NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information - page 346.

rickyjames

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Quote from: farl4web on March 14, 2014, 07:37:28 AM

Quote from: Touque on March 13, 2014, 07:19:48 PM

If you run a NXT node, you are supposed to receive NXTcoins and it is called forging.

You don't understand it. Running a node is not the same as forging. This mistake is maybe the cause of all the miscommunication here?

Forging:
People unlock their account on a simple computer and are chosen to generate a block. You will receive the fees of that block in your account.
Forging is free, just turn your computer on.

Running node:
Nodes are servers which will help stabilize and secure the network. You don't earn fees of blocks.
Running a node is running a dedicated server and can cost money.

Is this really true? If you are running NRS 0.8.9 on a node, you are ineligible to be selected to forge a block and receive the standard NXT fee award for forging that block? If so, this is news to me. How does NRS 0.8.9 know you are running a node and not an open client and so exclude you from generating a block? How is DGex managing to forge so many NXT with all the NXT they are holding from clients? You're telling me Graviton has 50 million of other people's NXT running on his laptop computer with an open client and not a rackmount server node?

Somebody tell me one more time what the difference is between an open client and a node, and what hallmarking is and what good it does. I thought a node was the same as an open client on a laptop, it could just handle more bandwidth.

zorke

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Quote

Personally... I do view Nodecoin as just a project/asset/coin... but let me make one thing clear... IF the intention of "Nodecoin should be redeemable for accessing services (DAC, NxtCash, whatever)" was to exclude NXT from being used as well... then it is definitely a NO GO.

You are 100% right. I agree also with this one.

martismartis

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Quote from: farl4web on March 14, 2014, 07:37:28 AM

Quote from: Touque on March 13, 2014, 07:19:48 PM

If you run a NXT node, you are supposed to receive NXTcoins and it is called forging.

You don't understand it. Running a node is not the same as forging. This mistake is maybe the cause of all the miscommunication here?

Forging:
People unlock their account on a simple computer and are chosen to generate a block. You will receive the fees of that block in your account.
Forging is free, just turn your computer on. AND UNLOCK ACCOUNT

Running node:
Nodes are servers which will help stabilize and secure the network. You don't earn fees of blocks.
Running a node is running a dedicated server and can cost money.

rickyjames

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Activity: 196

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Quote from: abctc on March 14, 2014, 06:56:02 AM

Quote from: Pouncer on March 14, 2014, 06:21:46 AM

... Reasons why it is not any ordinary coin:-
1. It was designed to be used as an integral part of Nxt. At the heart of any crypto currency is the blockchain, and how it is secured. NodeCoin has been positioned to be the mechanism to (help) secure it. ...

- why so many talks about nodecoin? peerexplorer.com also has a mechanism to support nodeowners, but nobody objects.

Btw, there is a shortage in "cashes" at peerexplorer.com ATM, it would be good, if someone made some "cashes". I've made some.

With all due respect to the excellent product you have created at peerexplorer.com, it is not a $50 million capitalized group endeavor that we are hoping to grow into a multi-billion dollar resource for public use.

landomata

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: chanc3r on March 14, 2014, 07:31:54 AM

Quote from: landomata on March 14, 2014, 07:06:46 AM

Main point is we have to make nodecoin un-trade-able (remove speculation) so the only way to get Nodecoin is to run a node.

I have said the same thing myself in different ways... I think 'limit' is probably achievable...
Lets see how this develops in inf-com.

that sounds great.. like getting vouchers from a supermarket.. you have to "shop" there to get vouchers and vouchers are only redeemable for there goods and not redeemable for cash! you have to run a node to get nodecoins and node coins are only redeemable for nxt at a set price and not trade-able.

EXACTLY

wesleyh

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Quote from: rdanneskjoldr on March 14, 2014, 07:36:35 AM

1- For nodecoins to have monetary value,it requires people buying them or donating nxt.Let it be something private,and an emergency mechanism for the community to protect the network .If someone would like to spend some extra money protecting it, he just would have to donate some Nxt.But as we are going to have a lot of activity on the AE,i think nodecoins will be worth nothing very soon.Unless you people who are in favour of nodecoins,want to keep donating Nxt to give it some value.Money has to come from somewhere.

2º- @Wesleyh- Can it be interesting to create private assets??With a password requested to purchase them or something.This way enterprises or whoever can issue assets to just run in a private circle.This is not yet possible, and if its something symbolic,other people could distort it by taking them if they cost close to nothing.

I don't make the api, however an enterprise can transfer assets itself it does not have to put them on the exchange.

farl4web

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Quote from: Touque on March 13, 2014, 07:19:48 PM

If you run a NXT node, you are supposed to receive NXTcoins and it is called forging.

You don't understand it. Running a node is not the same as forging. This mistake is maybe the cause of all the miscommunication here?

Forging:
People unlock their account on a simple computer and are chosen to generate a block. You will receive the fees of that block in your account.
Forging is free, just turn your computer on.

Running node:
Nodes are servers which will help stabilize and secure the network. You don't earn fees of blocks.
Running a node is running a dedicated server and can cost money.

rdanneskjoldr

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Activity: 288

Merit: 250

1- For nodecoins to have monetary value,it requires people buying them or donating nxt.Let it be something private,and an emergency mechanism for the community to protect the network .If someone would like to spend some extra money protecting it, he just would have to donate some Nxt.But as we are going to have a lot of activity on the AE,i think nodecoins will be worth nothing very soon.Unless you people who are in favour of nodecoins,want to keep donating Nxt to give it some value.Money has to come from somewhere.

2º- @Wesleyh- Can it be interesting to create private assets??With a password requested to purchase them or something.This way enterprises or whoever can issue assets to just run in a private circle.This is not yet possible, and if its something symbolic,other people could distort it by taking them if they cost close to nothing.

wesleyh

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Quote from: rickyjames on March 14, 2014, 07:34:13 AM

No. Nodecoin is not "just" an asset if it is integrated / hardwired into the client software in a way that no other created asset on AE is that is just TRADED there, and if it is automatically given away to certain client users in a way that no other created asset is.

It's not integrated in any client software. It will only be given if the users asks for it. (not like now on testnet).

rickyjames

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Quote from: mcjavar on March 14, 2014, 06:42:39 AM

Quote from: Pouncer on March 14, 2014, 06:21:46 AM

Quote from: rickyjames on March 14, 2014, 04:40:46 AM

Where nodecoin becomes part of the fabric of NXT is if we as a community decides to offer it as an official ongoing reward to run a computer and support our network.

Once we do this, once we cross over this line, we can no longer call ourselves a pure Proof of Stake cryptocurrency.

We will have changed the core definition of what NXT is if the NXT experience is expanded to include the awarding of nodecoin along with the forging of NXT.

This is the key point of rj's argument. Nodecoin is not any "ordinary" coin anyone can create on top of Nxt. If it were, no one would have any reason to object to it.

Reasons why it is not any ordinary coin:-

1. It was designed to be used as an integral part of Nxt. At the heart of any crypto currency is the blockchain, and how it is secured. NodeCoin has been positioned to be the mechanism to (help) secure it. Anything, whose function is to secure the network will be seen as an integral part of Nxt, whether it is in the NRS core or otherwise. This alters, or at least can be perceived to alter, the DNA and hence the very identity of Nxt. Therefore it cannot be treated as just an ordinary coin anybody can build.

2. It is designed to power the key engines of Nxt (AE, gateways, NXTCash, NXTmixer, etc), which are projects funded by the community. "Nodecoin should be redeemable for accessing services (DAC, NxtCash, whatever)". So if a Nxter has millions of Nxt but no NodeCoins, he has to buy them just to uses the very services that are suppose to make Nxt unique? That makes NodeCoins to be more superior in function than NXT.

Edit: I hope I have got this point wrong!

3. It has been positioned by James as a non-profit, community project. This gives further credence to Ricky's point that "we as a community decide to offer it as an official ongoing reward to run a computer and support our network". If this has been privately developed by James as a random Nxter, this association will be absent.

If we agree that it is no ordinary coin for the above reasons, then we should consider Ricky's point about NodeCoin altering the very fabric of Nxt; and not just brushing it aside as just a coin anybody can create on top of Nxt.

You all have to understand that it is out of our power/control to decide if Nodecoin (or any other coin) will be built ontop of Nxt.
It is an asset. People will decide if they use it or not.

Quote from: martismartis on March 14, 2014, 06:44:02 AM

Nodecoin is ASSET!!! Don't mix with coin/project/whatever.

No. Nodecoin is not "just" an asset if it is integrated / hardwired into the client software in a way that no other created asset on AE is that is just TRADED there, and if it is automatically given away to certain client users in a way that no other created asset is.

wesleyh

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Quote from: chanc3r on March 14, 2014, 07:31:54 AM

Quote from: landomata on March 14, 2014, 07:06:46 AM

Main point is we have to make nodecoin un-trade-able (remove speculation) so the only way to get Nodecoin is to run a node.

I have said the same thing myself in different ways... I think 'limit' is probably achievable...
Lets see how this develops in inf-com.

And then what? If not tradeable, it's useless.

chanc3r

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Quote from: landomata on March 14, 2014, 07:06:46 AM

Main point is we have to make nodecoin un-trade-able (remove speculation) so the only way to get Nodecoin is to run a node.

I have said the same thing myself in different ways... I think 'limit' is probably achievable...
Lets see how this develops in inf-com.

wesleyh

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Activity: 308

Merit: 250

Quote from: ?? on ??

@wesley im also thinking a bit mad here but could you intergrate some sort of txt alert for when you receive payment or when buy sell orders are filled and so on? or would there be any point in that?

You should already receive notification if buy / sell orders are filled. Receive payment, sure will do.

Damelon

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Quote from: ?? on ??

@damelon

good point! didnt realsie beta max had the porn industry lol

if anything i think we can apply this to bitcoin/master and nxt.. bitcoin has been blackend by silkroad and money luandering the same way beta max was by porn. nxt is the newer faster smoother "cleaner" versoin lol

You misunderstand: VHS had the porn industry! That's why it became to be used by many people Cheesy

Betamax actually missed the boat on that one.

Ludom

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Quote from: swartzfeger on March 14, 2014, 04:18:13 AM

Quote from: Ludom on March 14, 2014, 03:04:46 AM

My english sucks and it's why I don't write a lot here.

But this time, I should say : What's the problem with Nodecoin and the work of James ?

Nodecoin is "just" an Asset... like others. There is no danger for NXT. The security is always based on NXT. No change.

About the value of Nodecoin, it's simple : if nobody buy Nodecoin, the value is 0. If you think that is useful, you can buy some and it has some value. The value depends of the NXTers.

If you don't have NXT and no money to buy some, you can have some Nodecoin. But the goal of Nodecoin is to buy eventually some NXT to forge.

Message to James : continue to work. Your things are great. NXT needs your projects. Don't take attention to the haters and hear the silent majority who like your work. I'm one of them.

You're English is perfect for contributing here; participate!

You're opinion is valued (although everyone may not agree). I agree with a lot of what you posted, at least the spirit of it.

You have no idea how many time I need to write one sentence. Undecided

daysi

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https://i.imgur.com/AjnBlES.gif

no pressure Cool

https://nextcoin.org/index.php/topic,3652.15.html

Damelon

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Quote from: ?? on ??

if anything nxt will be the VHS to mastercoins beta max

Dangerous metaphor, because Betamax was actually better, but remained relatively obscure due to VHS having

a) the porn industry
and
b) better marketing

Not implying that porn = better marketing by the way. Wink

apenzl

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Quote from: landomata on March 14, 2014, 06:24:38 AM

Idea:

1) Inf-Com puts up 1,000,000 Nxt. in an account.....issues a Sell on AE....sets the price at 100 Nodecoin for 1 Nxt or whatever ....then if anyone who has been running his node has 100 nodecoin he can redeem it and get 1 nxt.

Nodecoins should not be transferable. Once they are redeemed they should be send back to the nodepool for collection by others.

+1

I see Nodecoin as a push to jumpstart us. In time, we will have:

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on February 10, 2014, 04:23:28 AM

True reward for supporting Nxt network comes from services that use Nxt. Someone owns a currency exchange and mine blocks to keep his business running. Another one owns a shop and mine blocks to keep his business running. The 3rd person owns a software company that develops programs for Nxt-based services and mine blocks to keep his business running. Selfish miners (those who mine only to earn fees) should be "removed" from the system, they r not interested in success of Nxt and only want to cash-out.

Also this

Quote from: ?? on ??

Personally... I do view Nodecoin as just a project/asset/coin... but let me make one thing clear... IF the intention of "Nodecoin should be redeemable for accessing services (DAC, NxtCash, whatever)" was to exclude NXT from being used as well... then it is definitely a NO GO.

+++++!

ShroomsKit_Disgrace

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Yeah! I hate ShroomsKit!

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: ShroomsKit_Disgrace on March 14, 2014, 06:56:55 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

12 hours before mastercoin AE goes live and they are down 7% in the last 24hours.... hhmmm people must not have much faith in there AE... or just have more faith in ours! Cheesy

Any thoughts about Mastercoin AE? Will it be a killer? Wouldn't ppl say now: why AE in NXT if we have one with Mastercoin on top of Bitcoin?
Excuse my ignorance if I am overlooking something too obvious here.

i seriously doubt mastercoin AE will kill nxt... if anything nxt will be the VHS to mastercoins beta max... because mastercoin runs on bitcoin everything will take ten mins to confirm and you also need the bitcoind/qt running in the background and have to download the blockchain (which for new users takes ages and takes allot of memory!) nxt on the other hand... is 10 times faster... uses a webclient ie. no blockchain download or client download or background client download.. it ~~looks~~ is more user friendly.

when do you think people will be able to use masterchest on mobile devices? probably a very long time due to downloads and block chain ect... nxt can be modified to work on mobile devices including apple devices because its web bassed! its guna tear the shite outa mastercoin AE!

So many thanks!!!!
I think you (and thereby, NXT) have a HUGE point here. We should let the "crypto-public" appreciate the benefits of our AE and so on. MARKETING!

landomata

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Quote from: chanc3r on March 14, 2014, 07:00:47 AM

Quote from: landomata on March 14, 2014, 06:24:38 AM

Idea:

Don't know the feasibility of it though.

1) Inf-Com puts up 1,000,000 Nxt. in an account.....issues a Sell on AE....sets the price at 100 Nodecoin for 1 Nxt or whatever ....then if anyone who has been running his node has 100 nodecoin he can redeem it and get 1 nxt.

Nodecoins should not be transferable once they are redeemed they should be send back to the nodepool for collection by others.

I'm sure we can fix the Nodecoin generation rate so the program can run for x amount of time.

This is a rough idea....I don;t have the time to think this thru into more details.

It will allow new nxters to determine how much Nxt they can get if they run their clients for x amount of time.

Its already for discussion in the Inf-Com bitbucket and will be discussed in the Inf-Com thread.
Hidden in James posts is also some network mapping capabilities of node coin which may be of use in management of the network.

Main point is we have to make nodecoin un-trade-able (remove speculation) so the only way to get Nodecoin is to run a node.

Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information - page 346. (Read 2761645 times)