Topic: Litecoin Is NOT Dead (It Is Just Dying A Slow Death) - page 19. (Read 28336 times)

You can't change Avatars at the moment, otherwise I would have already. Go check in the meta forums. I am not trying to convince myself that Litecoin is destined to fail, I have already convinced myself that Litecoin will fail if it continues down the same path. I feel like my arguments are very well thought through and articulately conveyed. If you feel like they are baseless, well then I guess that is your opinion.

Opinions are like belly buttons, everyone has one. For example, "But the fact remains that when significant money is put into Litecoin's backbone and the network is perceived as very secure, that is going to attract a lot of attention from many corners." Is just an opinion, it doesn't change that fact when you start the sentence with "the fact of the matter remains."

Bitcoin and Litecoin are different crypto currencies with different dynamics. Just because something happened one way with Bitcoin doesn't mean that it will happen that way with Litecoin. Furthermore, the money that was flowing into Bitcoin was going to numerous fronts.. payments processing, exchanges, ATMs, mining hardware, etcetera. Whereas the money flowing into Litecoin is mostly sheep following the pack, ASIC manufacturers trying to make money off of ASIC buyers, and ASIC buyers mistakenly trying to make money off of buying unprofitable mining hardware.

"Litecoin has a far, far greater chance of success than any other digital currency in existence that isn't called Bitcoin, right now. As for saying that somehow the price relative to Bitcoin is an indicator of market enthusiasm for Litecoin...take another gander at Coinmarketcap and get back to me."

I see value in some other alternative coins, and I even think some of them have a large chance to overtake Litecoin as people slowly realize that Litecoin is just one big marketing campaign. If your investment strategy is to look at coinmarketcap and choose the coins with the biggest market cap, then I don't feel like that is a smart investment. According to you, this is how "smart money" operates. However, I think the "even smarter money" does extensive research on all coins that are available and the ones in development, and then comes to a proper decision as to what they will put their money in. After doing this myself I have come to the conclusion that "smart money" isn't actually so smart afterall.

So, remove the Litecoin logo from your avatar and call it quits, man...because it sounds to me like you're now just trying to convince yourself that Litecoin is destined to fail and are coming up with baseless arguments to support that hypothesis. Unfortunately, the conditions that exist right now, with money flowing into Litecoin infrastructure in the multi-millions (and soon hundreds of millions), are likely to lead to a lot of growth next year. I can assure you that Litecoin will not be slowed by your decision to bail out on it.

You are basically saying that what's good for the goose is NOT good for the gander and what has happened in Bitcoin, with smart investment money following infrastructure money, is not going to happen in Litecoin...for reasons you can't really articulate. But the fact remains that when significant money is put into Litecoin's backbone and the network is perceived as very secure, that is going to attract a lot of attention from many corners.

Litecoin has a far, far greater chance of success than any other digital currency in existence that isn't called Bitcoin, right now. As for saying that somehow the price relative to Bitcoin is an indicator of market enthusiasm for Litecoin...take another gander at Coinmarketcap and get back to me.

Yeah, and you know where Bitcoin was accepted at the start of 2013? The Silk Road...aaaand, that's about it.

To say a large amount of the improvements made to Bitcoin over the years have come largely from Litecoin developers is a rediuclous statement. I'm well aware they have made a couple security and efficiency improvements, however those improvements are dwarfed when you look at all the improvements that have been made on Bitcoin since Litecoin's inception.


Smart money blindly follows people like sheep just because others have done the same before them? That doesn't sound like smart money to me. Some of the more innovative coins lately have been purely PoS with no mining involved. To say that Litecoin will remain #2 because of all the money pouring in for mining hardware is again a fallacy. There are other crypto currency networks that are more secure than Litecoin due to using different methods of PoS and PoW, sometimes combining the two to exemplify the matter. Furthermore, the mining hardware being made for Litecoin is Scrypt mining hardware, not Litecoin mining hardware. Most people only care about profit and throw them on a multi pool of some sort as it makes them more money. If there weren't a million other Scrypt coins that people could also mine with Scrypt ASICs, then it might not of made sense to make one just yet.

I agree Litecoin has it's own network effect, however it is not nearly as strong as Bitcoin's network effect. Search Bitcoin in Google news and tell me how many articles pop up, then search for Litecoin. You don't even need to tell me the answer, because I already know that there will be much less articles about Litecoin. As I believe I said in the OP, it is Bitcoin that is in the news all day everyday, not Litecoin. Litecoin has a small network effect that is somewhat limited within people engaged in the crypto currency community, however Bitcoin's network effect stretches much wider than that. Since Litecoin's network effect is limited somewhat to people engaged in the community, they are more likely to look at Litecoin for what it is.. Bitcoin with a few changed parameters.


I wouldn't be so sure that Innosilicon was the only reason for the decline in price, in fact I am sure that is not the only reason. The fact of the matter is that we can only speculate to the reason, however I feel that the market sentiment has changed over the past 6 months. Six months ago if you asked me if Litecoin would be the #2 currency in two years, I would have told you yes. Now, six months later, that decision is not so easy anymore and the market is reflecting that.

Again... the money flowing into ASIC hardware argument is flawed because some of the most innovative coins coming out don't even need mining hardware to secure their block chains. It was estimated in December that the Bitcoin network uses $15 million dollars in electricity everyday. If you can't see the value in PoW alternatives, then you must hate planet earth. The money being poured into ASICs are just smart people (ASIC manufacturers) trying to make a buck off of less smart people (ASIC buyers.) Nothing more, nothing less. If these magic money machines actually made any money at all, why wouldn't they just keep them? I realize from experience it is tough to scale a mining operation, however most of these ASIC manufacturers just want FIAT/BTC. They are not making Scrypt ASICs to support Litecoin, they are doing it to make money.


I wouldn't suggest you take my word for that either. I propose you go and read through Satoshi's posts on these forums and come to that conclusion yourself. Furthermore, if he hasn't touched the coins yet.. which were worth about 1,000,000,000 dollars at Bitcoin's peak in December, then I doubt he will ever touch them. If he was going to dump, then 1 billion dollars would be quite tempting. Satoshi must have balls of steel if he is planning on dumping and hasn't yet. One more thing.. if Satoshi dumps then it will likely get out who he is, and as you can tell he doesn't want that to happen.

+1

best not to refer to NXT as shit, strong team, community and developers (as the market cap proves) everyone deserves a chance

Was Bitcoin accepted at these stores 8 months ago Mr Troll? Could you spend them on Expedia, Overstock, Tigerdirect last Xmas - no you could not.

Shame for you, you cant delete posts like you did on your self moderated thread. All your posts you make here were answered on your post below, but you deleted them. Troll with an agenda - everyone should ignore your posts.

You told everyone you just deleted 2 posts on the thread - i count over 20 posts deleted by you. What a joke you are and so stupid you thought you could lie and get away with it.

https://bitcointa.lk/threads/litecoin-is-officially-dead.331214/page-5

Your NXT and DRK will not overtake LTC - No matter what FUD you spread.

Litecoin 24 hour volume $ 1,306,188   
NXT  24 hour volume $ 60,987


which one looks like the shit coin ?

a 287 million dollar shit coin - Good one! Some comedians round these parts....

BTC is accpeted at over 50,000 stores as well as MAJOR brands like Expedia, Overstock, Tigerdirect, etc etc.

Litecoin is accepted as none of those stores....and is just another shit alt coin.

Your opinion is worth nothing at all. You were the guy with the self-moderated thread in which you deleted every post that supported litecoin. It made you look very foolish.

And anyway, BTC is not widely adopted, so you have scored yet another own goal.

It's all guesswork, but LTC doesn't look like its dying to me. Apart from it being priced at nearly $10, which was a dream not so long ago, it has a history of following BTC and dipping or rising against it in response to whatever is happening with BTC. It has been steady all the time, apart from one insane leap on BTC's tail.

Fact is, mining is not showing signs of slowing sown, the difficulty is going up, and I can't see why that when Scrypt Asics become popular, that people won't turn them on LTC causing the difficulty to increase comparative to the new hashing power.

Fair enough, t's not a "cutting edge" crypto these days, but neither is BTC. In fact, BTC is horrible to use. But I'm not betting against it losing its pole position.

BTC and LTC are King and Queen, and I can't see anything upsetting that situation at this point in time.

Are you not aware that a large amount of the improvements to Bitcoin actually COME FROM Litecoin's developers? Warren and Charles have been contributing to Bitcoin development for years. To say that Litecoin merely copies Bitcoin features is erroneous.


It isn't about difficulty. It's about investment. The smart money always follows the money...and the amount of money being poured into dedicated hardware for Litecoin infrastructure right now is very significant. There are a lot of reasons for it, from miners hoarding until it's profitable to increased media exposure attracted to growth, venture capital investments, etc...

As for your comment about Bitcoin's network effect...it is Litecoin's network effect that has kept it in the #2 spot for so long and nobody is even close to dethroning it. So you can't have your cake and eat it, too - Bitcoin has a network effect, true...but so does Litecoin.


The reason for the sharp decline in Litecoin's price relative to Bitcoin can be marked with a giant flashing neon arrow at the first couple weeks of May, when the Innosilicon A2 Terminator 80Mh/s systems started shipping. This gave a small group of miners an outsized share of the block rewards, due to the huge proportion of hashing power they added to the network. They proceeded to dump their coin (presumably in a mad dash toward ROI before competitors came on the scene) and miners, not always being the most educated on the dynamics of markets, were content to just keep dumping into weakness. This was combined with a strong rally in Bitcoin, which traditionally sees investment capital leave Litecoin into Bitcoin, to take advantage of the move up. Recently the ratio took a jump in Litecoin's favor when the rally petered out.

Once ASIC hardware takes over the network and it reaches a relative equilibrium of hashrate ownership close to what it had when it was GPU-driven, the dumping mentality should not be as pronounced. You are just failing to observe the reasons for the drop and you aren't seeing that the money that's being poured into Litecoin infrastructure (regardless of how much fiat capital is in it) is actually a giant vote of confidence, and people should be following that money.


I'm not convinced of that. Satoshi cut all ties and disappeared the instant that Gavin Andresen said he was meeting with the CIA about Bitcoin. He hasn't had a thing to do with it since, hasn't been an advocate of it, has not come out of hiding except to say that he is NOT Dorian Nakamoto. A guy like that, who takes such pains to ensure his privacy and who has divested himself of all relationships related to Bitcoin, doesn't strike me as particularly trustworthy. I'm not going to put my faith in the assurances of some random person who cannot possibly know Satoshi's mind or intentions.

Though in fairness, you write this as ASICs are just now starting to take over the network. We're going to have a much different looking picture at the end of 2014. When you look at Litecoin's network difficulty and hashrate, it dwarfs all other alts.

Litecoin's network will never have the hashrate or difficulty that Bitcoin does, because of Scrypt. That limits the amount of hashrate that can be squeezed out of ASIC hardware, relative to power consumption. But in relative terms, Litecoin's network over the next year will likely grow to become just as secure as Bitcoin's is, today...if the current momentum is any indication.

Bitcoin looked stagnant for a long, long time before ASICs hit it, and more attention started getting drawn to it. That attention came from the investment being made in its infrastructure. That vote of confidence was essentially what catapulted it into the consciousness of venture capitalists and investors. So the premise that Litecoin is somehow dying a slow death, while hundreds of millions are being poured into hardware infrastructure seems a tad premature, to me.

Are you kidding me? Bitcoin was the first crypto currency, it is innovation at its finest. Sure, money in itself is not innovative, but a decentralized psuedo anonymous currency was certainly innovative. They continue to improve upon Bitcoin and add new features, improving on the original innovation, which is why I would still call it innovative. My grudge with Litecoin is that they simply copy those features.


I think Litecoin is actually accepted at a lot of places, but if it weren't number 2 on the market cap list, I don't think this would be true. Businesses go after where the money is, as they are in the business of making money.


There's a big difference in between gimmicks and innovation. I agree that most of the "innovative" alternative coins that have come out have been mainly gimmicky and only made small changes, however there are some truly innovative ones out there as well. I think to brush everything off as a gimmick is a mistake. I agree Auroracoin was somewhat of a gimmick, but it was also innovative in the fact that no one had distributed a crypto currency like that before. Just because something is innovative doesn't mean I would think it is a good investment, and that is usually in the case of the innovation(s) being a gimmick. I don't think anyone actually thought Aurora Coin would overtake Bitcoin. The most vocal supporters of the gimmicky pump and dump coins, are usually people trying to pump up the price so that they can dump them, and it is hardly a shared community sentiment.

There are many non nefarious reasons someone would want privacy. For example, the want to stop the NSA, CIA, and Corporations (etcetera) intercepting and studying our data. Pretty much everything from what we look at on the internet, where we go, what we do, what we like, what we don't like, and reading private communications. The list goes on and an and I think in this day and age (thanks Snowden) people are more aware of the need for privacy. The TOR underground is understanbly a bit comprehensive to start using new technologies.. who knows who developed them and what their purposes were for doing so. There could very well be a back door to the CIA, admittedly that is unlikely but when you're selling drugs would you really want to take chances like this? They will eventually move over to something more private and anonymous, but it is too early to make that transition.


Just because difficulty goes up it does not mean that price will follow, and the "all other digital currencies are fighting for table scraps" goes along with the "too big to fail" mantra that I don't believe applies to crypto coins- or anything for that matter.


It's mostly crazys and stupids that have called Bitcoin dead in the past. They don't understand that crypto currencies are a movement, and Bitcoin is at the forefront of this movement. It will likely stay there for some time. I don't think these people understand the network effect, something which is more applicable to Bitcoin than Litecoin. You can't kill movements, especially political, human rights, and religious ones.  I feel crypto currencies are a political and human rights movement wrapped into one in the form of currency.


The money WAS going into Litecoin. It has been on a steady decline for the past 6 months, the same amount of Litecoins today can only buy you half as many Bitcoins s they could 6 months ago. What you are seeing is the result of Litecoin being on top for so long and the natural choice to be the #2 crypto currency. That choice is not so clear cut anymore, and for some like me it is not even a hard decision.


Mark my words, Satoshi will never dump his coins. This is because for Satoshi, Bitcoin is more of a political and human rights movement in the form of a currency. Satoshi empowered this movement through the one thing most people care about most in this world- money. Bitcoin is just Satoshi's soap box.

This is very true, relatively speaking, LTC is the only other ledger that is at least significantly secure, especially with ASICs (excluding the possible pool issues). Frankly, the security already established for Bitcoin and the growing security for Litecoin are going to be difficult to beat (and that's what it'll take to overtake either coin). It seems that people keep forgetting that the alternate crypto-currency scene is a fringe of an already fairly fringe scene; so what is great for them isn't going to necessarily be great for a majority of others.

It surprises me that so many people here think that an anon coin or a coin with a ton of nifty features is the bee's knees. Last time I checked, using those other protocols still requires a significant amount of technical knowledge or familiarity. Do we honestly think the majority of people would look for something like that as the alternative to bank-owned fiat? As I see it, the place for improvement is not in anon or new algorithms or nifty new features, but in ease of use and ready accessibility (such as in a improved GUI experience like someone had already mentioned).

However, infrastructure is significantly more limited than it is with BTC and a lot of other alts are quickly catching up. LTC still has a sizable edge, but that gap is closing rather than expanding.

My feeling is that the real innovation will happen on a user interface level (not just wallets but also services), rather than at the protocol level...although some things may need flexibility with the protocol's core development and if its worth making significant changes at the protocol level, then you proceed accordingly. To that end, I still think that the Litecoin developers and platform are going to be able to remain a lot more flexible and amenable to this stuff than Bitcoin. I think as a result of so much weight being heaped upon Bitcoin, it's going to become pretty inflexible...and that opens up avenues for Litecoin to explore.

+1

lets understand marketing

infrastructure is the key for investors and businesses to adopt a coin

I run a business and as yet my customers do not understand crypto

If i was to offer them crypto i would select a coin that has a strong infrastructure and investors


btc and ltc both have enterprises supporting this, why is there asic machines on sale if the market was not there, why is there atm's being built if the markets not there

please provide me with another coin that has the infrastructure to support my customers cash exchange and a network that is very hard to fall down like other altcoins have after a few months

That is the one way I could see Litecoin being worthwhile; basically innovating off its differences with bitcoin. The problem is, I haven't seen any real innovation, nor plans for anything in the near future that makes me think litecoin should go up in value.

Of course it may, and perhaps there are things planned that are quite unique. But, again, it does appear to be more a 'stay the course' type of coin, even if that course has been leading downward. I wouldn't tell anyone to invest or not invest in any coin, but I simply don't see a reason for myself to invest in it.

I'm not in Litecoin because I believe it has the potential to take over Bitcoin's spot...I still think that's wholly unlikely. However, I'm a BIG believer in choice, and not having only one point of failure.

I always liken it to the situation we have with the internet, today. We have protocols that drive the network that have forced developers to shoehorn things into it that perhaps it's not best suited to...streaming media would be a biggie. If we had started with multiple networks, one could have evolved to specialize in streaming media and now you would possibly have a much more efficient way of getting video/audio across the network, more bandwidth (or less required bandwidth) and who knows what else it may have opened up, to have an alternative. The point is, having a choice breeds innovation.

At the protocol level, Litecoin has some significant differences that may ultimately lend it to applications that Bitcoin doesn't. It is insulated from certain issues in the Bitcoin core development, because it is a separate team (although they work closely with the Bitcoin developers) and they have a different design philosophy, in many ways. Bitcoin is going to be under tremendous political pressure from developers and elsewhere to be this or that, whereas Litecoin has less pressure to accommodate. So no...nobody's going to convince me that it isn't a big positive that we have Litecoin around.