Topic: [HAVELOCK] CasinoBitco.in (CBTC) IPO Official Thread - page 9. (Read 25116 times)

Hey all!
IPO is one day away!

For the sell clause: It was very important for us to word this in a way to build confidence, benefit, & protect investors. This is why we opted to add the higher of the 30-day weighted average price, or asking price - or asset sale price. So, investors will walk home with the best possible outcome in this situation.

The #1 concern was to protect investors in this clause - We'd want them to benefit the same as management in these scenarios. We don't intend to de-list unless it is somehow necessary, and investors should fully benefit from any risk/reward, as any upside potential should be reflected in the bid price as part of an efficient market, which would have ideally appreciated significantly for any IPVO investors. If not, it's our responsibility to compensate investors fairly. Unfortunately, such a clause is probably necessary to any bitcoin-based asset listing - It's included for transparency, and we seek to place our investor's interests first any any such situation.

Ultimately, is there some level of risk people need to account for there? Yes. I think this illustrates the value of earning the trust of our investors, which is very important to us.  

You can buy through Havelock Investments on Tuesday at noon (ESD).  You would need to create and fund (with BTC) your account first.

Here's the IPO page when you can purchase CasinoBitco.in when the IPO starts at the above time. 
https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=CBTC#ui-tabs-3

If you miss out on the IPO, the open market will being trading after the IPO sells out.  Here is the link for the open market:
https://www.havelockinvestments.com/order.php?symbol=CBTC

This should be obvious based on how many people argue that PMB's (some of which are already IMPOSSIBLE to earn a full ROI on) are a good investment. You can sit there throwing math at them all day and their response is always along the lines of "I get paid daily or weekly and I can sell at any time, so it's profitable." It's a little depressing, really, and some of the IPO's are taking advantage of that. One of them was going for at least 5x its true valuation and promised (through a private offer) that I'd make a profit investing because people are going to be dumb enough to overvalue it as well and I could make a quick exit for at least 2x the investment amount as soon as the IPO hit. I didn't take them up on that offer, but there's been others run the same way as well. People are taking advantage of those stupid enough to invest in something when they have no business investing in the first place. Sure, some of them might turn a profit, but this isn't really investing, it's flat out gambling. I can go to a casino and figure out whether I'll win or lose a lot faster than dealing with IPO's here.

With that said, I think CBTC has a decent chance of survival. I'm also against their clause where they can buy back at the current price (meaning if they hit the big news, they could do a buyback right after they find out, taking all the increased profit and earnings). It'd also be possible to manipulate pricing so that stock price drops before something major happens -> they buy back -> they get even more benefits. The situation all caters towards Casinobitco.in, and that's a bit of a worry. When looking for investors, our security matters as well.

And they are going to be releasing the data from the 5th up through today as well, so we can see what the past 3-4 days have been like prior to the IPO, for any wondering!

how to buy?

The question below is posted by ScatterShot in the Newbies section.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.3111845

I have reposted it here as requested, and as a potential large investor I too would appreciate a response.

Thank you.


ScatterShot's Question:
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In regards to this thread: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.3090397

I believe casinobitcoin is right when they repeatedly characterize this investment as "high risk / high reward", except for this passage in the prospectus:

"CasinoBitco.in reserves the right to buyback outstanding units of CBTC on Havelock Investments with a 30 day notice, with the price being determined by the higher of the 30-day weighted average price or the current market asking price of CBTC at the time of the official announcement of the buyback."

Yes, the company is young, small, behind the curve and undercapitalized, and there are many other problems including the ones KingOfSports alluded to (all of this is the "high risk" stuff). Now, *if* the company gets to the point where they start to take significant market share and "break out" commercially with rapid growth on strong fundamentals (the "high reward" part that investors would hope for), this clause would allow the company to unilaterally cash out the IPO investors at the instant valuation, which might cut them off from the lion's share of the upside over the following months/years.

I don't have a problem with this clause in and of itself, especially since the issuer has been above board with its inclusion in the prospectus. But there's really no way that any "sophisticated investor" (as defined by the SEC) being approached through a brokered or unbrokered private placement would touch this without having the clause severed from the prospectus, or reducing the implied P/E multiple by at least an order of magnitude, making the PPS about BTC 0.000018/share.

With this clause, IPO investors will still bear the full advertised high risk, but might not reap the associated high reward.

I'd appreciate it if someone who isn't a "newbie" could repost this to the thread mentioned above. Thanks.

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Sure thing! We've had more than one request.

The biggest as far as viewership and a clear path to betting (tournament coverage and reliable score keeping records etc.) are probe DOTA, SC2 and League of Legends.

One of the sexy aspects of casino/betting is that the double income source allows casinobitco.in to ride the popularity of both types of games. Its also client-less which means its device independent. I expect great things.

Bitcoin sportsbook is definitely a profitable business in the foreseeable future, I may put Casinobitco.in in my investment portfolio

I will be picking up some shares in this IPO for sure. Diversification is always good and I consider casinobitco.in one of few betting/casino sites with a very bright future.

Literally on deck this week is More sports options, including MLB 1st 5 Innings, then Parlays.

We are also very close to launching our affiliate program which we will beta for our most loyal users who are interested, uvwvj  - you are on that list, of course.

Hey KOS,
If there is no changing your mind, I may not spend time sending anything for now, we can agree to disagree. No hard feelings.

However, we 100% agree on reduced juice & more betting options - Those are all in the works - including 1st 5 innings bets for baseball - due by tonight/tomorrow.

Right now, our #1 priority is developing our affiliate backend.

Just fyi guys as a major sports bettor I can give insight on the sportsbook market, Bitbook.biz and NitrogenSports offer -106 reduced juice odds on almost all sports. Reduced juice is one of the biggest things sports bettor use for deciding where to bet. For Casinobitco.in to ever have the chance to be the top book or top 2 books they will need to at least match this. Right now in my opinion Bitbook is the biggest book and no one seems to be even close to them. -106 means on a 50/50 bet, the bettor risks $106 to win $100 in profit. Casinobitco.in's current lines are -110. Meaning $110 to win $100. This is a difference of about 2% house edge from book to book.

Casinobitco.in also is very behind as they are not providing teasers, parlays or any special type of bet. There also is no live betting. Bitbook.biz offers live betting on EVERY baseball game and offers parlays. Nitrogen offers parlays and Bitcoinsports.eu offers teasers.

Also, casinobitco.in feel free to PM the info you said you would be happy to send me. I have PMed you my email address. However to me your valuation should be at highest a 1000 BTC valuation to me so do not know if it would be beneificial for you to send me the info. Bitbook is the main horse in the sportsbook biz right now, followed by Nitrogen.

From personal experience I have quite a few friends who watch those tournaments this is a good idea +1
Catching up was away for a while, I do believe that the gambling space has potential to diversify itself and this is one of the ways to do so best of luck.

Site has been announced to the public since June 7th. Any startup expenses pre-July have been accounted for in our July starting balance and will not affect investors/dividends, which will be based on operating income going forward.

Our competition can be viewed on the attached Alexa traffic trends graph (Top - Casino, Bottom - Sports): http://imgur.com/xq7rUMC
As you can see here, we're growing fast (dark blue line on both)! We believe this is in large part due to our competitive advantages, and intend to push those further - whether it be unique leagues, bet types, games - or our focus on P2P offerings, which are FUN, competitive, and create loyalty (NFL Suicide leagues are the current example.... NFL Squares should be next). Of course, we'll still compete directly as well as building our own "niche" this way.

We could certainly stay private, and have had offers for additional funding. However, we feel our IPVO will raise our profile, additionally motivate us to benefit our shareholders, and also pay dividends in the form of investor ideas/input, word-of-mouth advertising, etc.

Awesome, thanks for the response. Going back to my original question:
How long has this site been operational?
I noticed the detailed statements go from July-August, but other Google docs files note starting back in May or so.

Next small round of questions:
Who is your primary competition? What do you offer that they don't?

As traffic to your site increases, why launch an offering at all?
If a gambling website is fun, profitable, and offers gaming variety, it'll grow on its own over time. When that happens, you'll have earned enough money to increase the maximum bets on your own instead of using raised funds to subsidize this part.

Hi, the time zone is ESD. The current time is indicated in the top right as well.
Auto buy orders/IPO subscription is something we're looking at but we're going with 'first come, first serve' for now.  Thanks for the feedback.

good,Interesting!

very interested in this IPO, the casino is very professional looking and entrancing to use (even for someone who hates gamble)
So I have question about the IPO for Havelock as I think the IPO will be gone in about an hour.
it says 2013-09-10 12:00:00 , i live in sydney australia so i am wondering what region this is,AND even better i would love it if i could set a automatic buy order!