Topic: Petition to get rid of or fix the default trust system - page 2. (Read 5306 times)

Precisely. Scammers dislike the DefaultTrust system because it makes them stand out, just like people disliked the scammer tag system not for the centralization but rather for the fact it added an obvious marker to them.

It is interesting that 38 people voted for the new trust system, however only 17 of those people have conducted trades on here before (as defined as having at least one positive trust report that is trusted by my trust list). (I excluded four people because the only positive trust they had was from repaying no collateral loans and for being "a good poster" or because they are a moderator). Of the 17 people, 3 of them likely have sufficient reputation so they would never need to send goods/funds first to their trading partner, so only 14 people who would potentially get scammed if the trust system did not work properly voted for the new system. 5 people with at least one negative trust report (based on my trust network), two of which I know have been removed from default trust list voted for the new trust system.

On the other hand there were 26 people who have traded on here before (as evidenced by either positive trust by someone in the default trust network, or neutral trust from someone in default trust representing they escrowed a transaction).

Looking at the poll results that way shows that scammers were very much against out current system and people who actually benefit from our current system want to continue to use it.

You keep saying this is a serious discussion, but you haven't said any points that haven't been refuted. I'm legitimately concerned in your trust system flaws/fixes, however you haven't pointed out anything (see my post on page 4 questioning your OP) https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10372879

If you actually want to see the system changed, stop acting like a victim, put some people on your ignore list, and prove that it should be changed and suggest some fixes. The only thing this thread is saying right now, is I'm mad I was called a scammer, the system is broken because I'm a scammer and I don't like it, thats what people are proving by beating the proverbial dead horse. If proving you aren't a scammer isn't something you care to do or whatever, just get to the reasons why the system is broken. Not trying to antagonize you, but if you have legitimate concerns and you aren't just trying to make noise, now would be the time to actually open up a dialog with how we can change the trust system (not to suit yourself) but to make it work better for everyone. Preferably before the new forum software comes would be nice.

Note how almost all the people who petition to remove DefaultTrust have negative trust or have been removed from it.

The bias is quiiiite clear.

huh how is this witch hunt helping you to gain more  all i see is 2 coins, which is commisioned by TECSHARE and ukcrypto

Joke's on you I've made $87,654 in sales this week, what do I do?
I sell posts like yours to Bollywood, they like them so much they are pressing me to encourage you post even more threads like this.

I will say... Woodcollector can apply a nice finish to his exotic wood products... I have never said that he produces shitty work.... With so much money being made in the wooden bitcoin memorabilia. ...supposedly 100K$ +.    I think I will give master wood carving a try..... I have a Harbor Freight in the next town over....all it takes is an 18 dollar set of chisels .   Tho. I would use cheap Oak or Cherry... home grown in the USA. Stored at one of my warehouse Home Depots.. If anyone would like a cheaper Knock-off wooden bitcoin token , please PM me....My first Master Piece will be named ... " #10. " .... I don't know what the design will be.... I'll just find some picture from the Internet or picture from this forum and copy it..... I will apply the fastest finish possible and mass produce it ....because it doesn't matter .... Because.....I will have achieved Master Wood Carver in only a few short weeks.... I think my only compatitision will be Smoothie....He  has the Master Wood Carver talent already as seen in his video... His technic with the ..GO.. button is flawless...

SORRY  that I shifted off topic just a bit...so with that said....I support the default trust system...

Really though one of the most telling things is that no legitimate artist would give a shit about leaving this forum.  The mere fact that woodcollector even wants to be able to continue doing his "business" here shows you what a fake he is.  I assumed originally that he was clever and malicious but he plays stupid so well he almost has me convinced he is just some dumbass that actually thinks he is a master wood carver.  Wouldn't that be funny?  If he actually thinks the garbage he is posting is true.  heh

Still waiting for the circle and right angle...hand carved free hand
Lots of text you write but it is for nothing as your credibility is gone.

Lets first cover the FACTS, then get this back on topic since this is the "fixing the default trust system thread" not the "smoothie and friends want to have another temper tantrum to feel good about themselves thread"

1: There are all but maybe 6 or 7 people still whipping your dead horse. Maybe 8 or 9. Of that i am 100% certian that about 30% of those "people" are alts of your own band of idiots.

2: There are on any given day over a thousand active members on this forum

Which means that

3: you and your very tiny band of whipper snappers constitute less than 1% of people on this forum.

which further brings me to....

4: you and your little degenerate band of kids are the MINORITY on this forum.

I know this because

5: at least twice a day i get a P.M. from someone on this forum telling me about your little kids society and how you maintain to act in the very same fashion you are yet today, and that you idiots will attack any high profile body on this forum. Its the only reason your here, they were kind enough to point out all of your post history's as evidence that not one of you provide anything useful here.

Which brings me to....

6: some of the communities most prestigious members are now making their way onto my client roster

Because

7: Ever since day 1, this whole charade started by nubbins then followed up by the usual suspects has been nothing more than 1 huge publicity campaign for me that i could have never even thought of on my own. I started as a pretty much anonymous virtual identity on BCT and thanks to the efforts of you, BG4, CITM, Nubbins, Jonald, and the rest of your degenerate clan. Today. I'M F#@KING FAMOUS and all over the web with my anonymous identity people who would have never found me in the bitcoin market have been lead right to me and its all thanks to you.

Here's just one message of 7 i received today.


Straight from the mouth of a guy who one of the highest trusted members on this forum.

Moving on to a message i got last weekend


which starts to bring this to a close...

8: Prior to Nubbins starting his free marketing campaign for me, i was doing good to have made somewhere in the ballpark of around $40,000 in sales to bitcoin clients. Thats measuring from November when i made the first piece for Blazedout419 until January 19th when nubbins started in. Since mid January up to tonight i have made an additional $51,000 in sales. Thanks to you idiots i have made more in two and a half weeks then i could have done on my own in 3 months.

that leads us to the ONLY thing all of you have been right about so far......

9: for about the past 5 days now, i fully admit i am 100% guilty of trolling all of you into acting out like the kiddies you are. Some of my recent clients pointed out that if it was not for all of your infantile charades they themselves would have never found what i have to offer or ever new i was part of the bitcoin community as i had no idea how much of a community there was outside this forum and never would have thought to market myself in those other places as i didn't even know they existed. Those same new clients also pointed out that besides doing it for laughs (which i have gotten a lot of lately, i mean come on "wet chocolate"? hahahahaha) spending an hour or so a day antagonizing you and your fellow group of kids here on the forum was the easiest and best free marketing i could get in the community because although there are only a few of you, you all make a lot of noise all across bitcoin websites because it is by default your nature to seek out attention. That leads clients right to me, and anyone with a brain can take a look back through the circus act and see that i am 100% the man i say i am which leads to a sale.

And finally....

10: back on topic since only a few bodies seem to be able to read that have posted on the past 5 pages. This thread is about the abuse and faults in the trust system. Not about wood, not about tools, not about videos. Its about a serious problem that has so many quick and easy solutions is almost moronic that Theymos has not done something about it yet.

Now, please feel free to carry on with your off topic rants about chocolate and wood and tools and whatever else. Although it was a giant headache in the beginning, this dog and pony show that nubbins started has been one of the best things that could have happened to me in the bitcoin space, it increased sales, increased visibility, and it only cost me a few days worth of time which were made up for by selling the things i made in those days. Now not only am i famous in the real world, i have a famous bitcoin identity too.

Edit: i'll be back to stir the pot again tomorrow some time. Take your pop shots in the mean time if you must. While your at it, link your wittiest reply to the above on reddit, shout it out on your twitter and social media accounts, be sure it finds its way to CCT and LTBTC too.

Thanks for the free marketing   Sad part is if you were not all children about it, i might have actually paid you for your services.

One more edit: I sat back and had a laugh to myself and figured i would share it with all of you who are just following along for the laughs. The best part of it all is these guys dont even realize that nobody on this forum or in bitcoin in general takes them seriously or really even pays attention to them any more and they still spend hundreds of hours online fighting for that attention. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH   You cant even script comedy that good.

NOW, back on topic. I will not be replying to any more off topic posts in this thread. I'll start another thread so i can troll you kids tomorrow. This thread is for serious discussion.

Yep, better watch the video again little boy. http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/05E50/pfeil-Swiss-made-Full-Size-Carving-Tool-Set.aspx?refcode=10INGOPB&gclid=Cj0KEQiA6dGmBRC_3Mi-x_XywKsBEiQA1lcFPwHWktT_apmWFdaYHe_vSIiU3qk5y8rdStZEDQOqNaAaAskW8P8HAQ

Looks like we have another little man with a napoleon complex in our midst. Off topic as usual, and blowing hot air. 

For those who get lost in the previous 5 pages of kid shit. This thread is about the abuse and faults in the default trust system and the little kids who game it like its their very own MMORPG. NOT ABOUT WOOD CARVING

It's prettmsimple really, and I'm sure he just wanted another thread.

Woodcutter has not talent. Simple, truth and fact.

If anyone asked to See a short video of a design I did or a piece of music I'd be happy to show it, I've nothing to hide and maybe a video,would help some people learn.

Woodcutter is just enjoying the posts and publicity. The guy's clearly not got talent/skill/ability so his posts are just trying to keep the limelight he needs.

Just boycott his posts, don't reply, he'll soon go away

Apparently this guy figured out who he was from merely a few pictures  :

WC doesn't want to give BitcoinEXpress what he simply asked for... one perfect circle and one perfect right angle.

He won't reveal his true identity...

But he sure cries like a little baby when people do call his bullshit out for what it is.

Now he says he will have another forum developed....LOL! yeah sure buddy...$250,000 worth of development...yup

 

Hmm.

Same camera, same photo editing software
Tecshare has a laser engraver, and claims to be a woodworker
Similar activity times
Some of WC's files are hosted on Tecshare's domains
Tecshare is willing to put his reputation on the line for WC
Similar writing/debate styles
WC clearly has the knowledge of one here longer than a couple of months
WC is known to use alts
Anything else?

Not sure I'm willing to accept Tecshare is WC, that's a lot of coincidences, but still coincidences. They certainly are working together now though, perhaps in the past as well.

I'm sceptical of that but I don't doubt they're now collaborating behind the scenes to try 'take down the system'  . Though they have become more alike in style and argument. Tecshare also was suspicioulsy absent yesterday morn whilst WoodCollector was doing his babbling. I really hope they do create their own forum though. Having them two as admins would certainly be interesting, but I suspect this fantasy forum is yet more lies from WC.

The writing style as well as rationale sound very much like Techshare so I would infer that there is a possibility that Techshare purchased this account to push his agenda

You've been listening to Techshare's bullshit rhetoric for too long and have taken exactly the same route as him. Funny how the feedback system is perfectly fine whilst it suits you and you're happily collecting those nice green virtual popularity points and we don't hear a peep from you about it, but the moment someone scams or abuses it or is revealed as a fraud, well, you cry hysterically and make it your life goal to try bring it down whilst inventing conspiracy and lies to suit your agenda. I don't think most of us would even care if the feedback system was removed completely. The only thing I care about though is then there will be no system in place for calling out scammers like you to stop newbies from being robbed blind. You're nothing but a childish amateur woodworker fantasist and it's mind blowing that you're trying to keep up this facade of lies which nobody but a fool would buy. You're either a troll or an idiot if you think people will buy your bullshit here. Just leave or shut up because you're not going to achieve anything apart from joining the ranks of crazies like tecshare who nobody has an ounce of respect for anymore.

Very well said. I think it works great. People can look at a users feedback and decide whether they still want to do business with them. The red flag is really helpful to that as well.

So I did read your wall of text, and let me respond with my own.

Well, first off. If Bitcointalk has a major sway on Bitcoin itself, then there is a more serious issue here than default trust. If a peer to peer decentralized currency depends on the existance of a privately owned forum, then it would be best for Bitcoin to die now, rather than later when there is more money involved.

I found a few issues, your first major issue seems to be that you aren't seperating the economy sections from the rest of the forum. Your trust rating doesn't follow you around everywhere, just where its relevant. There have been plenty of longterm scammers who have stuck around and continued to use the knowledgebase. As long as they stayed out of the marketplace sections, it doesn't matter that much. If you wanted to argue the point, its that buying/selling things has become a video game. But if you go into any of the general sections, no one cares about your trust. My point being, that the social gathering side is seperate from the financial side of the site. You by your own admission haven't been here very long. A good portion of us have been here since the old scammer tag system. It was so heavily asked for that there be a feedback system, that the current system we have today was created. The whole point of default trust isn't to create a popularity or leverage system, its to create a system where people who give accurate feedback can be noted so that newbies take their feedback a little bit more serious than someone's sockpuppet empire. The way it was designed was to protect newbies, not the gullible or stupid. People were supposed to create their own trust lists after figuring out how things worked around here, and the default trust list was to help people not used to Bitcoin's nature not get scammed in their first 10 minutes here.

That said, this and the 50 other threads asking for someone to be removed is proof that the system works. If someone leaves unfair feedback, they are either removed from the default trust list, or if they are left on, people just begin to disregard their feedback. By natural order, that person is then eventually removed anyway. You think that Nubbin's feedback of you is unfair, and if it is, those that added Nubbin's to their trustlist who put him on default trust will make the decision to remove him if his feedback is no longer accurate enough to remain on default trust. If they don't, then people begin to disregard their opinon of who is trustworth to leave others feedback, and an entire branch of the trust system is pruned.

Until we can change the nature of anonymous nonrefundable transactions, some sort of feedback system has to be in place. It has to be resistant against people with multiple accounts, and it has to be able to evolve constantly to warn people of new threats. Is the default trust system perfect, nope. But Theymos has demonstrated time and time again that he is all ears if you have any suggestions, just keep my other points in mind when you are proposing fixes. That said, from my perspective, you are a scammer. I don't know where the 1000 BTC risked came from in your negative feedback, which I suppose is the only questional aspect of it all, but all that means to me is that if we were to ever trade, I'd insist on using escrow. While it would be lovely for you to resolve your pending disputes, I don't really have any judgements.

Good luck with your new forums.