Topic: Proof that God exists - page 29. (Read 62389 times)

That some of the alleged miracles which are impossibly improbable by all normal rules of science could have been brought about by exceedingly well-planned use of a subatomic tweak here and there does not prove that God does exists.  It merely claims that
i) God could exist in a world of well-defined immutable laws of physics which we only found out quite recently
ii) That such a God could accomplish miracles by much smaller adjustments than theology people had previously thought
iii) Proof that God does Not exist becomes more difficult for atheists

Also, I'm not claiming total divine control of every detail of every quantum state; just a very occasional few, enough to pick the least bad history.


Now blackbird307, I don't know the game beer pong to look at the odds of your getting the ball in first try by ordinary luck.  I am not aware of any divine purpose for "arranging" that you miraculously do, as you seem to be of the militant atheist mindset who would refuse to be converted by such an event if it did occur.  In any case, landing a ball in a pint glass is not improbable enough for the class of events which I notice.

David getting a history-changing hit on Goliath is improbable enough.  Did it actually happen ?  Well, that is a long time ago.  Could it happen by beer-pong luck ? probably not.  Could that have happened by propagation-of-consequences miraculous luck ?  Well I'm saying that it could have, and very well might have happened.  xslugx, I stop short of saying that it must have happened, because it was a long time ago and there are all sorts of flaws in records of that age.

yes , i believe in all the shittiest magical thing on this earth... because i want to do that..

If I play beer pong and get the ball in from the first try am I lucky or is it some proof of divine intervention?

If it happened than it was possible. Don't get the fact that it was lucky in there to brag about god. It's not because the chances were incredibly thin that it's a miracle if it happened.
And is it me or are you talking about David and Goliath like they were true?

Oh me I am going to argue with that one.

What you're saying is that every action is the result of others. That everything has its own causes; Fair enough, it means that the way the first atom of hydrogen was send into that precise direction with this precise number of quanta or energies decided everything.
And so? How does it prove the existence of God in any way? It just explains how an omninious and omnipotent being could be... Omninious and omnipotent? Whaou, what a demonstration...

For you to say that requires presumption that the scriptural record of David and Goliath must be untrue, as it was an impossibly lucky shot with a huge consequence upon all subsequent history.
Now, why should we believe your assertion ?

Still - There is no God, and until real evidence it will remain so.

Presumption that a photon is both a countable particle and a wavelike splurge is testable with the two-slits experiment and photon counting photomultiplier equipment.  I got the hang of those before postulating about how much could depend on a fortuitous particle state.  There remains a gaping hole between my saying that such does happen occasionally but influentially, and yourselves seeing an example of such a tiny miracle leading to an observably big miracle.  There remains a second gaping hole between observably big impossibly improbable events occurring and those being a part of a divine plan.  There remains a third gap between noticing a miraculous anomaly and finding out whether its cause was divine or satanic.

That's one hell of a presumption.

I did my science degree to "find out all of the rules which are known to be exactly true, and to learn the methodology of test by which those were discovered, and how to apply honest test for anything else which we are not quite sure about yet".
I regarded questions of theology and the origins of the universe to be much more important than mere details of the next commercially viable technology.
Whilst there are plenty of hoaxes, nonsenses, and blatant political and commercial exploitations to provide examples of purportedly holy claims which are certainly untrue, there remain a handful of miraculous events which do seem to have happened, and which do seem to be the work of God.  The way which I reconcile present day science with the appearance from time to time of miracles is to say that present science gives every particle a quantum mechanical uncertainty.  If God gets to choose whether an atom was Left or Right, and is omniescent about propagating all future consequences of such a choice, that sort of very tiny subatomic tweak, sometimes years in advance of the main event, can be chosen to pick which trouser-leg of history we end up following.  So by tweaking the right quantum state a few years beforehand, God really could have set the best wind speed on the day when David hit Goliath with an inaccurate primitive projectile weapon. 

Now, who's going to argue against that one ?

Already tried so many times to make him give a definition...
But he won't. He know the moment he gives his definition we'll simply counter him.

Hey BADecker, you missed this:

Agreed. Crazy people are crazy. That's just how it is.

Wishing doesn't make anything. Things are what they are.   

Wishing it to be science does not make it so. Same with religion.

You're not doing science.
The first step of any scientific reasoning is to define the terms your using. You never defined neither entropy nor complexity. Hence you never made any reasoning, you're just speaking believing it makes sense.

No but it proves that you still have no clue about the scientific definition of entropy which has, for the 58th times, nothing to do with complexity, complexity being not even a precise term.

There you go again, sporting the only science that can prove my thinking is wrong... political science. How does political science work? Two basic ways. It supports lying when beneficial to its cause, and it supports using continued media-like blabbering to drown out the truth.

Part of the reason that these guys do research and make Godless theories is because they don't want to believe in God.

They neither prove that cause and effect, complex universe, universal entropy, don't exist, nor that their combined existence doesn't proves God. Rather, these guys do everything that they can to make theories that attempt to disprove Him.

Their theories haven't been proven. But the laws of nature listed above are being proven all around us, regularly, on a daily basis. These scientific jokers are foolish when they try to prove that God, Who science has proven to exist, doesn't exist.

Your thinking is not only flawed. It's irrelevant and insulting.