NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information - page 289.

windjc

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:32:58 AM

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:31:12 AM

No its not. Nxt is being introduced as a currency as we speak. Ripple never has and never will (probably). So this, again, i just your opinion.

Again - NXT is the currency and Nxt is the platform (although my understanding is that you only care about NXT so you think that Nxt == NXT).

OMG. My apologies.

Nxt, NXT, nXT, nXt.

You do realize that newbies read this thread. Why would you or anyone insist on calling two completely separate things basically the same, if we could just assume the collective of both in our discourse.

And I care about both. A great deal. I think that NXT should be promoted as a currency with all the speculation that comes with that and I think that Nxt should be promoted as a decentralized asset exchange with a emphasize on ease of use, ease of adoption, and security.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:31:12 AM

No its not. Nxt is being introduced as a currency as we speak. Ripple never has and never will (probably). So this, again, i just your opinion.

Again - NXT is the currency and Nxt is the platform (although my understanding is that you only care about NXT so you think that Nxt == NXT).

windjc

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:30:15 AM

Quote from: BrianNowhere on March 18, 2014, 01:27:44 AM

Why should I have any money in it at all if not for a potential price increase. If not for that I am just risking losing all of it for absolutely no reason. I suppose you expect people to just love the idea so much that they are willing to risk losing thousands in hopes that it gets developed.

Is that the idea?

Nxt was not my idea so you'd have to as BCNext that (oh - yes - not possible).

Whether launching it the way it was launched was a good idea is another thing that has (and should) be questioned.

In coming to a decision about whether to invest or divest it is important to at least have a "clear understanding" of the "beast". That is all that I am trying to establish here.

And just as Bitcoin is not the code Satoshi originally wrote, neither will Nxt be the instrument exactly like BC might have planned. You should really let that sink in;)

windjc

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:26:47 AM

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:24:25 AM

Actually as a currency Nxt can and should be compared to other alts. Absolutely. POS vs. POW.

It is a poor comparison - if you want to compare NXT to something then I think XRP is a much closer one.

No its not. Nxt is being introduced as a currency as we speak. Ripple never has and never will (probably). So this, again, i just your opinion.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: BrianNowhere on March 18, 2014, 01:27:44 AM

Why should I have any money in it at all if not for a potential price increase. If not for that I am just risking losing all of it for absolutely no reason. I suppose you expect people to just love the idea so much that they are willing to risk losing thousands in hopes that it gets developed.

Is that the idea?

Nxt was not my idea so you'd have to as BCNext that (oh - yes - not possible).

Whether launching it the way it was launched was a good idea is another thing that has (and should) be questioned.

In coming to a decision about whether to invest or divest it is important to at least have a "clear understanding" of the "beast". That is all that I am trying to establish here.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: 2Kool4Skewl on March 18, 2014, 01:25:36 AM

Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:21:30 AM

(personally "I am hodling")

FIFY

Haha - yes I'm not such a fan of "memes" (and I don't hodl any cute little doggies either).

BrianNowhere

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:21:30 AM

Quote from: BrianNowhere on March 18, 2014, 01:18:09 AM

You seem to be sending a strong SELL message. Not sure if you care, but that's what I'm getting. I can just wait for the new assets to come out, no reason to stick around, is pretty much what you are saying.

That I guess is how you have decided to interpret my posts.

Buy or sell is up to you and others - it's a free market!

(personally "I am holding")

Why should I have any money in it at all if not for a potential price increase. If not for that I am just risking losing all of it for absolutely no reason. I suppose you expect people to just love the idea so much that they are willing to risk losing thousands in hopes that it gets developed.

Is that the idea?

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:24:25 AM

Actually as a currency Nxt can and should be compared to other alts. Absolutely. POS vs. POW.

It is a poor comparison - if you want to compare NXT to something then I think XRP is a much closer one.

2Kool4Skewl

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:21:30 AM

(personally "I am hodling")

FIFY

windjc

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:20:04 AM

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:16:55 AM

But, again, you seem to dismiss Nxt as a currency. Makes no sense. It can exist as both, despite the original developers initial intentions, if we even know what those were/are.

And *again* you are "putting words in my mouth" (I wish you wouldn't do that as I am not doing that to you).

Firstly Nxt =/= NXT they are two different things.

Nxt is the platform and NXT is the "fuel" that it runs on - these are just the plain facts that I am stating.

So NXT *is* a crypto-currency but *it is not equivalent to LTC and other Bitcoin clones*. You can only compare "apples to apples".

Actually as a currency Nxt can and should be compared to other alts. Absolutely. POS vs. POW.

Green apples to red apples.

As an exchange it should be compared to MC, Emunie, and others.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: BrianNowhere on March 18, 2014, 01:18:09 AM

You seem to be sending a strong SELL message. Not sure if you care, but that's what I'm getting. I can just wait for the new assets to come out, no reason to stick around, is pretty much what you are saying.

That I guess is how you have decided to interpret my posts.

Buy or sell is up to you and others - it's a free market!

(personally "I am holding")

windjc

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Activity: 2156

Merit: 1070

Quote from: BrianNowhere on March 18, 2014, 01:18:09 AM

Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 12:57:08 AM

Quote from: BrianNowhere on March 18, 2014, 12:54:38 AM

If you have powers to predict markets so well you could make a lot of money on Wall St.

I don't have such powers although I did make quite a bit of money from a few well chosen stocks (such as Sun Microsystems back in the early 90's).

I am "no hippie" but I do *get* what Nxt actually *is*. It is *not* another "pump and dump copy coin" but instead a *platform*.

Right from the start Nxt was presented without the word "coin" and this among other things was *deliberate*.

You could unzip your pants and stick your wang in the Nasdaq in the 90's and make money. I don't think Mr. Buffet or Soros has to worry about being dethroned anytime soon.

Well I'm glad we've had this discussion and I understand more now what I've suspected for a while now about both Nxt and Ripple, which is that both believe they can exist in a vacuum somehow unencumbered by market forces.

At least Ripple has made their system scalable. If the price of XRp went up the fees would still be infinitesimal. You seem to not be worried at all about contingency in case you are wrong, which is something I would think any good programmer should always be thinking about and why I say it's very concerning to me.

You seem to be sending a strong SELL message. Not sure if you care, but that's what I'm getting. I can just wait for the new assets to come out, no reason to stick around, is pretty much what you are saying.

I don't think Ian even realizes the message he is actually sending. But you should spend more time looking at what everyone else in the community is working on before forming an opinion on the state of things.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:16:55 AM

But, again, you seem to dismiss Nxt as a currency. Makes no sense. It can exist as both, despite the original developers initial intentions, if we even know what those were/are.

And *again* you are "putting words in my mouth" (I wish you wouldn't do that as I am not doing that to you).

Firstly Nxt =/= NXT they are two different things.

Nxt is the platform and NXT is the "fuel" that it runs on - these are just the plain facts that I am stating.

So NXT *is* a crypto-currency but *it is not equivalent to LTC and other Bitcoin clones*. You can only compare "apples to apples".

BrianNowhere

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 12:57:08 AM

Quote from: BrianNowhere on March 18, 2014, 12:54:38 AM

If you have powers to predict markets so well you could make a lot of money on Wall St.

I don't have such powers although I did make quite a bit of money from a few well chosen stocks (such as Sun Microsystems back in the early 90's).

I am "no hippie" but I do *get* what Nxt actually *is*. It is *not* another "pump and dump copy coin" but instead a *platform*.

Right from the start Nxt was presented without the word "coin" and this among other things was *deliberate*.

You could unzip your pants and stick your wang in the Nasdaq in the 90's and make money. I don't think Mr. Buffet or Soros has to worry about being dethroned anytime soon.

Well I'm glad we've had this discussion and I understand more now what I've suspected for a while now about both Nxt and Ripple, which is that both believe they can exist in a vacuum somehow unencumbered by market forces.

At least Ripple has made their system scalable. If the price of XRp went up the fees would still be infinitesimal. You seem to not be worried at all about contingency in case you are wrong, which is something I would think any good programmer should always be thinking about and why I say it's very concerning to me.

You seem to be sending a strong SELL message. Not sure if you care, but that's what I'm getting. I can just wait for the new assets to come out, no reason to stick around, is pretty much what you are saying.

2Kool4Skewl

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Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:13:43 AM

Quote from: 2Kool4Skewl on March 18, 2014, 01:12:23 AM

Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:03:25 AM

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:00:55 AM

You said "The value of NXT *can never be very high".

Yes - but what is *very* - hardly a "specific" number right?

Logically if 1 NXT is 1 USD right now then no-one would use the Nxt platform as it would cost you 1 USD to send 1 USD.

This is part of the reason why the NXT tx fee should be reduced. Low tx fees encourages NXT to be used as a platform and will help support its price.

Agreed. This idea that Nxt cannot be a currency AND a platform is so very odd to me. Bitcoin is both. Albiet a different platform.

I don't think Ian dismissed the fact that NXT is both a currency and a platform. You can't have one without the other.

windjc

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:15:21 AM

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:12:31 AM

But as I do not think investors should run around complaining about or celebrating prices, I also don't think developers should condescendingly dismiss investors concerns.

Investors are the marketers, the mouth pieces for innovation. Bitcoin, had there been no promise of value, no speculators, would not exists as it does today if at all.

In no way am I trying to "be condescending" - just pointing out that NXT is not like LTC or other Bitcoin clones (so investors should be aware of this and what being a "platform" implies).

But, again, you seem to dismiss Nxt as a currency (and it should be pointed out that those "clones" are not good currency options). Makes no sense. It can exist as both, despite the original developers initial intentions, if we even know what those were/are.

windjc

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Quote from: eightspaces on March 18, 2014, 01:02:02 AM

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:00:55 AM

Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 12:59:57 AM

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 12:57:27 AM

Going around telling people to accept the fact that Nxt won't be worth much just because you have a vision for it that you desire, is disingenious and and really is just counter productive.

I am doing no such thing - I am simply pointing out that the "market will decide" what the value of NXT will be and what the "parameters" are.

You said "The value of NXT *can never be very high".

Why waste ur time guys?

Your condescension only reflects on you. If you dismiss my points out of hand, you are too narrow minded to be a leader in the Nxt movement. Not that you can't serve other purposes.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:12:31 AM

But as I do not think investors should run around complaining about or celebrating prices, I also don't think developers should condescendingly dismiss investors concerns.

Investors are the marketers, the mouth pieces for innovation. Bitcoin, had there been no promise of value, no speculators, would not exists as it does today if at all.

In no way am I trying to "be condescending" - just pointing out that NXT is not like LTC or other Bitcoin clones (so investors should be aware of this and what being a "platform" implies).

If people have invested in NXT thinking it is just like LTC then they have "not done their due diligence".

windjc

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Quote from: 2Kool4Skewl on March 18, 2014, 01:12:23 AM

Quote from: CIYAM on March 18, 2014, 01:03:25 AM

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:00:55 AM

You said "The value of NXT *can never be very high".

Yes - but what is *very* - hardly a "specific" number right?

Logically if 1 NXT is 1 USD right now then no-one would use the Nxt platform as it would cost you 1 USD to send 1 USD.

This is part of the reason why the NXT tx fee should be reduced. Low tx fees encourages NXT to be used as a platform and will help support its price.

Agreed. This idea that Nxt cannot be a currency AND a platform is so very odd to me. Bitcoin is both. Albiet a different platform.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: windjc on March 18, 2014, 01:09:49 AM

Right. But you assume that the cost to make a transaction would always be 1 Nxt. Unless this is an ultimatum that cannot ever change, then I am not sure why this matters.

At the moment it does - and soon it will likely change to being 0.1 (from memory that was what was most popular) - so as I said some smart math guy could probably come up with some sort of formula that involves the "available supply" of Nxt and the number of transactions and predict the likely value of it (not me though as I am not so good with math).

Micro transactions are really not something that any blockchain is going to handle perfectly although with Nxt the idea of being able to regularly *shrink* the blockchain will certainly make it a better option than say Bitcoin.

Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information - page 289. (Read 2761645 times)