Topic: Liquid Synergy Designs Inc. -ASIC mining hardware - page 134. (Read 423279 times)

I agree with a lot of what you said, if we could recover the chip cost plus I think at least 1/2 of the assembly costs (which is more than reasonable) then walking away with ~75% of your initial investment (a ~25% loss) is better than having H/W that does not return as much.

But at this point I don't think a chip refund is possible, does anyone seriously think Yifu will send tens of thousands of BTC back, not happening. Only thing to do is wait for steamboat to receive the chips and support him in getting the H/W out as fast as possible.

Has anyone seen the latest project next difficulty level? The situation is looking quite bleak. This delay has already killed our ROI.

The only profits left at this point are for the assemblers / group buy leaders. The chips will probably ship eventually, the assemblers will build and ship out then worthless products. Everyone will have "fulfilled their obligations". The assemblers and group buy leaders will have their profits, and the end users will be the proud new owners of equipment worth far less than they paid for it.

Rinse and repeat, and that's the Bitcoin mining hardware business in a nutshell.

I'm a small buyer in one of the later batches. I know my opinion counts for zip in this matter. Yet I'd like to go on record and state that I strongly disagree with Steamboat's "wait and see attitude". Yes, if we wait long enough, we'll probably get the chips. But what's the point by then?

Steamboat has stated he will continue to monitor the situation. I'm not even sure what that means. If that means he's exploring civil and law enforcement intervention, then fine. If it means he's monitoring his email for news on when Avalon may decide to ship, that's not good enough!

The excuses in Avalon's latest statement are hard to believe at best. Frankly, IMO It's one of the most absurd official company lies I've ever seen. It's clearly a ploy to get us off his back for a couple more weeks. AND WE ARE DOING JUST WHAT HE WANTS! Yifu is acting like a spoiled child trying to get his way, and we are letting him get away with it.

Ideally, I'd like to see all the group buy leaders get together and take a united stance. I feel that is our best chance at a timely resolution. Combined, they should have enough leverage to get things moving.

Barring that happening, I'd like to see Steamboat step up and say just a little bit more than "Let's just keep waiting". If nothing else, set a deadline for chip shipments, and outline potential next steps should that shipping window not be met. The group buy individual purchasers don't have a contract with Avalon. Steamboat does. It's time he actively advocate for our rights under that contract!

Some sort of action must be taken soon, or we may as well all just pack it up! Simply continuing to wait will have EVERY SINGLE PERSON in this group buy lose their ass. But hey, it's bitcoin mining - nothing new there, right?

I know I've said things in this post that will be unpopular. Flame away if you must. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just stating things as I see them. Something must be done here guys!

PS: I'll try and respond kindly to the inevitable flames to my post. But please excuse me if my responses are delayed. As a customer in a later batch, my profits are gone at this point no matter what happens. I'll probably take a break from here and go lick my wounds. Someone wake me up if my miners ever ship...

Yes, so would I - If I got them in a timely manner. But I DON'T want miners even WITH chips in them at a cost of $325+ US each if they are only earning pennies a day. If you're losing money on them, it makes no sense to have them.

One way to look at it is this: I get a refund on the chips, the assembler keeps the assembly costs that I've already paid, but refunds the overnight shipping (since he's not gonna ship me anything). I've lost the assembly costs, but I've regained the chip cost. Even that undesirable outcome would probably result in more actual cash back in my pocket than waiting for my batch 4 miners to arrive sometime in oh... let's just say October? Gee, I wonder what the difficulty will be at then...

(I realize this scenario would potentially present somewhat of a windfall for the assemblers - they would have to eat parts cost, but would be spared the cost of having boards manufactured. It'd sure be ironic if the only people to make money are the assemblers, for not assembling...)

What's the point in getting chip refunds when we've already paid for assembly etc?  I'd rather have a miner with chips in it than a miner without chips sitting on my desk.

They say gen2 in october!
So since we are not asking for refund, nor for compensation.
LETS WAIT! thats the best idea.

I never said that I did, but neither do you so when would gen 2 chips arrive? You dont know, neither do I. But if you are just going to change the subject when I point out issues in the logic why are we continuing to discuss this?

So, since you seem to have a contact with Avalon that noone else has. What is the delivery time at present?

Think this through and be realistic. You are asking everyone else to take a huge loss, and delay their boards much much further than they would at present.

What i've read, there's no new boards needed, pins are same, just some components replacements.
And if you have ordered thousands of boards, you need to look what pays you back the most, gen 1 coming in another month. or gen 2 coming in two months (avalon numbers)
If you would have the refund meanwhile, it would give you the option at least. With difficulty going up 40-50% ever 11 days..
I just do not want to see them deliver as nothing happened, without any compensation. A refund, could mean with an option to buy when in stock, at a later stage to show good faith.
But if you want to create problems, instead of suggesting solutions, be my guest. I'm sure its a lot of help to someone.

20$ per board over thousands of boards....and this is not something you just fix, you redesign. How long would it take to change the board and then source new parts (potentially) since you do not know if the current ones will work. Would you need new regulators?

How do you know those chips would function on the old boards that were already bought and paid for by the group buy members? Do they have the same pin out? Voltage? Watts? Amps? Grounds? There are so many factors to consider that could make the entire investment a waste in your scenario that I would rather just wait.

From what I read the gen2 will be the same size, but different pinout and I'm sure other small differences would need a complete redesign. You can't expect to just drop it in.

If Avalon is right about gen2 coming out in october. Those past groupbuys should get priority (for example those with refund).
Old hardware designs shall support gen 2 chips.
Would that then not be best? get refund now, wait for gen 2 when you might actually get some of your investment back. And then they only offer gen 2 based on in stock ordering so we will know that the delivery time will be correct.

So you don't want any compensation for delays?
What if the refund gave you priority of gen2 delivered in october, and your board would support it?
I'm speechless of how friendly some people are for getting screwed like this..

If Avalon is right about gen2 coming out in october. Those past groupbuys should get priority (for example those with refund).
Old hardware designs shall support gen 2 chips.
Would that then not be best? get refund now, wait for gen 2 when you might actually get some of your investment back. And then they only offer gen 2 based on in stock ordering so we will know that the delivery time will be correct.