Topic: 📈 NastyFans: The Bitcoin Enthusiast Fan Club (est. 2012) - page 9. (Read 959381 times)

Again, please re-read what I said - I did not pay taxes until 2018. That is when I started mining again, after quitting near end of 2011 and back then, it was not taxable. If I recall, in 2014 is when the IRS made the distinction that bitcoin was classified as property and taxable. I keep/kept saying 2018 as that related to me. I did not once state that was when taxation started. I think the only other reference I made to time was that possibly it was not taxable when they bought their seats - I state that because I do not know when the seats were sold or when this venture began. If I recall you started with a gpu so it had to be a while back.

Yup.  They are paid weekly despite claims made by individuals on this thread.  You can view the weekly payouts here: https://nastyfans.org/distribution.summary.csv

My offer of a buyback was with all of our savings so they could claim any BTC they feel is theirs.

I totally agree that when you get paid in BTC it is taxable at that Fiat rate at the time of payment (I even stated that is how I handle my mining revenue) Re-read what I said - I claim the USD value at the time it is mined (when I get paid from the pool) and then I also claim the loss/gain when I convert it.


Are the seat holders actually paid yet? Can they convert the BTC they have earned right now?

Also - I believe when most of them bought seats - BTC was not taxable. I know it was not taxable when I was mining in 2010 or 2011. 2018 was the first year I had to pay taxes on any crypto earnings.

I am not attempting to spread any misinformation. I just don't see this as being an advantageous investment for any one involved. It would have been a better investment to simply hodl their BTC and to never have bought a seat. That one individual would then have 1.6 BTC now instead of 0.00950615 BTC. For someone simply hodl'ing from way back then, they would not owe any taxes until they cashed it out.

I see that you are in disagreement though and feel that collecting that much BTC back then and having only a small fraction of it now is still somehow a gain. I will refrain from asking any more questions or posting any more comments.

all other things aside, you should be compensated for the cost of operation. So, 100% of all mining revenue goes to the seats (minus what goes to nastymining)?


If they were to invest BTC as BTC and they lost BTC, it could be claimed as a loss. If they were to invest BTC by converting it to Fiat and it lost value in relation to BTC but gained value as Fiat, they would owe tax on the Fiat gains - because it was Fiat not BTC. In these people's cases, they gave you BTC and they are getting a return in BTC - at no point did they convert the BTC to Fiat nor are they getting a return in Fiat. So, to have paid 1.6 BTC and have only 0.00950615 BTC in returns is a loss. If they were to cash out now (get no further disbursements) and convert the 0.00950615 BTC to Fiat, yes, they would pay taxes on the 0.00950615 BTC. I am pretty sure for investment purposes (I could very well be wrong), it is not taxable until one converts it to Fiat.

Personally, I am not an investor with my BTC, I get mine thru mining and as a miner I have to claim the value of the BTC at the time it is mined, and then claim the loss/gain when I convert it.
My RL job pays me in Fiat, at which time I then convert it 100% to BTC. I use BTC to pay for everything I can and when I cannot use BTC, I convert it back to Fiat. At every conversion, I either owe tax for any gains, or I can file a loss if the value is lower. I add all that up at the end of the year. Have done this for my taxes since 2018.

OgNasty, you need to address the ongoing liability Nastyfans may have should you lose your assets to a actual charity.  Eventually every coin you have may be seized unless you show any proof I outted or exposed or admitted or claimed I was a pedophile.   Those rumors you started helped contribute to my mental illness, my drinking problem and my stroke.   At the same time, I have said nasty things about you, but none were untrue to me.

Take advantage of OG's buy back offer while the illegal shares are still worth anything.

ibminer, why don't you take advantage and sell your 1.6 BTC worth of seats?  That's less than 1/10th of his buy back offer.  

Nope.  All electricity costs have always come out of my own pocket.  I know it seems odd that people would attack someone for running miners for others behalf and paying all the associated costs for them, but that's literally what is occurring here.



This is a dangerous statement that could potentially land you in big trouble with the tax reporting agencies in your country.  If you claim a loss of funds to your government's tax agency the way people claim it on this thread, you will likely face penalty as you should be claiming your fiat gains.  Stating otherwise is a dangerous claim that could land people in hot water if they listen to you, so be careful.



They went from $1.54 to over $30 all while paying weekly distributions.  I don't see that as the price of seats going down.  No other reasonable person, vendor, or agency would either.  You are wrong, but I do urge you to claim the loss on your taxes and see what happens.  Would be great to see you put your money where your mouth is and accept the consequences for once rather than troll me.

A couple of things about this comparison:
*A car is a deprecating asset. A car gives utility (the ability to quickly move from point A to point B), which over time, removes the value of said asset. Except in unusual circumstances, someone buying a car is doing so for the utility, not for the hope of it increasing in value.
*I think most reasonable people who invested in NastyFans expected to have returns in terms of BTC, not USD. This is true for all investors in mining equipment. Mining equipment is illiquid, and as such is going to generate higher than /BTC returns for people to continue to invest in mining equipment, otherwise people would simply invest in bitcoin.

I think some reflection as to why NastyFans has performed the way it has since its inception is in order. What happened to cause the price of seats to go down so much? Like cars, mining equipment is a deprecating asset because they will generate less revenue over time as the difficulty increases, however mining investors expect the mining revenue to make up for the lost value in the miners.

ok - I was unclear if the agreement allowed you to keep any portion of the revenue being generated. Are you compensated for the cost to run the miners?

as for the ROI aspect, until the seats are worth more BTC than they cost (being worth more USD is irrelevant) the ROI is negative.

It's actually the opposite.  The last vote on donation % was to increase the amount given to seats.  I also don't take anything for myself from mining rewards.  They're all sent directly to NastyFans.  I buy seats and get payouts the same as everyone else.  The fact you could even think I have taken a penny for myself from this organization when I've donated hundreds of BTC to it and paid electricity out of my pocket for nearly a decade shows the level of disinformation being pushed.

The way I'm criticized for my involvement with NastyFans, I have to wonder...  Do you guys want me to just stop mining on behalf of NastyFans?  What is your goal with these attacks?  Do you want me to stop spending my time trying to raise funds for seats and move on to other projects where I'm more appreciated?  I've already made a nearly million dollar buyback offer for anyone who wants to cash in their seats at a massive profit to their issued price.  It seems like people commenting here want to push false narratives and spread lies about me and NastyFans.  What is the goal?  Is that goal for your own petty revenge because you blame Bitcoin vendors for accepting your BTC and keeping you from getting rich, or are you trying to help NastyFans members grow this organization like they got involved to do?  Maybe if I understood the motivations behind these attacks, I could help you get some sort of satisfaction other than knowing you helped me buy back a ton of seats at well below their fair value.  If there's a better way to unlock value for NastyFans members than I have been doing without expecting things from me you wouldn't expect from all NastyFans members, I'd love to hear it.  

The question was based on an accusation you could not state a fact. 

It seems clear that Elon Musk did not take a portion of your BTC purchase to build up a BTC mining operation and offer weekly BTC returns, so again, I don't see this as the same thing.

I believe I have been stating facts.. unless that question was for Og?

ib, don't let him distract you with value vs quantity.  Different things.    


ib, can you say your current nastyfan seats are worth the 1.6 btc you paid?   Is something restricting you from stating facts?

Open letter to OgNasty

when you bought the Tesla for 6.59229 BTC did you give them BTC or did you cash out 6.59229 BTC for USD and give Tesla the USD? If so, your truck has lost no value as it is the worth the same amount of USD - give or take.

In this scenario, they gave you BTC and expect ROI in BTC, your goal was to return them BTC - the fact that BTC is worth more or even it was worth less USD is irrelevant - their BTC investment should be worth more BTC than when they gave it to you.

It sounds like since BTC has gone up in value the decision was to give the seats less BTC because it is "worth more USD" that way you could keep the majority of BTC for yourself? I could be wrong - I have not seen the books to know if 100% of the mining rewards (minus the agreed upon percentage that goes to you) has gone to the seats or not.

If the full amount that should have gone to the seats has gone to the seats, then it was a bad investment based on the actual BTC return to date. They would have been better to invest it elsewhere or to just HODL it.

A good example would be the individual who paid 1.65 BTC and has received/earned only 0.00950615 BTC in return. that is a loss of 1.64049385 BTC

Great news!  We were able to have our non-functional board repaired free of cost by one of our fellow helpful NastyFans members!  Our S17Pro is back to mining at full capacity and I'm sure this will help resale value along with higher donations if it continues to operate normally. 

S19's are in pretty high demand still.  They're currently selling for 3x the retail price and if you want to pay retail they are sold out.  If you were able to get an order in with Bitmain you would be waiting more than 6 months for delivery.  For these reasons we're still plugging away with what we have and enjoying the increased value of BTC in our savings while we wait for the right opportunity for expansion. 

You’re wrong. It’s ok that you’re wrong. I can see why you want to ignore the Tesla example as it is easier to attack me than Tesla, but you cannot say NastyFans seats have lost value without also claiming Teslas sold for BTC have also experienced the same massive loss of value. It’s an idiotic stance to take in real world practice, and it is no different here. I feel like I owe it to people to say that if you try to claim a loss on the purchase of seats while they have gained value then you will likely run into problems with your government and personal finances. It is beyond irresponsible to push the loss of value false narrative for that reason and your incorrect comments could potentially be damaging to those who believe them. It is quite obvious you are in the wrong here and I would like to request you make your own thread to push your false narratives.



“Tesla is scamming! Look what they’ve done to my BTC investment! Elon Musk is a scammer!”

Yup, you sound that stupid...

First, I do not care about your truck purchase, spare me the ego trip. And this is certainly not the same thing as taking in BTC investments for a BTC mining group which offers weekly BTC returns.

Again, I'm not talking about "any BTC project, service, or good". I'm talking about a mining organization that took investments with the intent to return weekly distributions of BTC. Thus, a "return on investment" should be measured in BTC.

---

I technically paid 1.65... but as mentioned, to try and be as fair as possible here, I cut out some of the initial purchase because I did get an asset out of it (which I have to assume is real silver), but certainly no matter which way you cut the price up, even a basic online seat at that time wouldn't be anywhere near 100%, let alone 125%.

The 'donation' was apparently going to a guy who's purpose was to get BTC into the hands of NastyFans. Now he acts like his purpose was to get USD to NastyFans. 

As I've posted before, I lost hope a while ago on ever getting my BTC back out of this, but I just can't sit here and see Og claiming "125% ROI" on something I'm a part of, and not express any concerns.

I posted this in my Tesla thread but it seems appropriate as a response here. Claiming you’ve lost money because something you purchased didn’t rise in value as much as BTC is not only wrong, it’s an attack you could make against any BTC project, service, or good, and doing so makes you an enemy to anyone engaging in any of those activities (e.g. anyone who actually uses Bitcoin). Literally everything in the world “lost value” measured in BTC. Using that as a way to attack this project is not only dishonest, it’s an insult to people who understand basic finance and an attack on all those that actually accept Bitcoin.

So you paid 1.65 BTC and received a return of 0.0095 BTC?  That would be a ROI of 0.5%, or a loss of 99% of your money
If you had not used the nastyfans service, you would have been whole. What value did that forced donation provide to you?

I also noticed the way he deflected as if you had thanked him.  Since this ponzi has not been timed out by limitations, you should file a complaint about his ICO to the SEC.  :/

Thanks. I ended up voting no. I believe any lottery run here will not end well for me, or most seat holders, and this will likely benefit only the larger seat holders.

Looks like the latest statistics are now showing:

no: 1038 (6.4%)
yes: 1891 (11.6%)