Most Bitcoin will be clawed back due to widespread theft - page 4.

davidgdg

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Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 05:27:07 AM

Quote from: davidgdg on March 02, 2014, 05:24:57 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 05:02:37 AM

Quote from: davidgdg on March 02, 2014, 04:58:57 AM

The OP may be a very clever fellow but he is no lawyer and would be well advised not to opine upon subjects about which he is clearly ignorant.

My father (and I am age 48) is a very high-powered attorney. I do suggest you have several attorneys comment on this matter.

I disagree with your assertion that I am ignorant and that I should not express my educated opinions. I have posted the Wikipedia link to the law that applies to stolen property.

The biggest myopia of Bitards is they somehow think the government doesn't want to (or can't) control currency any more Roll Eyes

The government will not give up its power willingly. They will bend the rules to their favor. Only rock solid anonymity can fend off the government and Bitcoin can never have that.

Disclaimer: I am not giving legal advice, please consult your own professional. I sharing my opinions. I am not responsible for what you do after reading my opinions.

Then I suggest you ask your father if the victim of a theft has an equitable tracing remedy into a mixed fund where the new owner is a bona fide purchaser (hint - the answer is "no").

Cite case law. Otherwise you are just blowing out of your arse.

Ask your Dad

PrintMule

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FREE $50 BONUS - STAKE - [click signature]

Trying to hold btc mixer accountable is not yet possible by current laws? There's no law, which requires that particular service to keep records. Also by which jurisdiction should that service be approached, if it's based in, say, North Korea?

AnonyMint

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Quote from: davidgdg on March 02, 2014, 05:24:57 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 05:02:37 AM

Quote from: davidgdg on March 02, 2014, 04:58:57 AM

The OP may be a very clever fellow but he is no lawyer and would be well advised not to opine upon subjects about which he is clearly ignorant.

My father (and I am age 48) is a very high-powered attorney. I do suggest you have several attorneys comment on this matter.

I disagree with your assertion that I am ignorant and that I should not express my educated opinions. I have posted the Wikipedia link to the law that applies to stolen property.

The biggest myopia of Bitards is they somehow think the government doesn't want to (or can't) control currency any more Roll Eyes

The government will not give up its power willingly. They will bend the rules to their favor. Only rock solid anonymity can fend off the government and Bitcoin can never have that.

Disclaimer: I am not giving legal advice, please consult your own professional. I sharing my opinions. I am not responsible for what you do after reading my opinions.

Then I suggest you ask your father if the victim of a theft has an equitable tracing remedy into a mixed fund where the new owner is a bona fide purchaser (hint - the answer is "no").

Cite case law. Otherwise you are just blowing out of your arse.

davidgdg

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Activity: 552

Merit: 501

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 05:02:37 AM

Quote from: davidgdg on March 02, 2014, 04:58:57 AM

The OP may be a very clever fellow but he is no lawyer and would be well advised not to opine upon subjects about which he is clearly ignorant.

My father (and I am age 48) is a very high-powered attorney. I do suggest you have several attorneys comment on this matter.

I disagree with your assertion that I am ignorant and that I should not express my educated opinions. I have posted the Wikipedia link to the law that applies to stolen property.

The biggest myopia of Bitards is they somehow think the government doesn't want to (or can't) control currency any more Roll Eyes

The government will not give up its power willingly. They will bend the rules to their favor. Only rock solid anonymity can fend off the government and Bitcoin can never have that.

Disclaimer: I am not giving legal advice, please consult your own professional. I sharing my opinions. I am not responsible for what you do after reading my opinions.

Then I suggest you ask your father if the victim of a theft has an equitable tracing remedy into a mixed fund where the new owner is a bona fide purchaser (hint - the answer is "no").

AnonyMint

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 521

Quote from: mannie on March 02, 2014, 05:09:40 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 03:51:38 AM

Quote from: mannie on March 02, 2014, 02:56:58 AM

And how do you think restitution of stolen bitcoins, radically dispersed around the globe, will work across multiple national borders?

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5454129

Ah, so bizarre conspiracy theories and crystal ball predictions about a world government. That's what will lead to restitution. Okay. I'm out.

Before I go, it's much more likely governments will seek to simply shut down all exchanges with inadequate security much like they have done with copyright infringement.

Why would the government shut down the greatest global tracking device ever invented.

You Bitards have tunnel vision. All you can see is $1,000,000. Your greedy salivation is shutting down your pre-frontal cortex.

mannie

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Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 03:51:38 AM

Quote from: mannie on March 02, 2014, 02:56:58 AM

And how do you think restitution of stolen bitcoins, radically dispersed around the globe, will work across multiple national borders?

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5454129

Ah, so bizarre conspiracy theories and crystal ball predictions about a world government. That's what will lead to restitution. Okay. I'm out.

Before I go, it's much more likely governments will seek to simply shut down all exchanges with inadequate security much like they have done with copyright infringement. You don't see everyone who downloaded Game of Thrones being hauled before the courts. Law enforcement is too busy trying to shut down Pirate Bay. Restitution from the early days of bitcoin, before exchange security, won't be a priority. They didn't chase down Joseph Kennedy after they cracked down on insider trading.

AnonyMint

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Activity: 518

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Quote from: davidgdg on March 02, 2014, 04:58:57 AM

The OP may be a very clever fellow but he is no lawyer and would be well advised not to opine upon subjects about which he is clearly ignorant.

My father (and I am age 48) is a very high-powered attorney. I do suggest you have several attorneys comment on this matter.

I disagree with your assertion that I am ignorant and that I should not express my educated opinions. I have posted the Wikipedia link to the law that applies to stolen property.

The biggest myopia of Bitards is they somehow think the government doesn't want to (or can't) control currency any more Roll Eyes

The government will not give up its power willingly. They will bend the rules to their favor. Only rock solid anonymity can fend off the government and Bitcoin can never have that.

Disclaimer: I am not giving legal advice, please consult your own professional. I sharing my opinions. I am not responsible for what you do after reading my opinions.

davidgdg

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Activity: 552

Merit: 501

The OP may be a very clever fellow but he is no lawyer and would be well advised not to opine upon subjects about which he is clearly ignorant.

Zarathustra

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Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 04:51:53 AM

...and 47% unemployment due to contagion with Knowledge Age technological unemployment (see Economic Devastation thread) will for about 10 - 20 years implode the Industrial Age economy.

But this will not last forever. The Knowledge Age will march on and be much greater in production.

You are a dreamer. A debt collapse of the society means mad max and dark age, but not only 47 % unemployment. Ridiculous.

AnonyMint

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Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:49:38 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 04:45:22 AM

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:35:25 AM

Patriarchy (= ever growing debt/society/economy enforced by organized violence by priests and militarists, aka the state) startet some thousand years earlier, you idiot. But it will stop.

Economic growth will stop forever. Hahaha. Yeah right. Talk about looney cookie.

Of course it will. The decadent citizen as a 'living' cartoon of the human is an evolutionary cul-de-sac. If you can't see it, your problem.

The $150 trillion global debt collapse...

http://www.gfmag.com/tools/global-database/economic-data/11855-total-debt-to-gdp.html#axzz2iu5C4Y4Z
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.3902083

...and 47% unemployment due to contagion with Knowledge Age technological unemployment (see Economic Devastation thread) will for about 10 - 20 years implode the Industrial Age economy.

But this will not last forever. The Knowledge Age will march on and be much greater in production.

Zarathustra

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Activity: 1162

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Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 04:45:22 AM

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:35:25 AM

Patriarchy (= ever growing debt/society/economy enforced by organized violence by priests and militarists, aka the state) startet some thousand years earlier, you idiot. But it will stop.

Economic growth will stop forever. Hahaha. Yeah right. Talk about looney cookie.

Of course it will. The decadent citizen as a 'living' cartoon of the former human is an evolutionary cul-de-sac. If you can't see it, your problem.

AnonyMint

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Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:45:37 AM

I dont need you for that. Non-paranoid cypherpunks already confirmed it to me.

Bullshit.

Zarathustra

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Merit: 1004

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 04:26:14 AM

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

Most insiders and heroes here dont share your conspiracy theories.

I didn't say they do. I said they do speculate the Satoshi was NSA. Don't conflate two orthogonal things.

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

I'm not a cypherpunk

I am.

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

but I am nevertheless able to handle a device which can't being linked to myself.

Tell me more about your method, so I can tell you why you are technically ignorant of the fact that you are linked by the NSA.

I dont need you for that. Non-paranoid cypherpunks already confirmed it to me.

AnonyMint

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Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:35:25 AM

Patriarchy (= ever growing debt/society/economy enforced by organized violence by priests and militarists, aka the state) startet some thousand years earlier, you idiot. But it will stop.

Economic growth will stop forever. Hahaha. Yeah right. Talk about looney cookie.

Zarathustra

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Merit: 1004

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 04:26:14 AM

Since you've confirmed you are Malthusian idiot such as the Luddites, I can now dismiss you as delusional.

Btw, the economy and society have continued to grow since Mesopotamia until now. That won't stop.

Patriarchy (= ever growing debt/society/economy enforced by organized violence by priests and militarists, aka the state) startet some thousand years earlier, you idiot. But it will stop.

AnonyMint

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Activity: 518

Merit: 521

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

Most insiders and heroes here dont share your conspiracy theories.

I didn't say they do. I said they do speculate the Satoshi was NSA. Don't conflate two orthogonal things.

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

I'm not a cypherpunk

I am.

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

but I am nevertheless able to handle a device which can't being linked to myself.

Tell me more about your method, so I can tell you why you are technically ignorant of the fact that you are linked by the NSA.

I know of only two current ways to be truly anonymous. That is to access the internet from either netcafe with no cameras or from a mobile device for which you have not registered you id, and which you have not used for any other purpose (and remember the device has an id too, not just the simmpak). And you need to be careful about being recorded on the numerous cameras and ways of tracking your location, e.g. license plate tracking and every car now has tracking secretly built in. Because wireless device location can be pinpointed with triangularization.

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

As I've read in other threads (in your totalitarian 'self-moderated(!) thread and the mad max thread) you dont understand the concept of society, economy, debt and growth.

Hahaha. You are referring to these threads:

Economic Devastation

Mad Max outcome

"Failure to Understand Bitcoin Could Cost Investors Billions" (Bitcoin's flaws)

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

You think the hypercomplex society/economy (that came about solely on the basis of additional debt which is enforced by organized violence of the state) could be maintained in a barter world where crypto currencies replace growing debt. This is mickey mouse economics.

I never said that. You have reading comprehension problems. Perhaps you didn't read my other thread, where I stated that currency is fundamental to the maximum division-of-labor.

No Money Exists Without the Majority

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 04:10:40 AM

Cryptographics will destroy society/economy. That's the reason why I support it. I dont support it for the purpose of maintaining an endlessly rampant growing economy.

Since you've confirmed you are Malthusian idiot such as the Luddites, I can now dismiss you as delusional.

Btw, the economy and society have continued to grow since Mesopotamia until now. That won't stop.

Zarathustra

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Activity: 1162

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Quote from: AnonyMint on March 02, 2014, 03:39:35 AM

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 02:32:00 AM

The bitcoin community and the government dont know the identity of satoshi, the most famous bitcoiner. How is that possible, if bitcoin can't be used anonymously?

Best guess is NSA = Satoshi. Ask any insider privately. They all tell me this.

Even if that isn't true, you have no way to know if the NSA knows who Satoshi is.

Also block chain analysis seems to indicate he hasn't spent any of his Bitcoins, and who was recording IP addresses in Utah in 2009. It is 2014 now.

Most insiders and heroes here dont share your conspiracy theories.
I'm not a cypherpunk but I am nevertheless able to handle a device which can't be linked to myself.

As I've read in other threads (in your totalitarian 'self-moderated(!) thread and the mad max thread) you dont understand the concept of society, economy, debt and growth. You think the hypercomplex society/economy (that came about solely on the basis of additional debt which is enforced by organized violence of the state) could be maintained in a barter world where crypto currencies replace growing debt. This is mickey mouse economics.
A barter economy is austrian science fiction and did never exist in the real world. Stateless, unruled humans are not doing business, since they are (have been) self-sufficient.

Cryptographics will destroy society/economy. That's the reason why I support it. I dont support it for the purpose of maintaining an endlessly rampant growing economy/society.

Sorry for my poor English. It is not my language.

AnonyMint

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Quote from: mannie on March 02, 2014, 02:56:58 AM

And how do you think restitution of stolen bitcoins, radically dispersed around the globe, will work across multiple national borders?

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5454129

AnonyMint

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 521

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on March 02, 2014, 02:37:34 AM

First, as its been stated elsewhere, clawbacks
aint gonna happen as there is legal precedent
that values accepted in good faith aren't
subject to "clawbacks"...

You are ignorant of the legal system and the principle of Nemo dat quod non habet.

AnonyMint

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Activity: 518

Merit: 521

Quote from: Zarathustra on March 02, 2014, 02:32:00 AM

The bitcoin community and the government dont know the identity of satoshi, the most famous bitcoiner. How is that possible, if bitcoin can't be used anonymously?

Best guess is NSA = Satoshi. Ask any insider privately. They all tell me this.

Even if that isn't true, you have no way to know if the NSA knows who Satoshi is.

Also block chain analysis seems to indicate he hasn't spent any of his Bitcoins, and who was recording IP addresses in Utah in 2009. It is 2014 now.

Topic: Most Bitcoin will be clawed back due to widespread theft - page 4. (Read 14504 times)