Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s - page 581. (Read 880461 times)

Time machine

Yes it really is... Not sure what else I can do to prove that? 
John

What can you get out of this if you overclock it?

+1 - The whole idea of accepting ONLY BTC is rediculous. The ONLY way BTC is going to become recognized as something other than a novelty / illicit currency is to get people to see it as at-least on-par with their local paper currency on a large scale. Once the currency is developed, and people start to realize the value, THEN this is possible, until then keep dreaming... PCB's, chips, etc are bought with USD/EURO/ETC not BTC... not yet atleast....

As for pegging the price to BTC it would put way too much volatility into the sale for both sides - take 5 minutes and think about, customers purchases a device for say $2000 BTC adjusted in USD. Company spends 2 million taping out a chip, purchasing said chips with funds, then that customer backs out of the deal 3 weeks and 25% drop later in BTC value. Are you going to screw the customer out of $500? or are you going to eat the cost yourself? are you simply going to risk bring labeled as vaporware by stating that you are not accepting refunds??

 You see the problem with this now?... Took less than 5 minutes.

I don't know how people fail to understand this...

If someone was selling a machine that only had one function and that function was to print out $100 dollar bills, would you buy it for $500?

what if I told you it could only print out four bills before it self-destructed?  Would you still buy it for $500?

IMHO, this won't be much of an announcent until they release pricing information. If they have a 400 Gh/s chip and end up charging ASICminer prices for it, it obviously ends up being cost prohibitive. But if they're able to significantly beat KnC's $/SHA, we may have something here. I am encouraged by what they say about helping to secure the network. I'm definitely watching...

Hmm... I was hoping for something a bit more meaty for a rebuttal. 

I agree that multiple payment options could/should be available... but the PRICE should be in BTC.
The machine makes BTC... if more comes out than you put in... you win!
If less comes out... you should have bought BTC directly.

Seems like a straight forward/simple concept...  take 5 minutes to think on it.

Is Bob Smith really his name ?! The only thing that would be a bigger red flag is if he signed his name John Doe...

What a bunch of nonsense.  You don't know how to figure out what BTC was valued at when you purchased the machine?  IMO the more payment options, the better.

I am going to get on my soapbox for a sec... so prepare for a bit of suds 

Hopefully they price it in BTC rather than some fiat denominated BTC.

First we are trying to promote an economy of buying things with BTC.  This does put some risk on the manufacturer, but if we want the BTC economy to successful, we all need to take some risks.  Miners are not averse to risks so we participate in pre-buys.

Machines that produce BTC should also be denominated in BTC.  People who buy miners are buying to make more BTC. If the machine doesn't make more BTC than it costs... then it is clearly a bad investment. That is, the purchaser could have just purchased BTC outright and been ahead.

Pricing in USD or EUR or whatever, muddies the water on the calculation of ROI, but ultimately for miners, the calculation is easy in BTC:
 (BTC in) > (BTC out) == bad deal, should have just bought BTC and held it
 (BTC in) < (BTC out) == good deal, buy buy buy

From a practical perspective, if folks are worried about trying to get BTC lined up before sales become available, Hashfast can communicate before hand what the pricing will be by a week or so.  Then buyers can get their ducks in a row.  Avalon Batch 3 gave less than a day which prevented some from being able to participate in the sale.

It's 400Gh/s per chip. Re-read the Uniquify letter. It's in there...

KnC is anticipating at least 250 Watts per chip, and they have a heatsink that's rated for 320 watts, I think.  This company may use water cooling, there's self-contained, off the shelf water cooling equipment you can get for PCs that's pretty cheap now (a couple hundred bucks per unit).  KnC was going to do use it, before data centers told them they didn't want water in their datacenters. 

If that's not a concern for Fasthash then water cooling could be an obvious solution to the thermal issues.

Anyway, their announcement was that it would be significantly less then 400 watts. So this isn't really an issue.

From reading this, it seems that this 400 GH/s unit takes 400 watts to run. This makes me think that this isn't one chip, but multiple chips on a board. Otherwise this one chip would take 400 watts which is pretty ridiculous and would need a pretty big footprint to allow that much heat into a heatsink. Don't forget most cpu's are under 130 watts and most gpu boards are under 250 watts.

I couldn't agree more.
I've done pre-orders before and they worked out well for me so far.
Been burnt on some, made a killing on others.

I'd love to see an opportunity to pre-order a 400 Gigahash chip from anyone as long as I believe in their capability to deliver.
And you damn well bet I'll do my very best to find out just how credible their offer is.

I actually prefer the pre-order model.  I mean, it allows savvy investors to make their decision on who to pre-fund based on their own ability to evaluate technical proposals.  For example, I decided to go with Avalon after they'd managed to at least demo a working unit (proving they weren't total vaporware).  And so far it's paid off great.

That also means of course I'm not in the position of all these people who have been completely burned by BFL and loath the idea of pre-orders.

The way KnC presented themselves made me think that they'd be a good deal as well.

And here's the thing, remember, the less risk you take the less reward you get.  Look at the price difference between batch 1, batch 2 and batch 3 Avalons. It went from $1,200 to $1,500 to something like $7k. People buying batch 1 were taking a blind risk, people buying batch 2 knew Avalon could at least ship demo units. And people buying batch 3 knew that Avalon could deliver (at least most of their orders) in a somewhat timely manner.

The lowest risk are things like USB erupters.  You know you'll get your unit and you'll get it on time. But the ROI is basically not going to happen unless either bitcoins go way up or just ignore the electrical costs (which is easy when it's probably only a few dollars a month)

KnC's prices were ridiculously cheap compared to their competition, there's a reason for that: if they made their offer low enough that profitability would basically be guaranteed if they delivered then they would get funded for sure. If they charged high prices, people not buy in - and they'd not get funded.

So basically people want ASIC makers to shoulder all the risk, and then charge reasonable prices that allow miners to get ROI are living in fantasy land.

I'm just hoping KnC keeps rewarding it's initial customers, rather then jacking up their prices in the future.

Agreed, if we see no more like the first example and more like the latter then the BTC world will be a better place. We have the power to support (or not) these ventures, I just hope we all use our heads when we choose!

HAHA

I had to watch the video...

Are you sure? 

LMAO