Lose vs Loose - page 3. | Bitcointalksearch.org

Peter Lambert

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Quote from: deisik on December 13, 2013, 01:41:16 PM

"Capable at doing" gives me 325,000 results in Google... Can Google be actually wrong to such a degree? Really, I don't feel that I ~~musused~~ misused the word and preposition here (I wrote intuitively).

Fixed sp. (sorry, all this talk of grammar made me do it)

But a Google search for "capable of doing" gives 103,000,000 hits. And if you look at the links for "capable at doing", they are not very reliable sources, mostly the middle of blog posts. So this seems to be a common mistake, perhaps common enough that it is no longer a mistake and is acceptable now?

LostDutchman

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Now, I want you all to remember that...................................................

.....the misuse of the prepostion, especially the ending of a sentence with a preopostion is something up with which I will not put!

The above sentence is technically grammatically correct but awkward as Hell.

What is one to do?

My $.02.

Wink

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Quote from: Peter Lambert on December 13, 2013, 01:32:47 PM

I don't think you can say "capable at doing something". You can say "capable of doing something", or "good at doing something". You might also say you are "capable in a topic or field".

So these are acceptable renderings of the original sentence:
neither do I find myself specifically capable of learning foreign languages (If you view 'learning foreign languages' as an action)
neither do I find myself specifically capable in learning foreign languages (If you view 'learning foreign languages' as a field of study)
neither do I find myself specifically proficient at learning foreign languages

"Capable at doing" gives me 325,000 results in Google... Can Google be actually wrong to such a degree? Really, I don't feel that I misused the word and preposition here (I wrote intuitively). Also, regarding the ambiguity, consider the dialogue below:

- English is a notoriously difficult language to learn!
- How would you know if English is your native language?

Don't see any ambiguity here (and no pause between the two clauses that would formally justify a comma between them in writing). Obviously, the context says it all. Even if I wanted to ask about native language, the whole question would sound really insane (note "whether" instead of "if"):

- How would you know whether English is your native language?

Peter Lambert

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Quote from: deisik on December 13, 2013, 12:15:48 PM

Quote from: Peter Lambert on December 13, 2013, 11:58:41 AM

On the third part, I agree it should be "capable of learning".

As to me, being "capable of learning" means having the qualities or abilities needed to do something (i.e. learning a language in principle), whereas being "capable at learning" means being skilled at doing something, i.e. "doing it the right way". So when I say that I am capable of learning a foreign language, I mean that I can learn it to a certain degree. But when I say that I am capable at learning a foreign language, it means that I can master it perfectly...

I don't think you can say "capable at doing something". You can say "capable of doing something", or "good at doing something". You might also say you are "capable in a topic or field".

So these are acceptable renderings of the original sentence:
neither do I find myself specifically capable of learning foreign languages (If you view 'learning foreign languages' as an action)
neither do I find myself specifically capable in learning foreign languages (If you view 'learning foreign languages' as a field of study)
neither do I find myself specifically proficient at learning foreign languages

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Quote from: bitmarket.io on December 09, 2013, 11:35:59 PM

if one understands the context the spelling is irrelevant. only someone without a life would draw joy out of calling someone on it to boost their little ego.

i say the size of your bank account / wallet says how smart u r

Gulp! I thought it was the size of one pinis. Tongue

deisik

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Quote from: Peter Lambert on December 13, 2013, 11:58:41 AM

The first one would be clearer if he specified what 'know' linked to, rather than leaving it open ended which causes confusion because it looks like it links to 'English is your native language' rather than 'English is hard to learn'. So a more clear way of writing it would be "How would you know English is hard to learn if English is your native language (is it)?" Or, as suggested, you could add the comma to separate the two clauses.

"I don't think it difficult" - looks fine to me. That is not the phrase structure I use, but that does not make it wrong. I find your objection unfounded.

On the third part, I agree it should be "capable of learning".

As to me, being "capable of learning" means having the qualities or abilities needed to do something (i.e. learning a language in principle), whereas being "capable at learning" means being skilled at doing something, i.e. "doing it the right way". So when I say that I am capable of learning a foreign language, I mean that I can learn it to a certain degree. But when I say that I am capable at learning a foreign language, it means that I can master it perfectly...

Peter Lambert

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Quote from: u9y42 on December 13, 2013, 10:20:25 AM

Quote from: deisik on December 13, 2013, 09:24:54 AM

Now you have no other option left but do just that, as what you've stated means there are some. This is an Off-topic section of the forum, so you have the right to unleash yourself (and I would not mind)...

Not exactly grammatical errors, but allow me to try... Grin

How would you know if English is your native language (is it?)? - I kind of take this to mean that you're asking him if he is sure that English is his native language. So, maybe a comma in there might help: "How would you know, if English is your native language?" though it may be more clear the other way around: "if English is your native language, how would you know?".

I don't think it difficult (English grammar at least) - I'm not sure you can omit the implicit "is" in there: "I don't think it is difficult (English grammar at least)"

neither do I find myself specifically capable at learning foreign languages - I don't know if "specifically" is the best word to use in this context; you're sort of specifying something indeed, but it kind of sounds weird to me. Also, did you mean "incapable" instead of "capable"? And "of" instead of "at"? That way, I think you're saying that you don't find yourself capable of learning foreign languages. "neither do I find myself specifically incapable of learning foreign languages"

Anyway, that's all I got. I hope someone else can help out (and probably point out my own mistakes). Roll Eyes

The first one would be clearer if he specified what 'know' linked to, rather than leaving it open ended which causes confusion because it looks like it links to 'English is your native language' rather than 'English is hard to learn'. So a more clear way of writing it would be "How would you know English is hard to learn if English is your native language (is it)?" Or, as suggested, you could add the comma to separate the two clauses.

"I don't think it difficult" - looks fine to me. That is not the phrase structure I use, but that does not make it wrong. I find your objection unfounded.

On the third part, I agree it should be "capable of learning".

deisik

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Quote from: u9y42 on December 13, 2013, 10:20:25 AM

I don't think it difficult (English grammar at least) - I'm not sure you can omit the implicit "is" in there: "I don't think it is difficult (English grammar at least)"

I can omit the linking verb here, I am absolutely sure of that

Quote from: u9y42 on December 13, 2013, 10:20:25 AM

neither do I find myself specifically capable at learning foreign languages - I don't know if "specifically" is the best word to use in this context; you're sort of specifying something indeed, but it kind of sounds weird to me. Also, did you mean "incapable" instead of "capable"? And "of" instead of "at"? That way, I think you're saying that you don't find yourself capable of learning foreign languages. "neither do I find myself specifically incapable of learning foreign languages"

Anyway, that's all I got. I hope someone else can help out (and probably point out my own mistakes). Roll Eyes

I did actually mean that I am not very good at learning foreign languages (which should be clear from the context), my point being that the English language (its grammar) is not so difficult that even I could somewhat learn it. That's why I used "specifically" to point this out...

deisik

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Quote from: u9y42 on December 13, 2013, 10:20:25 AM

Quote from: deisik on December 13, 2013, 09:24:54 AM

Now you have no other option left but do just that, as what you've stated means there are some. This is an Off-topic section of the forum, so you have the right to unleash yourself (and I would not mind)...

Not exactly grammatical errors, but allow me to try... Grin

How would you know if English is your native language (is it?)? - I kind of take this to mean that you're asking him if he is sure that English is his native language. So, maybe a comma in there might help: "How would you know, if English is your native language?" though it may be more clear the other way around: "if English is your native language, how would you know?".

I think that a comma is not needed here. If the conditional clause comes first, we put a comma between it and the main clause (as in this sentence). We don't use a comma if the main clause comes first (though we could still use a comma to aid better understanding). And a comma should be used when connecting two independent clauses

Your doubts are actually about semantics and possible misunderstanding, that's why the context is so important (by the way, this sentence is made of two independent clauses)

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Quote from: deisik on December 13, 2013, 09:24:54 AM

Now you have no other option left but do just that, as what you've stated means there are some. This is an Off-topic section of the forum, so you have the right to unleash yourself (and I would not mind)...

Not exactly grammatical errors, but allow me to try... Grin

How would you know if English is your native language (is it?)? - I kind of take this to mean that you're asking him if he is sure that English is his native language. So, maybe a comma in there might help: "How would you know, if English is your native language?" though it may be more clear the other way around: "if English is your native language, how would you know?".

I don't think it difficult (English grammar at least) - I'm not sure you can omit the implicit "is" in there: "I don't think it is difficult (English grammar at least)"

neither do I find myself specifically capable at learning foreign languages - I don't know if "specifically" is the best word to use in this context; you're sort of specifying something indeed, but it kind of sounds weird to me. Also, did you mean "incapable" instead of "capable"? And "of" instead of "at"? That way, I think you're saying that you don't find yourself capable of learning foreign languages. "neither do I find myself specifically incapable of learning foreign languages"

Anyway, that's all I got. I hope someone else can help out (and probably point out my own mistakes). Roll Eyes

deisik

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Quote from: hilariousandco on December 13, 2013, 08:52:10 AM

Quote from: deisik on December 13, 2013, 08:13:14 AM

Quote from: hilariousandco on December 13, 2013, 07:52:42 AM

English is a notoriously difficulty language to learn. I don't begrudge anyone for not having perfect grammar. English and Americans are generally lazy when it comes to learning another language anyway, so I find it rich when they criticise others when they themselves cannot use the language properly, nor can they speak another language other than their own. In fact, I'm not sure I've ever met somebody with perfect English grammar, and of course that includes myself and, ironically, most so-called grammar nazis.

How would you know if English is your native language (is it?)? I don't think it difficult (English grammar at least), neither do I find myself specifically capable at learning foreign languages (now it is a matter of vocabulary for me)...

I won't point out all the grammatical errors in the above statement Grin

.

Now you have no other option left but do just that, as what you've stated means there are some. This is an Off-topic section of the forum, so you have the right to unleash yourself (and I would not mind)...

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Quote from: deisik on December 13, 2013, 08:13:14 AM

Quote from: hilariousandco on December 13, 2013, 07:52:42 AM

English is a notoriously difficulty language to learn. I don't begrudge anyone for not having perfect grammar. English and Americans are generally lazy when it comes to learning another language anyway, so I find it rich when they criticise others when they themselves cannot use the language properly, nor can they speak another language other than their own. In fact, I'm not sure I've ever met somebody with perfect English grammar, and of course that includes myself and, ironically, most so-called grammar nazis.

How would you know if English is your native language (is it?)? I don't think it difficult (English grammar at least), neither do I find myself specifically capable at learning foreign languages (now it is a matter of vocabulary for me)...

I won't point out all the grammatical errors in the above statement Grin

.

There are many ways in which English is difficult to grasp. Obviously there's no test to rate languages on a scale of difficulty, but I've found the majority of people who speak English as a second language have told me how difficult they find it, and I often read about how hard it is to master the grammar, but obviously some people pick languages/grammar up quickly than others. Maybe try find a multi-lingual person and ask them haha.

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Quote from: hilariousandco on December 13, 2013, 07:52:42 AM

English is a notoriously difficulty language to learn. I don't begrudge anyone for not having perfect grammar. English and Americans are generally lazy when it comes to learning another language anyway, so I find it rich when they criticise others when they themselves cannot use the language properly, nor can they speak another language other than their own. In fact, I'm not sure I've ever met somebody with perfect English grammar, and of course that includes myself and, ironically, most so-called grammar nazis.

Really? I always thought, and heard other people saying, that it was one of the easiest languages to learn. Huh

deisik

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Quote from: hilariousandco on December 13, 2013, 07:52:42 AM

English is a notoriously difficulty language to learn. I don't begrudge anyone for not having perfect grammar. English and Americans are generally lazy when it comes to learning another language anyway, so I find it rich when they criticise others when they themselves cannot use the language properly, nor can they speak another language other than their own. In fact, I'm not sure I've ever met somebody with perfect English grammar, and of course that includes myself and, ironically, most so-called grammar nazis.

How would you know if English is your native language (is it?)? I don't think it difficult (English grammar at least), neither do I find myself specifically capable at learning foreign languages (now it is a matter of vocabulary for me)...

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Quote from: u9y42 on December 13, 2013, 03:50:20 AM

Quote from: QuestionAuthority on December 13, 2013, 03:22:53 AM

Many people on this forum are not native English speakers. They may not use the language perfectly but at least they try. There are also many children here that don't attempt to use perfect written communication. They are at a disadvantage because they were schooled in the USA.

You're right, and I sort of agree with your original point, that is, provided you can get your point across, some spelling/grammatical errors shouldn't be much of an issue. But I don't think anyone here is trying to stop them from using the forum or some such... you learn as you go, as you use the language. So I was just pointing out that using Spanish, even though you can use a translation service to understand it, it does little to help them learn English, and is probably not that great at communicating with most of the users of this forum. Tongue

English is a notoriously difficulty language to learn. I don't begrudge anyone for not having perfect grammar. English and Americans are generally lazy when it comes to learning another language anyway, so I find it rich when they criticise others when they themselves cannot use the language properly, nor can they speak another language other than their own. In fact, I'm not sure I've ever met somebody with perfect English grammar, and of course that includes myself and, ironically, most so-called grammar nazis.

deisik

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Quote from: QuestionAuthority on December 13, 2013, 03:22:53 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Well, to be fair, google translate (for example) does do a good job at it. Still, I'm not sure it adds much to the thread to bring Spanish into a discussion about how many people either don't know how to spell, or are using different rules. Tongue

Many people on this forum are not native English speakers. They may not use the language perfectly but at least they try. There are also many children here that don't attempt to use perfect written communication. They are at a disadvantage because they were schooled in the USA.

Children?! I don't remember exactly, but isn't this forum 18+ or so?

u9y42

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Quote from: QuestionAuthority on December 13, 2013, 03:22:53 AM

Many people on this forum are not native English speakers. They may not use the language perfectly but at least they try. There are also many children here that don't attempt to use perfect written communication. They are at a disadvantage because they were schooled in the USA.

You're right, and I sort of agree with your original point, that is, provided you can get your point across, some spelling/grammatical errors shouldn't be much of an issue. But I don't think anyone here is trying to stop them from using the forum or some such... you learn as you go, as you use the language. So I was just pointing out that using Spanish, even though you can use a translation service to understand it, it does little to help them learn English, and is probably not that great at communicating with most of the users of this forum. Tongue

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Es fácil de entender lo que dice. Todo lo que tienes que hacer es utilizar un programa de traducción en línea creo que es súper fácil de hacer.

Well, to be fair, google translate (for example) does do a good job at it. Still, I'm not sure it adds much to the thread to bring Spanish into a discussion about how many people either don't know how to spell, or are using different rules. Tongue

Many people on this forum are not native English speakers. They may not use the language perfectly but at least they try. There are also many children here that don't attempt to use perfect written communication. They are at a disadvantage because they were schooled in the USA.

deisik

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