Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 - page 83.

bitcoiner49er

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Quote from: BenTuras on August 09, 2013, 01:35:02 AM

I am DISGUSTED by most replies here. Almost all comments here are about missing ROI and the like. Hardly anyone mentions the terrifying times that team Avalon and their family went through and probably still are.

It's just GREED all the way.

Imagine you are a bright young man, with some bright friends, able to make a unique product that brings in millions and then you, your team and family found yourself in the crosshair of . All of you would take CARE OF YOUR FAMILY and would have to put your CRM on halt.

Yes, I am a customer of Bitsyncom, machines and chips.
Yes, I am waiting for some chips, but I will never let greed take over.
Yes, I will buy again.

Call me stupid, call me an idiot, but at least I am still decent.

REALLY?! So it's just now, when the fan is getting clogged full that YiFu decides to clue us in? He had to try and stop the hemorrhage that he created and came up with new music for the same dance. How did Batch #1 for Zefir get through, but amazingly no others? Not one ounce of apologetic verbiage in his whole sales pitch. Angry

I would give my right arm for a person with power/authority to be honest for once in their lives. How stupid do you think we are YiFu/Josh/next ASIC creator? You can't even accept your role in the failure. Almost the whole frickin' world finds someone else to blame for personal/business short falls. Man up, give your customers some concession due to the late delivery of your products and take the hit in your bottom line. If you do this, I would respect you YiFu. I'm betting that won't be the case.

*sigh* Cor aut mors

Bitcoinorama

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Quote from: Vigil on August 09, 2013, 08:42:46 AM

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on August 09, 2013, 08:36:09 AM

Quote from: Vigil on August 09, 2013, 08:32:56 AM

Not if they just wanted to delay all the other chips for a bit. They wouldn't have to completely scam anyone, just hold up the delivery of everyone's chips to make a greater ROI and then send them out a month or two later than expected.

Like I said, not accusing anyone, just throwing it out there.

That IS scamming everyone, and now the US, of which Bitsycom is a registered company now recognises Bitcoin as a currency, and Bitsyncom fits the description of a 'common enterprise' and the volume of chips they have purposely delayed to manipulate the network's hashrate they are directly fraudulently manipulating a currency for their own gain. That's major f**king fraud on a grand scale. I really don't think Yifu has though this through at all.

This is very very serious...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Currency_intervention

http://ia800904.us.archive.org/35/items/gov.uscourts.txed.146063/gov.uscourts.txed.146063.23.0.pdf

In that case, pump-and-dumps are fraud as well since they manipulate the currency value. I really don't want to bring in the authorities because we are just asking for the very thing we don't want - i.e., the government to come in and start regulating all BTC transactions and exchanges.

It's inevitable governments will, especially with Bitsyncom's corruption and recent bullshit. This is not a game, this is now a real currency as far as the government are concerned and Bitsyncom have been caught directly manipulating it red handed, affecting the creation and flow of said acknowledged currency, be it with Batch 2 miners pre-mined covered in dust and with pool already assigned, or be delaying equipment that directly effects the amount of currency in circulation. There is evidence by the pictures Gridchip added that this is undeniably the case, it has tracking details on it. Those chips have been in Bitsyncom's hands since the end of June, a month and a half ago.

FCTaiChi

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Quote from: bystander on August 09, 2013, 01:59:28 AM

Fool us once shame on him, fool us twice shame on us.

Sorry have to fix this:
Fool me once, shame on ... shame on you. Fool me ... you can't get fooled again.

Oh no! I'm contributing to the spam.. people always talk about Whaaambulance, but this forum could use a Spambulance much more.

pajak666

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Looking for advertising deal

Quote from: Vigil on August 09, 2013, 08:42:46 AM

In that case, pump-and-dumps are fraud as well since they manipulate the currency value. I really don't want to bring in the authorities because we are just asking for the very thing we don't want - i.e., the government to come in and start regulating all BTC transactions and exchanges.

No shit sherlock
http://www.vosizneias.com/127514/2013/04/04/new-york-7-arrested-in-pump-and-dump-penny-stocks-scheme/

Somehow Pirateat40 got charged and nothing bad happened except some thief behind bars

atcsecure

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Quote from: MinermanNC on August 09, 2013, 08:31:32 AM

Some tech firm needs to redesign fpga boards to be more powerfull and enery efficient, get them back on the market. I dont care if its the size of a wheel barrel to produce 60 g/hash or more! this asic sharade really sucks...I dont care which company it is,,they all promise the moon in the beggining and never fully deliver on time if at all. The web sites all look so inviting and exciting....but seems they all hit snags. fpga technology is here and should be developed more. Maybe Im crazy... but i think there is a market for them still if done right and affordable.

ASIC's are pretty much a scam at this point, seeing how no "end user" can get them, yet the difficulty is going through the roof, so somebody/company is deploying massive amounts of hashing power but with NO BODY SHIPPING real products - its an insider scam

I invested a good amount of money into these chips like everybody else - based on the delivery time - and now I will won't ever get close to making that $$$ back, and now Avalon mentions a 2nd gen CHIP? WTF? they can't even get Gen 1 chips out the door

Vigil

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Quote from: Bitcoinorama on August 09, 2013, 08:36:09 AM

Quote from: Vigil on August 09, 2013, 08:32:56 AM

Not if they just wanted to delay all the other chips for a bit. They wouldn't have to completely scam anyone, just hold up the delivery of everyone's chips to make a greater ROI and then send them out a month or two later than expected.

Like I said, not accusing anyone, just throwing it out there.

That IS scamming everyone, and now the US, of which Bitsycom is a registered company now recognises Bitcoin as a currency, and Bitsyncom fits the description of a 'common enterprise' and the volume of chips they have purposely delayed to manipulate the network's hashrate they are directly fraudulently manipulating a currency for their own gain. That's major f**king fraud on a grand scale. I really don't think Yifu has though this through at all.

This is very very serious...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Currency_intervention

http://ia800904.us.archive.org/35/items/gov.uscourts.txed.146063/gov.uscourts.txed.146063.23.0.pdf

In that case, pump-and-dumps are fraud as well since they manipulate the currency value. I really don't want to bring in the authorities because we are just asking for the very thing we don't want - i.e., the government to come in and start regulating all BTC transactions and exchanges.

FlappySocks

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Activity: 546

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If he doesn't come up with some sort of offering to compensate us, I cant see how he can show his face in public again.

He needs to restore his credibility, and fast. Even refunding all our money without the chips wont keep the wolf from the door.

If I get my chips NOW, and 50% refund and be first in line for free next gen ASICs, then I might be a bit happier.

Bitcoinorama

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Quote from: Vigil on August 09, 2013, 08:32:56 AM

Not if they just wanted to delay all the other chips for a bit. They wouldn't have to completely scam anyone, just hold up the delivery of everyone's chips to make a greater ROI and then send them out a month or two later than expected.

Like I said, not accusing anyone, just throwing it out there.

That IS scamming everyone, and now the US, of which Bitsycom is a registered company now recognises Bitcoin as a currency, and Bitsyncom fits the description of a 'common enterprise' and the volume of chips they have purposely delayed to manipulate the network's hashrate they are directly fraudulently manipulating a currency for their own gain. That's major f**king fraud on a grand scale. I really don't think Yifu has though this through at all.

This is very very serious...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Currency_intervention

http://ia800904.us.archive.org/35/items/gov.uscourts.txed.146063/gov.uscourts.txed.146063.23.0.pdf

Vigil

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Activity: 378

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Not if they just wanted to delay all the other chips for a bit. They wouldn't have to completely scam anyone, just hold up the delivery of everyone's chips to make a greater ROI and then send them out a month or two later than expected.

Like I said, not accusing anyone, just throwing it out there.

MinermanNC

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Some tech firm needs to redesign fpga boards to be more powerfull and enery efficient, get them back on the market. I dont care if its the size of a wheel barrel to produce 60 g/hash or more! this asic sharade really sucks...I dont care which company it is,,they all promise the moon in the beggining and never fully deliver on time if at all. The web sites all look so inviting and exciting....but seems they all hit snags. fpga technology is here and should be developed more. Maybe Im crazy... but i think there is a market for them still if done right and affordable.

Bicknellski

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Activity: 924

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Vigil on August 09, 2013, 08:14:07 AM

What if the group buys (or some of them) are "in" on the "delay" thing? Not to knock anyone - just speculation.

I don't think anyone in a group buy is involved in this fiasco. Seriously. We wanted our chips at the date specified not a day later. There was a level trust between the board developers, the group buys and unfortunately Avalon.

Those outside that arrangement I couldn't even try to account for but those in our community and group buys that support DIY... that I would say is beyond reproach. It be financial suicide for most especially those who have pre-ordered all the components.

HeRetiK

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Playgram - The Telegram Casino

Quote from: Vigil on August 09, 2013, 08:14:07 AM

What if the group buys (or some of them) are "in" on the "delay" thing? Not to knock anyone - just speculation.

Nah, I don't think they're close enough to Bitsyncom to be directly involved in this. They're just buyers like everyone else.

sprint347

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Quote from: pajak666 on August 09, 2013, 05:55:24 AM

SO WHAT ARE THESE CHIPS?

SO this photo was made @ chinese customs office?
http://thegenesisblock.com/latest-shipment-of-avalon-asics-could-increase-network-hashrate-by-500/#!prettyPhoto

It is a lie.

Someone has no doubt already done this, but according to the waybill those boxes went from Shanghai to Hong Kong, via Yangtze River Express freight on the afternoon of the 25th of June, on flight Y87981.

SolarSilver

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Quote from: kaerf on August 09, 2013, 02:46:49 AM

i was fortunate enough to be a batch #1 customer, but even that was delayed about a month and a half (after having announced they "shipped") with very little communication from avalon (it was nerve wracking). As a result of their weak customer service and still unproven mass delivery capability, I only purchased a single batch #2 unit which ended up being 3.75 months late (originally March 10th ship date).

Batch #2 turned out not to be such a wreck after all:

As a Batch #2 Wave 1 and Batch #2 Wave 2 customer, I can only state that my ordered (and delivered) machines will break even next week, even after the months of delays. But then again I was lucky to get them in time, no trade-ins and no customs problems like some of the Serbian and German buyers.

Batch #2 Wave 1 cost BTC 76.2 / unit and Batch #2 Wave 2 cost BTC 56.4 / unit

They will both break even on about the same time, next week Monday or Tuesday probably.

Batch #2 Wave 1 started hashing 2013-06-21
Batch #2 Wave 2 started hashing 2013-07-04

It's only Batch #3 orders (full units and chip sales) that will have a longer wait to see their initial BTC generated (if all of it in total)

My Batch #3 units started hashing 2013-08-01 and so far have generated about 10% of their initial cost in BTC

Batch #1 and Batch #2 buyers should not complain too much, unless they are the ones that have not received their units yet and are getting no feedback (customs issues, trade-ins, broken units)

BitCsByBit

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Once they "clear" the customs and are finally delivered, it will be interesting to see what week are these chips made in.

The writing on the chips will identify this.

Vigil

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What if the group buys (or some of them) are "in" on the "delay" thing? Not to knock anyone - just speculation.

Bitcoinorama

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: MinermanNC on August 09, 2013, 08:06:10 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Well 25th is way over a month, it's six weeks, so TSMC kept their side of the bargain. WTF Avalon has been doing since is anyone's guess, but those chips ain't held up in any customs there, Bitsyncom made receipt of those as confirmed by Gridchip...

135 Pieces (if all chips) would be over 2 Million Chips if my calculations are correct.

Each box contains 6 "Smaller Boxes"

Each Small Box contains 2600 Chips

Thats

135*6 = 810 Small Boxes

810 * 2600 = 2,106,000 Chips.

Obviously what we can see in the picture is a group of 24 boxes estimated at around 300,000 chips.

Either way you are correct, we are not getting any information from this tracking number as they arrived at their destination UNI GLORY INTL LOGISTICS

Great analysis BG. 2 million seems like a lot tho...maybe not...

I agree 2 Millions does seem like a lot, I think only 1 Million was ordered through their website? They could be using the rest to build machines, have deals that are in Cash vs BTC with local groups, or there literally could be multiple packages for different customers (not just Avalon) in that same shipment which means there really is only the ~300k chips.

Who knows!

Point is TSMC clearly fulfilled their side of the bargain and Bitsyncom split over the lies they have been telling you!

Vigil

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Someone wanted the chips, threats were made: "hold off the orders or we'll send the Yakuza after your ass." Chips have been running off the machines like crazy and being sold on alibaba and all around china with a trickle of them finishing off our orders.

I think we need to seriously consider making sure that the ASIC chip technology gets nowhere close to China, IOW don't get them made from Chinese manufacturers. There have to be others out there. China is just shooting yourself in the foot - they will steal your tech, patent infringe like a mofo and sell to the highest bidder.

TheSwede75

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Outside of anything else it seems exceptionally odd that problems involving the Avalon staff would somehow disturb shipments from foundry to end clients. It seems highly unlikely that Chinese foundries do not have routines for sending hardware to other countries.

Stack

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Quote from: SebastianJu on August 09, 2013, 08:02:12 AM

I really would like to know why these chips exist but we didnt get them. Was there a big buyer that wanted chips fast and got our chips so we have to wait now? I really would like to read an explaination.

I dont know how Yifu could make this good again. I mean when its a miner he could say, ok, one month waiting means 75% higher difficulty, i give you 75% refund. But this cant work for chips since the chips are only half of the cost of a miner. Even when yifu would refund all bitcoins for the chips it wouldnt work out to cover the loss.

I wonder if he offers a full refund and what my groupbuy members would say about this offer...

A refund of our chips does not recover what we've paid to assemblers... who have already spent much of our money on parts and start-up expenses

Mind you.. getting *something* back is better than losing the lot... which is quite possibly how this ends... people are talking about roi but personally i'm thinking this will end up a BFL scenario where we never see product - they just ask everyone to "trade up" to the next gen.. and guess what.. people will and then the cycle repeats

Topic: Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 - page 83. (Read 186720 times)