Author

Topic: Hash Ribbons Indicator confirms 10th buy signal in 9 years (Read 939 times)

legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Not much to say, the buy signal occured, price and hash followed suit:




legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Courtesy of the indicators skeptics, top quotes now added to OP. Thanks again for input folks, always appreciated.



$7245, December 27th 2019 (10)

Yup, you nailed it again...

Anyone who uses mining for price predictions turns into an instant prick in my book.

I can hardly find a worse indicator other than the number of horses that have taken a dump on the track at Kempton.



legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
I want to see bitcoin at over 8 thousand in the next day or two which would mean that it wasn't just a one time increase but a bull run, we are going to rock the boat if we continue like this for couple more days in the following aftermath.

Done  Grin

hero member
Activity: 2828
Merit: 611
Honestly, it was a good call and the price kept on increasing, if you bought bitcoin one week ago and now sold you would have made 10% profit. People love to talk about how they missed out on bitcoin and how they could have profited while ignoring the fact that you could have made 10% in just one week if you purchased bitcoin, that is not something you see very often neither in anything people invest in except maybe some few stocks.

Let's hope that it will continue to grow and this signal wasn't just for this 10% but for something much larger, I want to see bitcoin at over 8 thousand in the next day or two which would mean that it wasn't just a one time increase but a bull run, we are going to rock the boat if we continue like this for couple more days in the following aftermath.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Just noticed the Monthly chart is now signalling a buy, although obviously the month would have to close at current prices for this to hold:
This would be the first buy signal since October 2016 at $709, as well as 7th buy signal in 9 years  Cool



Notice how it signaled recovery in 2019 but no buy signal (price follow through, at the time), suggesting the network growth & price is stronger than it was in January 2019.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Willy Woo is pointing at a bullish pattern on Litecoin's hash ribbon indicator. He thinks LTC might lead BTC:



What do you think? What's his track record like anyway? I've never followed his analysis much. I'm more of a straight up TA guy.

That's interesting, I haven't looked at LTC's hash ribbons, didn't even know it existed. Would need to back-test to form an opinion, as the example only shows 1 time previously when it was relevant - so this could obviously be an anomaly as opposed to a pattern like it has been with BTC. My gut feeling is that it's irrelevant, it's nothing like BTC's hash, but I'll let the mathematics speak for themselves instead of my own prejudice, when I get a chance to look at it and get back to you  Tongue Thanks for giving me something to look into!

Willy Woo's track record isn't bad in my opinion. If I'm not mistaken, he was wrong about $5-6K holding in 2018, or some similar level, but he was right about the bottom of BTC around $3.2K or something like that - basically at the same time as the hash ribbons indicated, prior to the source code being written. Hence that indicator existing basically.

With this in mind, I don't doubt that Willy is right again about LTC, I wouldn't like to counter-trade this theory personally. I don't know anyone better who can analyze on-chain data as well as he can, put it that way. Not to mention his charts are incredibly useful I find: http://charts.woobull.com/
legendary
Activity: 1806
Merit: 1521
Willy Woo is pointing at a bullish pattern on Litecoin's hash ribbon indicator. He thinks LTC might lead BTC:



What do you think? What's his track record like anyway? I've never followed his analysis much. I'm more of a straight up TA guy.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
No, it was not what math calculated, don't bring math into this.
It was what you got from forcing math formulas with no basis. 

Source code mathematics referenced below. I haven't forced anything, I didn't write the code  Roll Eyes

If you pick your timesets as you see fit you can come up with really amazing facts, let's have an example...
Bitcoin will NEVER REACH 100K /BTC.

And I can prove it with hashrate, furthermore, I will avoid the first years with the dramatic price increase and the years with no asic mining.
On the 1st of January 2015, we had a price of 750$ and a hashrate of 11PH.
On the 1st January 2020, we're sitting at 7000$ and a hashrate of 90 EH.

That's a growth of 10x in price and 9000x in hash rate.
So, using math  to reach 100k we need an increase of ~15k times in hahrate...
That's math!!!!

Congrats on your mathematics! Price is also -60% since ATH while hash rate is up around 700% (8x)
I guess this also means by standard of simple mathematics that 16x hash rate would mean the price would be -120%?
So that's anything between a price of -$1,500 and +$100K. I think you need to work on your indicator, it's lacking utility  Tongue
As you'll see below, the code uses "variables" and more than one equation Wink

You see....math!





Code: (Hash Ribbons indicator)
//@version=4
study("Hash Ribbons",overlay= false)

// NOTES

// The "Spring" is the confirmed Miner capitulation period:
// - The 1st "gray" circle is the start of Capitulation (1 month Hash Rate crosses UNDER 2 month Hash Rate)
// - Last "green" circle is the end of Capitulation (1 month Hash Rate crosses OVER 2 month Hash Rate)
// - The "greener" the spring gets (up until blue) represents Hash Rate recovery (it is increasing)
// - The "blue" circle is the first instance of positive momentum following recovery of Hash Rate (1m HR > 2m HR). This is historically a rewarding place to buy with limited downside.

// INPUTS

type = input('Ribbons',options=['Ribbons','Oscillator'],title="Plot Type")
len_s = input(30,"Hash Rate Short SMA (days).")
len_l = input(60,"Hash Rate Long SMA (days).")
signals = input(true, "Plot Signals")
plot_halvings = input(true,"Plot Halvings")
raw = input(false, "Plot Raw Hash Rate")

// HASH RATE MA

// HR on TV only has "yesterday's" value --> use "lookahead_on" when running live (on current bar), to pull forward yesterdays data
live_HR_raw = security("QUANDL:BCHAIN/HRATE", "D", close,gaps=barmerge.gaps_off, lookahead=barmerge.lookahead_on)
live_HR_short = security("QUANDL:BCHAIN/HRATE", "D", sma(close,len_s),gaps=barmerge.gaps_off, lookahead=barmerge.lookahead_on)
live_HR_long = security("QUANDL:BCHAIN/HRATE", "D", sma(close,len_l),gaps=barmerge.gaps_off, lookahead=barmerge.lookahead_on)

hist_HR_raw = security("QUANDL:BCHAIN/HRATE", "D", close,gaps=barmerge.gaps_off, lookahead=barmerge.lookahead_off)
hist_HR_short = security("QUANDL:BCHAIN/HRATE", "D", sma(close,len_s),gaps=barmerge.gaps_off, lookahead=barmerge.lookahead_off)
hist_HR_long = security("QUANDL:BCHAIN/HRATE", "D", sma(close,len_l),gaps=barmerge.gaps_off, lookahead=barmerge.lookahead_off)

daily_s10 = security(syminfo.tickerid, "D", sma(close,10),gaps=barmerge.gaps_off, lookahead=barmerge.lookahead_off)
daily_s20 = security(syminfo.tickerid, "D", sma(close,20),gaps=barmerge.gaps_off, lookahead=barmerge.lookahead_off)


// DAILY TIMEFRAME MGMT

is_newbar(res) =>
    t = time(res) // res calculated below \/
    change(t) != 0 ? true : false

// Check how many bars are in our upper (otf) timeframe
since_new_bar = barssince(is_newbar("D")) //1-360 for minutes, D = Daily, W = Weekly, M = Monthly
D_total_bars = int(na)
D_total_bars := since_new_bar == 0 ? since_new_bar[1] : D_total_bars[1] // calculates the total number of current time frame bars in the OTF

// INDICATORS

HR_short = float(na)
HR_long = float(na)
HR_raw = float(na)
s10 = float(na)
s20 = float(na)

HR_short := barstate.isrealtime ? live_HR_short : hist_HR_short
HR_long := barstate.isrealtime ? live_HR_long : hist_HR_long
HR_raw := barstate.isrealtime ? live_HR_raw : hist_HR_raw

s10 := barstate.isrealtime ? (since_new_bar == D_total_bars ? daily_s10 : s10[1]) : daily_s10
s20 := barstate.isrealtime ? (since_new_bar == D_total_bars ? daily_s20 : s20[1]) : daily_s20

capitulation = crossunder(HR_short,HR_long)
miner_capitulation = HR_shortrecovering = HR_short > HR_short[1] and HR_short > HR_short[2] and HR_short > HR_short[3] and miner_capitulation
recovered = crossover(HR_short,HR_long)

// HASH BOTTOM + PA SIGNAL

buy = false
buy := s10>s20
     and (
     (barssince(recovered) < barssince(crossunder(s10,s20)) and barssince(recovered) < barssince(capitulation))
     or crossover(HR_short,HR_long)
     )
     
buy_plot = buy and (buy[1] == false)

// OSCILLATOR

delta = HR_short-HR_long
diff = (delta/HR_short)*100

// PLOT - DEFAULT

plot(raw ? HR_raw : na, color = color.green, linewidth = 1, style = plot.style_line, title='HR Raw')
p1=plot(type=='Ribbons'? HR_long : na, color = color.gray, linewidth = 2, style = plot.style_line,title='HR SMA Long')
p2=plot(type=='Ribbons'? HR_short : na, color = (HR_shortfill(p1,p2,color=(HR_short
// PLOT - OSCILLATOR

plot(type=='Oscillator' ? diff : na,style=plot.style_columns,color=(diff<0?color.red:color.blue),title='Oscillator')

// PLOT - SIGNALS

plotshape(signals ? capitulation :na,style=shape.circle,location=location.top,color=color.gray,size=size.normal,transp=50,text='Capitulation',textcolor=color.black,title='Capitulation')
plotshape(signals ? miner_capitulation : na,style=shape.circle,location=location.top,color=color.green,size=size.normal,transp=90,title='Miner Capitulation')
plotshape(signals ? recovering : na,style=shape.circle,location=location.top,color=color.green,size=size.normal,transp=50,title='Recovering')
plotshape(signals ? recovered : na,style=shape.circle,location=location.top,color=color.lime,size=size.normal,transp=0,textcolor=color.white,title='Recovered')
plotshape(signals ? buy_plot: na,style=shape.circle,location=location.top,color=color.blue,size=size.normal,transp=0,text="Buy",textcolor=color.blue,title='Buy')

// HALVINGS

halving_1 = timestamp(2012,11,28,0,0)
halving_2 = timestamp(2016,7,9,0,0)
halving_3 = timestamp(2020,4,30,0,0) // projected! https://www.bitcoinclock.com/
h1_range = time >= halving_1 - 3*(24*60*60*1000) and time <= halving_1 + 3*(24*60*60*1000) //adds 3 day either side for chart visibility
h2_range = time >= halving_2 - 3*(24*60*60*1000) and time <= halving_2 + 3*(24*60*60*1000) //adds 3 day either side for chart visibility
h3_range = time >= halving_3 - 3*(24*60*60*1000) and time <= halving_3 + 3*(24*60*60*1000) //adds 3 day either side for chart visibility
bgcolor(h1_range and plot_halvings? color.red : na, transp = 20)
bgcolor(h2_range and plot_halvings? color.red : na, transp = 20)
bgcolor(h3_range and plot_halvings? color.red : na, transp = 20)

//ALERTS

alertcondition(capitulation, title='Alert - Capitulation')
alertcondition(recovered, title='Alert - Recovered')
alertcondition(buy and not(buy[1]), title='Alert - Buy')

Reference: https://www.tradingview.com/script/kT7jIvqv-Hash-Ribbons/
legendary
Activity: 2912
Merit: 6403
Blackjack.fun
You said pun....and then you start using again the word capitulation 3 times.... Angry

To correct you, the indicator claimed there was capitulation (which I agree with), given the historical relevance of this indicator for 9 years. Bare in mind there was also 'minor' "miner capitulation" three times in 2015. Arguably, you could say if it's minor capitulation it's merely a correction, and you'd be right, however I am referencing the indicator here rather than my own personal bias or perspective, that isn't relevant. The importance right now is that the recent correction/capitulation was very limited and short-lived, and therefore has reflected the 2015 corrections that occurred during accumulation.

Don't credit me, credit the indicator. I am just publishing what the mathematics have calculated  Kiss

No, it was not what math calculated, don't bring math into this.
It was what you got from forcing math formulas with no basis.  

If you pick your timesets as you see fit you can come up with really amazing facts, let's have an example...
Bitcoin will NEVER REACH 100K /BTC.

And I can prove it with hashrate, furthermore, I will avoid the first years with the dramatic price increase and the years with no asic mining.
On the 1st of January 2015, we had a price of 750$ and a hashrate of 11PH.
On the 1st January 2020, we're sitting at 7000$ and a hashrate of 90 EH.

That's a growth of 10x in price and 9000x in hash rate.
So, using math  to reach 100k we need an increase of ~15k times in hahrate...
That's math!!!!

Again, using math...
Assuming the new generation 5nm miners with claims of 25% increase in efficiency Bitmain and Cannan claim , screw that just for fun lets go to 1nm miners we will get around 1PH per miner at 3000W. But! we need 1,3 billions of them!
That is going to be 72kwh x 365 x 1 300 000 000, or 34,164,000,000,000‬‬ kwh or 34,164 Twh or 1.5 times what the world is consuming at a cost of 2.6 trillion in equipment but....with a remaining reward of only 300 billion coins (at 100k value)

You see....math!
Just how you chose arbitrarily points for your TA I did the same and I've proved with math, that it won't be possible for BTC to reach 100k.

So, hash and price...nope!!!
Just like brand new car sales don't drive wages up but are an effect of them.
Stop trying to see things where there is nothing to see,  you might end up with a pink Rolls Royce  Grin and that's not a good thing, trust me!

legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213

You are more than welcome with the off topic. No local rules here, just speculation Grin
Also if it weren't for your post, I would of likely missed the $50 box that I wanted  Tongue
So thanks for notifying me as it were  Wink
legendary
Activity: 2688
Merit: 13334
BTC + Crossfit, living life.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
To be fair, for now, the miner capitulation appears to of been averted, instead it seems there was only minor capitulation Tongue

What the hell is a "minor" capitulation?

Minor: lesser in importance, seriousness, or significance. (note pun).

You were saying capitulation we have 6 exahash in hash rate growth.

Even if we assume the best gear in efficiency that's 100k s17+ worth 170 mllion$ or 80 million if we go with cheap TH but power-hungry options.
You're arguing about miners capitulation with this amount of hashrate being added?

To correct you, the indicator claimed there was capitulation (which I agree with), given the historical relevance of this indicator for 9 years. Bare in mind there was also 'minor' "miner capitulation" three times in 2015. Arguably, you could say if it's minor capitulation it's merely a correction, and you'd be right, however I am referencing the indicator here rather than my own personal bias or perspective, that isn't relevant. The importance right now is that the recent correction/capitulation was very limited and short-lived, and therefore has reflected the 2015 corrections that occurred during accumulation.

Seriously why do you try to see things and trends and relations when there this one?

Hash Ribbons confirmed it's 10th buy signal in 9 years yesterday on the Daily chart,

Yup, you nailed it again..../s


Don't credit me, credit the indicator. I am just publishing what the mathematics have calculated  Kiss
legendary
Activity: 2912
Merit: 6403
Blackjack.fun
To be fair, for now, the miner capitulation appears to of been averted, instead it seems there was only minor capitulation Tongue

What the hell is a "minor" capitulation?
You were saying capitulation we have 6 exahash in hash rate growth.

Even if we assume the best gear in efficiency that's 100k s17+ worth 170 mllion$ or 80 million if we go with cheap TH but power-hungry options.
You're arguing about miners capitulation with this amount of hashrate being added?

Seriously why do you try to see things and trends and relations when there this one?

Hash Ribbons confirmed it's 10th buy signal in 9 years yesterday on the Daily chart,

Yup, you nailed it again..../s
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Just found the medium thread about this indicator (after sometime I know  Roll Eyes), so have added in the Risk/Reward Returns table (based on Daily buy signals):

For reference sake, with the December 2019 buy signal at $7,245, that suggests a dip between 3-15%, this would calculate the next swing low around $7025-$6,160, with around $6,600 as an average. While $6,400-$6,500 might not be the bottom, this reliable indicator is none the less suggesting we are very unlikely to break below $6K.
If I find the time, I will try and make a table & chart that represents the min-max & average time after the buy signal that the low arrives, as I realise in 2015 this was nearly a year...
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
And now you have the Weekly confirming the 7th buy signal in 9 years as well:

Weekly chart - has been flirting with recovery stage of miner capitulation, similar to August 2016:

Signals (2011-2019):
$5.28, December 26th 2011 (1)
$6.35, June 18th 2012 (2)
$23.80, February 4th 2013 (3)
$227, January 26th 2015 (4)
$231, May 25th 2015 (5)
$3533, January 7th 2019 (6)
$7385, December 30th 2019 (7)



Average of 1 buy signal every 18 months in the past 9 years. 2 signals have occurred in the past 3 years.

Notably on certain exchanges (such as Bitstamp), the indicator is again signalling a buy on this weeks current opening candle:



If the candle closes with the buy signal, this would be the first time two consecutive weeks have received buy signals Shocked

If these buy signals come through, I will become an uber bull  Grin

And there you have it.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
I really adore people who look at charts all day and try to figure out when bitcoin will go up or will go down. Haven't you already learnt your lesson from the past 10 years when bitcoin has always been under control of whales? I mean honestly charts could say that bitcoin has to go above 20 thousand dollars tomorrow and you can see bitcoin at 2000 dollars or maybe charts could say price will go down a lot but it reaches a new all time high.

Why would that happen? Simply because there are people with BILLIONS of dollars in bitcoin and those are the people who are in control of the price, when you leave an unregulated market to folks who first created it, they will do whatever they can to run it because they know there is no law that says they can't manipulate in bitcoin.

As  exstasie said, I don't find this to be particularly true, but assuming it is... When do you think these people with BILLION OF DOLLARS will pump or dump the price of Bitcoin? Do you think they do this randomly at bad times, or more likely to do it knowing they can manipulate the technical picture of the charts? There are enough examples of this, bouncing back from oversold RSI, closing above or below the 200 Day MA in a single day, a lot of these days bot driven to remove the human emotions from the trades.

My point is, if whales are going to make big moves, I assure you it's based on probabilities rather than a "hunch" they can move the price higher or lower. Otherwise they won't remain a whale of market long that's for sure. Of course many whales do get it wrong, never to be whales again, but the whales play into the technical as much (if not more) than the average trader. Most relevantly, anyone can get it wrong, probability only gives you so much of a chance to get things right.

I'm glad you adore people like me, I did enjoy successfully predicting many aspects of the breakdown from $10k down to current prices. What you're mainly forgetting is there can be a 99% chance that we go up, and the market can still go down 1 out of 100 times. This is the entire basis of basic mathematics that it seems so many overlook. Not to mention all technical analysis is subjective, as it should be.
legendary
Activity: 2842
Merit: 1511
Why would that happen? Simply because there are people with BILLIONS of dollars in bitcoin and those are the people who are in control of the price, when you leave an unregulated market to folks who first created it, they will do whatever they can to run it because they know there is no law that says they can't manipulate in bitcoin.

If we were to give you billions of dollars in bitcoin and told you to manipulate price, what are the chances you'd screw up and end with nothing? Pretty high I'd say. Nobody has manipulated the ledger for over nine years, so your only options are to try outsmarting the market by trading and/or faking numbers on exchanges. As Mark found out with Willy, this quickly leads to an untenable position.
legendary
Activity: 1806
Merit: 1521
I really adore people who look at charts all day and try to figure out when bitcoin will go up or will go down. Haven't you already learnt your lesson from the past 10 years when bitcoin has always been under control of whales?

Whales don't control the market. The stupid ones who fight the market, and try to "force" it up or down, don't stay whales for long.

Case in point: the Bitstamp bear whale. BTC was trading in the mid-$300s at the time, then this guy single handedly dumped Bitstamp down to $300. Then he placed a 30,000 BTC sell wall there.

The market ate through his wall then rallied 50% to the mid-$400s. He lost his "whale" status after that. Wink
legendary
Activity: 2100
Merit: 1058
I really adore people who look at charts all day and try to figure out when bitcoin will go up or will go down. Haven't you already learnt your lesson from the past 10 years when bitcoin has always been under control of whales? I mean honestly charts could say that bitcoin has to go above 20 thousand dollars tomorrow and you can see bitcoin at 2000 dollars or maybe charts could say price will go down a lot but it reaches a new all time high.

Why would that happen? Simply because there are people with BILLIONS of dollars in bitcoin and those are the people who are in control of the price, when you leave an unregulated market to folks who first created it, they will do whatever they can to run it because they know there is no law that says they can't manipulate in bitcoin.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
5 Day Chart:

Just noticed this is also the first buy since 2016 approx $575 BTC, given there was no buy signal earlier this year:



This is therefore the 8th buy signal in 9 years on this time-frame, average of 1 signal every 13.5 months.

There is notable confluence with the TD Sequential as the 5 Day chart also printing a TD 9 Buy signal:



Last time we had a TD 9 Buy on the 5 chart was in January 2019 at $3,222 during miner capitulation Shocked
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Hash Ribbons confirmed it's 10th buy signal in 9 years yesterday on the Daily chart, make of it what you will:



Here's the zoomed out / back-tested look of 2015-2019 buy signals from this indicator:



The 3 Day chart is also signalling a buy, confirmation would arrive tomorrow with the close of the current candle:



The Weekly chart however, that has been signalling "hash recovery" has been unable to maintain this MA bull-cross:



And for reference sake, the Monthly chart is still signalling capitulation (but is much less reliable indicator on this time-frame it seems):



Longer-term time-frames are yet to confirm this hash recovery, as well as price follow through, but already seeing buy signals on lower times-frames.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
I am not an expert on reading charts, but on the chart in the opening post it looks like the market collapse is yet to come. I think the risk is still in the air and rising up hashrate does not calm me down at all. I think I won't be calm until about mid-February.

To be fair, for now, the miner capitulation appears to of been averted, instead it seems there was only minor capitulation Tongue
FYI, after studying the source code of the indicator, it's clear that one requirement of the buy signal is bullish price movement, hence no buy signal from this indicator yet.

I tested this by using the indicator on a Gold chart (on the Daily and Weekly as an experiment), that has had a recent upwards move in price, which signaled a buy on both charts. Hence if Bitcoin's price were to break upwards, it's confirmed that there would be a buy signal (as long as hash rate holds up as well). Obviously this could come from lower lows, but it's worth paying attention to imo, as this would be the first buy signal since $3,635 on January 11th 2019.

Hence, OP updated from bearish scenario to bullish setup.
hero member
Activity: 2002
Merit: 516
I am not an expert on reading charts, but on the chart in the opening post it looks like the market collapse is yet to come. I think the risk is still in the air and rising up hashrate does not calm me down at all. I think I won't be calm until about mid-February.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Literally flashing green in front of my eyes  Shocked the Weekly is also bull-crossing:

legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Capitulation is over? I am not 100% sure on the conditions for the buy signal (blue dot), but the sold green dot indicating the bullish MA crossover is very close to this. Will update when it occurs. Here would be the equivalent "point in hash rate" to January 2019 price buy signal (blue dot) based on the Hash Ribbons indicator:

legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
How do you distinguish between a dip and a crash here?

Last week's difficulty drop was only -0.74%. Prior to that, difficulty actually rose by +1.99%. That doesn't seem indicative of "capitulation" to me. We need an actual crash like Q4 last year for miners to start shutting down en masse.

I think you may be confusing the start of the capitulation with the end of the capitulation cycle. Minder shut off en masse usually at the end of the such a cycle.

You're removing all meaning from the word "capitulation" and making it interchangeable with "bear market." There is no such thing as a capitulation cycle. It refers to a specific part of a bearish market cycle, where massive losses on high volumes are observed.

There is nothing interchangeable about miner capitulation and bear markets, there is only a relative correlation between the two. For example as previously referenced, there was miner capitulation in 2012 and 2013 that arrived during price consolidation periods, without any bearish price movements.  Fundamentally, the hash ribbons indicator is based on hash rate, not price that relates to bear markets. Acknowledging certain relationships between the two - miner capitulation and bear markets - might be a good start in order to understand this technical analysis.
legendary
Activity: 1806
Merit: 1521
How do you distinguish between a dip and a crash here?

Last week's difficulty drop was only -0.74%. Prior to that, difficulty actually rose by +1.99%. That doesn't seem indicative of "capitulation" to me. We need an actual crash like Q4 last year for miners to start shutting down en masse.

I think you may be confusing the start of the capitulation with the end of the capitulation cycle. Minder shut off en masse usually at the end of the such a cycle.

You're removing all meaning from the word "capitulation" and making it interchangeable with "bear market." There is no such thing as a capitulation cycle. It refers to a specific part of a bearish market cycle, where massive losses on high volumes are observed.

Miners capitulating at the end of a bear market is exactly what would be expected:

Regarding the indicator, it is by default based on the 30 and 60 SMA's of hash rate. Therefore, as far as I understand with the coding:
  • When the 30 initially crosses below the 60 (bearish) that creates the red area whereby the indicator signals the beginning miner capitulation (shown by the title "capitulation").
  • When the 30 is rising back towards the 60, we see the red area shrink (as shown with the green dots), as capitulation is losing momentum.
  • When the 30 is again trending downwards away from the 60 (that it previously crossed), we then see the transparent dots signalling continued "miner capitulation".
  • When the 30 crosses back above the 60, indicating an exhaustion of miner capitulation, we then receive the "Buy Signal" (as shown above in blue)

That's like calling a bearish cross a "capitulation." A bearish cross will always precede capitulation, but capitulation does not always follow from a bearish cross.

Hash rate follows price (though it doesn't correlate perfectly) so watching miners instead of price just seems to further blur the issue.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
How do you distinguish between a dip and a crash here?

Last week's difficulty drop was only -0.74%. Prior to that, difficulty actually rose by +1.99%. That doesn't seem indicative of "capitulation" to me. We need an actual crash like Q4 last year for miners to start shutting down en masse.

I think you may be confusing the start of the capitulation with the end of the capitulation cycle. Minder shut off en masse usually at the end of the such a cycle.

Regarding the indicator, it is by default based on the 30 and 60 SMA's of hash rate. Therefore, as far as I understand with the coding:
  • When the 30 initially crosses below the 60 (bearish) that creates the red area whereby the indicator signals the beginning miner capitulation (shown by the title "capitulation").
  • When the 30 is rising back towards the 60, we see the red area shrink (as shown with the green dots), as capitulation is losing momentum.
  • When the 30 is again trending downwards away from the 60 (that it previously crossed), we then see the transparent dots signalling continued "miner capitulation".
  • When the 30 crosses back above the 60, indicating an exhaustion of miner capitulation, we then receive the "Buy Signal" (as shown above in blue)

Hope that helps things for you sufficiently. Consequently this indicator measure mining difficulty decreasing, but is still based on hash rate nonetheless.
Bare in mind this is only one indicator, that I wouldn't rely on to trade on exclusively. But it appears to be a well back-tested indicator none the less.
legendary
Activity: 1806
Merit: 1521
How do you distinguish between a dip and a crash here?

Last week's difficulty drop was only -0.74%. Prior to that, difficulty actually rose by +1.99%. That doesn't seem indicative of "capitulation" to me. We need an actual crash like Q4 last year for miners to start shutting down en masse.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Currently back to capitulating regarding miner hash rate, for anyone who cares or understands how this indicator functions:

legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
What 2018 miner capitulation?
Glad you asked, because I don't even know what that phrase means--not to mention what significance it has or why it might lead bitcoin to plummet to $3800.  That would be one hell of a drop, nearly 50% lower than where it currently is.  And if that were to happen, altcoins would probably get hammered even worse.  

As usually people trying to find a connection out of nothing when the reality was totally different!

This latest difficulty change has levelled out at just over 5% below the ATH hash rate that's despite the price being over 20% lower than it was at that time. Looks like they've taken it in their stride not that anyone should care in the slightest.

And we're still up 20% on a 90 days time frame while the price is down 25% Tongue
I can hardly find a worse indicator other than the number of horses that have taken a dump on the track at Kempton.


In order to provide some historic context to this Hash Ribbons indicator, as well as to highlight this isn't just relevant to 2018, here is a zoomed out view of it's relevance from 2015 to present. Call it repeated coincidence, or alternatively a consistent and relevant pattern that has formed.



Additionally, below is the Weekly view to confirm it's relevance in accurately anticipating price movements. As you can tell, it has been backtested in order to be as useful as possible in determining price movements based on decreasing difficulty levels and their relevant MAs.



I do find your analysis of s17 and s20 releases very relevant, but instead believe it contextualizes how and why mining capitulation occurs, as oppose to disproves it.
legendary
Activity: 2912
Merit: 6403
Blackjack.fun
What 2018 miner capitulation?
Glad you asked, because I don't even know what that phrase means--not to mention what significance it has or why it might lead bitcoin to plummet to $3800.  That would be one hell of a drop, nearly 50% lower than where it currently is.  And if that were to happen, altcoins would probably get hammered even worse.  

As usually people trying to find a connection out of nothing when the reality was totally different!

This latest difficulty change has levelled out at just over 5% below the ATH hash rate that's despite the price being over 20% lower than it was at that time. Looks like they've taken it in their stride not that anyone should care in the slightest.

And we're still up 20% on a 90 days time frame while the price is down 25% Tongue
I can hardly find a worse indicator other than the number of horses that have taken a dump on the track at Kempton.
legendary
Activity: 2590
Merit: 3015
Welt Am Draht
Actually I believe the manipulators who are dumping bitcoin want the price to go to $1000. They didnt succeed the last time, so they will try it again.

If that causes them to thicken and engorge then more power to them. Sounds jolly expensive to me.

This latest difficulty change has levelled out at just over 5% below the ATH hash rate that's despite the price being over 20% lower than it was at that time. Looks like they've taken it in their stride not that anyone should care in the slightest.

legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1483
At this point, a lot depends on how the miners behave. If miners decide to sell BTC stocks (and among them there are certainly a few whales) this can cause big drops which will be a great time for price manipulators to lower the price even more. It looks like we might have one more big dump before halving.

isn't that always the case? miners are just bitcoin investors/holders. you're basically just saying that you expect whales to dump.

the negative sentiment around here is tangible!

They will have to sell, to pay mining costs.

we actually don't know the extent to which this is true. we know that bitmain stockpiles their mining rewards for very long periods of time. poorly capitalized and/or leveraged mining operations need to sell to cover overheads, but the industry is becoming increasingly well-capitalized and industrial. so i don't know how useful these assumptions are.

The exchanges are to blame for this. If they had a consensus in putting limits to the price, such dumps would not happen.

i prefer free markets to collusion among exchanges.
hero member
Activity: 2002
Merit: 516
Yes. Like I posted two days ago, we are going back to 3k levels.
Earlier on I believed the price would never return there, but after several weeks of lower highs, its evident the price will dump to that level again.

Actually I believe the manipulators who are dumping bitcoin want the price to go to $1000. They didnt succeed the last time, so they will try it again.


Right now, it's not just about manipulators and whales. At this point, a lot depends on how the miners behave. If miners decide to sell BTC stocks (and among them there are certainly a few whales) this can cause big drops which will be a great time for price manipulators to lower the price even more. It looks like we might have one more big dump before halving.


They will have to sell, to pay mining costs.
The exchanges are to blame for this. If they had a consensus in putting limits to the price, such dumps would not happen.

The worst it can happen now its governments stepping in to stop the manipulation, and putting several regulations which would cripple the market even more. People love to go to extremes, so its wild west on one side, and a statist dystopia on the other.

By the looks of it, we will have a replay of the "despair" phase on the classical cycle chart, where the "takeoff" phase was the 3k in August 2017. This will confirm the theory of the four-year cycle is not valid at all, and each cycle would need to be stretched.

I also think that this period will extend. I think the 2020 period will be something like "no mans land" and proper price increases will not start until 2021.
sr. member
Activity: 1400
Merit: 347
Yes. Like I posted two days ago, we are going back to 3k levels.
Earlier on I believed the price would never return there, but after several weeks of lower highs, its evident the price will dump to that level again.

Actually I believe the manipulators who are dumping bitcoin want the price to go to $1000. They didnt succeed the last time, so they will try it again.


Right now, it's not just about manipulators and whales. At this point, a lot depends on how the miners behave. If miners decide to sell BTC stocks (and among them there are certainly a few whales) this can cause big drops which will be a great time for price manipulators to lower the price even more. It looks like we might have one more big dump before halving.


They will have to sell, to pay mining costs.
The exchanges are to blame for this. If they had a consensus in putting limits to the price, such dumps would not happen.

The worst it can happen now its governments stepping in to stop the manipulation, and putting several regulations which would cripple the market even more. People love to go to extremes, so its wild west on one side, and a statist dystopia on the other.

By the looks of it, we will have a replay of the "despair" phase on the classical cycle chart. This will confirm the theory of the four-year cycle is not valid at all, and each cycle would need to be stretched.
hero member
Activity: 2002
Merit: 516
Yes. Like I posted two days ago, we are going back to 3k levels.
Earlier on I believed the price would never return there, but after several weeks of lower highs, its evident the price will dump to that level again.

Actually I believe the manipulators who are dumping bitcoin want the price to go to $1000. They didnt succeed the last time, so they will try it again.


Right now, it's not just about manipulators and whales. At this point, a lot depends on how the miners behave. If miners decide to sell BTC stocks (and among them there are certainly a few whales) this can cause big drops which will be a great time for price manipulators to lower the price even more. It looks like we might have one more big dump before halving.
sr. member
Activity: 1400
Merit: 347
Yes. Like I posted two days ago, we are going back to 3k levels.
Earlier on I believed the price would never return there, but after several weeks of lower highs, its evident the price will dump to that level again.

Actually I believe the manipulators who are dumping bitcoin want the price to go to $1000. They didnt succeed the last time, so they will try it again.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Got stopped out for break-even.

Break-even stop loss* now in play, represented by the green line at $7486.25.



Onto the next setup, probably this one with a new 3 Day candle opening tomorrow:



A move above $7800 would be very bullish for this chart, especially if it's a green 2 moving above a green 1.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Break-even stop loss* now in play, represented by the green line at $7486.25. Check OP for entry confirmation. Too easy  Roll Eyes
I wasn't going to take this trade until I saw how bullish people's replies were in this thread, so thanks for that metric Grin



Topic highlights:

Stop being an analyst and just take it that the market of bitcoin is far from being in command.

i advice you buying at current prices because smart investors alreday starting for buying now

The OP just copied the 2018 bar pattern and randomly added it to the current chart.

Wake up man!

See related bullish analysis:
Two & Four Year MA's Claim It's Time To Accumulate Bitcoin (03/12/19)
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1483
What 2018 miner capitulation?
Glad you asked, because I don't even know what that phrase means--not to mention what significance it has or why it might lead bitcoin to plummet to $3800.

this is what investopedia has to say:

All that said, I don't think the market is headed back to the $3k range.  It's possible, true.  Probable?  I don't think so.

the 200wma---which served as the bottom in 2015 and again in 2018---is around $5000 now. going back to the $3000s at this point would suggest that bitcoin's long term bull trend is dead.
legendary
Activity: 2730
Merit: 1288
Will we go back to $3,800? Unlikely, but clearly this is possible if the capitulation is as aggressive as 2018.

Why price of Bitcoin would act similar as in 2018 that come after monster bull year of 2017?  Was 2019 same as 2017? I see this year price of Bitcoin will maybe double while in 2017 it went up more then 10 times. Wake up man!
legendary
Activity: 1806
Merit: 1521
What 2018 miner capitulation? Why should anyone other than miners give a fuck what it costs them?

Anyone who uses mining for price predictions turns into an instant prick in my book.

Some miners obviously capitulated. The drop in hash rate supports that theory. It's obvious why though: price dropped and their operations become unprofitable so they shut down.

Miners shutting down certainly didn't predict anything.

The extrapolation in the OP is pretty bizarre too. In 2018, we had a clear triangle breakdown that broke 8 months of horizontal support. There is no parallel on the 2019 chart. The OP just copied the 2018 bar pattern and randomly added it to the current chart.
sr. member
Activity: 1176
Merit: 286
low prices already passed ; every time you wait for buying at cheap prices you will never buying before halving ; and after halving prices can rise a lot and market can have a ; big change like 2017 as all remember
i advice you buying at current prices because smart investors alreday starting for buying now
legendary
Activity: 2534
Merit: 1338
A price of $3800 seems unlikely, but we should be prepared for the unexpected. It could happen but I try to see that as a buying opportunity. And I believe that we will see another big bull run starting next year.
A price that low will surely be unexpected and very improbable as well, as we know from watching the charts bitcoin has a very clear tendency to generate new higher lows, this basically means that after the bull market and the crash that inevitably follows the lowest point that bitcoin reaches is always higher than the previous one, the previous low was around 3000 and while a price of 3800 is higher than that it doesn't seem as high as what we have seen in the past.
legendary
Activity: 3360
Merit: 1203
I think we should have hit 3k$ some days ago when the hash rate was at ATH. Now its seems that West hash power is trying to control the asian power which I doubt it could happen even if some asian mining farms are going for a pause. Remember that some miners are in long term as they can afford to pay for bills for the previous bull run as they're prepared for situation like this so if we go to 3k$ prepare for 2k$.
The worst scenario for all this is altcoins going down a lot and we could see big project announce collapse and I don't want to see a scenario like this so lets hope for better times ahead.
legendary
Activity: 3318
Merit: 1133
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
Just how many charts have you seen in this forum?
That is just one out of 100.

Some tells it could go to 50k and this is just the start which is being manipulated.
Maybe you could provide more proof next time.
Those who speculate at $100k have more proof that what you are posting right now.
Stop being an analyst and just take it that the market of bitcoin is far from being in command.
legendary
Activity: 3528
Merit: 7005
Top Crypto Casino
What 2018 miner capitulation?
Glad you asked, because I don't even know what that phrase means--not to mention what significance it has or why it might lead bitcoin to plummet to $3800.  That would be one hell of a drop, nearly 50% lower than where it currently is.  And if that were to happen, altcoins would probably get hammered even worse. 

It could happen but I try to see that as a buying opportunity.
You might see it that way and I might, too, but if bitcoin were to drop that much the market and a lot of investors and traders would be fleeing in droves.  It might be quite a while before we saw $7500 again and much, much longer before bitcoin sees its previous ATH of $20k or whatever it was.  I like buying opportunities but I'd prefer not to have as good an opportunity as that.  And I'm sure I'm not alone.

All that said, I don't think the market is headed back to the $3k range.  It's possible, true.  Probable?  I don't think so.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1622
Bare in mind that in 2018 we broke 6000 support that was holding price for 9 months and we saw prices last seen one year ago. That was major reason for 50% price drop. Not "Miner Capitulation" what is an effect and not a reason for falling prices.

It is hardly unlikely to see the same output (50% price drop) with different market condition, price, volume, adoption, global situation with the only one constant (some miners quit mining).
legendary
Activity: 2590
Merit: 3015
Welt Am Draht
What 2018 miner capitulation? Why should anyone other than miners give a fuck what it costs them?

Anyone who uses mining for price predictions turns into an instant prick in my book.

Why does it not work the the other way? Hash rates have been making constant all time highs while the price action has been largely dead.
hero member
Activity: 1008
Merit: 510
A price of $3800 seems unlikely, but we should be prepared for the unexpected. It could happen but I try to see that as a buying opportunity. And I believe that we will see another big bull run starting next year.
sr. member
Activity: 1974
Merit: 450
To see whether this prediction is true or not, we need to wait until December. If this December the price of bitcoin drops, it is very likely that this prediction will occur. but there is a difference between this year and 2018, namely halving that happened. I am pretty sure that current prices will last. it was proven when the price of bitcoin fell to the level of $ 6k, and then rose again. it made me think positively about this development.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 2213
Regarding the indicator, it is by default based on the 30 and 60 SMA's of hash rate. Therefore, as far as I understand with the coding:
  • When the 30 initially crosses below the 60 (bearish) that creates the red area whereby the indicator signals the beginning miner capitulation (shown by the title "capitulation").
  • When the 30 is rising back towards the 60, we see the red area shrink (as shown with the green dots), as capitulation is losing momentum.
  • When the 30 is again trending downwards away from the 60 (that it previously crossed), we then see the transparent dots signalling continued "miner capitulation".
  • When the 30 crosses back above the 60, indicating an exhaustion of miner capitulation, we then receive the "Buy Signal" (as shown above in blue)

after studying the source code of the indicator, it's clear that one requirement of the buy signal is bullish price movement, hence no buy signal from this indicator yet.



Hash Ribbons confirmed it's 10th buy signal in 9 years yesterday on the Daily chart, make of it what you will:



The 3 Day chart is also signalling a buy, confirmation would arrive tomorrow with the close of the current candle:





Original post:
Disclaimer: Don't shoot the messenger or indicator Wink
I'm posting this not necessarily because I believe it will happen, but for educational purposes.
See related education: Bitcoin repeating history with descending triangle & other indicators TA series.




Source: Trading View, November 28th 2019.

The chart speaks for itself. The extrapolated price comes from the "2018 miner capitulation" that caused the price to drop 50%. Will we go back to $3,800? Unlikely, but clearly this is possible if the capitulation is as aggressive as 2018. Notably the VPVR is supporting the price target of $3,800, as is the extrapolation, with forecasted price for the block halving in May 2020 above $6K followed by another swift recovery and subsequent bull-run.

This isn't the first theory regarding price forming a higher low double bottom instead of holding the $5-6K area. As published last month, the 50 & 200 Day death cross [Part 10] also resulted in a 50% drop in price in 2014 and 2018, implying a 50% probability of such an outcome (using 4 sets of available data).


Credit to Willy Woo for the Bitcoin Difficulty Ribbon chart and the Hash Ribbons indicator by capriole_charles.

Quote from: capriole_charles
Buying during Miner Capitulation yields wonderful returns.


Disclosure: The author of this TA holds approximately 57% of wealth in cryptocurrency, 88% allocated to Bitcoin, and will continue to heavily accumulate between the $4.8K to $6.8K range, as well as for 6 months DCA leading up to the block reward halving until May 14th 2019.



Related analysis:
Extrapolating 2014 Correction: Could $6,500 Be The Low For Bitcoin?, December 2019 (bullish)
Two & Four Year MA's Claim It's Time To Accumulate Bitcoin, December 2019 (bullish)
Bitcoin Is Repeating History? TA Series On Repeating Past Patterns, September-October 2019 (bearish)

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