I'm getting sick of the blame-game. The entire value of Bitcoin (or any other cryptocurrency) rests on these types of issues being resolved. All this mud-throwing business isn't helping.
Mt.Gox is blaming the core-devs while they *could* implement a fix (apparently) and keep their business running. Even if a fix isn't as simple, the way communication has been nothing but blaming someone else makes people loose trust. Mt.Gox is running a very profitable business so they should be pushing and pulling for sollutions. Working together with devs instead of alienating them.
On the other hand devs and other bitcoin entrepeneurs have been quick to slag off Mt.Gox and it's CEO in particular. The only result is fueling critisism to either party. The core-dev group has taken a huge responsibility and should take this seriously.
While i'm sure exchanges and devs are working on a fix together, that part isn't as public as it should be. Seeking the media (like todays article on Forbes) is not constructive. Keeping the public updated on any progress would help regain trust. After all, we all want Bitcoin to succeed as a viable payment option. Problems like these can happen but businesses will only get into cryptocurrencies if these types of problems are resolved in a professional manner. The stability needs to be guaranteed. This week will go down in bitcoin-history as a black one and it will be remembered and referenced to whenever any other problems occur in the future. If this drags on any longer the public trust will dive down to zero and we're back to a cool but useless cryptocurrency, used by geeks and criminals.
Topic: New Mt Gox Press Release - Feb 10 - they are claiming flaw in bitcoin protocol ! - page 2. (Read 33066 times)
February 13, 2014, 07:52:07 AM
February 12, 2014, 10:40:33 AM
Agreed ...the jury is still VERY much out that this is a systemic problem affecting anyone but GOX
Bitstamp are just check to confirm due to the mud being flung by GOX
Bitstamp are just check to confirm due to the mud being flung by GOX
I do believe it's a widespread problem, but not systemic. It isn't inherent to the protocol. It's just a best practices thing where less-than-best has become very common. Some (Bitstamp) are responding sensibly to it, while others (the Magic the Gathering folks) are spreading FUD and trying to cover their ass.
I think we can see which response has better results already.
February 12, 2014, 07:57:10 AM
I send PM to Vircurex 
asking them would they do something before they get attacked.
Let see what is going to be in reply
I will post it later if they answer
asking them would they do something before they get attacked.
Let see what is going to be in reply
I will post it later if they answer
February 12, 2014, 12:13:58 AM
looks like the devs tried to defend themselves too quickly.
are people going to go after btce and bitstamp now?
are people going to go after btce and bitstamp now?
Why would they? Is Bitstamp blaming everyone but itself, while making terrorist threats to hold customer funds forever unless other people meet their demands?
No, they're doing what Gox SHOULD have done. Implementing a fix immediately without whining and crying and pointing fingers everywhere but themselves.
Agreed ...the jury is still VERY much out that this is a systemic problem affecting anyone but GOX
Bitstamp are just check to confirm due to the mud being flung by GOX
Also it seems strange how the DDOS attacks are upon the other exchanges ..... great time for GOX to buy some cheap BTC ......all coincidence of course ..lol
February 11, 2014, 10:11:17 PM
looks like the devs tried to defend themselves too quickly.
are people going to go after btce and bitstamp now?
are people going to go after btce and bitstamp now?
Why would they? Is Bitstamp blaming everyone but itself, while making terrorist threats to hold customer funds forever unless other people meet their demands?
No, they're doing what Gox SHOULD have done. Implementing a fix immediately without whining and crying and pointing fingers everywhere but themselves.
February 11, 2014, 06:38:11 PM
hopefully he rather understands them very well and made a killing for the company to replace the lost coins....
but am sure he blames everything on bitcoins flaw so he needed to do some insider trading for his own or for by him
controlled accounts.......ripping off the whole community and magically disappearing when being held accountable !
-----THAT ARE THE BITCOINFOUNDATIONS BOARD SHENANIGANS TO PROMOTE BITCOIN AND SERVE THE COMMUNITY---
KEEPING QUIET FOR CRIMINAL INSIDER TRADING !
but am sure he blames everything on bitcoins flaw so he needed to do some insider trading for his own or for by him
controlled accounts.......ripping off the whole community and magically disappearing when being held accountable !
-----THAT ARE THE BITCOINFOUNDATIONS BOARD SHENANIGANS TO PROMOTE BITCOIN AND SERVE THE COMMUNITY---
KEEPING QUIET FOR CRIMINAL INSIDER TRADING !
February 11, 2014, 03:20:39 PM
looks like the devs tried to defend themselves too quickly.
are people going to go after btce and bitstamp now?
looks like it's a PR stunt/nightmare for everyone. including the devs.
guess there was more truth in gox's statement than people care to give them credit for.
(i'm not saying that they aren't incompetent by all means)
don't worry 99%+ of all bitcoins should still be there
are people going to go after btce and bitstamp now?
looks like it's a PR stunt/nightmare for everyone. including the devs.
guess there was more truth in gox's statement than people care to give them credit for.
(i'm not saying that they aren't incompetent by all means)
don't worry 99%+ of all bitcoins should still be there
I think the problem people have with Gox is the way they handled the announcement and also the havoc it caused in the Bitcoin markets afterwards which could have been avoided. Their long-winded announcement went into a lot of technical detail about the transaction malleability flaw. Most traders are non-technical users of Bitcoin and would assume after reading the announcement that Bitcoin was broken. Sure enough, the announcement caused the flash crashes only minutes after release at Btc-e and Bitfinex resulting in millions of dollar losses from panic and margin calls.
This resulting panic in the markets could have been easily avoided had the announcement been reworded differently in a less dramatic fashion. You only need to read the first 2 paragraphs and immediately you suspect some serious flaw in Bitcoin. Less emphasis should have been made on all the details of the flaw, we are not to blame, more emphasis on that Bitcoin is not broken, this issue is not major, everyones funds are safe, we apologize to our customers for long delays etc... The devs were right to say that Bitcoin is not broken in order to prevent FUD from spreading and reaching the mainstream media with damaging articles where average joes would use this as another reason to avoid Bitcoin. Thanks to the devs a lot of the articles out there emphasize that this is a minor flaw and solutions can be easily implemented.
Mark Karpeles may understand technical issues well, but when it comes understanding investor and traders psychology and the huge impact these announcements will have on the Bitcoin markets, he either doesn't seem to have a clue or simply doesn't care (negligence).
February 11, 2014, 01:34:16 PM
looks like the devs tried to defend themselves too quickly.
are people going to go after btce and bitstamp now?
looks like it's a PR stunt/nightmare for everyone. including the devs.
guess there was more truth in gox's statement than people care to give them credit for.
(i'm not saying that they aren't incompetent by all means)
don't worry 99%+ of all bitcoins should still be there
are people going to go after btce and bitstamp now?
looks like it's a PR stunt/nightmare for everyone. including the devs.
guess there was more truth in gox's statement than people care to give them credit for.
(i'm not saying that they aren't incompetent by all means)
don't worry 99%+ of all bitcoins should still be there
February 11, 2014, 01:28:37 PM
CRAZy WEEk 
February 11, 2014, 01:14:35 PM
Bitstamp made an announcement:
Quote
Dear Bitstamp users
Bitstamp’s exchange software is extremely cautious concerning Bitcoin transactions. Currently it has suspended processing Bitcoin withdrawals due to inconsistent results reported by our bitcoind wallet, caused by a denial-of-service attack using transaction malleability to temporarily disrupt balance checking. As such, Bitcoin withdrawal processing will be suspended temporarily until a software fix is issued.
No funds have been lost and no funds are at risk.
This is a denial-of-service attack made possible by some misunderstandings in Bitcoin wallet implementations. These misunderstandings have simple solutions that are being implemented as we speak, and we're confident everything will be back to normal shortly.
Withdrawals which failed on the 10th and 11th of February will be canceled and the amounts added back to the customer account balances.
We will communicate any further developments regarding this issue.
Thank you for your understanding!
Best regards
Bitstamp team
Bitstamp’s exchange software is extremely cautious concerning Bitcoin transactions. Currently it has suspended processing Bitcoin withdrawals due to inconsistent results reported by our bitcoind wallet, caused by a denial-of-service attack using transaction malleability to temporarily disrupt balance checking. As such, Bitcoin withdrawal processing will be suspended temporarily until a software fix is issued.
No funds have been lost and no funds are at risk.
This is a denial-of-service attack made possible by some misunderstandings in Bitcoin wallet implementations. These misunderstandings have simple solutions that are being implemented as we speak, and we're confident everything will be back to normal shortly.
Withdrawals which failed on the 10th and 11th of February will be canceled and the amounts added back to the customer account balances.
We will communicate any further developments regarding this issue.
Thank you for your understanding!
Best regards
Bitstamp team
February 11, 2014, 12:12:19 PM
Err, Bitcoin still works great today, Gox 
February 11, 2014, 10:18:31 AM
but be careful as you just need to sell them again a bit cheaper cause withdrawls begin to get stuck there as well 
February 11, 2014, 08:29:01 AM
Wow...
btw do you think the price will go down even more? im thinking about moving my money to bitstamp (in USD) tp buy more bitcoins... Whats the possibility that gox doesnt have all the BTC it claims (fractional banking appliedto BTC exchange)?
btw do you think the price will go down even more? im thinking about moving my money to bitstamp (in USD) tp buy more bitcoins... Whats the possibility that gox doesnt have all the BTC it claims (fractional banking appliedto BTC exchange)?
price mght go down and might go up too
It is realy hard to say for 100% what is going to be.For now on it seems going back to where it was before this messy weekend.
I guess you can buy some more at bitstamp, if I would be you I would do that.
February 11, 2014, 07:43:01 AM
Wow...
btw do you think the price will go down even more? im thinking about moving my money to bitstamp (in USD) tp buy more bitcoins... Whats the possibility that gox doesnt have all the BTC it claims (fractional banking appliedto BTC exchange)?
btw do you think the price will go down even more? im thinking about moving my money to bitstamp (in USD) tp buy more bitcoins... Whats the possibility that gox doesnt have all the BTC it claims (fractional banking appliedto BTC exchange)?
February 11, 2014, 07:24:27 AM
MtGox caused havoc in the markets today with their dramatically worded and damaging announcement. They diverted blame from themselves and placed the full blame on the Bitcoin protocol and making a minor technical issue (that already existed for years) seem like a critical widespread panic issue by the way the announcement was started and worded throughout. Most traders are non-technical users and their first reaction would be to panic after reading such a statement. Up to 15,000 bitcoins were dumped down to 102 at Btc-e on this news resulting in millions of dollars lost. Bitfinex also had thousands of BTC dumped down to 100, mainly margin liquidations. I would be surprised if the MtGox CEO did not know beforehand the effects and impact and knock on effects that such an announcement would have on traders and on the markets in all exchanges. It is amazing and scary how one person could have had such an influence in the marketplace.
Mark and/or his friends could have easily sold bitcoins on the other exchanges such as Btc-e or Bitfinex and placed low buyback orders before making the announcement. They could have set up accounts with fake details, Tor etc. Hundreds, maybe thousands of bitcoins could have been bought back for cheap netting them potentially in excess of $1m+ gain on the traders panic.
It is no longer simply a case of being Goxed again and joke about it like in 2011 or 2012. We are now dealing with very serious amounts of money, millions of dollars worth of bitcoins were made and lost on this single announcement across all exchanges not only MtGox.
I am not even a customer of MtGox (I left them a year ago), yet I have been adversely affected (as have thousands of other non-Gox exchange users) by their negligence and adverse affect their announcement has had on the other exchanges namely Bitfinex and Btc-e. The other exchanges are operating fine and do not have the same technical issues that Gox is facing. Yet, MtGox goes and ahead and basically says that the issue affects everyone else:
Bulls***
Mark and/or his friends could have easily sold bitcoins on the other exchanges such as Btc-e or Bitfinex and placed low buyback orders before making the announcement. They could have set up accounts with fake details, Tor etc. Hundreds, maybe thousands of bitcoins could have been bought back for cheap netting them potentially in excess of $1m+ gain on the traders panic.
It is no longer simply a case of being Goxed again and joke about it like in 2011 or 2012. We are now dealing with very serious amounts of money, millions of dollars worth of bitcoins were made and lost on this single announcement across all exchanges not only MtGox.
I am not even a customer of MtGox (I left them a year ago), yet I have been adversely affected (as have thousands of other non-Gox exchange users) by their negligence and adverse affect their announcement has had on the other exchanges namely Bitfinex and Btc-e. The other exchanges are operating fine and do not have the same technical issues that Gox is facing. Yet, MtGox goes and ahead and basically says that the issue affects everyone else:
its not only gox------ all exchanges don´t have no more the real BTC´s....alll raided the same way....the digits there are just that- digits- not to be withdrawn anymore.....
Cheers
Cheers
Bulls***
REALLY ?
quote from another thread :
Hm, wonder if this explains why I've heard all other exchanges updating their systems as well. I believe this mutability issue is not as "insignificant" as the core dev team is attempting to convey.
Yes, the problem may be sperading. I have been waiting more than three hours now for the withdrawal of the rest of my BTC from Bitstamp. #bitcoin-otc is full of other people with the same problem. Anyone else experiencing problems withdrawing BTC from other exchanges today? The withdrawal is marked "Finished" in my Bitstamp transaction history. I have tried to contact support there, but no answer yet.
BTC-e...not working properly anymore as well......
February 11, 2014, 04:36:08 AM
Still trying to align the fact in my own head, that, the Bitcoin Foundation felt compelled to post a clarification of a companies press release, whos CEO of said company just happens to sit on the same Foundations board.
Are we finally going to see a shift away from the amateur old guard soon?
Are we finally going to see a shift away from the amateur old guard soon?
February 11, 2014, 04:30:04 AM
Once Gox re-enable withdrawals, it will just be an empty shell.
And if not ? What if they rly say sorry, we just did the lehmann broth. move.
How will this affect the market ?
How many btc are gone then ? 50k ?
February 11, 2014, 04:26:40 AM
I personally consider the Gox show is over 
BitStamp and BTC-e are both trading around $700 and Gox has hovering around $600.
I am so glad the market has decoupled from Gox.
I just hope the less informed bitcoin holders will read up on the transaction malleability issue
and realise Gox is just shifting blame blame with a feeble excuse.
Once Gox re-enable withdrawals, it will just be an empty shell.
R.I.P Gox
BitStamp and BTC-e are both trading around $700 and Gox has hovering around $600.
I am so glad the market has decoupled from Gox.
I just hope the less informed bitcoin holders will read up on the transaction malleability issue
and realise Gox is just shifting blame blame with a feeble excuse.
Once Gox re-enable withdrawals, it will just be an empty shell.
R.I.P Gox
considering that yesterday's price slump is already rectifying itself, i'd say the market has already turned it's back on gox, having realised what utter crap of information they have been feeding us.
goodnight gox, it was nice knowing you.
February 11, 2014, 04:20:14 AM
I personally consider the Gox show is over
BitStamp and BTC-e are both trading around $700 and Gox has hovering around $600.
I am so glad the market has decoupled from Gox.
I just hope the less informed bitcoin holders will read up on the transaction malleability issue
and realise Gox is just shifting blame blame with a feeble excuse.
Once Gox re-enable withdrawals, it will just be an empty shell.
R.I.P Gox
BitStamp and BTC-e are both trading around $700 and Gox has hovering around $600.
I am so glad the market has decoupled from Gox.
I just hope the less informed bitcoin holders will read up on the transaction malleability issue
and realise Gox is just shifting blame blame with a feeble excuse.
Once Gox re-enable withdrawals, it will just be an empty shell.
R.I.P Gox
February 11, 2014, 01:37:59 AM
Not entirely. A shitload went for prices ranging from $600 to $102. ALL open buy orders in that range were filled, only the few at the very bottom went for $102.
Dang, that really makes me wish I'd had a standing buy order setup for some ridiculously low price.
But then you would have to use Gox and you wouldnt get your money or bitcoins back
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