I think at this point what we should hope is an official statement.
These moves from Bitfinex have heavily influenced the trading of the coin and should not remain unanswered for a too long period of time imo.
Both for Darkcoin and the website.
Topic: [OFFICIAL]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading - page 191. (Read 723903 times)
June 02, 2014, 11:01:36 AM
June 02, 2014, 06:38:15 AM
The point I was trying to make was that it doesn't make an exchange any more or less of a target by carrying so called 'anonymous' coins.
As far as regulators are concerned there are not different types of crypto - there's just 1 - the crypto economy. They don't give a sh*t if a particular coin is anonymous or not. As far as they're concerned they all are due to the simple fact that there's no counter party involved as with fiat.
As far as regulators are concerned there are not different types of crypto - there's just 1 - the crypto economy. They don't give a sh*t if a particular coin is anonymous or not. As far as they're concerned they all are due to the simple fact that there's no counter party involved as with fiat.
June 01, 2014, 11:00:47 PM
if used correctly its fairly anonymous. one of the first rules is to use one address per transaction. no one listens because they like addresses with high balances so coins become more track-able
June 01, 2014, 10:26:41 PM
Sure.
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
I don't agree with this being as significant issue as everyone' string to make it out to be.
The bitcoin blockchain is anonymous.
Although you can 'track' transactions, they are moving between addresses which do not correspond to real world identities. You might be able to find out who has a private key for a particular address or you might not.
DRK takes this 1 step further by obfuscating the actual transactions themselves.
The idea that regulators are going to be happy with one of these and not the other is a bit ridiculous I think. They will have a monumental problem with both and if they have the first clue about whats good for the Fiat money system will not allow crypto anywhere near it in any shape or form.
There are other reasons for this which are much more important than anonymity. In particular the fact that crypto is unlevered base money. That makes it a threat (a bit like precious metals) to a money system which is levered off a fixed capital base and underwritten by nothing more than private debt.
IP address is easy to trace for transaction that uses blockchain.
DRK, on the other hand, uses multiple layers random seed to make it almost impossible to trace.
June 01, 2014, 08:10:36 PM
Sure.
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
I don't agree with this being as significant issue as everyone' string to make it out to be.
The bitcoin blockchain is anonymous.
Although you can 'track' transactions, they are moving between addresses which do not correspond to real world identities. You might be able to find out who has a private key for a particular address or you might not.
DRK takes this 1 step further by obfuscating the actual transactions themselves.
The idea that regulators are going to be happy with one of these and not the other is a bit ridiculous I think. They will have a monumental problem with both and if they have the first clue about whats good for the Fiat money system will not allow crypto anywhere near it in any shape or form.
There are other reasons for this which are much more important than anonymity. In particular the fact that crypto is unlevered base money. That makes it a threat (a bit like precious metals) to a money system which is levered off a fixed capital base and underwritten by nothing more than private debt.
June 01, 2014, 07:27:13 PM
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
http://youtu.be/M7bbDpwlTws?t=11m40s
Wow! How can a single person say so much, but actually say so little.... Basically she totally avoided answering the question. But reading between the lines she said the on the sliding scale transparanty has a higher priority than privacy, so I woudln't be surprised if later in the course of history the agencies will try to prevent obfusicated transactions to help their cause.
June 01, 2014, 06:52:14 PM
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
http://youtu.be/M7bbDpwlTws?t=11m40s
June 01, 2014, 05:35:53 PM
is the bitstamp-bitfinex link so that arbitrage is not possible? i.e. if bitstamp price is lower than you cant buy @ the bistamp price and vice versa; but then, how comes they have the same price-curves, how is the linking explainable practically? thx
it is there to add liquidity, not to prevent arbitrage. Arbitrage is something positive for the market and the trading sites.
ok, but how comes my orders @ bitstamp prices are never filled, if bitfinex prices are higher?
Because Bitfinex doesn't have funds 100% of the time on bitstamp. Also you have to calculate the spread that gets added. Trading fees on BFX <<
thats not possible is it? they are routing the order to bitstamp after adding/substracting bitstamp fees, so one bitstamp order generates revenue for bitfinex? i think the fees bitfinex pays to bitstamp are included in the fees that bitfinex takes from the customers.
Raphael said here that Bitfinex is no longer brokering Bitstamp orders
Oh, sorry I missed that.
yeah, but very interesting posting indeed; correct me if i´m wrong: some days ago i read a post from raphael or giancarlo stating that they just met with the bitstamp guys and everything is fine with them and so on - and now the link is cut??? thats a major change - was there an annoucement or any news? or am i misunderstanding something?
edit: here´s the link to the post:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.6913625
June 01, 2014, 05:00:09 PM
is the bitstamp-bitfinex link so that arbitrage is not possible? i.e. if bitstamp price is lower than you cant buy @ the bistamp price and vice versa; but then, how comes they have the same price-curves, how is the linking explainable practically? thx
it is there to add liquidity, not to prevent arbitrage. Arbitrage is something positive for the market and the trading sites.
ok, but how comes my orders @ bitstamp prices are never filled, if bitfinex prices are higher?
Because Bitfinex doesn't have funds 100% of the time on bitstamp. Also you have to calculate the spread that gets added. Trading fees on BFX <<
thats not possible is it? they are routing the order to bitstamp after adding/substracting bitstamp fees, so one bitstamp order generates revenue for bitfinex? i think the fees bitfinex pays to bitstamp are included in the fees that bitfinex takes from the customers.
Raphael said here that Bitfinex is no longer brokering Bitstamp orders
Oh, sorry I missed that.
yeah, but very interesting posting indeed; correct me if i´m wrong: some days ago i read a post from raphael or giancarlo stating that they just met with the bitstamp guys and everything is fine with them and so on - and now the link is cut??? thats a major change - was there an annoucement or any news? or am i misunderstanding something?
edit: here´s the link to the post:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.6913625
Maybe what he meant on reddit was that they are not a broker anymore and don't allow users to choose to root their orders. Now this is all done automatically and you will not even know if funds are on BSTMP or not.
thats the problem with their statements, its 90% clear and 10% it could mean anything else. slowly but surely i start to supect that the cause why they never announce anything on the site, but on reddit and bitcointalk is "plausible deniability" ..
June 01, 2014, 04:57:22 PM
is the bitstamp-bitfinex link so that arbitrage is not possible? i.e. if bitstamp price is lower than you cant buy @ the bistamp price and vice versa; but then, how comes they have the same price-curves, how is the linking explainable practically? thx
it is there to add liquidity, not to prevent arbitrage. Arbitrage is something positive for the market and the trading sites.
ok, but how comes my orders @ bitstamp prices are never filled, if bitfinex prices are higher?
Because Bitfinex doesn't have funds 100% of the time on bitstamp. Also you have to calculate the spread that gets added. Trading fees on BFX <<
thats not possible is it? they are routing the order to bitstamp after adding/substracting bitstamp fees, so one bitstamp order generates revenue for bitfinex? i think the fees bitfinex pays to bitstamp are included in the fees that bitfinex takes from the customers.
Raphael said here that Bitfinex is no longer brokering Bitstamp orders
Oh, sorry I missed that.
yeah, but very interesting posting indeed; correct me if i´m wrong: some days ago i read a post from raphael or giancarlo stating that they just met with the bitstamp guys and everything is fine with them and so on - and now the link is cut??? thats a major change - was there an annoucement or any news? or am i misunderstanding something?
edit: here´s the link to the post:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.6913625
Maybe what he meant on reddit was that they are not a broker anymore and don't allow users to choose to root their orders. Now this is all done automatically and you will not even know if funds are on BSTMP or not.
June 01, 2014, 04:52:07 PM
You guys realize that Bitifinex is looking at the $, which is what any exchange with half a mind would do.
Darkcoin has A Lot of buys/sell every hour, much less everyday. There are Buys in the 100s of BTC's.
Dark would bring Bitifinex a lot of new revenue...
Darkcoin has A Lot of buys/sell every hour, much less everyday. There are Buys in the 100s of BTC's.
Dark would bring Bitifinex a lot of new revenue...
Yes but I guess a lot of traders frown apon adding such a coin and will consider leaving this site. There aren't only upsides
The amount of traders coming in, with 100s of BTC and USD to trade DRK will far outnumber the # leaving because of ignorant reasons frankly..
Sure.
Don't call them ignorant reasons please.
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
2. DRK has a way-higher volatitlity and lenders don't want to lend to such a risky investment with margin. We know that bitfinex says the money is guaranteed, but we all know that it is only backed by the funds stored on the site, if the total amount available drops below the amount owed to lenders, then they can't pay without running fractional exchange.
Plus DRK may just be all hype with little sustainability.
Adding DRK now would only fuel the bubble which is not healthy.
If they are serious about DRK, they should just wait a couple of months. See if people are still interested in it and then perhaps add it. Now is not the best time.
June 01, 2014, 04:42:49 PM
is the bitstamp-bitfinex link so that arbitrage is not possible? i.e. if bitstamp price is lower than you cant buy @ the bistamp price and vice versa; but then, how comes they have the same price-curves, how is the linking explainable practically? thx
it is there to add liquidity, not to prevent arbitrage. Arbitrage is something positive for the market and the trading sites.
ok, but how comes my orders @ bitstamp prices are never filled, if bitfinex prices are higher?
Because Bitfinex doesn't have funds 100% of the time on bitstamp. Also you have to calculate the spread that gets added. Trading fees on BFX <<
thats not possible is it? they are routing the order to bitstamp after adding/substracting bitstamp fees, so one bitstamp order generates revenue for bitfinex? i think the fees bitfinex pays to bitstamp are included in the fees that bitfinex takes from the customers.
Raphael said here that Bitfinex is no longer brokering Bitstamp orders
Oh, sorry I missed that.
yeah, but very interesting posting indeed; correct me if i´m wrong: some days ago i read a post from raphael or giancarlo stating that they just met with the bitstamp guys and everything is fine with them and so on - and now the link is cut??? thats a major change - was there an annoucement or any news? or am i misunderstanding something?
edit: here´s the link to the post:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.6913625
June 01, 2014, 04:37:15 PM
is the bitstamp-bitfinex link so that arbitrage is not possible? i.e. if bitstamp price is lower than you cant buy @ the bistamp price and vice versa; but then, how comes they have the same price-curves, how is the linking explainable practically? thx
it is there to add liquidity, not to prevent arbitrage. Arbitrage is something positive for the market and the trading sites.
ok, but how comes my orders @ bitstamp prices are never filled, if bitfinex prices are higher?
Because Bitfinex doesn't have funds 100% of the time on bitstamp. Also you have to calculate the spread that gets added. Trading fees on BFX <<
thats not possible is it? they are routing the order to bitstamp after adding/substracting bitstamp fees, so one bitstamp order generates revenue for bitfinex? i think the fees bitfinex pays to bitstamp are included in the fees that bitfinex takes from the customers.
Raphael said here that Bitfinex is no longer brokering Bitstamp orders
Oh, sorry I missed that.
June 01, 2014, 04:36:47 PM
I see your concerns. Many people also had the same concerns for BTC, it would be wise to not underestimate/be wary of coins because of new things they bring to the table.
What exactly are you talking about? I have not commented on the quality of the coin... I was talking about regulatory issues and market statistics..
I'm also talking about regulatory issues. I meant people thought BTC was an "anonymous" coin because you couldn't see who owned an address. DRK takes the next steps with anonymity, I doubt it will get regulated, at least not anytime soon(for a few years) imo
Ok, now I get your angle.
The thing is, BTC doesn't go around screaming: "Hey use our coin to make anonymous payments".
But as you say, we will see, only future will tell.
June 01, 2014, 04:35:14 PM
is the bitstamp-bitfinex link so that arbitrage is not possible? i.e. if bitstamp price is lower than you cant buy @ the bistamp price and vice versa; but then, how comes they have the same price-curves, how is the linking explainable practically? thx
it is there to add liquidity, not to prevent arbitrage. Arbitrage is something positive for the market and the trading sites.
ok, but how comes my orders @ bitstamp prices are never filled, if bitfinex prices are higher?
Because Bitfinex doesn't have funds 100% of the time on bitstamp. Also you have to calculate the spread that gets added. Trading fees on BFX <<
thats not possible is it? they are routing the order to bitstamp after adding/substracting bitstamp fees, so one bitstamp order generates revenue for bitfinex? i think the fees bitfinex pays to bitstamp are included in the fees that bitfinex takes from the customers.
Raphael said here that Bitfinex is no longer brokering Bitstamp orders
June 01, 2014, 04:33:46 PM
I see your concerns. Many people also had the same concerns for BTC, it would be wise to not underestimate/be wary of coins because of new things they bring to the table.
What exactly are you talking about? I have not commented on the quality of the coin... I was talking about regulatory issues and market statistics..
I'm also talking about regulatory issues. I meant people thought BTC was an "anonymous" coin because you couldn't see who owned an address. DRK takes the next steps with anonymity, I doubt it will get regulated, at least not anytime soon(for a few years) imo
June 01, 2014, 04:31:33 PM
I see your concerns. Many people also had the same concerns for BTC, it would be wise to not underestimate/be wary of coins because of new things they bring to the table.
What exactly are you talking about? I have not commented on the quality of the coin... I was talking about regulatory issues and market statistics..
June 01, 2014, 04:28:26 PM
You guys realize that Bitifinex is looking at the $, which is what any exchange with half a mind would do.
Darkcoin has A Lot of buys/sell every hour, much less everyday. There are Buys in the 100s of BTC's.
Dark would bring Bitifinex a lot of new revenue...
Darkcoin has A Lot of buys/sell every hour, much less everyday. There are Buys in the 100s of BTC's.
Dark would bring Bitifinex a lot of new revenue...
Yes but I guess a lot of traders frown apon adding such a coin and will consider leaving this site. There aren't only upsides
The amount of traders coming in, with 100s of BTC and USD to trade DRK will far outnumber the # leaving because of ignorant reasons frankly..
Sure.
Don't call them ignorant reasons please.
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
2. DRK has a way-higher volatitlity and lenders don't want to lend to such a risky investment with margin. We know that bitfinex says the money is guaranteed, but we all know that it is only backed by the funds stored on the site, if the total amount available drops below the amount owed to lenders, then they can't pay without running fractional exchange.
I see your concerns. Many people also had the same concerns for BTC, it would be wise to not underestimate/be wary of coins because of new things they bring to the table.
June 01, 2014, 04:27:10 PM
Has this whole DRK thing been confirmed officially by Bitfinex or is all this speculation at this point?
June 01, 2014, 04:25:40 PM
You guys realize that Bitifinex is looking at the $, which is what any exchange with half a mind would do.
Darkcoin has A Lot of buys/sell every hour, much less everyday. There are Buys in the 100s of BTC's.
Dark would bring Bitifinex a lot of new revenue...
Darkcoin has A Lot of buys/sell every hour, much less everyday. There are Buys in the 100s of BTC's.
Dark would bring Bitifinex a lot of new revenue...
Yes but I guess a lot of traders frown apon adding such a coin and will consider leaving this site. There aren't only upsides
The amount of traders coming in, with 100s of BTC and USD to trade DRK will far outnumber the # leaving because of ignorant reasons frankly..
Sure.
Don't call them ignorant reasons please.
1. DRK is a pseudo-anonyous coin, that hides transactions (ofuscating) and thus makes anonymous transactions possible. If a government/regulation wants to ban those, Bitfinex could get more trouble than would have been neccessar.y
2. DRK has a way-higher volatitlity and lenders don't want to lend to such a risky investment with margin. We know that bitfinex says the money is guaranteed, but we all know that it is only backed by the funds stored on the site, if the total amount available drops below the amount owed to lenders, then they can't pay without running fractional exchange.
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