Topic: POLL: How will Blockstream/Core Be Remembered? (Read 2497 times)

Actually, I was responding to someone's remark about price dropping.

I want Bitcoin to succeed both because I'm an investor and
because I like the idea.

At least we know your motivation for support of Classic.  Success of bitcoin should not be measured by its price.

BTW, a static increase of block size does not solve anything.  It is like changing size of an array on the stack, if you need to store more data, you have the same problem.  A real solution would be to allow for dynamic size.  The question is how to grow this size and how to build consensus of what the currently agreed (between nodes) max block size is.  You need two algorithms: one to grow the size, another one to 'broadcast' what the new, to be accepted size suppose to be.  If the system was centralized, solution would be easy.  a central node would decide what the new size is, and inform all other nodes.  But bitcoin is decentralized and more democratic, your node is as valid and needed as any other node on the network.  So that is where the challenge begins.

What classic offers is hard forks every few months or years.

Not to take away Galvin's contributions to bitcoin, but his suggestions fall short.

I've seen too many times projects fail because they were deployed without proper testing.  Just because the code change is easy does not make it right.

If you ever looked at bitcoin code, you'll not want to rush any new changes without extensive testing.  Changing a header constant is not a solution, it is postponing it at the expense of a hard fork.

It has come to my attention recently, that suddenly, previously diehard Blockstream/Core Supporters are suddenly feeling downtrodden.  Sounding downright miserable actually.  Full of rational speech, and moans of being treated unfairly.

Perhaps I have been wrong in my Vote for Option #D.  Perhaps after a good solid trouncing - as Bitcoin Classic legitimately displaces the "New Bitcoin" nonsense Blockstream/Core has been promoting - we should all immediately FORGIVE (Option#A) the Blockstream/Core participants.

What say you?  Is this change of heart in the Blockstream/Core den legitimate and deserving of forgiveness?  Or just another ploy of which we are all too familiar?  Vote your mind in our Poll!

But nevertheless - soon we VOTE FOR CLASSIC!

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Nice to at least see Blockstream/Core Supporters admitting Core is in the wrong.  Let's see if they listen to you.  They haven't listened to anyone else.  

And I hate to say this.... but I hope they don't.  Because if they do - they might actually save themselves, and I think the last thing Bitcoin needs is this group of monkeys running the show any longer.  It just delays action on the inevitable fact that we need a different governance team.

I think Classic has enough of a jump on things (and hopefully they have their noses firmly to the grindstone getting ready to upload a download!) and we can just do the Fork, and eliminate TWO (2) problems at once.....

1) Raise Blocksize and Get a Hard Fork behind us (so that Bitcoin can learn from the process and continue to grow unfearfully)
2) Say Goodbye to Blockstream/Core.  

More Votes for Option #D I see!!!!

Yes, exactly. The block size increase needs to be done in core, not some "soda-branded offshoot". Come on Core, please get this done now!

well it is what they are doing, but not directly by increasing it, but with SEG Wit, which would result in the same thing basically

still beyond me why they can not increase it directly to two mega in core, but they need to do it via other random fork with stupid name

Interesting Results so far.  Very little support for Forgiveness so far.  I would say I was surprised, but I guess given the degree of illegal and unprofessional activity emanating from Blockstream/Core Supporters.... well, maybe it is to be expected.

No, you miss the point.... it is Brand CORRECTION!

Coca~Cola CLASSIC was simply a response to the confusion caused by "New Coke".  You are getting confused.... it was "New Coke" that SUCKED SO BAD that it was yanked completely off the shelves and now is no longer produced.

HERE'S THE HISTORY:::

Coke Classic was just a temporary marketing patch.  ORIGINALLY you had "Coca~Cola".  Then a bunch of hijaaking idiots came along that thought they knew better than everybody actually drinking Coca~Cola, and decided to change the formula to "New Coke".   Well, New Coke sucked.  But it had already damaged the brand so badly, and confused things so much, that to restore sanity - there had to be a marketing bridge back to the Original.  So they created "Coke Classic".  THEN they just phased out New Coke completely - until it was gone forever.  Then Coke Classic just slowly phased out as a "temporary name" and people just drank "Coca~Cola" again.

This is a PERFECT analogy of what is going on in Bitcoin.   First you had the Original Satoshi Vision Bitcoin.  Then Blockstream/Core came along and thought they knew better and hijaaked Bitcoin, and tried to make it "New Bitcoin" - totally ignoring the overwhelming Bitcoin Community.  But "New Bitcoin" where Bitcoin only lives in crippled little sidechains.... SUCKS.   But the brand damage has been done, so "Bitcoin Classic" is rolling out.  My guess is that once the fork occurs, and everybody back to using the Original Bitcoin, then eventually people will just call it Bitcoin again, and slowly over time "Bitcoin Classic" as a "temporary name" will fade away, having done its job.

So you are actually incredibly wrong.  Coke Classic did its job PERFECTLY.  It accomplished its mission so well.... that no one even remembers New Coke.... except for this vague blurry remembrance of a yucky taste in their mouth.  And that is how this will end also.  After the Bitcoin Classic Fork.... Bitcoin will simply return to being Bitcoin, and the New Bitcoin Vision of Blockstream/Core will fade away forgotten, except for just a brief memory of a yucky, dirty feeling, a brief time of hateful divisiveness, lies, FUD, DDOS attacks etc.

Have a Bitcoin and a Smile  

Yeah this.

Pretty freakin simple.

The WELL WE WANT TO RAISE THE LIMIT WE JUST CANT AGREE HOW is a tired, lame, bogus meme that is no longer holding any water.

Well, it is simple really.  Bitcoin is about decentralization.  It's about "Bitcoin For the People".

You can't have that when you have a Centralized Governance Team - i.e. Blockstream/Core - that has major conflicts of interest, and who rule through methods of Censorship, FUD, Lies, Manipulation, Shrill Screeching when things don't go their way etc.

The concept of Classic is incredibly simple:

1) Listen to the wishes of the Overwhelming Majority of the Community, and get on with what needs to be done, which in this instance is a small, reasonable Blocksize increase.

2) I'm going to quote the actual www.BitcoinClassic.com website on the next item....
"In the future we will continue to release updates that are in line with Satoshi’s whitepaper & vision, and are agreed upon by the community."

3) Which brings us to the issue of Governance.  Steps 1 & 2 are critical to Governance.   A governance team that doesn't listen to the wishes of its people..... is not for the people.   And a Governance Team that strays from the path towards a path that is in their own selfish interests..... cannot be trusted.   And a Governance Team that employs the methods of rulership/leadership as outlined in bold above.... well, is not good at all.

But the main thing I like about Classic is this......

It allows for all possibilities.  We get to take the chains off Bitcoin..... slowly, carefully and in controlled fashion.... and continue growing and testing the possibilities.  I believe we haven't even touched the edges of the capabilities of Bitcoin.  Blockstream/Core though is like one of these helicopter parents.... forever hovering, fearful, saying "you can't do this", or "Oh No - Be Careful you'll hurt yourself"   You've got to back off and let the kid grow up!   That's Blockstream/Core parenting.  On the other end of spectrum was Mike Hearn/XT parenting.... just let the kid run wild with no discipline, no rules or restrictions whatsoever.  BOTH are extremes, and bad examples of parenting.

The Classic Team will guide Bitcoin, but not smother it.  As it grows it will have many adventures.  It will encounter all types of financial friends.  Some good.  Some evil.  But it is the LIFE OF A FINANCIAL INSTRUMENT!  I say let it grow and explore the world.

keepdoing, I'm still waiting for an explanation that come from you. If you're confident enough in it, you should at least be able to explain me why it is so good.

any way you title it.. we are once again discussing alt coins,
just like the xt threads, this belongs in the alt coin section.

I'll take that bet.

I say Classic will boost Bitcoin price drastically.  Everyone will be cheering that the scalability impasse has been bridged and that the era of centralized development is over!