Topic: [OFFICIAL]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading - page 32. (Read 723903 times)

To be fair for full disclosure I bought all my BTC from $20-$200 and have already cashed out a nice profit so it is easy for me to be relaxed. If the price goes to zero I will have only missed an opportunity to make more rather than having lost something I invested. I wish I could be this relaxed when I'm trading fiat markets, crypto does a weird thing to me where I'm able to disassociate it from money.

In fact, I don't see it the other way

I'm just making sure that I won't be caught unprepared if shit massively hits the fan. If there were no B2X tokens coming about (but the tension would be the same for some other reasons), I would likely cash out mostly. I know that I often turn out to be overly pessimistic, and it costs me some profits lost (mind you, these are not the same as real losses), but, on the other hand, I'm pretty safe and secure if the price should crash really hard. Ultimately, it all comes down to your risk tolerance, mine seems to be low while yours is certainly higher

I don't expect the price to go down but I'll be ready to short it if it tells me it wants to go down. After watching the order flow just after 01:00 GMT today I'm now looking for a pullback to get long as I no longer hold out hope of getting any in the 6,000-6,500 range I was watching. You see it the other way and that's fine with me, I'm not here to persuade you to change your view, I'm just saying how I see it.
As for guessing what everyone else is doing, it's just that, guessing by what I see on the tape. That can change very quickly, people change their minds all the time.

Your logic doesn't hold

We have something like a week before the hard fork if not more, provided it does happen at all which doesn't seem set in stone either (but I may be wrong here). That basically means that you can safely lend your funds for short term loans a few times (in, fact, you can lend them at least 3 times). It simply doesn't make sense to keep your money in your account without action, but you should know that as good as I do. If you expect the price to go down, you should short now instead of waiting or at least already have orders in place. Personally, I shorted at 7399 and have a few orders at higher levels (but these orders don't lock the funds anyway). Otherwise you lend the money out (which I also did). Thus I sold borrowed bitcoins and lent my own ones (with a positive rates spread). Now I can sit and wait patiently for the hard fork to come in while making use of volatility by closing and reopening some of my margin positions. What's bad with that?

I can't be exact as I wasn't watching at the precise time of the fork but as nobody else has answered you I'll try and help. I logged in a couple of hours after the fork and the new coin was already available. My understanding is that a snapshot of all balances is done at the exact time the fork block is mined and then it just takes a little while for the database to be updated with each new balance, so yes as I understand it you can close out any position immediately after block 494,784 is confirmed.

As I told someone else on the last page:


Several people have told me that the best way to get a response from Bitfinex is to hassle them on Reddit.


This is related to the discussion I was having above with deisik about BTC lending rates going up. We have different views but I get the feeling that people are mostly going flat and waiting so they have funds ready to react if the fork does impact the price.

I mean how fast Bitfinex makes snapshot of blockchain after the fork? Can I close BTCUSD long at the next moment after forkblock? Any ideas?

In case of a leisurely bitfinex support:

1) Who remember at what moment bitfinex has sent Bitcoin Cash tokens to user accounts at August 1st?
    What will happen if I close BTCUSD long on Bitfinex right after finding the forkblock number 494784 but early then Bitfinex add B2X tokens?
    (looks like rhetorical question. Indeed I sent this question to support 3 weeks ago)

2) Second case: Why are such low rates on USD lending? Approximately 1% of the costs can be obtained 20% (the cost of B2X token relative to BTC price) (very confusing moment)

That is what makes a market, two traders looking at the same thing and interpreting it the to mean the opposite. As I said earlier the BTC I have lent out is coin I intend to keep come what may, so if it turns out I'm wrong it doesn't really change the outcome here. I have separate funds that I trade with but I'm just not feeling anything that makes me want to take a short right now. We'll see how it develops over the next 9 or 10 days.

Today's rates are different that yesterday's

If you follow them, you could notice that they increased for over 3 times during the last 24 hours if we talk about short term rates. Yesterday rates for 2-day loans were around 0.02% daily (I managed to borrow at lower than 0.018%), while today they have already surged to over 0.07% and above, and the offers are quickly filled. As to me, that pretty much means exactly what I say, namely, that people are expecting Bitcoin to tank massively. Indeed, it doesn't mean that it will, but personally, I interpret such change in this way

Yes, we're pretty much on the same page. I'm just not seeing much shorting going on so I think it's mainly lack of supply rather than demand. So rather than thinking that they expect the price to tank, I think they just don't want to be lent out as a precaution on the slight chance that it does, it could take 2 days to get your coins back to be able to react. It's a subtle difference I know but it makes me feel more bullish at the moment.

But this is what I'm saying myself

Well, at least, in respect of the effect on interest rates. In general, the rates are rising in two cases. The first case when there is no supply (let's assume the demand side doesn't change) and this is what you seem to mean, and the second one is when there is demand rising (i.e. when people are looking for a shorting opportunity). But in either of these two cases, people are expecting the Bitcoin price to tank, right? Since otherwise the supply wouldn't diminish, while the demand wouldn't increase

It's a portmanteau of scalping and delicious. Markets that move like BTCUSD are a paradise for scalpers but that's tough to do on the exchanges we have. I'm going to be a very happy trader if/when I can trade BTC futures on huge leverage and low fees using TT.


I know what you mean, that's exactly what I was thinking going into the last forks, but the more I think about it I'm sure a lot of traders are just moving their funds into their trading accounts ready to sell if the price goes down. The actual fall from the highs is very small right now so I don't think there is much shorting going on. It's just a theory I'm having at the moment.

I agree that it rather seems like day traders are preparing for or expecting a crash if BTC interest rates go up.

What do you mean by "scalplicious"?

Maybe, you wanted to say spectacular? That I certainly agree with. Regarding Bitcoin funding interest rates having started to rise, I think this has more to do with the expectations of Bitcoin price going down (which is opposite to what you might think). People borrow more when they want to short, that basically means they expect Bitcoin prices to go down, and not rise in the nearest future. For example, USD rates are up when Bitcoin goes up since it makes perfect sense to borrow dollars and buy bitcoins with them. It works in reverse as well

I might be proved completely wrong but I'm personally not concerned about the fork having an adverse effect on BTC price. I understand there are risks but my assessment is that it one that I'm willing to take so I'm just leaving my BTC lent out. The BTC I have lent out is for the hodl, I'm not selling anytime soon. The interest rates are already starting to increase as I think many are taking them out of lending so I'm just benefiting from that.


The CME announcement last week could have a huge impact, in fact, I'm convinced it has far more to do with breaking $7k than the fork does. I'm hoping they get the necessary regulatory approval because I'm itching to day trade BTC futures on a real trading platform. It will be scalplicious.

Well, it seems that I mean exactly that

You borrow (i.e. short Bitcoin) and lend out (i.e. sort of go long) the same amount of bitcoins (let's discard the differences in the funding rates for the moment), so this is exactly what you will see, i.e. PnL being close to neutral. Indeed, if the price surges you won't be able to reap profits but, personally, I can't call that losses simply because you won't suffer any real losses if the price crashes or just seriously corrects instead. This is what hedging means. I understand that when taken in isolation, this approach doesn't make a lot of sense (since you could just sell the coins for fiat and get done with that), but there are still many use cases when it does. One such use case I just mentioned, i.e. receiving B2X tokens in a safe way


There might be a dramatic squeeze when Bitcoin futures are allowed since it doesn't take a lot to bring Bitcoin down Soros style (even if temporarily)

OK, I was reading too much into your use of the word hedge. What you suggest looks to be a good way of receiving the fork coin and still having your BTC available to trade short if you need to. I was thinking that what you meant by a hedge was that your PnL column would be neutral whatever happens to the BTC price. I was just pointing out that if the price goes up then you will get those losses.
(FWIW I'm looking at anything down to $6,000 as a buying opportunity if it breaks below that then a major correction may be in play ~$4,000 ish)



You are confusing two different things, trading tokens and the split. What you quote above refers to the futures market. If you want to speculate by trading the new coin now you have the option to split some BTC into BT1 and BT2 and trade these. They are not the new coin but just tokens that are being traded internally at Bitfinex. You are not being forced to use them it is completely optional.

When the fork actually happens around the 16th November you will automatically be credited the new B2X coin for all the BTC you own.

Bitfinex abandoned this forum and thread a long time ago. If you need confirmation that what I told you is correct I think you'll have more chance of getting a response on  /r/bitcoin or /r/bitcoinmarkets.

Hi I am confused about Bitfinex policy with segwit2x.
I can understand( Announcement https://www.bitfinex.com/posts/221) that we can now split our bitcoins to BT1 AND BT2 with the help of coin split manager.
And this BT2 will later become B2X at the time of split.


But here my question is if i donot want to split my coin like this and if i have
1btc in my bitfinex account at the time of fork.
Will i get the equal amount of B2X after the fork?

Or only if I Split my BTC before the fork like BT1 and BT2 then only I am getting B2X coin after the fork.

Their T&C for segwit2x https://www.bitfinex.com/legal/cst/segwit2x

Sorry posting here again as I think this is the official  support thread of bitfinex.
I will be really pleased to get any definite answer.

Original Post: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitfinex-with-segwit2x-2367234

What losses do you refer to?

You just won't be able to ride the price spike should there be any, but other than that, I would in no case count it as "losses". At max, these would be unearned or lost profits (or rather lost profit opportunities), but given the uncertainty, price volatility, and the current Bitcoin price itself, that might not be a very bad idea after all. Anyway, we are already well below the recent highs, so it may be too late to short unless we are going to drop a lot lower, of course (say, a few thousand dollars)

An interesting idea. The thing that concerns me is there is no correlation between the amount you can make on the lend/borrow spread and the price of Bitcoin. So yes you will be protected from any fall in BTC value due to any problems during the fork but if the price screams higher you will suffer big losses.