Precious metals are not useful in a collapse scenario! - page 12.

tvbcof

legendary

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Quote from: markj113 on October 30, 2016, 09:31:15 AM

@ iamnotback,
...
How much have you made off Bitcoin as you consider yourself such an investment guru.
...

Apparently not enough. The ridiculous fear-mongering leveraging the shallow depth of most people's conception of reality in a transparent attempt to artificially inflate Bitcoin at the expense of PMs is a pattern seen in various semi-notorious and/or semi-desperate scammers over the years. Cypherdoc (aka, Dr. Lowelife) springs to mind.

Perhaps I'll re-visit this thread to flesh things out, but the short story is: Bitcoin and PM's are effectively the same thing with some modestly different and potentially symbiotic strengths and weaknesses. In anything approaching a bonafide 'collapse scenario', it would behoove one to have command of both. In a genuine collapse it could be life and death.

mindrust

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Quote from: markj113 on October 30, 2016, 01:09:41 PM

Quote from: mindrust on October 30, 2016, 01:08:08 PM

Quote from: markj113 on October 30, 2016, 01:04:28 PM

Quote from: antonioa on October 30, 2016, 12:59:39 PM

Gold is a bubble which may at any moment burst. I'm not buying gold right now and do not advise others. The price will fall.

I disagree, I think there is still a lot of upside with many predicting $5 gold by 2020.

If trump wins expect a $100 price increase overnight.

You are half true. Gold can rise $100 overnight only if Hillary gets elected, not Trump. Hillary wants to have war with Russia, not Trump. She is giving weapons to the rebels in Syria, not Trump. Yet you say if Trump gets elected we should expect a 100$ rise in gold??Nope.

The establishment wants a Hilary win, I think a trump win will make the markets nervous and thats always good for gold prices.

Who gives a shit about the establisment? There are facts. She wants to start WW3. If she gets elected both Trump and Hillary voters will go for a rush on gold. Trump followers will be the first ones who hoard gold because they are smart, when the stupid killary voters realize what they've done they will join them too and double the effect.

markj113

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Quote from: mindrust on October 30, 2016, 01:08:08 PM

Quote from: markj113 on October 30, 2016, 01:04:28 PM

Quote from: antonioa on October 30, 2016, 12:59:39 PM

Gold is a bubble which may at any moment burst. I'm not buying gold right now and do not advise others. The price will fall.

I disagree, I think there is still a lot of upside with many predicting $5 gold by 2020.

If trump wins expect a $100 price increase overnight.

You are half true. Gold can rise $100 overnight only if Hillary gets elected, not Trump. Hillary wants to have war with Russia, not Trump. She is giving weapons to the rebels in Syria, not Trump. Yet you say if Trump gets elected we should expect a 100$ rise in gold??Nope.

The establishment wants a Hilary win, I think a trump win will make the markets nervous and thats always good for gold prices.

mindrust

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Quote from: markj113 on October 30, 2016, 01:04:28 PM

Quote from: antonioa on October 30, 2016, 12:59:39 PM

Gold is a bubble which may at any moment burst. I'm not buying gold right now and do not advise others. The price will fall.

I disagree, I think there is still a lot of upside with many predicting $5 gold by 2020.

If trump wins expect a $100 price increase overnight.

You are half true. Gold can rise $100 overnight only if Hillary gets elected, not Trump. Hillary wants to have war with Russia, not Trump. She is giving weapons to the rebels in Syria, not Trump. Yet you say if Trump gets elected we should expect a 100$ rise in gold??Nope.

edit: Actually i guess you are right. If Trump gets elected we may see a 100$ rise. On the other hand if Hillary gets elected... 500+

markj113

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Quote from: antonioa on October 30, 2016, 12:59:39 PM

Gold is a bubble which may at any moment burst. I'm not buying gold right now and do not advise others. The price will fall.

I disagree, I think there is still a lot of upside with many predicting $5k gold by 2020.

If trump wins expect a $100 price increase overnight.

antonioa

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Gold is a bubble which may at any moment burst. I'm not buying gold right now and do not advise others. The price will fall.

olubams

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Quote from: Fortify on October 30, 2016, 04:42:59 AM

You cannot predict the future, so you cannot definitively say that silver coins will never be used as a currency again. It's highly likely they won't, but not impossible. I think plenty of people who collect gold, silver, platinum and other rare metals see beyond the physical item. There are industrial uses for these materials, as you say, which could mean they get melted down for their useful properties in electronics or plating. Like every other market in the world, the price changes on these metals due to supply and demand - that is where investors make money.

This is definitely true because no one knows the future and moreover as someone as done the comparison between the market capitalisation of both currencies I Dont think crypto is getting there anytime soon... In my own opinion, if crypto will even move closer to precious metal then it will have to enjoy the legitimacy it currently enjoys which I dont see happening anytime soon and even if that should happen, then it defeats most of the objective crypto represents in the first place...

markj113

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There have been numerous crashes all of the world since day 1.

Bitcoin never existed in these times and people survived by trading hard assests and skills.

Same applies today.

If the world went to shit I personally would be alot happier with a few half and full sovereigns over a few bitcoin any day of the week.

There is also a reason why UK fighter pilots are issued with gold sovereigns as part of their survival kit and not a paper wallet.

iamnotback

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Quote from: markj113 on October 30, 2016, 09:31:15 AM

Also stating gold is not liquid is bollocks

You have a significant reading comprehension deficiency. This is 3rd time I've told you that the scenario entertained is "in a collapse". We aren't talking about being able to drive over to your coin dealer (who btw in a collapse scenario has already been killed and all his inventory stolen). Your Porsche 911 has been destroyed in this scenario. I suppose you didn't even read the linked scenario:

Quote from: iamnotback on October 30, 2016, 03:07:22 AM

Quote from: TPTB_need_war on July 12, 2015, 05:07:32 PM

surviving the war in Bosnia

Btw, there are no coin dealers in Mindanao nor in rural areas of most of the world.

Try to sell some precious metal where I am, and you'll be missing an arm or finger or eyeball not too long after that.

Quote from: mindrust on October 30, 2016, 09:57:20 AM

Liquidity? What are you taking about? We are talking about gold here, the most ancient currency of all times. Don't mix gold with bunch of anonymous internet software.

GAFC.

mindrust

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So you think you know precious metals better than Russia and China?

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-28/russias-most-potent-weapon-rapidly-hoarding-gold-global-currency-war-upon-us

Russia and China saw these days coming long before anyone and started hoarding gold. When the shit hits the fan, gold will make a huge jump.

Liquidity? What are you taking about? We are talking about gold here, the most ancient currency of all times. Don't mix gold with bunch of anonymous internet software.

markj113

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@ iamnotback,

I made enough off gold to pay off my mortgage in full by age 39 and buy myself a nice porsche 911.

How much have you made off Bitcoin as you consider yourself such an investment guru.

Bitcoin has in no way proven itself in crash scenario take Venezuela as a good example. Bitcoin volume hit $117k a week, pocket change.

Also stating gold is not liquid is bollocks, you can pretty much sell as much gold as you want anywhere in the world. A few months back I walked into a bullion dealer and sold about $75k worth on the spot with no drama whatsoever.

iamnotback

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The IQ here is amazing. Roll Eyes

Time to spank some braggart tinfoil pointed hat wearing dolts...

Quote from: markj113 on October 30, 2016, 05:06:17 AM

For me its a simple case of follow the big money.

Governments, central banks and very powerful individuals are all ploughing their money into gold and there is a reason for this.

And they aren't buying silver dimes. They are buying Comex bars, bullion, ETFs, and otherwise investing based on liquidity.

Any BS from gold propagandists to the contrary is not factual.

Quote from: mindrust on October 30, 2016, 05:10:27 AM

It seems you don't understand a shit about precious metals.

See how small bitcoin is comparing to gold market? It is like a tiny sand particle on earth.

The issue is whether it will be liquid during a collapse, which has nothing to do with the relative supply that is stored in some few numbers of vaults mostly controlled by super wealthy and governments.

Comparing the liquidity of gold to Bitcoin now for an individual with a wireless computer connection in most locations of the world to liquidity of physical precious metal coin in those locations, makes gold look pathetic.

You son, don't understand precious metals. Get off my lawn with your pathetic attempts to insult yourself.

Quote from: markj113 on October 30, 2016, 05:37:37 AM

Total gold market cap = $7,617,683,440,065
Total bitcoin market cap = $11,342,306,883

bitcoin market cap = 0.1489% of gold's

I think we would have to see quite a swing in prices to see "the situation change a lot" Cheesy

Saplings grow very rapidly to oak trees, but oak trees don't grow to the moon. Are you investing for maximum or minimum gain. Duh. Roll Eyes

Quote from: BADecker on October 30, 2016, 05:51:47 AM

A Massive 'Coronal Hole' on the Sun is Blasting Earth w/ Solar Storms That Could CRIPPLE Power

Sunspot magnetic field driven activity is headed for minimization from 2020s through 2040s:

Quote from: iamnotback on October 29, 2016, 04:17:11 AM

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/nature/sun-drop-in-energy-output-is-stronger-than-expected/

Here is the RT video with English CC subtitles (click the CC button):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M9cklpcJNs

Basically the cooling with accelerate in 2020s, and then get worse in 2030s, then start to warm in 2040s.

BADecker

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Also, above^^^.

The Dangers of Buying Gold

Quote from: http://www.cmi-gold-silver.com/article/dangers-of-buying-gold/?utm_source=LRC&utm_medium=textad&utm_campaign=advertisedgold

Most of the firms sponsoring the ads promote gold coins at grossly inflated prices. One company openly acknowledges marking up their gold bullion coins thirty percent but sometimes has markups of seventy percent. Another firm has been known to markup its coins one hundred percent.

...

Should the callers be astute enough to ask about the American Eagle gold coins, the world’s best-selling gold coins, or the South African Krugerrands, the world’s best known gold coins, both of which carry very low premiums over the value of their gold content, the telemarketers unload their big guns and start talking about “gold confiscation.”

In 1933, in the midst of the Great Depression, by executive order President Roosevelt made it illegal for Americans to own gold bullion or gold bullion coins. The order stood until December 31, 1974. Telemarketers call Roosevelt’s act a “confiscation,” but in reality it was a “call-in” of U.S. gold coins.

Read more at http://www.cmi-gold-silver.com/article/dangers-of-buying-gold/?utm_source=LRC&utm_medium=textad&utm_campaign=advertisedgold.

Cool

BADecker

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Here is a very important reason, and a near possibility, why one should keep cash and junk silver coins on hand. Crypto and banking will be useless in a potentially real, more serious scenario like this.

A Massive 'Coronal Hole' on the Sun is Blasting Earth w/ Solar Storms That Could CRIPPLE Pow

Quote from: https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/10/no_author/solar-storm-alert/

Solar winds triggered a giant geomagnetic storm this week, raising fears that they could cripple power supplies.

The charged particles are coming from a coronal hole on the sun that is currently facing Earth.

If Earth's magnetic field was hit by charged particles the effects could also include radar and satellite interference, causing problems phone and internet networks and navigation services.

Power grid operators in the US were put on alert yesterday following concerning space weather forecasts. But the impact could be felt all over the world.

Warnings were issued by the operator of the biggest power grid in the US, PJM Interconnection LLC, as well as by Midcontinent Independent System Operator, which manages high-voltage power lines across North America, reports Bloomberg.

These were the result of US Space Weather Prediction Center raising a 'serious' G3 level storm alert, though the alert was later downgraded to a less severe G2 storm.

Read more at https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/10/no_author/solar-storm-alert/.

Cool

markj113

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Quote from: Betwrong on October 30, 2016, 05:32:15 AM

You are right but only partly right. As we all know the Market Cap depends on the price of Bitcoin and on the price of precious metals. If the price of Bitcoin will go up in the future faster than the prices of precious metals the situation might change a lot.

Lol

Total gold market cap = $7,617,683,440,065
Total bitcoin market cap = $11,342,306,883

bitcoin market cap = 0.1489% of gold's

I think we would have to see quite a swing in prices to see "the situation change a lot" Cheesy

Betwrong

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🌀 Cosmic Casino

Quote from: mindrust on October 30, 2016, 05:10:27 AM

It seems you don't understand a shit about precious metals.

See how small bitcoin is comparing to gold market? It is like a tiny sand particle on earth. I am not saying bitcoin doesn't have a future but nothing can destroy precious metals. It is the ultimate safest choice.

Period.

You are right but only partly right. As we all know the Market Cap depends on the price of Bitcoin and on the price of precious metals. If the price of Bitcoin will go up in the future faster than the prices of precious metals the situation might change a lot.

mindrust

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It seems you don't understand a shit about precious metals.

See how small bitcoin is comparing to gold market? It is like a tiny sand particle on earth. I am not saying bitcoin doesn't have a future but nothing can destroy precious metals. It is the ultimate safest choice.

Period.

markj113

legendary

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For me its a simple case of follow the big money.

Governments, central banks and very powerful individuals are all ploughing their money into gold and there is a reason for this.

They are trying to eliminate the 3rd party risk assosciated with Fiat (same applies bitcoin). With gold no other supporting system is required, you hold it and you own it. If there was a significant crash in fiat would the general public be looking to exchange one set of virtual digits on a screen for another or would there be a flight to hard assets?

I also think bitcoiners are going to be in for a major shock when central banks are ready to move over to cashless and bitcoin is then seen as a threat. It will be eliminated through excessive regulation, legal restrictions etc.

Spoetnik

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FUD Philanthropist™

A large part of the globe does not have any electricity nor will they.
Yet, they still use a currency of some type.

If the digital system is neutered in a disaster something will HAVE to be used.
It will HAVE to be something you can hold in your hand and put in your pocket.

And because this scenario is plausible it means FIAT cash paper money and / or metals will always be needed.
..like they always were before.

You don't throw the baby out with the bath water Wink

In other words just because there is "not as much" as a need for Metals or FIAT ...
does not mean we throw them out and abandon them all together.

Life is about stability + security.. AKA: Back up plans.

Fortify

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You cannot predict the future, so you cannot definitively say that silver coins will never be used as a currency again. It's highly likely they won't, but not impossible. I think plenty of people who collect gold, silver, platinum and other rare metals see beyond the physical item. There are industrial uses for these materials, as you say, which could mean they get melted down for their useful properties in electronics or plating. Like every other market in the world, the price changes on these metals due to supply and demand - that is where investors make money.

Topic: Precious metals are not useful in a collapse scenario! - page 12. (Read 13437 times)