Topic: Revoke self-moderating privileges from korner and other hypertrolls - page 3. (Read 1228 times)

Predictably korner deleted his trollthread about Quickseller and created a new one to appeal the hostility towards Bitcoin SV. I'm sure theymos will jump right on to fix this injustice.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/--5275550

As a trolljob it's quite crafty - mentioning CSW is bound to generate some responses.

I found a similar request from 2007: Lauda should have his ability to delete posts in Self Moderated thread removed.

It has been done before:

This is why commercial websites and service industry force users to verify their phone numbers and email addresses with an OTP so that they can not create the multiple accounts and take the benefits if any.

I think this modification needs to be done on the bitcointalk as well. I'm not sure how people will react to this but it's gonna hurt people with 50 and 100 alts. LOLZ.

May be theymos won't accept this considering this comment here:

I think there needs some hard decisions to be made to increase the forum quality. It will benefit everyone down the line from mods to users, and from advertisers to campaign managers for quality work.

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^##I know this is all about self moderating privileges and associated acts but this is happening because people has access to multiple accounts and they move on immediately to next one after getting banned.

7 of my insightful old posts criticizing BSV were deleted yesterday by the same hypertroll mentioned in the OP. I support the proposal of stopping such fudster from creating self moderated threads.

This person is creating what is effectively scam accusations in the reputation sub as self moderated threads. This prevents the accused from bring able to respond.

This person should either have to post threads in the correct sub, or have the ability to remove posts in his self moderated threads removed.

This is not a function of his beliefs, associations, or who he is attacking. It is a function of basic fairness to those he is accusing.

Here is the newest gem:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/--5274890

I'm not a fan of Quickseller but I really doubt the accusation true. And it's a self-mod thread so you can easily guess what will happen. I'm failing to see what possible value this kind of behavior has for the forum. "Bitcoin SV" and other shitpuppets acting this way should be banned or nuked but if that's not possible for some reason - why not just stop them from creating self-mod threads.

It may depend on who is handling the situation, the admins could be more liberal in handing out bans for suspected links between accounts than regular mods. Theymos may also not be privy of the situation.
For what it's worth Korner has long been autobanned along with a huge number of his alt accounts, the issue is they push out more new troll accounts each time.
The mods would be at a loss between allowing free speech or following their hunch and shutting dowm such potential alt accounts who share habits with a previously banned account. To me it's a clear case of evasions, but I'm not the one burdened with carrying out the action.

Self mod threads is encouraged as it is used to prevent spam, putting a price on it would be counter productive. A rank up criteria could work theoretically, with jr member as the minimum threshold. it would be abused to a extent, but can reduce the rate of new trolls.

He also wrote this:


I don't see any reason why iamnotback would be subject to a permanban and not korner or bitcoin sv or whatever his account right now is, every single thing that theymos mentioned above also applies to him, from making a topic unusable to keeping on evading bans.

Remember those golden words:

Great minds discuss bitcoin ideas.  (BPIP, Basements)
Average minds discuss bitcoin events. (News, Scams, Airdrops)
Small minds discuss bitcoin people. (Politics/Drama)

Right, that's the theory. Now in practice the hypertrolls figured out other ways to get the attention, such as creating frivolous flags and fake accusations and amplify them by abusing self-mod/locking. If you oppose such flags you're supposed explain yourself in the referenced thread but you can't because it's locked and there is another thread but it's self-mod. Basically people get drawn into these trolling schemes not because they really want to feed the troll but sometimes just by following good forum practices.

After that thread End of newbie restrictions; ban changes that was made in January 2014, theymos repeatedly emphasized that there will no longer be newbie jails. I am going to search and give more posts of theymos.

Historical changes of newbie jails

In the announcement thread for self-moderated feature, theymos wrote
I think we can take it and move onwards by sticking with the core approach "Don't feed the troll".

Trollers create such threads to troll and catch attention of readers and posters. If no one replies to such threads, they won't keep their monologue for too long. It reduces traffics in trolling-threads and also discourages them to create other trolling-threads.

They'd be forced to use and expose their other accounts. I would prefer to have them banned on sight but perhaps removing self-mod privilege after abusing it a few times (and/or the lock feature, which as Rizzrack pointed out is also being abused) would be better than nothing.


That would punishing all users for the actions of one lunatic. I'm proposing punishing (well, mildly admonishing really) just the one lunatic.


If those features are being abused beyond any reasonable "free speech" excuse then there should be some sort of limit to that. I'd be ok with the locking restrictions but it would still not prevent the perp from creating self mod threads and that is quite a nuisance even without the whole flag situation. Perhaps the limit should be one self-mod thread per 10 merits earned or something like that .

And again, the right call would be to enforce ban evasion rules until the troll runs out of clean IPs and money for copper accounts but this is not working in this case.


Read the threads referenced in the OP when you get a chance. This troll takes it to a whole new level. Sure they could still troll without self-mod, and they could create self-mod threads with new alts before they get detected, etc. But if there is at least some restriction on those activities once the sockpuppets start abusing forum privileges then I think it would have a cooling effect. Right now there is absolutely nothing to reign them in. Flags can't be reported to mods and are not moderated anyway. Locking/self-mod abuses are not really moderated either.

My thinking on this exactly.  But not only is this something Theymos isn't likely to act on, this is also a good point:

This guy will continue to troll the forum to death regardless of whether he can create self-moderated threads or not, so that kind of restriction probably wouldn't even be productive.  Apparently korner is a Russian troll?  I think I've heard his name before, but I can't say I remember any of his posts or that he had such a negative reputation.

Nah, let's not go that route.  There are times when you want/need to make a local rule that a certain member or group of members can't post in your thread, and when they end up doing it anyway I think you ought to be able to nuke their post(s) quickly and without having to go through the mods.

You have a point there...
Though I would say the abuse is locking the reference thread for the flag. He cannot add a self-mod thread as reference but instead opens a normal thread and locks it.

I propose that flag reference threads can be locked only by mods and preferably only in certain situations like when OP removed support and issue solved and there is no more useful info just spam... perhaps then. Just an idea.

To revoke forum features for some particular users might not be the right call.

If we can't stop him from creating alts and post here how is taking this privilege from a few of his accounts going to work?
We're talking about a lunatic who had at least 55 accounts on this forum, right now nothing is going to stop him, even if you ban all active ones he will come up with 50 more, this is his way of enjoying life.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see this happening but I also know that following the forum rules and the way theymos think about, let's call it freedom of speech nothing will change. And no,I'm not going to suggest ignore, the amount of spam and nonsense that comes from that guy can flood even Switzerland...and Nepal 

I would say lets' get rid of self-moderated topics in reputation, but...that will also end in a shitshow.

If we're not banning korner's alts can we at least prevent them from creating self-modded threads? They create accusations, even trust flags, then routinely delete posts in the subsequent discussions. It's quite clear that they just abuse the self-mod feature as another way to troll people (and spam via indirect notification PMs LOL).

Taking self-mod privilege away would probably remove a large part of the incentive for korner (and other proven hypertrolls like cryptohunter) to keep creating those threads. And yes, I know we shouldn't feed the trolls to begin with, etc, but honestly can we expect every user to be aware of all these disruptive sockpuppets. There should be a more direct punishment for abusing a forum feature in this way. Right now since ban evasion can't be proven to moderators' satisfaction there are basically no consequences for this. You can't even report it.

For example:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/--5215552 now has 13 posts, used to be 90+: https://loyce.club/archive/topics/521/5215552.html

User in question for those not familiar with the backstory:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/troll-abuses-self-moderated-topics-in-russian-local-5155000
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/the-many-accounts-of-korner-bitcoin-sv-5211434