It's Illegal to Feed the Homeless in Florida... WTF? - page 2.

BADecker

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Quote from: picolo on November 13, 2014, 03:34:37 PM

Quote from: dontCAREhair on November 13, 2014, 03:37:02 AM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on November 12, 2014, 04:13:31 PM

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 09, 2014, 12:59:12 AM

Can't share food in public, what do you think this sis, a free country? if you think this ordinance is about sharing food and not criminalizing homelessness, you're a bit naive not to see the politics of it. Roll Eyes

This is a free country, which entails something called freedom of association.

That means we are free to choose whether or not to live in communities which have rules about sharing food. We may even vote to change those rules! Shocked

Isn't democracy amazing? Cool

There are plenty of cities where you may feed the homeless, but that's not good enough for your bleeding heart, which desires to enforce a universal uniformity and hypocritically call such homogeneous altruism-at-gunpoint "freedom."

You hate people having the freedom to choose rules for their own local community, because you want everyone to be forced to subsidize the homeless and be forced to accept the (literally shitty) externalities that giving away free food to people without their own bathrooms/toilets/sewage systems/water bills creates.

That's taking the 'Free Shit Army' to a whole new level! Grin

The law/rules is not about the ability to share food, it is a question about food safety. The old man was sharing/giving away food in a way that would require him to meet certain food safety guidelines which he was not following.

So a disclaimer should suffice and people can make their own decision about taking his food or not.

This sounds good to me. If there is an ordinance against food-sharing in a park, and the old guy doesn't want to be confrontational, he could agree to meet the hungry people somewhere else to share the food.

picolo

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Quote from: dontCAREhair on November 13, 2014, 03:37:02 AM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on November 12, 2014, 04:13:31 PM

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 09, 2014, 12:59:12 AM

Can't share food in public, what do you think this sis, a free country? if you think this ordinance is about sharing food and not criminalizing homelessness, you're a bit naive not to see the politics of it. Roll Eyes

This is a free country, which entails something called freedom of association.

That means we are free to choose whether or not to live in communities which have rules about sharing food. We may even vote to change those rules! Shocked

Isn't democracy amazing? Cool

There are plenty of cities where you may feed the homeless, but that's not good enough for your bleeding heart, which desires to enforce a universal uniformity and hypocritically call such homogeneous altruism-at-gunpoint "freedom."

You hate people having the freedom to choose rules for their own local community, because you want everyone to be forced to subsidize the homeless and be forced to accept the (literally shitty) externalities that giving away free food to people without their own bathrooms/toilets/sewage systems/water bills creates.

That's taking the 'Free Shit Army' to a whole new level! Grin

The law/rules is not about the ability to share food, it is a question about food safety. The old man was sharing/giving away food in a way that would require him to meet certain food safety guidelines which he was not following.

So a disclaimer should suffice and people can make their own decision about taking his food or not.

BADecker

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It may be illegal, but it is not unlawful.

If you are a 14th Amendment citizen, you might have to follow all kinds of codes and ordinances. But if you are a "people" like one of those who set government in place, most or all of the codes and ordinances don't affect you if you don't want them to.

http://1215.org/

Of course, if you need some extra cash...

http://www.unkommonlaw.co.uk/

jaysabi

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Quote from: iCEBREAKER on November 12, 2014, 06:43:48 PM

Quote from: jaysabi on November 12, 2014, 04:58:18 PM

Freedom of association is the freedom to associate with certain groups of your own will, not the freedom to pass laws governing the behavior of other people. You've got a really poor understanding of what freedom is.

By seeking to impose a universal prohibition of food sharing bans, you advocate destroying the freedom you claim to value.

Double negative logic? How embarrassing for you! By restricting laws that restrict the freedom of people, you're infringing my right to belong to a group of people that passes laws that dictate what other people can do.

Haha, yeah, you're a real champion of freedom. Roll Eyes

JLynn171

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I would reccomend all the homeless to commit crimes and be fed and housed by the state of florida

jaysabi

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Quote from: dontCAREhair on November 13, 2014, 03:37:02 AM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on November 12, 2014, 04:13:31 PM

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 09, 2014, 12:59:12 AM

Can't share food in public, what do you think this sis, a free country? if you think this ordinance is about sharing food and not criminalizing homelessness, you're a bit naive not to see the politics of it. Roll Eyes

This is a free country, which entails something called freedom of association.

That means we are free to choose whether or not to live in communities which have rules about sharing food. We may even vote to change those rules! Shocked

Isn't democracy amazing? Cool

There are plenty of cities where you may feed the homeless, but that's not good enough for your bleeding heart, which desires to enforce a universal uniformity and hypocritically call such homogeneous altruism-at-gunpoint "freedom."

You hate people having the freedom to choose rules for their own local community, because you want everyone to be forced to subsidize the homeless and be forced to accept the (literally shitty) externalities that giving away free food to people without their own bathrooms/toilets/sewage systems/water bills creates.

That's taking the 'Free Shit Army' to a whole new level! Grin

The law/rules is not about the ability to share food, it is a question about food safety. The old man was sharing/giving away food in a way that would require him to meet certain food safety guidelines which he was not following.

Someone already answered this pretty effectively.

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 12, 2014, 03:18:06 PM

Come on, you believe that's true? I guess any little league teams in that city should stop distributing snacks after the game because they aren't in compliance with the law, right? I mean, the law is there to keep people safe from people who distribute food that can't be trusted because it doesn't have the city's stamp of approval on it that it's safe.

That's not at all the case. If a cop saw one of the parents distributing the team snack and some guy giving a homeless man the same snack, only one of them is getting arrested for violating the law, because only one of them is the intended target of the law.

I agree with the assessment that the law has nothing to do with food safety. It's about targeting the homeless.

dontCAREhair

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Quote from: iCEBREAKER on November 12, 2014, 04:13:31 PM

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 09, 2014, 12:59:12 AM

Can't share food in public, what do you think this sis, a free country? if you think this ordinance is about sharing food and not criminalizing homelessness, you're a bit naive not to see the politics of it. Roll Eyes

This is a free country, which entails something called freedom of association.

That means we are free to choose whether or not to live in communities which have rules about sharing food. We may even vote to change those rules! Shocked

Isn't democracy amazing? Cool

There are plenty of cities where you may feed the homeless, but that's not good enough for your bleeding heart, which desires to enforce a universal uniformity and hypocritically call such homogeneous altruism-at-gunpoint "freedom."

You hate people having the freedom to choose rules for their own local community, because you want everyone to be forced to subsidize the homeless and be forced to accept the (literally shitty) externalities that giving away free food to people without their own bathrooms/toilets/sewage systems/water bills creates.

That's taking the 'Free Shit Army' to a whole new level! Grin

The law/rules is not about the ability to share food, it is a question about food safety. The old man was sharing/giving away food in a way that would require him to meet certain food safety guidelines which he was not following.

iCEBREAKER

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Crypto is the separation of Power and State.

Quote from: jaysabi on November 12, 2014, 04:58:18 PM

Freedom of association is the freedom to associate with certain groups of your own will, not the freedom to pass laws governing the behavior of other people. You've got a really poor understanding of what freedom is.

You are creating a false dichotomy where none actually exists. By seeking to impose a universal prohibition of food sharing bans, you advocate destroying the freedom you claim to value.

Freedom of association necessarily includes freedom of disassociation, and the freedom go create/join communities based on like minded individuals.

These intentional communities, which are build on the foundation of a libertarian national government, provide for simultaneously maximizing freedom and utility for all participants.

There is a famous award-winning book length proof of this philosophy's claims, written by a Harvard professor, called 'Anarchy, State, and Utopia.'

I'll take Robert Nozick's "understanding of what freedom is" instead of your asinine interpretation (which seems to chiefly value the freedom to eat/sleep/shit anywhere you want) any day of the week! Grin

There are plenty of places where your Freely Shit Army is welcome; why do you need to insist that every town must follow in lockstep? What works for San Francisco and Portland doesn't always work for Retiredville, Florida.

stevegreer

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Quote from: jaysabi on November 12, 2014, 04:58:18 PM

Freedom of association is the freedom to associate with certain groups of your own will, not the freedom to pass laws governing the behavior of other people. You've got a really poor understanding of what freedom is.

Maybe he's a Constitutional Lawyer? Cheesy

That's a joke, by the way. Cool

jaysabi

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Quote from: iCEBREAKER on November 12, 2014, 04:13:31 PM

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 09, 2014, 12:59:12 AM

Can't share food in public, what do you think this sis, a free country? if you think this ordinance is about sharing food and not criminalizing homelessness, you're a bit naive not to see the politics of it. Roll Eyes

This is a free country, which entails something called freedom of association.

That means we are free to choose whether or not to live in communities which have rules about sharing food. We may even vote to change those rules! Shocked

Isn't democracy amazing? Cool

There are plenty of cities where you may feed the homeless, but that's not good enough for your bleeding heart, which desires to enforce a universal uniformity and hypocritically call such homogeneous altruism-at-gunpoint "freedom."

You hate people having the freedom to choose rules for their own local community, because you want everyone to be forced to subsidize the homeless and be forced to accept the (literally shitty) externalities that giving away free food to people without their own bathrooms/toilets/sewage systems/water bills creates.

That's taking the 'Free Shit Army' to a whole new level! Grin

Freedom of association is the freedom to associate with certain groups of your own will, not the freedom to pass laws governing the behavior of other people. You've got a really poor understanding of what freedom is.

iCEBREAKER

legendary

Activity: 2156

Merit: 1072

Crypto is the separation of Power and State.

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 09, 2014, 12:59:12 AM

Can't share food in public, what do you think this sis, a free country? if you think this ordinance is about sharing food and not criminalizing homelessness, you're a bit naive not to see the politics of it. Roll Eyes

This is a free country, which entails something called freedom of association.

That means we are free to choose whether or not to live in communities which have rules about sharing food. We may even vote to change those rules! Shocked

Isn't democracy amazing? Cool

There are plenty of cities where you may feed the homeless, but that's not good enough for your bleeding heart, which desires to enforce a universal uniformity and hypocritically call such homogeneous altruism-at-gunpoint "freedom."

You hate people having the freedom to choose rules for their own local community, because you want everyone to be forced to subsidize the homeless and be forced to accept the (literally shitty) externalities that giving away free food to people without their own bathrooms/toilets/sewage systems/water bills creates.

That's taking the 'Free Shit Army' to a whole new level! Grin

My Name Was Taken

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Quote from: Gronthaing on November 10, 2014, 03:27:35 PM

Quote from: btckold24 on November 10, 2014, 01:21:15 AM

wow another reason to not live in florida.... Thats the most insane law I have heard of

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on November 10, 2014, 01:44:17 AM

Some of the bylaws cities and states create in the US are just plain weird.
The homeless people ban is one of them, but I like the beach party comparison ^^.

I don't know about laws, but stuff similar to this doesn't happen only in Florida. Wasn't it in the UK that some people started installing anti-homeless spikes on the ground outside the buildings? And something like it was going on in Chicago as well.

YES! I remember reading about that. Apparently, it's a problem in Canada too: https://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/dailybrew/london-criticized-anti-homeless-spikes-canada-better-174042472.html

Quote from: bluemountain on November 11, 2014, 12:19:20 AM

There are similar "spikes" under bridges and benches are designed so it is not possible to sleep on them in many cities across the US. These kinds of things are going to give people incentives to get "off the street"

How does this give them an incentive to get off the street? If they responded to a simple incentive, you'd think being homeless would be it. This kind of comment ignores the fact that homelessness isn't just a case of being lazy or choosing not to work. It's often a slew of circumstances beyond their control, with a high incidence of mental health disorders, that makes 'being homeless' anything but a choice. These spikes are just inhumane and the advocates are the type of people who will victim-blame someone for being homeless.

My Name Was Taken

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Quote from: deluxeCITY on November 09, 2014, 02:04:32 AM

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 09, 2014, 12:59:12 AM

Quote from: stevegreer on November 07, 2014, 11:10:28 AM

Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 05, 2014, 12:43:22 PM

It baffles me how a 'republican' state like Florida allows the passage of a law making private charity to the homeless illegal, but republicans are constantly up in arms about the government giving handouts to poor people and how the poor are just leeches on the productive members of society. If private charities want to help people, don't make it illegal.

This law is bullshit.

It baffles me how you immediately turn this into something political. The article says the people violated a city ordinance which "bans the public sharing of food." Is this a passive-aggressive way of stopping people from feeding the homeless? Maybe. But it has nothing to do with Republicans, especially considering the mayor of Ft. Lauderdale is a Democrat (not to mention one who opposes same-sex marriage... Uh Oh! http://www.browardbeat.com/fort-lauderdale-mayor-harmed-by-anti-lgbt-vote/).

Can't share food in public, what do you think this sis, a free country? if you think this ordinance is about sharing food and not criminalizing homelessness, you're a bit naive not to see the politics of it. Roll Eyes

The law is not about sharing food in public, it is about distributing it in a way that people assume it is safe to consume. There are regulations regarding the distribution of food in order to help keep consumers safe from food borne illnesses that can be very harmful and that consumers have little other way to protect themselves against

Come on, you believe that's true? I guess any little league teams in that city should stop distributing snacks after the game because they aren't in compliance with the law, right? I mean, the law is there to keep people safe from people who distribute food that can't be trusted because it doesn't have the city's stamp of approval on it that it's safe.

That's not at all the case. If a cop saw one of the parents distributing the team snack and some guy giving a homeless man the same snack, only one of them is getting arrested for violating the law, because only one of them is the intended target of the law.

bluemountain

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Quote from: Gronthaing on November 10, 2014, 03:27:35 PM

Quote from: btckold24 on November 10, 2014, 01:21:15 AM

wow another reason to not live in florida.... Thats the most insane law I have heard of

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on November 10, 2014, 01:44:17 AM

Some of the bylaws cities and states create in the US are just plain weird.
The homeless people ban is one of them, but I like the beach party comparison ^^.

I don't know about laws, but stuff similar to this doesn't happen only in Florida. Wasn't it in the UK that some people started installing anti-homeless spikes on the ground outside the buildings? And something like it was going on in Chicago as well.

There are similar "spikes" under bridges and benches are designed so it is not possible to sleep on them in many cities across the US. These kinds of things are going to give people incentives to get "off the street"

axxo

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The details are complicated. The issue boils down to politicians not wanting competition. If they allow private groups or individuals to prove they can care for those in need, it makes it harder to argue the government is needed for that purpose.

picolo

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Quote from: My Name Was Taken on November 05, 2014, 12:43:22 PM

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/05/feeding-homeless-arrests/18529709/

TL;DR A 90-year-old man who runs a non-profit dedicated to helping homeless people was arrested in Fort Lauderdale for violating a new ordinance that makes giving food to homeless people illegal. He faces 6 months in prison and a $500 fine.

It baffles me how a 'republican' state like Florida allows the passage of a law making private charity to the homeless illegal, but republicans are constantly up in arms about the government giving handouts to poor people and how the poor are just leeches on the productive members of society. If private charities want to help people, don't make it illegal.

This law is bullshit.

It looks like a new example of too much regulation

Gronthaing

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Quote from: btckold24 on November 10, 2014, 01:21:15 AM

wow another reason to not live in florida.... Thats the most insane law I have heard of

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on November 10, 2014, 01:44:17 AM

Some of the bylaws cities and states create in the US are just plain weird.
The homeless people ban is one of them, but I like the beach party comparison ^^.

I don't know about laws, but stuff similar to this doesn't happen only in Florida. Wasn't it in the UK that some people started installing anti-homeless spikes on the ground outside the buildings? And something like it was going on in Chicago as well.

junglecat

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It's illegal to run a lemonade stand or garage sale in some states in the USA without a permit (tax stamp) so why they going to let you feed the homeless and lose tax income? Shocked

Swordsoffreedom

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Some of the bylaws cities and states create in the US are just plain weird.
The homeless people ban is one of them, but I like the beach party comparison ^^.

btckold24

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wow another reason to not live in florida.... Thats the most insane law I have heard of

Topic: It's Illegal to Feed the Homeless in Florida... WTF? - page 2. (Read 3512 times)