Topic: Official BITMINE CoinCraft series 28nm ASIC miners thread - page 89. (Read 565240 times)

Let me know what fans you are getting, I'm considering upgrading my as well

~n

which "sunday" or "today"  did you mean ?

Thanks for the detailed explanation.

Let's hope Giorgio is reading and simply pays the refunds as they have promised.

I'm not (yet) a lawyer, but im familiar with the swiss law. Don't hold me accountable for my opinion though

My opinion on their TOS / CPP:

In Switzerland, customers are well protected in case of Consumer contracts (B2C). If the contracts between Bitmine / Consumers would be considered as such a contract, their TOS / CPP would definetly be abusive and would't hold up in court. But I don't think we're talking about consumer contracts here:

Art. 32 of the Swiss Civil Procedure Codes states, what consumer contracts are:

"Consumer contracts are contracts on supplies for ordinary consumption intended for the personal use of the consumer or his family and offered by the other party in the course of its professional or commercial activity."

Since Switzerland has the "freedom of contract", I assume that their TOS / CPP are legit. I'm not 100% sure about this. If Bitmine doesn't hold up to their TOS / CPP, they breach the contract and are responsible for this breach.

In case they don't refund me in time (including a short grace period), they breach their TOS. With this behavior, they can only win some time, but would definetly loose in front of a court.

My worst concern is, that bitmine already is illiquid. In this case, it's not going to be easy to get my money back.

This is how I'm going to proceed:

- No refund withing grace period --> file a Betreibung (compulsory execution) --> since I don't have a so called "Rechtsöffnungstitel" (dismissal of objection), i have to file a "normal" law suit at the court of bellinzona, which prior requires a mediation. --> If I win the court proceedings (which I think is waterproof), Il get the above mentioned "Rechtsöffnungstitel", which allowes me to continue the compulsory execution. If they still don't pay me, I'm allowed to file a petition for bankruptcy. If the judge declares bankruptcy, all assets from bitmine will be seized and bitmine will loose power of disposition. The seized money will be handed percentualy to all creditors.

There also is a possibilty to directly file a petition for bankruptcy, if they stop paying all their creditors. But the requirement to file such a petition is very high. If we can prove, that the systematicly dind't pay anybody who asked for a refund, this is a possibilty.

This is the procedure to get your money back. On the other hand, I see a good chance (I don't clame that he did violate!) that bitmine (or especially Giorgo) violated the Swiss fair trade law or even the swiss penalty code. In this case, a law suit will be filed directly againts Giorgo (not Bitmine). If many customers file a complaint at the police office, the authoroties have to act ex officio.

It's not easy to explain the procedure in english. I'll keep you updated. If Bitmine forces me persueing the legal way, I'll (legaly) do anything to bring them to justice, also willing to group up with you guys to enforce our rights!

Sorry for all the mistakes and my sloppy english, but I'm in a hurry.

also handy to order 3000rpm FAN's (2) for front side.
Without temp will rise 57+ degree C, with FAN 43 degree C

...either they delivered without (at least 20 days) delay, or they owe you additional hash rate due to "terms of services" and "customer protection plan".
And they owe you a power supply or the refund for it. I estimate you have chosen to recieve the device without the power supply. But why?

In the meantime you can use a second power supply for powering the 2 remaining modules. I don't have it at hand, but I know of guides how to power up a PSU short-circuiting the right pins of the ATX connector. But please do intensive investigations and ask yourself if you are technically capable of doing such a thing before you risk your life in one way or another!

[edit]
I've found a guide: http://www.built-to-spec.com/blog/2011/12/20/testing-and-using-an-atx-power-supply-outside-of-a-pc/
use at own risk!
[/edit]

.. they do already .. sent the refund request and got the receipt after 5 (!) days 

1TH fully populated, 5 modules.
Using 3 atm.

No futher notifications received from Bitmine.

@atta2k15
Did you buy that fully populated or is one or another module additional hash rate granted by the CPP?
If you bought it fully populated, do you have an announcement for the shipment of the additional hash rate?

OK finally have my miner @ home. Proud of piece of hardware.
Looks solid and decent, am happy with it.










3 modules @ 200GH/s

for now have to do it with old PSU's,
!! BITMINE am waiting for BTC for the needed PSU !!

we're gonna need a bigger boat

Logged in again, read the thread, logged out again....

Unbelievable, this is the head of this headless company....ignorance at its best!

Sending the refund requests via registered mail would be the best option, as you can then prove after 30 days that they actually received the request.

Afterwards you can get a court to recognize the money they owe you fairly easily and have a proof that you used your right to cancel.

Bitmine is legally bound to their terms of service, even "more" than they are to standard business practices. (Meaning it is easier to collect)

If you have a court recognize the debt you can fairly easily have them forced to pay and will be able to collect further damages if they delay your refund any longer.


My two cents worth of opinion is that they will simply pay your refund if they see you are playing legal hardball, e.g. by sticking to the normal practices before you get a court to order them to pay.

This starts with sending your refund request by registered mail, as it will be quite easy for them to simply deny the receipt of your refund request if you only email them, or they will use some other delay tactics.
(If the answer "we didnt receive any refund requests via email" will hold up in court is another question, as there are ways to prove it, but you should always make things easy for yourself)

Anyone got any response from support the last days? Seems that there is no money left for at least a single supporter.

They have money. This is one of their addresses:

https://blockchain.info/address/1Cz1pTK8GxsJqdHQrFLWh77WwYsyqyDX3k

1977 BTC in there currently - that's $850k. I am awaiting just over 15 BTC (at yesterday's closing price), so plenty to repay there.

My background is in IT journalism.  If I don't get my refund due to Bitmine being shysters, or Bitmine going bust, then I will be writing them up for the IT press and probably the Daily Mail, who like Bitcoin related crash and burn stories.

Again, I'll re-iterate; the moment I get my refund I'm gone. I have no interest in staying here just to cause hassle.

Bitmine needs to sell the BCT mined with customer's hardware.

in that case jail is inescapable.

but be sure they have the money.
apparently bitmine thinks they can keep the money for no effort.

It seems that they don't have money for refunds...

@Giorgio: Do you mean the other "today"? You just crossed the line again, enough is enough.


At least you could write a short message, for sure you read this stuff here. You are just ruining your future buisness at all if there will be any.