Topic: How does ancap deal with an oil spill? - page 2. (Read 5864 times)
Remember when DOW had that plant explode in India? Lots of outrage, but no reparations were made.
Oh ok I thought you were saying the current system prevented more oil spills than AnCap would, my mistake.
I think your mistake is putting the cart before the horse. Why don't you take a year off from slapping your favorite pet political ideology on everything you see, and just educate yourself? When you come back from your sabbatical, with a fresh and newly primed mind filled with more knowledge than it currently stores, you can reevaluate the notion of your political beliefs.
What could it hurt? Stop insisting your political ideology is golden, and instead, just study the depth of the world's problems. Who knows what you'll discover?
Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.
[idiot]
It's a good thing there isn't a big militaristic government out there that
- invades country after country to control the oil supply,
- forces everyone to exchange oil using their currency, and
- protects oil-using polluters from retaliation
[/idiot]
I personally don't wish to trade one set of idiots (American War Machine) for another (Libertarians).
I personally want intelligence and knowledge coupled with long term thinking.
I get neither with the former, and neither with the latter.
Oh ok I thought you were saying the current system prevented more oil spills than AnCap would, my mistake.
Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.
[idiot]
It's a good thing there isn't a big militaristic government out there that
- invades country after country to control the oil supply,
- forces everyone to exchange oil using their currency, and
- protects oil-using polluters from retaliation
[/idiot]
I personally don't wish to trade one set of idiots (American War Machine) for another (Libertarians).
I personally want intelligence and knowledge coupled with long term thinking.
I get neither with the former, and neither with the latter.
Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.
[idiot]
It's a good thing there isn't a big militaristic government out there that
- invades country after country to control the oil supply,
- forces everyone to exchange oil using their currency, and
- protects oil-using polluters from retaliation
[/idiot]
Isn't the answer to this obvious? The government!
Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.Here's some information I was able to find within a few minutes (do note that I have not actively researched this area):
http://rense.com/general72/oinvent.htm
http://www.broandrew.com/suppression.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dfj1O45qZ5U
Please tell me about Frederick Seitz, the tobacco companies, and the oil companies, if you wish to get some insights into how certain organizations operate and who the real instigators might be.
Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.
Fucking Statist. Your condescending replies are indicative of your pretense of knowledge.
Isn't the answer to this obvious? The government!
Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.Here's some information I was able to find within a few minutes (do note that I have not actively researched this area):
http://rense.com/general72/oinvent.htm
http://www.broandrew.com/suppression.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dfj1O45qZ5U
(I'm the oil company)
Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
Fuck you and your oil. I'll drive electric.Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
Why aren't we all doing that right now? What stopped Mr. AnCap, the entrepreneur, from already making that happen?
Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.
(I'm the oil company)
Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
Fuck you and your oil. I'll drive electric.Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
Why aren't we all doing that right now? What stopped Mr. AnCap, the entrepreneur, from already making that happen?
(I'm the oil company)
Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
Fuck you and your oil. I'll drive electric.Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
Why aren't we all doing that right now? What stopped Mr. AnCap, the entrepreneur, from already making that happen?
What's that? you don't like it? You are paying a private agency to attack my offshore rigs with guns and boats? I'm filthy fucking rich. My guns are louder, dick longer, boats bigger.
Hmm... No, your dick is not bigger than my aerial bombardment. We can climb this tree, if you want, or we can negotiate peacefully. Your choice.That's real good for the environment when the well head starts gushing. Not a solution, Mr. AnCap dreamer.
(I'm the oil company)
Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
Fuck you and your oil. I'll drive electric.Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
What's that? you don't like it? You are paying a private agency to attack my offshore rigs with guns and boats? I'm filthy fucking rich. My guns are louder, dick longer, boats bigger.
Hmm... No, your dick is not bigger than my aerial bombardment. We can climb this tree, if you want, or we can negotiate peacefully. Your choice.What's that? You want to start your own rigs and run me out of business because consumers hate me and would rather buy your hippie fair-trade certified oil? Too bad, because the entry is too damn expensive. No, you know what? I'll let you waste millions to get your kickstarter funded rig up and running. Then I'll lower prices, because I can, because I paid off these rigs 20 years ago. I will drive you into the dirt.
/devilsadvocate
Hey, sure. But my hippy-friendly oil rig is paid off, and my payroll account is good for a year, because the people really fucking hate you. My kickstarter campaign tripled my goal. Free gas for everyone! How long can you keep that up, and the defense of your rig(s)?/devilsadvocate
Lol! Good points here.
(I'm the oil company)
Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
Fuck you and your oil. I'll drive electric.Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping the earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
What's that? you don't like it? You are paying a private agency to attack my offshore rigs with guns and boats? I'm filthy fucking rich. My guns are louder, dick longer, boats bigger.
Hmm... No, your dick is not bigger than my aerial bombardment. We can climb this tree, if you want, or we can negotiate peacefully. Your choice.What's that? You want to start your own rigs and run me out of business because consumers hate me and would rather buy your hippie fair-trade certified oil? Too bad, because the entry is too damn expensive. No, you know what? I'll let you waste millions to get your kickstarter funded rig up and running. Then I'll lower prices, because I can, because I paid off these rigs 20 years ago. I will drive you into the dirt.
/devilsadvocate
Hey, sure. But my hippy-friendly oil rig is paid off, and my payroll account is good for a year, because the people really fucking hate you. My kickstarter campaign tripled my goal. Free gas for everyone! How long can you keep that up, and the defense of your rig(s)? /devilsadvocate
These "Protection agencies" would, for all intents and purposes, become governing bodies. They would have to decide on sets of "rules" for members to be bound by in arbitration... which would effectively become laws. You would pay these "Protection agencies" a "membership fee", which would effectively be a tax. They would fulfill all the useful roles of government, without out all the bloat. The most significant difference is we would all have a choice. Protection Agency A, Protection Agency B, Protection Agency z, no protection agency, etc....
The most honest answer to any of these "How does ancap deal with..." questions is "I don't know, and it doesn't matter". The point is not how we can force everyone to live a "better" life, but how naturally we can't force anyone to do anything. The government is an evil corporate monopoly, and should be put down.
The most honest answer to any of these "How does ancap deal with..." questions is "I don't know, and it doesn't matter". The point is not how we can force everyone to live a "better" life, but how naturally we can't force anyone to do anything. The government is an evil corporate monopoly, and should be put down.
Except that the defining factor of a tax is that it is compulsory. The modern tax system, as well, is designed so that it's nearly impossible for the individual to figure out how much, if anything, they owe. So the fees which one would pay to a protection agency, which are completely voluntary, and necessarily quite simple to understand, are nothing like taxes.
I can't agree. I know exactly what I owe and it's not hard to understand what is going on.
(I'm the oil company)
Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping mother earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
What's that? you don't like it? You are paying a private agency to attack my offshore rigs with guns and boats? I'm filthy fucking rich. My guns are louder, dick longer, boats bigger.
What's that? You want to start your own rigs and run me out of business because consumers hate me and would rather buy your hippie fair-trade certified oil? Too bad, because the entry is too damn expensive. No, you know what? I'll let you waste millions to get your kickstarter funded rig up and running. Then I'll lower prices, because I can, because I paid off these rigs 20 years ago. I will drive you into the dirt.
/devilsadvocate
This is anarcho-capitalism.
So what happens next? millions of people form a consensus that this is evil, and form an alliance to overthrow the oilmongers. (this is what we call democracy). Government is a meaningless label. Power exists and always will. Whether it's a company, a cartel, a king, or a consensus; people will be "governed" regardless.
Fuck you and your fish. I'm not paying jack shit. I'm going to continue raping mother earth because it makes me filthy fucking rich. You want me to fix everything and pay those bleeding-heart fag-loving commy hippies on the beach, wiping off the black, slimy, baby seagulls with baby wipes and a motherly touch? Sorry. That doesn't make me money.
What's that? you don't like it? You are paying a private agency to attack my offshore rigs with guns and boats? I'm filthy fucking rich. My guns are louder, dick longer, boats bigger.
What's that? You want to start your own rigs and run me out of business because consumers hate me and would rather buy your hippie fair-trade certified oil? Too bad, because the entry is too damn expensive. No, you know what? I'll let you waste millions to get your kickstarter funded rig up and running. Then I'll lower prices, because I can, because I paid off these rigs 20 years ago. I will drive you into the dirt.
/devilsadvocate
This is anarcho-capitalism.
So what happens next? millions of people form a consensus that this is evil, and form an alliance to overthrow the oilmongers. (this is what we call democracy). Government is a meaningless label. Power exists and always will. Whether it's a company, a cartel, a king, or a consensus; people will be "governed" regardless.
Ignorance and agendas unique to an individual or entity will generally ensure that full property rights are not a long term solution (nor a short term solution) to resources which undergo transformation when processed for consumption, or resources which receive collateral damage due to other processes.
A link to the definition of communism is rather tiresome.
But it's so complicated! You can jerk your mind off all incessantly and it still wont work.
So? Who wants communism?
FirstAscent want's something to mentally masterbate to. Ancap ain't it. That's the point he is missing. READ THE HAYEK!
A link to the definition of communism is rather tiresome.
But it's so complicated! You can jerk your mind off all incessantly and it still wont work.
So? Who wants communism?
A link to the definition of communism is rather tiresome.
But it's so complicated! You can jerk your mind off all incessantly and it still wont work.
Read the Hayek speech, then we'll talk. It's was the link I was referring to.
Disclaimer: I'm not an AnCap myself and what follows is still science fiction.
The OP describes an externality.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Externality
Oil spills are no different, they could be handled with Coasian bargaining.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coase_Theorem
This requires strong property rights, rational actors, and very low transaction costs. Strong property and low transaction costs are already in the works: for example, Namecoin has strong property rights, and a digital cash server with an open API (like Open Transactions) could be automated for very low transaction costs. Rational actors are beyond science fiction and in the realm of fantasy, but large groups (like oil spill victims) approach rational behavior when viewed collectively.
I'm of the opinion that the only reason the world hasn't advanced to anarchy is because we haven't built all the necessary tools yet. But we're close.
The OP describes an externality.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Externality
Oil spills are no different, they could be handled with Coasian bargaining.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coase_Theorem
This requires strong property rights, rational actors, and very low transaction costs. Strong property and low transaction costs are already in the works: for example, Namecoin has strong property rights, and a digital cash server with an open API (like Open Transactions) could be automated for very low transaction costs. Rational actors are beyond science fiction and in the realm of fantasy, but large groups (like oil spill victims) approach rational behavior when viewed collectively.
I'm of the opinion that the only reason the world hasn't advanced to anarchy is because we haven't built all the necessary tools yet. But we're close.
Jump to: