Topic: If you're thinking buying mining hardware, read this first - page 4. (Read 92726 times)
There are about 7200 generated a day. So if he was 1/3 of the mining he could do 2000 or so. That is possible.
... So then even when the difficulty is at retarded proportions, the productivity won't necessarily have to decrease?
When total network was 1GHash/sec a block took 10 minutes, same as now. The whole point of difficulty is to keep productivity the same.
Were blocks worth more than 50 BTC back then? I remember reading in that one thread about the guy who bought two pizzas for 10,000 BTC that he was generating "a few thousand" bitcoins per day.
... So then even when the difficulty is at retarded proportions, the productivity won't necessarily have to decrease?
When total network was 1GHash/sec a block took 10 minutes, same as now. The whole point of difficulty is to keep productivity the same.
In all honesty, what could a card do if it was designed by NVIDIA or ATI for the specific purpose of mining? In realistic terms of today's usable technologies I mean.
Could any card ever do 9000mh/s? What about 9000gh/s?
Could any card ever do 9000mh/s? What about 9000gh/s?
If Moore's Law for semiconductors holds true in the future, then 9000mh/s dual GPU cards would become a reality (in theory) in roughly 7 years. Currently the best dual GPU does about 800 mh/s.
A 9 thash/s card will never happen with current silicon based GPUs. When we move onto 3d and carbon based resistors on graphene wafers after the 11nm process in 2015-16, we could see a limitless expansion of GPU computing power.
I haven't seen plans by AMD, but Nvidia is planning their graphene GPU technology 'Echelon' for 2018, the first chips are said to achieve 10 teraFLOPS of computing power, which is 400 times more powerful than a Radeon 6990. They will also use 20 times less energy than todays GPUs
http://www.eetimes.com/electronics-news/4210815/Nvidia-describes-10-teraflops-processor
Who is we? Nothing that NVidia is developing will reach consumers, at least not in the foreseeable future. If they succeed with their design, and that's a big if, it will be from a millions dollar grant by the US Govt, and certainly not developed in any way for mass release. Not to mention that double precision floating point operations are not at all used in hashing, so the power is irrelevant for bitcoin.
Not saying that technological progress isn't cool, but let's not conjure up pipe dreams of computing bitcoin to the moon just yet.
Just don't fucking do it. Its a waste of your money. I am out $1K bucks. /end thread /pin
Satoshi has probably created his difficulty model upon the expectation that processing power will really double in performance every 2 years.
Think 1.6 million difficulty in January 2009, people would simply quit mining because even the most expensive GPUs back then before the 5xxx series was released, cost about $300-$400 and only yield about 100mhash/s.
Doesn't sound so bad now that you can buy two 5830's for about 200 bucks and stretch them to 600mhash/s.
Similarly 160 million difficulty wont sound so bad many years in the future when you can get a fairly cheap GPU doing 10ghash/s,
but sounds like a nightmare to someone who only has access to year 2011 gpus doing a few hundred mhash/s
Think 1.6 million difficulty in January 2009, people would simply quit mining because even the most expensive GPUs back then before the 5xxx series was released, cost about $300-$400 and only yield about 100mhash/s.
Doesn't sound so bad now that you can buy two 5830's for about 200 bucks and stretch them to 600mhash/s.
Similarly 160 million difficulty wont sound so bad many years in the future when you can get a fairly cheap GPU doing 10ghash/s,
but sounds like a nightmare to someone who only has access to year 2011 gpus doing a few hundred mhash/s
In all honesty, what could a card do if it was designed by NVIDIA or ATI for the specific purpose of mining? In realistic terms of today's usable technologies I mean.
Could any card ever do 9000mh/s? What about 9000gh/s?
Could any card ever do 9000mh/s? What about 9000gh/s?
If Moore's Law for semiconductors holds true in the future, then 9000mh/s dual GPU cards would become a reality (in theory) in roughly 7 years. Currently the best dual GPU does about 800 mh/s.
A 9 thash/s card will never happen with current silicon based GPUs. When we move onto 3d and carbon based resistors on graphene wafers after the 11nm process in 2015-16, we could see a limitless expansion of GPU computing power.
I haven't seen plans by AMD, but Nvidia is planning their graphene GPU technology 'Echelon' for 2018, the first chips are said to achieve 10 teraFLOPS of computing power, which is 400 times more powerful than a Radeon 6990. They will also use 20 times less energy than todays GPUs
http://www.eetimes.com/electronics-news/4210815/Nvidia-describes-10-teraflops-processor
In all honesty if ATI/NVIDIA devoted even a minuscule fraction of their R&D twoards developing a bitcoin mining specific product, a Th/s rating of over 9000 is certainly not out of the question.
If that's even a possibility, I think miners need to start spending a little bit of time on the infrastructure, along with their hardware of course.
Perhaps, starting bitcoin businesses, providing services to accept bitcoins locally, start mini exchanges, etc. If it could all disappear one day because of a single rich company (rich in either liquid assets or resources) then mining is only going to work if it's a secret forever.
Oh absolutely.
Absolutely...
In all honesty, what could a card do if it was designed by NVIDIA or ATI for the specific purpose of mining? In realistic terms of today's usable technologies I mean.
Could any card ever do 9000mh/s? What about 9000gh/s?
Could any card ever do 9000mh/s? What about 9000gh/s?
In all honesty if ATI/NVIDIA devoted even a minuscule fraction of their R&D twoards developing a bitcoin mining specific product, a Th/s rating of over 9000 is certainly not out of the question.
I work a desk job. If I bought the best video card that fit in the thing (it's a decent system, I design tools with Autocad Inventor 3D modeling software) then mined all night while I wasn't there, no power costs. THEN, surely it is very profitable... 
Yeeaaa... you probably thought about getting some Nvidia Quadro or Tesla, eh?
Over 9000 GHash/s with one of those cards, fine quality - really nice.
Workstation cards like Nvidia Tesla M2090 are horrible for integer calculation like bitcoin mining. They will yield about 200-300 mhash/s but cost $7k to $20k dollars.
They have phenomenal performance for single and double precision floating point operations though (1 Nvidia Tesla M2090 card @ 1300gigaFLOPS equivalent to over 200 radeon 6990's)
I work a desk job. If I bought the best video card that fit in the thing (it's a decent system, I design tools with Autocad Inventor 3D modeling software) then mined all night while I wasn't there, no power costs. THEN, surely it is very profitable...
Yeeaaa... you probably thought about getting some Nvidia Quadro or Tesla, eh?
Over 9000 GHash/s with one of those cards, fine quality - really nice.
there is an engine that spins at about 300 rpm. it runs on any fuel, used motor oil, french fry grease and so on. These engines are bulletproof. They use them in india for power, and some have been running for 30+ years. You can get the fuel from restaurants, you can even charge them to take their used oil away...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GJgg-L95G2M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GJgg-L95G2M
Hey that's pretty cool. That guys whole video was interesting.
Thanks.
there is an engine that spins at about 300 rpm. it runs on any fuel, used motor oil, french fry grease and so on. These engines are bulletproof. They use them in india for power, and some have been running for 30+ years. You can get the fuel from restaurants, you can even charge them to take their used oil away...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GJgg-L95G2M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GJgg-L95G2M
This could work! Rig up some sort of sling for your groin to hold the battery (or batteries) and smuggle them in a pair of hammerpants. When co-workers ask you why you're walking funny tell them you just got a vasectomy. If they ask again a month later tell them you had to get a couple more because of how potent you are, and they'll stop asking ever again.
You could expand your operation by siphoning gas from cars in the parking lot and running a generator.
You could expand your operation by siphoning gas from cars in the parking lot and running a generator.
LOL!!!
This could work! Rig up some sort of sling for your groin to hold the battery (or batteries) and smuggle them in a pair of hammerpants. When co-workers ask you why you're walking funny tell them you just got a vasectomy. If they ask again a month later tell them you had to get a couple more because of how potent you are, and they'll stop asking ever again.
You could expand your operation by siphoning gas from cars in the parking lot and running a generator.
You could expand your operation by siphoning gas from cars in the parking lot and running a generator.
Wouldn't it be easier to use batteries designed for solar installations to charge at your employer and use them to power your rigs at night? Depending on how meaty of an individual you are (or want to become) it may be possible to lug a few thousand kwhr a day out that way -- a 380 amp/hour, 20 hour 6 volt deep cycle battery is only about 110 pounds.
I like it
Everything about this idea makes me laugh.
Wouldn't it be easier to use batteries designed for solar installations to charge at your employer and use them to power your rigs at night? Depending on how meaty of an individual you are (or want to become) it may be possible to lug a few thousand kwhr a day out that way -- a 380 amp/hour, 20 hour 6 volt deep cycle battery is only about 110 pounds.
I work a desk job. If I bought the best video card that fit in the thing (it's a decent system, I design tools with Autocad Inventor 3D modeling software) then mined all night while I wasn't there, no power costs. THEN, surely it is very profitable...
Except that you'd be stealing the electricity from your employer, not to mention that they would have claim to the bitcoins for providing the system, even if you provided the video card, assuming that your employer / network admin is ok with you making hardware changes.
If none of those things bother you and you're confident of getting away with doing it, then easy profit for you!
I work a desk job. If I bought the best video card that fit in the thing (it's a decent system, I design tools with Autocad Inventor 3D modeling software) then mined all night while I wasn't there, no power costs. THEN, surely it is very profitable...
i don't really see the point. investing thousands of $ into mining gear and investing some idle cpu cycles are 2 whole different things. nobody has invested in mining 1-2 years ago. nobody. they have used what was available.
Never PRESUME, because it makes PRES out of U and ME...
...or something like that
:O i've read the difficulty chart. i thought that's enough to assume nobody invested in mining.
I love how this thread just continues to be negative; ten whole pages of it. It's like you guys think that you can dissuade new miners from getting into the game by saying it's pointless and unprofitable and the sky is falling and we're all going to die if we buy more hardware.
personally I just dropped $5k on hardware in June and have another $1k in cards going live next week. If you understand anything about enterprise capacity planning, TCO-over-time analytics, or the like you can build rather efficient hardware. Then you rack and stack it, cool it, monitor it, and understand your electric usage. This is not rocket science but it's not a child's game either.
But hey, I'm all for keeping the difficulty low
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