from our bulk production of Monarch cards so contracts will begin to be served in the January / February 2014 time frame.

FWIW

PuertoLibre, I would modify that gif to be 10 days per change, not 14.

BFL can not be trusted to meet the demanding challenges of time to market.  But they will still get more suckers I'm sure.  Their production ability is piss poor but their marketing and advertising is ace.