[MOON] Mooncoin 🌙 move to a new thread - page 112.

coinflow

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Activity: 840

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Quote from: barrysty1e on January 06, 2018, 07:40:33 PM

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 07:33:12 PM

The original freezing was already doubtful (that's most probably why Cryptopia removed Mooncoin from their exchange), but as said, now is a new situation, because the stolen coins are available again and are still - exactly as when they were frozen - stolen goods.

Ask your lawyer.

it's not on cryptopia, because hex and i do not like each other.
having the upper hand (owning the exchange), he chose to act like a child knowing it would cause me some grief.. having just come onboard as the new dev at the time.

nothing to do with the freezing; no other exchanges have had an issue either morally or legally with it.

james

We all can't really check, what is the truth about removing Mooncoin from Cryptopia, it seemed odd back in the time. We would need Hex to give his opinion on this here, too.
Fact is, the coins are available again. Hopefully in the hands of a responsible person. And what I'm trying to say is, that we should not require that this one person (Vassilis) possibly becomes a criminal, only because some of the Mooncoin-holders do not want that the price may(!!) drop a little bit, because the authorities (whoever that is) decide to sell that stash in the far future. Bitcoin is also still doing well, despite of some authorities selling coins. Mooncoin is strong, don't forget that.

Mooncoin_Foundation

hero member

Activity: 1022

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Mooncoin at Bitcointalk

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 07:33:12 PM

Quote from: Mooncoin_Foundation on January 06, 2018, 07:17:07 PM

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 05:02:41 PM

Normally stolen goods are illegal in consequence, if not returned to their rightful owners; so an expert opinion from a qualified lawyer would be a good thing indeed.

Coins are not goods, and they were returned to our community, so they are not stolen at the moment.
Of course, now when they are returned, only their rightful owners can decide what to do with them, otherwise, they really will be stolen.

But another thing is that coins in fact were blocked/frozen, so it's like they are out of supply and are 'unofficial coins' now.
Remember that investors were investing because they believed these coins were frozen, maybe the price of Mooncoin never went to these levels without that,
so to 'unfreeze' them means that the decision-makers of this could be held liable for the loss of these investors afterwards.

So these coins are not Mooncoins, they are 'unofficial, frozen Mooncoins' which should be burnt, just to stay out of supply forever.

The original freezing was already doubtful (that's most probably why Cryptopia removed Mooncoin from their exchange), but as said, now is a new situation, because the stolen coins are available again and are still - exactly as when they were frozen - stolen goods.

Ask your lawyer.

Cryptopia explained why they removed Mooncoin, you can find it at the end of previous ANN thread. It had nothing in common with frozen coins.
The community decided to freeze coins to prevent spending them after they were not delivered to the court and to their owners.
Coins were frozen. Now the protection was hacked, it's a technical question. These coins are not real coins. The protection should be improved by burning these coins.
But if anyone wants to receive his/her coins back, and can prove his/her ownership, there can be a solution for that.
If not, what are we talking about?

barrysty1e

hero member

Activity: 636

Merit: 516

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 07:33:12 PM

The original freezing was already doubtful (that's most probably why Cryptopia removed Mooncoin from their exchange), but as said, now is a new situation, because the stolen coins are available again and are still - exactly as when they were frozen - stolen goods.

Ask your lawyer.

it's not on cryptopia, because hex and i do not like each other.
having the upper hand (owning the exchange), he chose to act like a child knowing it would cause me some grief.. having just come onboard as the new dev at the time.

nothing to do with the freezing; no other exchanges have had an issue either morally or legally with it.

james

paulus59

newbie

Activity: 231

Merit: 0

Quote from: barrysty1e on January 06, 2018, 07:34:21 PM

Quote from: paulus59 on January 06, 2018, 07:31:41 PM

hi james
i did the above getrawtransaction with the number and i get back :

No information available about transaction (code -5)

so i do a rescan ?

yep, easily achievable by adding -rescan to the program parameters of your mooncoin shortcut.
just remember to remove it once you've rescanned, its a pain to do it a few times in a row because you didnt remove it

oke i will i do it trough command , i let you now the results, iam of to bed now its midnight here ;-) thanks

barrysty1e

hero member

Activity: 636

Merit: 516

Quote from: paulus59 on January 06, 2018, 07:31:41 PM

hi james
i did the above getrawtransaction with the number and i get back :

No information available about transaction (code -5)

so i do a rescan ?

yep, easily achievable by adding -rescan to the program parameters of your mooncoin shortcut.
just remember to remove it once you've rescanned, its a pain to do it a few times in a row because you didnt remove it

coinflow

legendary

Activity: 840

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Mooncoin_Foundation on January 06, 2018, 07:17:07 PM

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 05:02:41 PM

Normally stolen goods are illegal in consequence, if not returned to their rightful owners; so an expert opinion from a qualified lawyer would be a good thing indeed.

Coins are not goods, and they were returned to our community, so they are not stolen at the moment.
Of course, now when they are returned, only their rightful owners can decide what to do with them, otherwise, they really will be stolen.

But another thing is that coins in fact were blocked/frozen, so it's like they are out of supply and are 'unofficial coins' now.
Remember that investors were investing because they believed these coins were frozen, maybe the price of Mooncoin never went to these levels without that,
so to 'unfreeze' them means that the decision-makers of this could be held liable for the loss of these investors afterwards.

So these coins are not Mooncoins, they are 'unofficial, frozen Mooncoins' which should be burnt, just to stay out of supply forever.

The original freezing was already doubtful (that's most probably why Cryptopia removed Mooncoin from their exchange), but as said, now is a new situation, because the stolen coins are available again and are still - exactly as when they were frozen - stolen goods.

Ask your lawyer.

paulus59

newbie

Activity: 231

Merit: 0

Quote from: barrysty1e on January 06, 2018, 07:29:04 PM

Quote from: paulus59 on January 06, 2018, 07:24:54 PM

hi james this is the transaction id : 742979eeef9719b998ee35f8687f0f3b3e77ae3f023f6919b5fdf3684e508d63
[edit] in wallet it says at transactions wallet is offline ?

ok, this generally means that the transaction wasn't broadcast, possibly due to network failure - as i can't see it in mempool at the moment.

at the console:
getrawtransaction 742979eeef9719b998ee35f8687f0f3b3e77ae3f023f6919b5fdf3684e508d63
(it will dump a very long hex number, copy this to clipboard)
sendrawtransaction

if you receive a tx rejected; you may have to rescan your wallet, as the funds haven't left yours.
if you receive a tx decode error, you mightve accidentally put another character in the string.

hi james
i did the above getrawtransaction with the number and i get back :

No information available about transaction (code -5)

so i do a rescan ?

barrysty1e

hero member

Activity: 636

Merit: 516

Quote from: paulus59 on January 06, 2018, 07:24:54 PM

hi james this is the transaction id : 742979eeef9719b998ee35f8687f0f3b3e77ae3f023f6919b5fdf3684e508d63
[edit] in wallet it says at transactions wallet is offline ?

ok, this generally means that the transaction wasn't broadcast, possibly due to network failure - as i can't see it in mempool at the moment.

at the console:
getrawtransaction 742979eeef9719b998ee35f8687f0f3b3e77ae3f023f6919b5fdf3684e508d63
(it will dump a very long hex number, copy this to clipboard)
sendrawtransaction

if you receive a tx rejected; you may have to rescan your wallet, as the funds haven't left yours.
if you receive a tx decode error, you mightve accidentally put another character in the string.

paulus59

newbie

Activity: 231

Merit: 0

Quote from: barrysty1e on January 06, 2018, 07:13:39 PM

Quote from: paulus59 on January 06, 2018, 07:09:57 PM

wel hmm got a error within the latest version mooncoin wallet :

has triggered forbiddentx alert (n=1481, txdebug=3204) in debug log ,

is this the case that my deposit mooncoin wallet is offline at bleutrade ? it cant send my coins over there ?

this is the function performing normally.
it actually flared up quite a bit this evening; it is dropping/preventing the transactions from entering mempool (ready to be committed to a block), if the given transaction matches one in a list of hashes.

edit: it doesnt mean that its dropped a transaction you've made, it means that another node has attempted to relay a transaction to your node, but your node has dropped it from mempool.

what is the transaction id for the transaction you're having issues with?

james

hi james this is the transaction id : 742979eeef9719b998ee35f8687f0f3b3e77ae3f023f6919b5fdf3684e508d63

[edit] in wallet it says at transactions wallet is offline ? : Status: 0/offline, is nog niet met succes uitgezonden ( its not by send succesfull ) its in dutch btw

Mooncoin_Foundation

hero member

Activity: 1022

Merit: 550

Mooncoin at Bitcointalk

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 05:02:41 PM

Normally stolen goods are illegal in consequence, if not returned to their rightful owners; so an expert opinion from a qualified lawyer would be a good thing indeed.

Coins are not goods, and they were returned to our community, so they are not stolen at the moment.
Of course, now when they are returned, only their rightful owners can decide what to do with them, otherwise, they really will be stolen.

But another thing is that coins in fact were blocked/frozen, so it's like they are out of supply and are 'unofficial coins' now.
Remember that investors were investing because they believed these coins were frozen, maybe the price of Mooncoin never went to these levels without that,
so to 'unfreeze' them means that the decision-makers of this could be held liable for the loss of these investors afterwards.

So these coins are not Mooncoins, they are 'unofficial, frozen Mooncoins' which should be burnt, just to stay out of supply forever.

barrysty1e

hero member

Activity: 636

Merit: 516

Quote from: paulus59 on January 06, 2018, 07:09:57 PM

wel hmm got a error within the latest version mooncoin wallet :

has triggered forbiddentx alert (n=1481, txdebug=3204) in debug log ,

is this the case that my deposit mooncoin wallet is offline at bleutrade ? it can send my coins over there ?

this is the function performing normally.
it actually flared up quite a bit this evening; it is dropping/preventing the transactions from entering mempool (ready to be committed to a block), if the given transaction matches one in a list of hashes.

edit: it doesnt mean that its dropped a transaction you've made, it means that another node has attempted to relay a transaction to your node, but your node has dropped it from mempool.

what is the transaction id for the transaction you're having issues with?

james

paulus59

newbie

Activity: 231

Merit: 0

wel hmm got a error within the latest version mooncoin wallet :

has triggered forbiddentx alert (n=1481, txdebug=3204) in debug log ,

is this the case that my deposit mooncoin wallet is offline at bleutrade ? it can send my coins over there ?

coinflow

legendary

Activity: 840

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Mooncoin_Foundation on January 06, 2018, 06:50:31 PM

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 06:26:09 PM

Quote from: Mooncoin_Foundation on January 06, 2018, 06:18:26 PM

Quote from: angel55 on January 06, 2018, 06:08:21 PM

I lost 57 million mooncoins from Cryptsy Sad

, reallly wish I could get those back.

I had lost many more coins at Cryptsy.

But what will be better, say, you have now 20 million coins and their price is 7 Sat.
Or you have 20+57=77 coins and their price is below 1 Sat due to dumping.
Or even worse: if coins go to the court, you have only some miserable compensation in BTC or in USD for that.

But the point is not what we want. The point is what is fair and what is really legal and wise in this situation.
In my opinion, burning coins if majority of their holders agrees with that right now, is legal and fair.

The point is, what is legal and what is not.

What is legal in one jurisdiction, could be illegal in another.
Generally laws are based on ethics and fairness.
If there is a lack of crypto laws, it's okay to act according to fairness and ethics.

These coins were already returned to the community and are in hands of our dev at the moment.
The majority of their holders decided already to burn coins.
If someone wants to get his/her coins and not burn them, even if major holders want to burn their coins, then please tell now.
But in this case he/she should have a legal proof that he/she is a legitimate owner of some amount of these coins.

As Vassilis is living in a European country - no banana state -, burning the coins with even one owner being against it, could leave recourse claims against him. So I'd recommend all here to stop requiring burning of the coins, as Vassilis is the only one who can decide this and no one should be angry and blame him, if he decides to give the coins to the authorities, as his lawyers most probably will advise him.

polemarhos888

sr. member

Activity: 499

Merit: 250

To The Moon !

Quote from: Mooncoin_Foundation on January 06, 2018, 06:50:31 PM

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 06:26:09 PM

Quote from: Mooncoin_Foundation on January 06, 2018, 06:18:26 PM

Quote from: angel55 on January 06, 2018, 06:08:21 PM

I lost 57 million mooncoins from Cryptsy Sad

, reallly wish I could get those back.

I had lost many more coins at Cryptsy.

But what will be better, say, you have now 20 million coins and their price is 7 Sat.
Or you have 20+57=77 coins and their price is below 1 Sat due to dumping.
Or even worse: if coins go to the court, you have only some miserable compensation in BTC or in USD for that.

But the point is not what we want. The point is what is fair and what is really legal and wise in this situation.
In my opinion, burning coins if majority of their holders agrees with that right now, is legal and fair.

The point is, what is legal and what is not.

What is legal in one jurisdiction, could be illegal in another.
Generally laws are based on ethics and fairness.
If there is a lack of crypto laws, it's okay to act according to fairness and ethics.

These coins were already returned to the community and are in hands of our dev at the moment.
The majority of their holders decided already to burn coins.
If someone wants to get his/her coins and not burn them, even if major holders want to burn their coins, then please tell now.
But in this case he/she should have a legal proof that he/she is a legitimate owner of some amount of these coins.

I agree 100% with you in this case ! All these people who want his lost coins (from cryptsy) back, must be have a document as a legal proof that they are the really owners of these coins.

Mooncoin_Foundation

hero member

Activity: 1022

Merit: 550

Mooncoin at Bitcointalk

Quote from: coinflow on January 06, 2018, 06:26:09 PM

Quote from: Mooncoin_Foundation on January 06, 2018, 06:18:26 PM

Quote from: angel55 on January 06, 2018, 06:08:21 PM

I lost 57 million mooncoins from Cryptsy Sad

, reallly wish I could get those back.

I had lost many more coins at Cryptsy.

But what will be better, say, you have now 20 million coins and their price is 7 Sat.
Or you have 20+57=77 coins and their price is below 1 Sat due to dumping.
Or even worse: if coins go to the court, you have only some miserable compensation in BTC or in USD for that.

But the point is not what we want. The point is what is fair and what is really legal and wise in this situation.
In my opinion, burning coins if majority of their holders agrees with that right now, is legal and fair.

The point is, what is legal and what is not.

What is legal in one jurisdiction, could be illegal in another.
Generally laws are based on ethics and fairness.
If there is a lack of crypto laws, it's okay to act according to fairness and ethics.

These coins were already returned to the community and are in hands of our dev at the moment.
The majority of their holders decided already to burn coins.
If someone wants to get his/her coins and not burn them, even if major holders want to burn their coins, then please tell now.
But in this case he/she should have a legal proof that he/she is a legitimate owner of some amount of these coins.

Vassilis_Dev

newbie

Activity: 56

Merit: 0

Quote from: polemarhos888 on January 06, 2018, 06:42:34 PM

Quote from: Vassilis_Dev on January 06, 2018, 06:31:39 PM

Please, community forgive me for my silence!

My life 2 days now is a real nightmare!
I get pm's from threats until asking money!
I check every few minutes if anything missing from the account!
The wallet is shield with the key and are not in network from yesterday.
Now is in my law consultants hands in privacy and secured for my personal safety.

Facts:
The 1st wave started after the announcement of the new dev(me)
The 1st wave used the old wallet.(the new wasn't working - in previous post i have post the commit/fix which published 1 day after the wave)
The last wave which came to my account happened ~1 day or less after my last communication with exchangers which ask them if they can block a series of addresses/transactions.(I have no reply yet from both)(I guess I'm in their list now! Cheesy

)

Good morning ! I have a question: Do you imagine that to receive in your lucky Moon address (in your signature) some extra billion coins...?

I believe that you will do the best in this case !

You know..
Be careful what you wishing!!

angel55

full member

Activity: 630

Merit: 172

Quote from: barrysty1e on January 06, 2018, 06:38:32 PM

Quote from: angel55 on January 06, 2018, 06:36:49 PM

I would at least like to get my 57 million mooncoins back that were stolen from crypsty.

2TdPqxrJMAmbUVqUssAAKfJ7YQNtmEbtCV

http://www.cryptsysettlement.com/

Ya looks like its too late for me, I was out of crypto for a long time after losing those crypsty coins out of sheer anger. I would be ok with a verified burn and then the total supply would be lower anyways.

polemarhos888

sr. member

Activity: 499

Merit: 250

To The Moon !

Quote from: Vassilis_Dev on January 06, 2018, 06:31:39 PM

Please, community forgive me for my silence!

My life 2 days now is a real nightmare!
I get pm's from threats until asking money!
I check every few minutes if anything missing from the account!
The wallet is shield with the key and are not in network from yesterday.
Now is in my law consultants hands in privacy and secured for my personal safety.

Facts:
The 1st wave started after the announcement of the new dev(me)
The 1st wave used the old wallet.(the new wasn't working - in previous post i have post the commit/fix which published 1 day after the wave)
The last wave which came to my account happened ~1 day or less after my last communication with exchangers which ask them if they can block a series of addresses/transactions.(I have no reply yet from both)(I guess I'm in their list now! Cheesy

)

Good morning ! I have a question: Do you imagine that to receive in your lucky Moon address (in your signature) some extra billion coins...?

I believe that you will do the best in this case !

barrysty1e

hero member

Activity: 636

Merit: 516

Quote from: angel55 on January 06, 2018, 06:36:49 PM

I would at least like to get my 57 million mooncoins back that were stolen from crypsty.

2TdPqxrJMAmbUVqUssAAKfJ7YQNtmEbtCV

http://www.cryptsysettlement.com/

amdk

newbie

Activity: 5

Merit: 0

Quote from: Vassilis_Dev on January 06, 2018, 06:31:39 PM

Please, community forgive me for my silence!

My life 2 days now is a real nightmare!
I get pm's from threats until asking money!
I check every few minutes if anything missing from the account!
The wallet is shield with the key and are not in network from yesterday.
Now is in my law consultants hands in privacy and secured for my personal safety.

Facts:
The 1st wave started after the announcement of the new dev(me)
The 1st wave used the old wallet.(the new wasn't working - in previous post i have post the commit/fix which published 1 day after the wave)
The last wave which came to my account happened ~1 day or less after my last communication with exchangers which ask them if they can block a series of addresses/transactions.(I have no reply yet from both)(I guess I'm in their list now! Cheesy

)

Get in touch with Max Keiser to get some info on cryto/blockchain expert lawyer. I don't think normal lawyer will be able to handle it, but that's just my suggestion, do what you think is best for you, the community and the future of this crypto.

Topic: [MOON] Mooncoin 🌙 move to a new thread - page 112. (Read 317744 times)