I think this mostly irregarded by many that invested in such coin because seeing a coin that's environment friendly is more important considering this means less energy needed for the blockchain.
PoS is already good enough I think even though many still thinks it's imperfect it's at least could save the environment and even elon is looking for coin that's environment friendly.
Topic: No doubt POS is centralized (Read 614 times)
Well it looks like POS is closer to a centralized system. although not completely centered. However, POS is more widely referred to as environmentally friendly. and it seems that Ethereum is switching to POS because they want to get support from the Government which is more supportive of the POS system that many say is more environmentally friendly. But I actually see that behind the environmentally friendly there is another agenda, which is easier to control because it is closer to a centralized system.
There is no doubt that POS is centralized. But the fact that ETH has moved to POS for government support, I doubt it, just moved to POS, ETH has been investigated by the SEC, from this action it can be seen that ETH and the government are not related and why does ETH need government support? The purpose of moving to POS is because ETH cannot solve problems like gas fees, transaction speed... this makes ETH lag behind its rivals. It can be seen that since ETH gas fees increased, a lot of projects have moved to build on other blockchains and so have users.
It is quite simple, ETH needs the government support for adoption. If the government supports ETH instead of Bitcoin then majority of the government citizen, institution and establishment will tend to use ETH than Bitcoin.
It has always been about getting the most support from the government. Otherwise, investors will look for other alternatives that're "regulatory-compliant". It's sad to say Ethereum preferred to please the regulators by sacrificing decentralization over performance/cost-efficiency. They claim ETH is now 99% energy efficient, but what they're doing is giving all of the power to centralized exchanges. It's a pity since it goes against Vitalik's original vision of making Ethereum the "decentralized platform for unstoppable applications".
There are numerous PoS coins on the market, while PoW coins like Bitcoin and Litecoin are the minority. With further tightening of government regulations, it's possible 99.99% of altcoins will turn to PoS while Bitcoin remains the only decentralized cryptocurrency with PoW consensus. I'm fine with that as long as decentralization/censorship-resistance prevails in the long run. Just my thoughts
Well it looks like POS is closer to a centralized system. although not completely centered. However, POS is more widely referred to as environmentally friendly. and it seems that Ethereum is switching to POS because they want to get support from the Government which is more supportive of the POS system that many say is more environmentally friendly. But I actually see that behind the environmentally friendly there is another agenda, which is easier to control because it is closer to a centralized system.
There is no doubt that POS is centralized. But the fact that ETH has moved to POS for government support, I doubt it, just moved to POS, ETH has been investigated by the SEC, from this action it can be seen that ETH and the government are not related and why does ETH need government support?It is quite simple, ETH needs the government support for adoption. If the government supports ETH instead of Bitcoin then majority of the government citizen, institution and establishment will tend to use ETH than Bitcoin.
The purpose of moving to POS is because ETH cannot solve problems like gas fees, transaction speed... this makes ETH lag behind its rivals. It can be seen that since ETH gas fees increased, a lot of projects have moved to build on other blockchains and so have users.
They are not on that upgrade yet. The merge as I read is the foundation of all the possible upgrade that is on the roadmap of ETH. Once the sharding is implemented, then that is the time when gas fee won't be an issue anymore since it will solve the scalability problem of ETH
Altcoins with PoS algorithms can indeed be said to be centralized but can also be said to be decentralized,
because if they have become coins and have a blockchain it will be difficult to say that they are centralized,
because I believe they have more validators.
because if they have become coins and have a blockchain it will be difficult to say that they are centralized,
because I believe they have more validators.
POS does look more like centralized. that's why I think a lot of people will switch from ETH to ETC. if you want to choose coins that have a POS system then I prefer BNB. but ETH is also good. but would not be a priority for me.
for some reason I prefer the POW system. because in POS we can only stake. and the beneficiaries are the largest holders.
we are talking about centralized not a good or bad token for investment. I admit when talking about another coin or token better to not invest where a coin comes near to POS or if you have to maybe not all in, half or 50:50. so if you think it's not profitable you can move at all to POW like another fork maybe, ETHPOW.for some reason I prefer the POW system. because in POS we can only stake. and the beneficiaries are the largest holders.
Currently more and more coins are using PoS. PoW is already becoming a very unpopular and persecuted consensus. Various governments oppose PoW, make various dubious arguments in favor of PoS, even trying to transfer bitcoin to PoS. This trend has been rapidly gaining momentum since last year. If you take the crypto industry 8-10 years ago, there many popular cryptocurrencies were on PoW, and now on PoS. Cryptocurrencies have long been moving toward regulation and centralization.
It's all the governments' fault. They want to control Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies by enforcing KYC/AML across every single centralized exchange. When they can't control trades performed directly on the Blockchain, they quickly attack crypto by saying it's "harmful to the environment". But the thing is Bitcoin can be as clean as any ordinary PoS coin if miners use alternative/renewable energy sources. If the vast majority of miners begin using solar, wind, geothermal, or even hydroelectric energy, then PoW would be environmentally-friendly.
This is nothing more than a plan for governments to push PoS in order to centralize the entire crypto/Blockchain space. Sadly, Ethereum fell for it by adopting the consensus algorithm. Other cryptocurrencies like Cardano, BNB, and even Polygon (MATIC) are PoS, so it should only be a matter of time before Bitcoin remains as the sole PoW cryptocurrency in the world. Even Zcash hinted the possibility of switching to PoS for "self-sustainability". I'm pretty sure whales will fill their pockets with a lot of money, leaving the little guy out of the system. What matters is that Bitcoin remains a PoW cryptocurrency to resist the evil forces of centralization. As long as it stays that way, no one will be able to stop it. Just my thoughts
The important thing is that bitcoin does not eventually break down in the face of government oppression. The government has two ways to fully control bitcoin:
1. Moves to PoS, controlling the blockchain, transactions and capacity, blocking and sanctioning any address. The perfect control tool. But there is a nuance here, a move to pos may kill all faith in bitcoin, so such drastic measures may turn out badly for the value of this asset.
2. The regulation of cryptocurrencies is being actively discussed. I recently came across another article where government officials are proposing to introduce KYC for bitcoin addresses. A nonsense that breaks all principles of cryptocurrencies and bitcoin, but it is already implemented. I read that in Dutch exchanges when transferring funds you have to give personal data not only of the sender, but also of the recipient. How do you like it? Alas, this is reality. This may take years or decades. After all, some 10 years have passed and now people are already more relaxed about KYC in cryptocurrency.
Well it looks like POS is closer to a centralized system. although not completely centered. However, POS is more widely referred to as environmentally friendly. and it seems that Ethereum is switching to POS because they want to get support from the Government which is more supportive of the POS system that many say is more environmentally friendly. But I actually see that behind the environmentally friendly there is another agenda, which is easier to control because it is closer to a centralized system.
Currently more and more coins are using PoS. PoW is already becoming a very unpopular and persecuted consensus. Various governments oppose PoW, make various dubious arguments in favor of PoS, even trying to transfer bitcoin to PoS. This trend has been rapidly gaining momentum since last year. If you take the crypto industry 8-10 years ago, there many popular cryptocurrencies were on PoW, and now on PoS. Cryptocurrencies have long been moving toward regulation and centralization.
It's all the governments' fault. They want to control Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies by enforcing KYC/AML across every single centralized exchange. When they can't control trades performed directly on the Blockchain, they quickly attack crypto by saying it's "harmful to the environment". But the thing is Bitcoin can be as clean as any ordinary PoS coin if miners use alternative/renewable energy sources. If the vast majority of miners begin using solar, wind, geothermal, or even hydroelectric energy, then PoW would be environmentally-friendly.
This is nothing more than a plan for governments to push PoS in order to centralize the entire crypto/Blockchain space. Sadly, Ethereum fell for it by adopting the consensus algorithm. Other cryptocurrencies like Cardano, BNB, and even Polygon (MATIC) are PoS, so it should only be a matter of time before Bitcoin remains as the sole PoW cryptocurrency in the world. Even Zcash hinted the possibility of switching to PoS for "self-sustainability". I'm pretty sure whales will fill their pockets with a lot of money, leaving the little guy out of the system. What matters is that Bitcoin remains a PoW cryptocurrency to resist the evil forces of centralization. As long as it stays that way, no one will be able to stop it. Just my thoughts
POS does look more like centralized. that's why I think a lot of people will switch from ETH to ETC. if you want to choose coins that have a POS system then I prefer BNB. but ETH is also good. but would not be a priority for me.
for some reason I prefer the POW system. because in POS we can only stake. and the beneficiaries are the largest holders.
we are talking about centralized not a good or bad token for investment. I admit when talking about another coin or token better to not invest where a coin comes near to POS or if you have to maybe not all in, half or 50:50. so if you think it's not profitable you can move at all to POW like another fork maybe, ETHPOW.for some reason I prefer the POW system. because in POS we can only stake. and the beneficiaries are the largest holders.
I agreed with what you have said above just let him to move whole of his assets to the pow coin like ethereum pow. This ethereum was fake ethereum like when bitcoin being faked by so many bitcoin fork coin.
POS does look more like centralized. that's why I think a lot of people will switch from ETH to ETC. if you want to choose coins that have a POS system then I prefer BNB. but ETH is also good. but would not be a priority for me.
for some reason I prefer the POW system. because in POS we can only stake. and the beneficiaries are the largest holders.
we are talking about centralized not a good or bad token for investment. I admit when talking about another coin or token better to not invest where a coin comes near to POS or if you have to maybe not all in, half or 50:50. so if you think it's not profitable you can move at all to POW like another fork maybe, ETHPOW.for some reason I prefer the POW system. because in POS we can only stake. and the beneficiaries are the largest holders.
I don't get why Vitalik and team decided to push the PoS upgrade when they knew about the risks of centralization. It was nothing but a move to enrich themselves and the whales, while leaving the little guy out of the system. The future of PoS cryptocurrencies looks dark, so our only hope lies with Bitcoin as a PoW cryptocurrency that puts decentralization/censorship-resistance above all else. Who knows if 99.9% of the coins switch to PoS while only Bitcoin remains with PoW consensus? Just my thoughts
Currently more and more coins are using PoS. PoW is already becoming a very unpopular and persecuted consensus. Various governments oppose PoW, make various dubious arguments in favor of PoS, even trying to transfer bitcoin to PoS. This trend has been rapidly gaining momentum since last year. If you take the crypto industry 8-10 years ago, there many popular cryptocurrencies were on PoW, and now on PoS. Cryptocurrencies have long been moving toward regulation and centralization.
I would say that the U.S. government could now take complete control of the entire ETH network. The first alarm bells are already starting to ring. The head of the SEC says that 44% of validators are located in the United States, which means that most of the validated transactions are American. In addition, the SEC wants to equate ETH to a security rather than a commodity and then the American securities laws will apply to ETH. The American government will block and confiscate any addresses at will and nobody will be able to object. This could kill the whole network, because it would be no better than the normal banking system.
I've read somewhere that the majority of ETH nodes are hosted on Amazon Web Services. That's within US jurisdiction, so it's easy enough to disrupt the ETH blockchain by shutting down the service completely. The SEC already said PoS cryptocurrencies like ETH could be classified as securities, so there would be nothing stopping them from taking action against ETH if exchanges and other industry players don't comply with the law. It's a dangerous situation that could completely undermine ETH as we speak. So much for a decentralized platform for smart contracts aiming to bring "banking to the unbanked".
I don't get why Vitalik and team decided to push the PoS upgrade when they knew about the risks of centralization. It was nothing but a move to enrich themselves and the whales, while leaving the little guy out of the system. The future of PoS cryptocurrencies looks dark, so our only hope lies with Bitcoin as a PoW cryptocurrency that puts decentralization/censorship-resistance above all else. Who knows if 99.9% of the coins switch to PoS while only Bitcoin remains with PoW consensus? Just my thoughts
There is no decentralization in PoS, and never has been. This is a big myth, which is imposed on us by developers of such coins and those who actively promote them in the network. It has been noticed more than once that when some PoS coin votes, 90% of addresses belong to one or several addresses. What kind of decentralization with such distribution of coins and votes can we talk about? ETH became just as centralized after the merger. More than 50% of the network validators are owned by a few large companies.
Exactly. PoS is utter centralization at its core. It enriches whales (mainly exchanges, big companies, and wealthy investors), while leaving the little guy out of the system. ETH made a bad decision by pleasing the regulators instead of the community. Now it's going to pay big time as centralized exchanges gain control of all of the network. ETH will now become an easier target for mainstream governments who'd want to censor people's ability to participate in "De-Fi" and gain financial privacy.
I would say that the U.S. government could now take complete control of the entire ETH network. The first alarm bells are already starting to ring. The head of the SEC says that 44% of validators are located in the United States, which means that most of the validated transactions are American. In addition, the SEC wants to equate ETH to a security rather than a commodity and then the American securities laws will apply to ETH. The American government will block and confiscate any addresses at will and nobody will be able to object. This could kill the whole network, because it would be no better than the normal banking system.
PoS does look centralized, but rest assured PoS is also decentralized, it's just that there is only 1 condition,
that is to make an even distribution to holders, usually this is done by Staking, I know Ethereum PoS is currently controlled by Lido and Coinbase,
but if you search furthermore, Coinbase is certainly an exchange, so maybe the address is the result of a pool of addresses on Coinbase
that is to make an even distribution to holders, usually this is done by Staking, I know Ethereum PoS is currently controlled by Lido and Coinbase,
but if you search furthermore, Coinbase is certainly an exchange, so maybe the address is the result of a pool of addresses on Coinbase
Having to bother about ethereum being controlled by few addresses isn't necessary to me because that's how the entire altcoin in the industry operates. Infact, it's no news that whales are the true determinants of the trends in the market. Even though the industry is said to be decentralized, we know that the decentralisation favours a few as they can control the market. I personally believe that reducing the cost and fees in the ethereum blockchain is more important than the centralization issue because it's been there all along.
It seems the major concern about Proof of stake that experts here warned about has begin to see the light.
According to cointelegraph, 40% of ethereum nodes are controlled by two addresses which are Lido and Coinbase.
This has just proven more that POS is not decentralized and favours investors with higher token supply
source
This is something the community has been warning against for a long time, but it seems that the ethereum developers simply do not care about it, now it is true a centralized network will bring benefits which a decentralized network cannot bring.According to cointelegraph, 40% of ethereum nodes are controlled by two addresses which are Lido and Coinbase.
This has just proven more that POS is not decentralized and favours investors with higher token supply
source
But without decentralization no coin can exist unless the governments allows it, so if at any point in time governments around the world decide they had enough with ethereum they will be able to destroy it without too much of a problem.
There is no decentralization in PoS, and never has been. This is a big myth, which is imposed on us by developers of such coins and those who actively promote them in the network. It has been noticed more than once that when some PoS coin votes, 90% of addresses belong to one or several addresses. What kind of decentralization with such distribution of coins and votes can we talk about? ETH became just as centralized after the merger. More than 50% of the network validators are owned by a few large companies.
Exactly. PoS is utter centralization at its core. It enriches whales (mainly exchanges, big companies, and wealthy investors), while leaving the little guy out of the system. ETH made a bad decision by pleasing the regulators instead of the community. Now it's going to pay big time as centralized exchanges gain control of all of the network. ETH will now become an easier target for mainstream governments who'd want to censor people's ability to participate in "De-Fi" and gain financial privacy.
Instead of switching to PoS, ETH should've switched to a hybrid consensus mechanism (PoW + PoS) that would help preserve decentralization/censorship-resistance. Now it's ruined, so our only hope lies with Ethereum Classic as the original version of the ETH blockchain. No one knows what the future holds for crypto, so we can only hope for the best. Just my opinion
It's really a wonder why Vitalik goes into this roadmap when of all people who has the knowledge of crypto and decentralization, he should have known. Did he make some deals with SEC? Just wondering.
OP says 40% but I've read it's actually 60% in some chats. It wouldn't be surprising really to see ETH tokens are going to be censored, block,ed or frozen once they see a user supports something that they don't like.
There is no decentralization in PoS, and never has been. This is a big myth, which is imposed on us by developers of such coins and those who actively promote them in the network. It has been noticed more than once that when some PoS coin votes, 90% of addresses belong to one or several addresses. What kind of decentralization with such distribution of coins and votes can we talk about? ETH became just as centralized after the merger. More than 50% of the network validators are owned by a few large companies.
Exactly. PoS is utter centralization at its core. It enriches whales (mainly exchanges, big companies, and wealthy investors), while leaving the little guy out of the system. ETH made a bad decision by pleasing the regulators instead of the community. Now it's going to pay big time as centralized exchanges gain control of all of the network. ETH will now become an easier target for mainstream governments who'd want to censor people's ability to participate in "De-Fi" and gain financial privacy.
Instead of switching to PoS, ETH should've switched to a hybrid consensus mechanism (PoW + PoS) that would help preserve decentralization/censorship-resistance. Now it's ruined, so our only hope lies with Ethereum Classic as the original version of the ETH blockchain. No one knows what the future holds for crypto, so we can only hope for the best. Just my opinion
And those two addresses if their stake their ethereum in the network pool then there can control the transaction, that is the irony of the whole situation, the proof of stake network will only make ethereum more centralized and control is given to the big bag holders in the network.
We will see more of these kinds of addresses that are contending to control the network popping up as time goes on because coinbase is an exchange so other big exchanges like Binance will join the list of ethereum holders competing for control of the network pool.
this is the second thread on the forum discussing this topic. Is this from other top coin maximalist. Ethereum is unlimited in mining although other idea now make it deflationary. However, the 40% held by the 2 exchanges are less than 5% of the whole market, so it means the percentage is significantly high to dictate the price and other decision of the coin. This staked portion does not look like it can be moved they can only benefit in the reward We will see more of these kinds of addresses that are contending to control the network popping up as time goes on because coinbase is an exchange so other big exchanges like Binance will join the list of ethereum holders competing for control of the network pool.
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