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Topic: NFTs in the Bitcoin blockchain - Ordinal Theory - page 14. (Read 9195 times)

legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823

And isn't it ironic that we like to compare the penetration of Bitcoin to the Internet, smartphones, tv, etc and we tend to forget every single one of them become widespread when it became affordable for the average Joe?


By "we", you mean who? I don't think everyone has the same definition, opinion or understanding of Bitcoin. Bitcoin for some people, and the way it's designed, is a kind of tool that can weaken and break down political strongholds, not a tool for personal finance like PayPal.


Quote

2. On long term, would usage of Ordinals have good impact on Bitcoin price?


The question perhaps should be, "Would Ordinals usage increase and therefore increase the demand for block space"? If the answer is "Yes", then I believe the demand for Bitcoin would also increase.


Another question, "Would high fees (caused by usage of Ordinals and other similar protocol) lead to decreased usage of Bitcoin on another aspect (buy goods, paid for service, etc.)?"


It would definitely lead to decreased usage of Bitcoin for financial transactions onchain, which could be pushed offchain, leaving Ordinals users the more willing onchain participants to pay for the high fees that the miners require to secure the network.
legendary
Activity: 1512
Merit: 7340
Farewell, Leo
I'm genuinely curious about what is so threatening about increasing the size by a factor of 2 or 4 for example.
Simply put: it isn't worth it.

So you're about to risk ruining a half-trillion project (at the time or writing this), opening up the Pandora box of a debate that broke Bitcoin in half already once (and in multiple small pieces), completely ignoring the mountainous history of second layers, breaking backwards-compatibility, prioritizing the short-term in a project whose success comes from long-term conservatism... And all that to... Quadruple the on-chain transactions? What when that will neither be enough? Will you start over?

Full nodes operators needing an extra terabyte disk is the last concern of mine if such thing was ever going to happen.
sr. member
Activity: 1036
Merit: 350
I'm genuinely curious about what is so threatening about increasing the size by a factor of 2 or 4 for example.
I've yet to hear an argument about how doubling or quadrupling the size of the blocks will be a bigger threat than the spam attack that turns users away, the centralizations of mining pools of farms, the near monopoly in mining gear production, the already enormous percentage of nodes hosted in data centers, and so on and on!
Aren't the blocks already 2-4 times bigger thanks to the latest updates (SegWit, Taproot)?
if all the transactions are legacy, then the block can be 1MB max.  so it's not across the board...
sr. member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 294
I'm genuinely curious about what is so threatening about increasing the size by a factor of 2 or 4 for example.
I've yet to hear an argument about how doubling or quadrupling the size of the blocks will be a bigger threat than the spam attack that turns users away, the centralizations of mining pools of farms, the near monopoly in mining gear production, the already enormous percentage of nodes hosted in data centers, and so on and on!
Aren't the blocks already 2-4 times bigger thanks to the latest updates (SegWit, Taproot)?
legendary
Activity: 2870
Merit: 7490
Crypto Swap Exchange
Quote
2. On long term, would usage of Ordinals have good impact on Bitcoin price?
The question perhaps should be, "Would Ordinals usage increase and therefore increase the demand for block space"? If the answer is "Yes", then I believe the demand for Bitcoin would also increase.

Another question, "Would high fees (caused by usage of Ordinals and other similar protocol) lead to decreased usage of Bitcoin on another aspect (buy goods, paid for service, etc.)?"

If only bigger maximum block size only lead to bigger storage requirement.

And to what other requirements? Ram, internet speed? Should we also compare those to the Satoshi era?
Centralization because people can't afford to run a node when we're talking about ASICs in the thousands of $ that are close to not even working in a normal house without modifications to the breaker and powerlines?

I'm genuinely curious about what is so threatening about increasing the size by a factor of 2 or 4 for example.
I've yet to hear an argument about how doubling or quadrupling the size of the blocks will be a bigger threat than the spam attack that turns users away, the centralizations of mining pools of farms, the near monopoly in mining gear production, the already enormous percentage of nodes hosted in data centers, and so on and on!

1. I'm actually in favor of maximum block size increase, as long as it's NOT based on arbitrary number or very high increment (e.g. 4 million weight unit to 100MB).
2. Other requirements? Aside from what you mentioned, i could think storage I/O, CPU speed and internet latency.
3. Miner generally don't run full node and mining pool definitely can afford very fast computer/server. The concern lies within individual and small group who want to run full node.
legendary
Activity: 2828
Merit: 6108
Blackjack.fun
If only bigger maximum block size only lead to bigger storage requirement.

And to what other requirements? Ram, internet speed? Should we also compare those to the Satoshi era?
Centralization because people can't afford to run a node when we're talking about ASICs in the thousands of $ that are close to not even working in a normal house without modifications to the breaker and powerlines?

I'm genuinely curious about what is so threatening about increasing the size by a factor of 2 or 4 for example.
I've yet to hear an argument about how doubling or quadrupling the size of the blocks will be a bigger threat than the spam attack that turns users away, the centralizations of mining pools of farms, the near monopoly in mining gear production, the already enormous percentage of nodes hosted in data centers, and so on and on!

I didn't debate about if it can or cannot. I am saying that based on normal network activity for onchain financial transactions we're seeing today, it can't.

And isn't it ironic that we like to compare the penetration of Bitcoin to the Internet, smartphones, tv, etc and we tend to forget every single one of them become widespread when it became affordable for the average Joe? Much unlike a 20$ tx!


legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
Let's take aside the fact that NFTs are "junk", let's put our ideologies at the back seat, and try to look at the fact that the fees from financial transactions alone won't secure the network.

Oh, but they can! The only thing is that you need more than 500 000 a day, if we look at block 788766 which had nearly the same fee/reward ratio you will see the median fee was 20$. So in order to get the same revenue that would guarantee the same level of protection you will need to have 4000 users paying on average $20 since the reward is gone.
OR!!!! You could have 40 000 and pay $2. Or 80 000 pay $1.

But that would imply every node would need to spend $100 on a 2 TB SSD, so let's go with a $20 per tx cause it's cheaper! Roll Eyes
 

I didn't debate about if it can or cannot. I am saying that based on normal network activity for onchain financial transactions we're seeing today, it can't.


Leave Ordinals alone, and allow it to exist as a "necessary evil" in the coming event when block rewards would not be enough to incentivize miners to keep securing the network.


1. Would Ordinals and other method to store arbitary data on-chain remain popular after next few halving?


I don't know. Probably? Especially during bull cycles when everyone goes crazy investing in anything? There's no better blockchain to store/secure NFTs than the Bitcoin blockchain.

Thinking from what currently is going on, people who use Bitcoin for financial transactions are not really willing to pay for high fees.

And why would people do that when the fee could be >2% of amount they're going to send?


That's the point, because Ordinals users won't mind paying for high fees to inscribe or trade their NFTs.
legendary
Activity: 2828
Merit: 6108
Blackjack.fun
Let's take aside the fact that NFTs are "junk", let's put our ideologies at the back seat, and try to look at the fact that the fees from financial transactions alone won't secure the network.

Oh, but they can! The only thing is that you need more than 500 000 a day, if we look at block 788766 which had nearly the same fee/reward ratio you will see the median fee was 20$. So in order to get the same revenue that would guarantee the same level of protection you will need to have 4000 users paying on average $20 since the reward is gone.
OR!!!! You could have 40 000 and pay $2. Or 80 000 pay $1.

But that would imply every node would need to spend $100 on a 2 TB SSD, so let's go with a $20 per tx cause it's cheaper! Roll Eyes
 
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
Another shower thought. I'm not starting an ideological debate. I'm merely pointing out a possible practical "benefit" from Ordinals from a viewpoint of incentivization and for the network to keep chugging along.

 Cool

Leave Ordinals alone, and allow it to exist as a "necessary evil" in the coming event when block rewards would not be enough to incentivize miners to keep securing the network. Thinking from what currently is going on, people who use Bitcoin for financial transactions are not really willing to pay for high fees. But the users who inscribe and trade their NFTs do. So unless users are willing to use Bitcoin for their daily transactions everyday and in every way, and more importantly, also be willing to "tip the miner", then we can't do anything but accept Ordinals to be a part of the network.

Let's take aside the fact that NFTs are "junk", let's put our ideologies at the back seat, and try to look at the fact that the fees from financial transactions alone won't secure the network.
newbie
Activity: 41
Merit: 0
I think it's usually useless to debate motivations: either it's unambiguous, in which case there is no debate... or it's not and there will be no resolution.  Ultimately what matters is what people do, not what motivates them.  If something is explainable as confusion or benign greed, it's prudent to stick with that assumption until facts show otherwise both because it's more likely to be true but also because it has less collateral damage if you're wrong.

As far as the quote--  Your guess is as good as mine as to the intended tone, it's probably a mistake to assume much about it.  It can be extremely difficult to figure out the correct tone from text,  something I know all too well as someone who writes messages intended to sound playful but get received by many as a particularly forceful sermon.  Smiley

That said, It's easy to be popular with almost any identifiable clique:  Just yell the party lines louder than other people, hate on the right enemies, cheer on the right heros.  So much so that excessive popularity with an identifiable group can be a red-flag:  People who are genuine will usually have some unpopular opinions, they'll usually have better things to do with their time than sing from the hymn book all day long.   Bitcoin and the adjacent altcoin ecosystems have been full of bad actors using the popularity play book: Even early on many of the top rated OTC participants were scammers.  Plenty of loud twitter voices promoting Bitcoin turned out to only doing it to form a following to sell their scamcoin to... even Craig Wright totally suckered a big swath of large block bitcoiners[1] by saying what they wanted to hear. ([1] whom I disagreed with, but at least the general position was one a (confused) person could honestly adopt... not a con, but Wright managed to turn many people into con-co-conspirators by playing to their biases)

This isn't to say that disagreeable people are more trustworthy,  I think the compulsively disagreeable are even more likely to be bad actors.  There really just isn't a magic formula to figure out good motivations from bad.  But we don't have to-- unless you're shopping for a spouse you don't need to worry about judging people, just consider their actions and your responses.


Debating motivation is just a matter of psychology in my opinion, and it won't change anything. In the end, everything still comes back to each individual's thinking.

It's really quite apprehensive about the current conditions, moreover, they are taking advantage of the popularity they get just to build a shitcoin for their own benefit. But I think this is predictable, and this is also very influential for people who are just starting out in the crypto world and I think not a few have experienced worse conditions than their previous finances.

Because there is no experience and basic knowledge for further research, this is actually detrimental for projects that want to run right. Because the level of popularity of shitcoin is even higher now.
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
[edited out ]

Since you said that you have listened to all of the episodes in his podcast, then you probably have heard him talk about his viewpoint?


Seems to me that I listened to a lot of podcasts in which Rodamor was at least one of the participants, and I would not claim to listen to or understand any of substantive meaning, yet I still know that there is a lot of podcast content that I mentioned to you and even provided a link to one of them in which Rodamor shared in hosting it, so that if you, yourself, had wanted to listen to Rodamor, then you could do that.  

To the extent to which that you were "asking questions" rather than making accusations in regards to Rodamor, to me, sometimes it seems that a certain amount of work, research looking into the matter and exploration is better to be made when throwing out certain seemingly FUD spreading theories about negative motives that anyone might have (especially if it seems possible to me that you likely had been getting some of your nonsense thoughts from questionable sources (or maybe you just come up with them on your own).. even if one of them might not have had been Greg.. hahahahaha - because the actual source (Rodamor's tweet) provided you ammunition to extrapolate nonsense, seemingly dumb and ill-explored thoughts from that relatively small piece of information)....


If that's how your mind works, then OK, I will have nothing more to say. I have taken enough crap from franky1 A.K.A. franknbeans to know that something will be a never-ending debate about nothing. I'll put you in my ignore list for now.

From a technical viewpoint, Bitcoin's code was changed with the Taproot patch that moved Bitcoin away from being purely a peer-to-peer electronic payment system as Satoshi envisioned, to include the "latest thing". One of the developers referred to this as "security regression." This is not what Bitcoin was designed to be.
You're getting tricked by misinformation-- what I suspect is some intentional consensus cracking (especially since we know most if not all of the BRC-20 stuff is being funded by Ayre & related entities) though it might just be confusion.

This stuff doesn't have anything to do with taproot-- to prove this to yourself go start up node software from 2019 before the taproot bip was even proposed and observe that accepts this stuff just fine.

You could potentially attribute the attack to segwit in the sense that it increased the block size which made more room for junk but to the extent that your complaint is that fees have been driven up, the same attack would have worked prior to segwit.  It's also easy to see that people were embedding irrelevant data in Bitcoin long before segwit (fine example being the Bitcoin Whitepaper).

If you want to complain instead that the attack is bloating the blockchain on disk of archival nodes or that its increasing the data that must be transferred during IBD-- then it's fine to criticize segwit but otoh where the hell were you when there was extremely widespread demand for additional capacity? -- it's not like bloating up the chain is a surprising result: it's the reasonable and expected downside of increasing the capacity.

It's important when contemplating an attack to realize that the attackers have every reason to mislead about the nature of the attack and the enabling factors.

Another piece of measing narrative craft-- one I've seen rodarmor fall for, in fact describing his action as a kick in the teeth to bitcoin developers-- is the false claim that these ordinals translations are in any way charged lower fees by the network.  This isn't true.  The network doesn't set fees at all, they're established by the users competitively bidding for access to capacity.  Miners accept transactions in order of most fees per unit capacity down until the block is full.  Every transaction competes equally(*) and needs to pay based on the capacity it uses.

The deceptive discount claim dupes people for two reasons:  The first is because Bitcoin's block limit isn't measured in bytes, it's measured in weight.  But because the limit works on weight so do fee calculations.  If the limits was a limit on bytes (or the complaint was how much space archived nodes are using) but the fees miners demanded were irrationally calculated based on something else then it would be correct to say there was a discount, but there isn't.  The second is because segwit did in fact lower fees-- but it did so purely because it increased capacity resulting in a lower equilibrium fee rate. (Again, that's what people demanded.  Good job, you got what you wanted...)

If someone wants to say "because segwit, witness data like signature or witness-embeded garbage uses less capacity" -- then THAT would be true. Witness data using less capacity remains well justified: it should because it's prunable and doesn't have to be stored long term just to run a node at all.  Making this data use *more* capacity wouldn't diminish its effect on driving up transaction fees, it would *increase it*, because it would be using more capacity which could otherwise be used for other transactions.

To the extent that some misguided idiots want to store data in the blockchain the fact that it uses less capacity than it would without segwit only helps mitigate the harm.

To the extent that high fees are from an attack intending to drive up fees it's irrelevant in any case: no matter how it works the attacker has to pay in the fees of the next best transaction they displace in each block they displace it.

(*) ignoring things like CPFP which make some transactions more profitable then their fees imply due to having high-fee children.

legendary
Activity: 2240
Merit: 1172
Privacy Servers. Since 2009.
Guys, enough of this shitcoin talk here in this thread. There's a nice altcoin forum part where you can share opinions on your beloved shitcoins and discuss all the news, including NFTs on your blockchain etc. This thread is for Bitcoin and ordinals.  Cool

Depending on who you ask, Ordinals might also be labelled as shitcoins.

They're even worse than that. Shitcoins are just sitting in their respective god-forgotten blockchains and not causing any damage to Bitcoin users. Not spamming anyone, not interfering with blockchain processes. I wish Ordinals were like shitcoins.  Cool
legendary
Activity: 3710
Merit: 10196
Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"
[edited out ]
Since you said that you have listened to all of the episodes in his podcast, then you probably have heard him talk about his viewpoint?

Seems to me that I listened to a lot of podcasts in which Rodamor was at least one of the participants, and I would not claim to listen to or understand any of substantive meaning, yet I still know that there is a lot of podcast content that I mentioned to you and even provided a link to one of them in which Rodamor shared in hosting it, so that if you, yourself, had wanted to listen to Rodamor, then you could do that. 

To the extent to which that you were "asking questions" rather than making accusations in regards to Rodamor, to me, sometimes it seems that a certain amount of work, research looking into the matter and exploration is better to be made when throwing out certain seemingly FUD spreading theories about negative motives that anyone might have (especially if it seems possible to me that you likely had been getting some of your nonsense thoughts from questionable sources (or maybe you just come up with them on your own).. even if one of them might not have had been Greg.. hahahahaha - because the actual source (Rodamor's tweet) provided you ammunition to extrapolate nonsense, seemingly dumb and ill-explored thoughts from that relatively small piece of information).... (hahahahahaha - and I am not even hating on you)

Maybe he's a new BTC developer.
Obviously, but WHO is he, and what were his other contributions in Bitcoin, or open source?
If you bother check his GitHub page at https://github.com/casey/, it looks like he write some Rust library/software with decent amount of stars.

Have you noticed that Google has very little information about him before Ordinals?
Little, but it's good enough to give rough idea what he does. Few example i found from quick search,
https://www.fastcompany.com/3058499/this-oculus-rift-engineer-taught-a-neural-network-to-create-80s-bbs-graffiti-art
https://stackoverflow.com/users/66450/casey-rodarmor
https://bitcoinmagazine.com/technical/what-is-the-future-of-bitcoin-privacy
https://www.mobygames.com/person/114951/casey-rodarmor/

Here's another couple of great examples where some more information could be found for anyone who might even be trying to be informed about his/her assertions about (what might be)... . thanks for showing some of that likely quickie further research ETFbitcoin....
legendary
Activity: 2870
Merit: 7490
Crypto Swap Exchange
Maybe he's a new BTC developer.
Obviously, but WHO is he, and what were his other contributions in Bitcoin, or open source?

If you bother check his GitHub page at https://github.com/casey/, it looks like he write some Rust library/software with decent amount of stars.

Have you noticed that Google has very little information about him before Ordinals?

Little, but it's good enough to give rough idea what he does. Few example i found from quick search,
https://www.fastcompany.com/3058499/this-oculus-rift-engineer-taught-a-neural-network-to-create-80s-bbs-graffiti-art
https://stackoverflow.com/users/66450/casey-rodarmor
https://bitcoinmagazine.com/technical/what-is-the-future-of-bitcoin-privacy
https://www.mobygames.com/person/114951/casey-rodarmor/
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
Plus WHO is Casey Rodarmor? Where was he during the scaling debate, and which side of the debate did he go in favor? What were his other contributions in Bitcoin?
Maybe he's a new BTC developer.
Obviously, but WHO is he, and what were his other contributions in Bitcoin, or open source? Have you noticed that Google has very little information about him before Ordinals? Plus in gmaxwell's post, why would he tweet something like, "Really a kick in the teeth for the authors of segwit", with an added piece of misinformation.
https://twitter.com/rodarmor/status/1614076795082641410
"Kick in the teeth"? Is he saying that with vindictiveness?
I doubt that Casey Rodamor is even close to the "villian" that you are suggesting that he might be.. even if some of the later developments might have been to strive to evolve cardinals/inscriptions into various ways to attempt to attack bitcoin - whether physically and/or socially.   and your harping on his "kick in the teeth" post was already characterized by GMaxwell as a misunderstanding that Rodamor seemed to have had, rather than as if Rodamor was wanting to be "vindicitive" as you seem to want to read into the situation, Wind_FURY.
I know it's sometimes hard to interpret the tone behind a forum post. I assure you that I was asking for opinions with sincerity if truly there's some vindictiveness in that tweet. Because for me there's a softer way of phrasing it instead of "kick in the teeth", followed by, I'll stop saying it's misinformation, the wrong assumption.
Quote
Rodamor seems to have a decent amount of skills to have had identified ways to get the cardinals/inscription thing going on bitcoin.. within the available rules.. I doubt that he would characterize himself as a new developer, but I recall that he had said that he had worked at Coinbase for a while, and he had said something about reviewing bitcoin code.. and may even participating in some of the discussions around development, which he likely would have to have some programming skills and abilities to know how the cardinal/inscriptions code would fit into being used in bitcoin, since he seems to have had been innovative in terms of the way that ordinals/inscriptions were introduced.. and that it was a kind of niche that no one had previously exploited (whether thinking about exploiting in a good or a bad way... which I am still not presuming ordinals/inscriptions to necessarily be bad even though there seems to be some later evidence that some of the BRC20 angle of the ordinals are being manipulated by Ayer/Wright - even if Greg (Gmaxwell) might not wanted to have wanted to use shittwat Wright's name within this discussion.

Rodamor had discussed cardinals and inscriptions on several bitcoin podcasts and gave reasons why to develop cardinals/inscriptions on bitcoin (and why not do it on shitcoins)... He had quite a few appearances on podcasts - especially right around the time that the cardinals/inscriptions went live in January/February 2023  (do you need me to provide some links? so you can actually listen to the ways that he discusses how he got into the ideas of cardinals/inscriptions), and he even has his own podcast (and has not had a new episode in the last few months)
I don't doubt his skills as a coder. I was merely curious what his previous contribitions were, because there's mostly nothing said about him before Ordinals when I do a search.

His opinion and what was he in favor during the scaling debate will truly say a lot about him. I'm not saying it will be good or bad, I'm not here to judge him. Merely curious.

Of course, it is not easy to judge character of any of the people in the bitcoin space, and sometimes they might seem genuine, but really have evil motives... so sometimes any of us might go by our own hunches, and even though Rodamor is not completely famous, there is quite a bit of content out there of him participating in interviews, discussions, talking about himself and talking about his views of bitcoin and various bitcoin related matters, including arts and some of his distastes that has evolved regarding scams in the shitcoin space (especially ethereum).   I just happened to have had listened to most (if not all) of the Hell Podcast episodes after I had heard Rodamor in an interview in some other podcast  (probably around the end of 2022), and Rodamor is pretty well liked (and even trusted to be a genuine and good actor) by a lot of folks in the bitcoin maximalist circles, even though some of the bitcoin maximalists did not really like some of what he had done in regards to cardinals/inscriptions, but I think that Rodamor has been able to defend himself quite well in terms of working within the code and largely having decently good intentions in terms of trying to expand bitcoin's use cases.. and I am not even suggesting that I necessarily agree with him and/or all of the points that he makes.. and surely I have not been hearing (or seeing him) much in the past couple of months, including that I doubt that he had much involvement in the BRC20 developments...

I don't have any problem with your wanting to be skeptical of motives of some persons in the bitcoin space, including persons that you don't know very well in terms of having had not seen their content,


I'm not skeptical of his motives, I'm just curious on what he was in favor for during the scaling debate, Segwit or bigger blocks. Merely a personal curiosity, although he's a smart guy. He probably supported Segwit.

Since you said that you have listened to all of the episodes in his podcast, then you probably have heard him talk about his viewpoint?

I think it's usually useless to debate motivations: either it's unambiguous, in which case there is no debate... or it's not and there will be no resolution.  


You're right, I'll stop asking.

 Cool
staff
Activity: 4172
Merit: 8419
I think it's usually useless to debate motivations: either it's unambiguous, in which case there is no debate... or it's not and there will be no resolution.  Ultimately what matters is what people do, not what motivates them.  If something is explainable as confusion or benign greed, it's prudent to stick with that assumption until facts show otherwise both because it's more likely to be true but also because it has less collateral damage if you're wrong.

As far as the quote--  Your guess is as good as mine as to the intended tone, it's probably a mistake to assume much about it.  It can be extremely difficult to figure out the correct tone from text,  something I know all too well as someone who writes messages intended to sound playful but get received by many as a particularly forceful sermon.  Smiley

That said, It's easy to be popular with almost any identifiable clique:  Just yell the party lines louder than other people, hate on the right enemies, cheer on the right heros.  So much so that excessive popularity with an identifiable group can be a red-flag:  People who are genuine will usually have some unpopular opinions, they'll usually have better things to do with their time than sing from the hymn book all day long.   Bitcoin and the adjacent altcoin ecosystems have been full of bad actors using the popularity play book: Even early on many of the top rated OTC participants were scammers.  Plenty of loud twitter voices promoting Bitcoin turned out to only doing it to form a following to sell their scamcoin to... even Craig Wright totally suckered a big swath of large block bitcoiners[1] by saying what they wanted to hear. ([1] whom I disagreed with, but at least the general position was one a (confused) person could honestly adopt... not a con, but Wright managed to turn many people into con-co-conspirators by playing to their biases)

This isn't to say that disagreeable people are more trustworthy,  I think the compulsively disagreeable are even more likely to be bad actors.  There really just isn't a magic formula to figure out good motivations from bad.  But we don't have to-- unless you're shopping for a spouse you don't need to worry about judging people, just consider their actions and your responses.
legendary
Activity: 3710
Merit: 10196
Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"
Plus WHO is Casey Rodarmor? Where was he during the scaling debate, and which side of the debate did he go in favor? What were his other contributions in Bitcoin?
Maybe he's a new BTC developer.
Obviously, but WHO is he, and what were his other contributions in Bitcoin, or open source? Have you noticed that Google has very little information about him before Ordinals? Plus in gmaxwell's post, why would he tweet something like, "Really a kick in the teeth for the authors of segwit", with an added piece of misinformation.
https://twitter.com/rodarmor/status/1614076795082641410
"Kick in the teeth"? Is he saying that with vindictiveness?
I doubt that Casey Rodamor is even close to the "villian" that you are suggesting that he might be.. even if some of the later developments might have been to strive to evolve cardinals/inscriptions into various ways to attempt to attack bitcoin - whether physically and/or socially.   and your harping on his "kick in the teeth" post was already characterized by GMaxwell as a misunderstanding that Rodamor seemed to have had, rather than as if Rodamor was wanting to be "vindicitive" as you seem to want to read into the situation, Wind_FURY.
I know it's sometimes hard to interpret the tone behind a forum post. I assure you that I was asking for opinions with sincerity if truly there's some vindictiveness in that tweet. Because for me there's a softer way of phrasing it instead of "kick in the teeth", followed by, I'll stop saying it's misinformation, the wrong assumption.
Quote
Rodamor seems to have a decent amount of skills to have had identified ways to get the cardinals/inscription thing going on bitcoin.. within the available rules.. I doubt that he would characterize himself as a new developer, but I recall that he had said that he had worked at Coinbase for a while, and he had said something about reviewing bitcoin code.. and may even participating in some of the discussions around development, which he likely would have to have some programming skills and abilities to know how the cardinal/inscriptions code would fit into being used in bitcoin, since he seems to have had been innovative in terms of the way that ordinals/inscriptions were introduced.. and that it was a kind of niche that no one had previously exploited (whether thinking about exploiting in a good or a bad way... which I am still not presuming ordinals/inscriptions to necessarily be bad even though there seems to be some later evidence that some of the BRC20 angle of the ordinals are being manipulated by Ayer/Wright - even if Greg (Gmaxwell) might not wanted to have wanted to use shittwat Wright's name within this discussion.

Rodamor had discussed cardinals and inscriptions on several bitcoin podcasts and gave reasons why to develop cardinals/inscriptions on bitcoin (and why not do it on shitcoins)... He had quite a few appearances on podcasts - especially right around the time that the cardinals/inscriptions went live in January/February 2023  (do you need me to provide some links? so you can actually listen to the ways that he discusses how he got into the ideas of cardinals/inscriptions), and he even has his own podcast (and has not had a new episode in the last few months)
I don't doubt his skills as a coder. I was merely curious what his previous contribitions were, because there's mostly nothing said about him before Ordinals when I do a search.

His opinion and what was he in favor during the scaling debate will truly say a lot about him. I'm not saying it will be good or bad, I'm not here to judge him. Merely curious.

Of course, it is not easy to judge character of any of the people in the bitcoin space, and sometimes they might seem genuine, but really have evil motives... so sometimes any of us might go by our own hunches, and even though Rodamor is not completely famous, there is quite a bit of content out there of him participating in interviews, discussions, talking about himself and talking about his views of bitcoin and various bitcoin related matters, including arts and some of his distastes that has evolved regarding scams in the shitcoin space (especially ethereum).   I just happened to have had listened to most (if not all) of the Hell Podcast episodes after I had heard Rodamor in an interview in some other podcast  (probably around the end of 2022), and Rodamor is pretty well liked (and even trusted to be a genuine and good actor) by a lot of folks in the bitcoin maximalist circles, even though some of the bitcoin maximalists did not really like some of what he had done in regards to cardinals/inscriptions, but I think that Rodamor has been able to defend himself quite well in terms of working within the code and largely having decently good intentions in terms of trying to expand bitcoin's use cases.. and I am not even suggesting that I necessarily agree with him and/or all of the points that he makes.. and surely I have not been hearing (or seeing him) much in the past couple of months, including that I doubt that he had much involvement in the BRC20 developments...

I don't have any problem with your wanting to be skeptical of motives of some persons in the bitcoin space, including persons that you don't know very well in terms of having had not seen their content, but I doubt that Rodamor is as evasive and lacking as content as you seem to be making him out to be, and likely when you are making superficial assertions about his potential vindictiveness or evil intents, you may well be getting that kind of information from bad and/or ill-informed sources... even if Greg was one of your sources.. hahahahahaha for the "kick in the teeth" reference.
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
Plus WHO is Casey Rodarmor? Where was he during the scaling debate, and which side of the debate did he go in favor? What were his other contributions in Bitcoin?
Maybe he's a new BTC developer.
Obviously, but WHO is he, and what were his other contributions in Bitcoin, or open source? Have you noticed that Google has very little information about him before Ordinals? Plus in gmaxwell's post, why would he tweet something like, "Really a kick in the teeth for the authors of segwit", with an added piece of misinformation.
https://twitter.com/rodarmor/status/1614076795082641410
"Kick in the teeth"? Is he saying that with vindictiveness?

I doubt that Casey Rodamor is even close to the "villian" that you are suggesting that he might be.. even if some of the later developments might have been to strive to evolve cardinals/inscriptions into various ways to attempt to attack bitcoin - whether physically and/or socially.   and your harping on his "kick in the teeth" post was already characterized by GMaxwell as a misunderstanding that Rodamor seemed to have had, rather than as if Rodamor was wanting to be "vindicitive" as you seem to want to read into the situation, Wind_FURY.


I know it's sometimes hard to interpret the tone behind a forum post. I assure you that I was asking for opinions with sincerity if truly there's some vindictiveness in that tweet. Because for me there's a softer way of phrasing it instead of "kick in the teeth", followed by, I'll stop saying it's misinformation, the wrong assumption.

Quote

Rodamor seems to have a decent amount of skills to have had identified ways to get the cardinals/inscription thing going on bitcoin.. within the available rules.. I doubt that he would characterize himself as a new developer, but I recall that he had said that he had worked at Coinbase for a while, and he had said something about reviewing bitcoin code.. and may even participating in some of the discussions around development, which he likely would have to have some programming skills and abilities to know how the cardinal/inscriptions code would fit into being used in bitcoin, since he seems to have had been innovative in terms of the way that ordinals/inscriptions were introduced.. and that it was a kind of niche that no one had previously exploited (whether thinking about exploiting in a good or a bad way... which I am still not presuming ordinals/inscriptions to necessarily be bad even though there seems to be some later evidence that some of the BRC20 angle of the ordinals are being manipulated by Ayer/Wright - even if Greg (Gmaxwell) might not wanted to have wanted to use shittwat Wright's name within this discussion.

Rodamor had discussed cardinals and inscriptions on several bitcoin podcasts and gave reasons why to develop cardinals/inscriptions on bitcoin (and why not do it on shitcoins)... He had quite a few appearances on podcasts - especially right around the time that the cardinals/inscriptions went live in January/February 2023  (do you need me to provide some links? so you can actually listen to the ways that he discusses how he got into the ideas of cardinals/inscriptions), and he even has his own podcast (and has not had a new episode in the last few months)


I don't doubt his skills as a coder. I was merely curious what his previous contribitions were, because there's mostly nothing said about him before Ordinals when I do a search.

His opinion and what was he in favor during the scaling debate will truly say a lot about him. I'm not saying it will be good or bad, I'm not here to judge him. Merely curious.
legendary
Activity: 3710
Merit: 10196
Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"
Plus WHO is Casey Rodarmor? Where was he during the scaling debate, and which side of the debate did he go in favor? What were his other contributions in Bitcoin?
Maybe he's a new BTC developer.
Obviously, but WHO is he, and what were his other contributions in Bitcoin, or open source? Have you noticed that Google has very little information about him before Ordinals? Plus in gmaxwell's post, why would he tweet something like, "Really a kick in the teeth for the authors of segwit", with an added piece of misinformation.
https://twitter.com/rodarmor/status/1614076795082641410
"Kick in the teeth"? Is he saying that with vindictiveness?

I doubt that Casey Rodamor is even close to the "villian" that you are suggesting that he might be.. even if some of the later developments might have been to strive to evolve cardinals/inscriptions into various ways to attempt to attack bitcoin - whether physically and/or socially.   and your harping on his "kick in the teeth" post was already characterized by GMaxwell as a misunderstanding that Rodamor seemed to have had, rather than as if Rodamor was wanting to be "vindicitive" as you seem to want to read into the situation, Wind_FURY.

Rodamor seems to have a decent amount of skills to have had identified ways to get the cardinals/inscription thing going on bitcoin.. within the available rules.. I doubt that he would characterize himself as a new developer, but I recall that he had said that he had worked at Coinbase for a while, and he had said something about reviewing bitcoin code.. and may even participating in some of the discussions around development, which he likely would have to have some programming skills and abilities to know how the cardinal/inscriptions code would fit into being used in bitcoin, since he seems to have had been innovative in terms of the way that ordinals/inscriptions were introduced.. and that it was a kind of niche that no one had previously exploited (whether thinking about exploiting in a good or a bad way... which I am still not presuming ordinals/inscriptions to necessarily be bad even though there seems to be some later evidence that some of the BRC20 angle of the ordinals are being manipulated by Ayer/Wright - even if Greg (Gmaxwell) might not wanted to have wanted to use shittwat Wright's name within this discussion.

Rodamor had discussed cardinals and inscriptions on several bitcoin podcasts and gave reasons why to develop cardinals/inscriptions on bitcoin (and why not do it on shitcoins)... He had quite a few appearances on podcasts - especially right around the time that the cardinals/inscriptions went live in January/February 2023  (do you need me to provide some links? so you can actually listen to the ways that he discusses how he got into the ideas of cardinals/inscriptions), and he even has his own podcast (and has not had a new episode in the last few months)
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
Plus WHO is Casey Rodarmor? Where was he during the scaling debate, and which side of the debate did he go in favor? What were his other contributions in Bitcoin?


Maybe he's a new BTC developer.


Obviously, but WHO is he, and what were his other contributions in Bitcoin, or open source? Have you noticed that Google has very little information about him before Ordinals? Plus in gmaxwell's post, why would he tweet something like, "Really a kick in the teeth for the authors of segwit", with an added piece of misinformation.

https://twitter.com/rodarmor/status/1614076795082641410

"Kick in the teeth"? Is he saying that with vindictiveness?
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