Arguably, custodial exchanges are antithetical to Bitcoin. Nowhere in the whitepaper does it say hand your BTC over to strangers on the internet (and you wouldn't be able to buy BTC from exchanges if people weren't doing that). That was never part of the design. As others have already said earlier in the topic, it's meant to be used peer-to-peer. That means no middlemen!
You sadly have to accept the consequences when you freely choose to use it wrong.
Topic: Isn’t KYC anti-ethical to Bitcoin? - page 5. (Read 839 times)
Yes, certainly it is, the KYC is against the whole base of bitcoin if you ask me, bitcoin was created to provide p2p transactions and economic freedom for people all over the world so everyone in any country with any law and with any religion can use borderless transactions and have his own privacy but the governments and the related organizations are trying hard to force people to pass KYC and provide them personal information but still you can use decentralized exchanges and do anonymous transactions to keep them away.
Many here agree that it's anti-ethical, but I'm not sure if I do. I'm not a fan of KYC, but Bitcoin wasn't created with anonymity in mind, and one could argue that transparency is more important. So KYC can be seen as acceptable as a way toward even more financial transparency. Moreover, you don't need to go through KYC to use Bitcoin. Many exchanges require KYC, but it doesn't mean it's impossible to avoid it, and owning a BTC wallet without any ID, sending BTC payments directly to others' addresses, is not a hard thing to do. I think that treatment of currencies should be fair, and what applies to fiat should apply to cryptos. What I don't like is when it's possible to exchange fiat using cash without providing an ID up to a certain amount of money, and yet some crypto exchanges impose KYC regardless of a sum in question.
Ahh, yeah the typical person never will as long as they are not earning in millions from the crypto. Lolz. Well, this is good one because I literally never cared for privacy of documents which I was uploading on the exchangers because I have always learnt about the exchanger first then did that action. I know there are many ways peeps can get screwed for uploading their KYC docs for example, ICO verification, airdrop verification etc. But obviously it is stupid to upload the docs to newly formed companies who are having fake profiles everywhere.
Here we are talking about crypto space where we have to buy pre-existing coins like Bitcoin, which is available everywhere and can easily bought with p2p, or trusted exchangers or even friend to friends to transfer for that matter.
As of me, I am not concerned at all.
Here we are talking about crypto space where we have to buy pre-existing coins like Bitcoin, which is available everywhere and can easily bought with p2p, or trusted exchangers or even friend to friends to transfer for that matter.
As of me, I am not concerned at all.
The reason why some people dislike submitting AML/KYC documents regardless of net worth is because database leaks do happen even if a certain company/platform is 100% totally legitimate.
But yea, if you’re fine with the risks, then you do you.
As explained above, in some instances it is not about the KYC itself for one platform but more to do with the data leak.
As for the need to KYC, you can imagine that even for a decentralised structure like Bitcoin some platforms can't get away without KYC-ing their customers for providing certain services to them, and Bitcoin like most of the other crypto unfortunately falls into this category
Ahh, yeah the typical person never will as long as they are not earning in millions from the crypto. Lolz. Well, this is good one because I literally never cared for privacy of documents which I was uploading on the exchangers because I have always learnt about the exchanger first then did that action. I know there are many ways peeps can get screwed for uploading their KYC docs for example, ICO verification, airdrop verification etc. But obviously it is stupid to upload the docs to newly formed companies who are having fake profiles everywhere.
Here we are talking about crypto space where we have to buy pre-existing coins like Bitcoin, which is available everywhere and can easily bought with p2p, or trusted exchangers or even friend to friends to transfer for that matter.
As of me, I am not concerned at all.
Here we are talking about crypto space where we have to buy pre-existing coins like Bitcoin, which is available everywhere and can easily bought with p2p, or trusted exchangers or even friend to friends to transfer for that matter.
As of me, I am not concerned at all.
The reason why some people dislike submitting AML/KYC documents regardless of net worth is because database leaks do happen even if a certain company/platform is 100% totally legitimate.
But yea, if you’re fine with the risks, then you do you.
However, while most of us are still concern with this anonymity, others are not thinking of it anymore as long as they are making profits, then regardless of how many times they will submit KYC form. Better accept the fact that bitcoin is considered not totally decentralized these days, unethical to think but that's the fact.
OP I'm assuming you mean antithetical and not anti-ethical, but anyway, KYC doesn't compare well with BTC, they're two different ideas. KYC refers to an abstract concept involving anonymity, and Bitcoin itself isn't truly anonymous. Every transaction is logged publicly. To the extent you don't need KYC to own a bitcoin wallet is the line where your anonymity ends. Bitcoin is "more private" than traditional banking, I'm not arguing otherwise, but crypto mixers exist for a reason.
Yes, it is almost impossible for KYC not to be related to BTC. I think because we are in a rule that has been made to cause a sense of security and comfort (the rulegiver) even though sometimes it is very contradictory. We need the market, the market needs us, the market is subject to the rules, we are forced to submit to the rules by the market. If I didn't need it it seemed like I'd be out of this circulation, but it doesn't seem like I could yet. Conversely, if we break the rules then we lose, besides that we also feel uncomfortable with the security of our data. Something difficult.
OP I'm assuming you mean antithetical and not anti-ethical, but anyway, KYC doesn't compare well with BTC, they're two different ideas. KYC refers to an abstract concept involving anonymity, and Bitcoin itself isn't truly anonymous. Every transaction is logged publicly. To the extent you don't need KYC to own a bitcoin wallet is the line where your anonymity ends. Bitcoin is "more private" than traditional banking, I'm not arguing otherwise, but crypto mixers exist for a reason.
If you use a centralized exchange, then you hand out many, important, personal stuff such as who you are. While you may achieve a significant proportion of anonymity (using CoinJoins, mixers etc.), it's still not enough to cover your untraceability. The fact that you've given away where you live, your phone number, your credit card / bank account, your identity etc., says a lot by itself. Those individuals behind the exchange can sell your info to even chain analysis companies.
So, I'd say that beyond purchases of cryptocurrencies, you should be really aware of who you're giving this sensitive information. Especially when you want to retain anonymity.
If we think of bitcoin originally, it says freedom is what bitcoin brings, and for that being anonymous is free. But i think with a lot of exchanges that we have right now which are mostly centralized, then submitting a KYC form is a must and they say its all for security reason. Although we still have some exchanges who are not requiring KYC, but most of them are not even reputable. So the risk will be much even higher.So, I'd say that beyond purchases of cryptocurrencies, you should be really aware of who you're giving this sensitive information. Especially when you want to retain anonymity.
For me, although its really quite unethical when we think of bitcoin with KYC, but if we want more efficient and secured transactions, then keeping your privacy may not be fully realized as it is. So just always be cautious and even careful on the exchanges you are submitting your KYC, as sharing your private datas may be quite dangerous to think particularly if you are a bag holder of bitcoin.
If you use a centralized exchange, then you hand out many, important, personal stuff such as who you are. While you may achieve a significant proportion of anonymity (using CoinJoins, mixers etc.), it's still not enough to cover your untraceability. The fact that you've given away where you live, your phone number, your credit card / bank account, your identity etc., says a lot by itself. Those individuals behind the exchange can sell your info to even chain analysis companies.
So, I'd say that beyond purchases of cryptocurrencies, you should be really aware of who you're giving this sensitive information. Especially when you want to retain anonymity.
So, I'd say that beyond purchases of cryptocurrencies, you should be really aware of who you're giving this sensitive information. Especially when you want to retain anonymity.
Ahh, yeah the typical person never will as long as they are not earning in millions from the crypto. Lolz. Well, this is good one because I literally never cared for privacy of documents which I was uploading on the exchangers because I have always learnt about the exchanger first then did that action. I know there are many ways peeps can get screwed for uploading their KYC docs for example, ICO verification, airdrop verification etc. But obviously it is stupid to upload the docs to newly formed companies who are having fake profiles everywhere.
Here we are talking about crypto space where we have to buy pre-existing coins like Bitcoin, which is available everywhere and can easily bought with p2p, or trusted exchangers or even friend to friends to transfer for that matter.
As of me, I am not concerned at all.
Here we are talking about crypto space where we have to buy pre-existing coins like Bitcoin, which is available everywhere and can easily bought with p2p, or trusted exchangers or even friend to friends to transfer for that matter.
As of me, I am not concerned at all.
The reason why some people dislike submitting AML/KYC documents regardless of net worth is because database leaks do happen even if a certain company/platform is 100% totally legitimate.
But yea, if you’re fine with the risks, then you do you.
-snip
But as of recently, it is hard to purchase any crypto without encountering a form of KYC.
But as of recently, it is hard to purchase any crypto without encountering a form of KYC.
It just depends where you want to buy it. Because blockchain is censorship-resistant, transacting any cryptocurrency doesn't actually need any special identity verification. All you have to sacrifice is to pay a fee to the miner.
However, people limit themselves by relying on a centralized entity facilitated by the government. Yep, they have not left the traditional way completely and are not confident to be independent.
To remain anonymous is only possible if people will not convert Bitcoin to Fiat.
Exactly thats right on point. When you bring in fiat currencies you will need to comply with its issuing government's laws. In the purest form, BTC is meant to be obtained by mining and used as currency among the people, exchanges changed it all when you could "buy/sell" BTC with fiat currency.
But as of recently, it is hard to purchase any crypto without encountering a form of KYC.
There are still ways to avoid KYC while using fiat by doing OTC P2P trades, there are also DEX such as Bisq where you can do P2P trades online which the need of KYC like it was the case with localbitcoins back in the day. 
In some cases, we have to come to terms with KYC requirements. Although a certain degree of anonymity is indeed inherent in decentralized cryptocurrency, it can only walk on the territory of certain states. And states do not like the circulation of large flows of money from unknown persons with unknown purposes. Therefore, in June 2019, the international financial group FATF adopted binding recommendations by states that KYC can be used only for the purpose of preventing money laundering and combating the financing of terrorism and only if transactions exceed one thousand euros.
So far, not many states have legalized cryptocurrency, and we still have the opportunity to trade cryptocurrency anonymously. In the future, these opportunities will decrease.
So far, not many states have legalized cryptocurrency, and we still have the opportunity to trade cryptocurrency anonymously. In the future, these opportunities will decrease.
Yes, yes it is. But right now that bitcoin is still not widely adopted by the majority of people, then unfortunately we need these easy to use onramps(though yes we have no-KYC p2p exchanges).
In the end, people will use whatever is easier for them. The typical person doesn’t care about privacy in the first place.
In the end, people will use whatever is easier for them. The typical person doesn’t care about privacy in the first place.
This is a very good point here. Once more people are in on bitcoin then we can utilize buying and selling OTC (Over The Counter) much easier.
As of right now I don’t think it’s that huge of a deal that companies are demanding KYC, as if they didn’t I think most governments would shut down exchanges.
Yes, yes it is. But right now that bitcoin is still not widely adopted by the majority of people, then unfortunately we need these easy to use onramps(though yes we have no-KYC p2p exchanges).
In the end, people will use whatever is easier for them. The typical person doesn’t care about privacy in the first place.
In the end, people will use whatever is easier for them. The typical person doesn’t care about privacy in the first place.
Ahh, yeah the typical person never will as long as they are not earning in millions from the crypto. Lolz. Well, this is good one because I literally never cared for privacy of documents which I was uploading on the exchangers because I have always learnt about the exchanger first then did that action. I know there are many ways peeps can get screwed for uploading their KYC docs for example, ICO verification, airdrop verification etc. But obviously it is stupid to upload the docs to newly formed companies who are having fake profiles everywhere.
Here we are talking about crypto space where we have to buy pre-existing coins like Bitcoin, which is available everywhere and can easily bought with p2p, or trusted exchangers or even friend to friends to transfer for that matter.
As of me, I am not concerned at all.
I can't decide. Bitcoin itself isn't fully anonymous neither. So when you say if KYC is non-ethical to bitcoin, It don't have a clear answer. If you said monero instead of bitcoin then I would say "yes" without a doubt.
Noncustodial wallets, mixing or privacy coins. The important steps are how to broadcast your transactions. Wallet itself can not protect your privacy or anonymity.[Guide] Decent mixing methods
Quote
Regardless of the project though, I don't like KYC in crypto. Crypto isn't something that needs a government support. It is not a bank. So KYC makes no sense.
Like or dislike, we will have to accept because more exchanges will be required to implement KYC by government command. 
When i first heard about bitcoin, one of the selling points then was the pseudo anonymity. But as of recently, it is hard to purchase any crypto without encountering a form of KYC.
I’m just curious of everyone’s thought on this.
I’m just curious of everyone’s thought on this.
I can't decide. Bitcoin itself isn't fully anonymous neither. So when you say if KYC is non-ethical to bitcoin, It don't have a clear answer. If you said monero instead of bitcoin then I would say "yes" without a doubt.
Regardless of the project though, I don't like KYC in crypto. Crypto isn't something that needs a government support. It is not a bank. So KYC makes no sense.
Not your keys not your coins. So you control what you do with either custodial or non-custodial wallets. Non-custodial wallets are ones to be chosen and used.
You can choose wallets with Tor connection and Coin Join transaction feature.
If you don't want to do KYC but still be able to buy or sell Bitcoin, do it on DEX or Peer to peer marketplace
Notyourkeys.org
Recommended wallets
[BIG LIST] Buy/Sell Crypto (OTC, P2P, DEXs, CEXs, NO-KYC, ATMs, etc.)
Help: A list of LocalBitcoin alternatives (P2P marketplaces)
You can choose wallets with Tor connection and Coin Join transaction feature.
If you don't want to do KYC but still be able to buy or sell Bitcoin, do it on DEX or Peer to peer marketplace
Notyourkeys.org
Recommended wallets
[BIG LIST] Buy/Sell Crypto (OTC, P2P, DEXs, CEXs, NO-KYC, ATMs, etc.)
Help: A list of LocalBitcoin alternatives (P2P marketplaces)
KYC is not a bad thing. If you don't want to use services that require it then you don't.
Depending on where you live there are plenty that do not require it.
There are exchanges for other coins, ways of getting cash, gift cards and just about anything else that do not require your info.
IF on the other hand you want a regulated environment with more rules and security, then yes you are going to wind up with KYC.
I can go to localcryptos.com and get cash for my BTC, and hope everything goes smoothly (it usually does) OR I can go to Gemini give up my personal info and know that it will go smoothly.
The choice is up to you.
-Dave
Depending on where you live there are plenty that do not require it.
There are exchanges for other coins, ways of getting cash, gift cards and just about anything else that do not require your info.
IF on the other hand you want a regulated environment with more rules and security, then yes you are going to wind up with KYC.
I can go to localcryptos.com and get cash for my BTC, and hope everything goes smoothly (it usually does) OR I can go to Gemini give up my personal info and know that it will go smoothly.
The choice is up to you.
-Dave
When i first heard about bitcoin, one of the selling points then was the pseudo anonymity. But as of recently, it is hard to purchase any crypto without encountering a form of KYC.
I’m just curious of everyone’s thought on this.
Yeah, there are other ways especially some p2p exchanges that don't require kyc for you to trade or buy BTC but isn't this whole idea of people being strict about doing kycs that makes it more concerning for others to believe that bitcoin is mostly used for bad transactions? I do understand that there has been negative news also about what happens to some people's Docs. but overall I don't see anything bad with KYC but don't do KYC on every site though. I’m just curious of everyone’s thought on this.
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