Topic: Just-Dice.com : now with added CLAMs : Play or Invest - page 27. (Read 454814 times)

I don't know if the digger made any private deals. He made none with me. I bought some coins cheap on poloniex when he dumped there. You seem to be implying that something unfair happened but as far as I can see the coins were sold to the highest bidder on a public marketplace.


I didn't blackmail anyone. I proposed switching to a new coin and the idea was unpopular. I never threatened anyone with anything.


The problem with a big dump is that it moves the price a lot. The dumper doesn't get as much as they expect to, holders find their holdings devalued, etc. The price now is much smaller than it was before the big digger dumped his coins.

It's not clear that anyone has 200% profit. The current price is over twice what the digger dumped it down to, but last I checked the entire buy book at poloniex was around 70 BTC, so if "my friends and I" attempted to dump the coins he sold to us we would probably make a net loss.

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make. You seem butthurt for some reason, but it's hard to know exactly why.

There is a class of JD investor who is inconvenienced by this change: the investor who doesn't want to be bankrolling a dice site at all, and is really only interested in having JD stake his coins for him.

Until yesterday he was able to invest in the bankroll with no offsite. All the big 100x investors would dilute his investment so much that he was taking very little risk from players.

Now however his share of the bankroll has almost doubled as all the 100x investors are now only 50x. And his share will continue to increase as the maximum offsite multiplier continues to drop.

I think the solution for this is to offer staking-only to those people, so you can continue to collect staking rewards (minus the 10% commission) without being involved in the bankroll at all.

It will take me a while to implement the staking-only feature. Until I do, I won't drop the maximum offsite multiplier below 25x.

Note, of course, that even with a limit of 10x on the offsite multiplier, it's still less risky for the investors with no offsite than it was before offsite investment was first offered.

That's the onsite investment, which is not affected by this change.

It shouldn't affect people buying much at all, for the reason in my previous post. The last time I looked, average leverage was 90x+ I believe, so basically, the chance only looks good but has little real-world effect. You will still earn and lose about what you did before.

I always thought x100 offsite was a pretty extreme amount of leverage and remember being surprised at the time that you initially went with that.  I think it makes sense to reign it in, especially since people claim to have offsite many more times clams than can possibly exist.  I appreciate you taking time to explain your thinking.  Thank you.

I always like rooting for players so never utilized offsite so that any wagering gains/losses were dwarfed by staking.  One thing this change does do is increase my de facto exposure to players.  It's cool, I'm not upset, but I wonder if this will give further impetus to staking pools.

My big unanswered question is how does this effect clam?  While that shouldn't be your focus, it is an interesting question.  Will people buy more clam in an effort to increase their exposure that is now lost, or does it now make owning clam less attractive since you can't get x100 leverage on it at JD?

Thanks for a great site!

so the max profit has halved, but the amount invested is still above 1,000,000.
Is this because not everybody was max leveraged?

Very sensible change dooglus. I used a high multiplier to keep earning a fair share, but never really felt comfortable with that.

Never the less, I like the offsite concept as it means one can keep Bitcoin offsite without the need to convert it into CLAM.

You and your friends, as you said, succesfully bought majority of digger's CLAMs. Good job. Before that you blackmailed him with snapshot and new coin. You can easy do that again. I don't see any problem with big dump, or is this just your right from now. At these price you still have over 200% profit. Congratulations.

Agree on the change. Right now it looks like a small fair lottery, not just a dice. And since the last whale was crushing so hard the market, a winner of 400K would crash it too.

I don't think it hurts anyone. Illustration (keep in mind people aren't winning 200k+ per roll as it is):

You have 100 CLAM and I have 200 CLAM. We both invest at 100x. You now have 10,000 and I have 20,000 (giving you 33.3% and me 66.6%).
He changes max Kelly to 10x
You have 100 CLAM and I have 200 CLAM. We both invest at 10x. You now have 1,000 and I have 2,000 (giving you 33.3% and me 66.6%).

This affects nothing on the user's end. Either way, our relative ownership of the pool is the same, therefore we both earn and lose at the same exact rate as we did when we were at 100x.

There is a slight difference due to people investing at 1x Kelly or so, but the majority were doing max.

It's been needed for some time doog and even as an investor I welcome the change. The risks of 100x were too high and could bring about huge losses if max profit was ever won, which was a tall order anyway given the odds of winning that insane amount. Not only is clam more protected now, perhaps people will choose to do more with their clam now rather than letting it sit with a high offsite on JD.

People may be hurt by this change but it is a needed one, for clam and for everyone who gambles and invests at JD.

I'm in the process of dropping the maximum "offsite multiplier" for investors on Just-Dice.

About a year ago now I introduced the idea of "offsite investing". The idea was to allow investors to effectively risk coins that they hadn't deposited, with the goal of allowing them to take most of their CLAMs off the site and stake them in a local wallet. CLAM was far too centralised, with some 70% of all the CLAMs sitting in the Just-Dice bankroll, and I was hoping this would help address that problem.

What actually happened was that almost nobody took any of their coins off the site, and everyone just used the offsite investing feature to massively increase the risk they were taking.

So now we find ourselves with around a million CLAMs in the bankroll, and a maximum profit of 400k CLAMs. A single lucky bet could wipe out almost half of the bankroll.

This seems like a bad idea, for various reasons;

  a) In order for investors to get any reasonable share of the site profits they have to dangerously over-extend themselves, risking far too much just to keep up with the other investors.

  b) If any lucky player ever did with the 400k maximum profit, they wouldn't be able to sell their coins for anywhere near as much as they might expect.

  c) Any attempt to dump 400k CLAMs on the exchanges would crash the market hard.

So I'm going to be reducing the maximum offsite multiplier in stages.

The maximum just dropped from 100x to 50x in the last hour, and so the maximum profit per bet is now down to 213k CLAMs. I will continue to drop it over the next few days until it is down to 10x. That will mean investors can risk no more than 5% of their coins per bet.

I expect the max profit even at 10x will be in the region of 50k CLAMs, which is still a very competitive amount to be able to win.

Just-Dice.com loves you too.

What is your userid on the site?

i am very love with just-dice.com,, everytime i am online, first i typo is that site and gmail long live just-dice.com

Sorry about posting in the wrong thread, I wasn't paying enough attention.

For those of you that missed it, in the last 4 days on JD, I went from -230 to +100 CLAM profit, and rained out 250+ CLAMs.

I'm happy to be a part of JD (especially when winning) and I appreciate Dooglus and his team and Mods.

Nooooo... you doxed the secret thread that was so nice an quiet. Now I have to subscribe to this one...

The funny thing about tips is that if you rekt it shows you you still have a substantial amount of profit, depends of the point of view thats a nice or a not nice thing, i think its nice because tecnically you cannot lose all

Unfortunately Randall lost after tipping out lots and lots on chat 

It was pointed out to me that both the Just-Dice threads have been moved into the same sub-forum. The other thread (for investors) used to be in the Securities sub-forum, and this one (for players) was in the gambling section.

Now that they're both in the same place I guess it makes sense to lock one of them - so I'm locking the other one.

The other thread is here:

  https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/just-dicecom-invest-in-1-house-edge-dice-game-242962

great! thanks a lot