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Topic: Rick Rolled by Coinbase, so I went to look at their local beautiful SF office... - page 3. (Read 10062 times)

legendary
Activity: 3934
Merit: 1248
Owner at AltQuick.com
I would say that the assumption that coinbase was in fact licensed in CA and NY has to do with the fact that much/most of the bitcoin related media is really not qualified to be reporting the news (to put it nicely) and the MSM probably picked up on a story by a site like CCN and did not properly check their facts

This isn't mom and pop media dude...

http://time.com/money/3682947/coinbase-launches-first-us-bitcoin-exchange/

http://www.cnbc.com/id/102367943

http://www.wsj.com/articles/first-u-s-bitcoin-exchange-set-to-open-1422221641

http://nypost.com/2015/01/26/coinbase-first-regulated-us-bitcoin-exchange-opens/

Checking facts on a Sunday night at 12am with some Rocket racing toward the moon... Pretty hard to pick up the phone and call that state of California then.

6am was the "launch" time here.

I don't think you blame them for trading on a meme about going to the moon.... Hence you lost money because the meme was wrong?  That's not enough for a case imo

Not sure about the other stuff though.... The advertising sounds a bit misleading


FUCK a stupid meme. Jesus christ! Has nothing to do with it really besides being gay and retarded. Not the reason I bought at all.  It was because California had approved and lic these folks.  Turning the Golden Gate City into the Golden Gate of BTC too.
legendary
Activity: 1316
Merit: 1000
Si vis pacem, para bellum
Buying on some silly meme announcement and graphic?

Not sure since when the Wall Street Journal and every other major news outlet was considered a silly meme / graphics.

Based on your post that you will be suing them, I will be sure to short Bitcoin because I believe in my heart that you will do so and this will bring the price down some.

I do not believe it will hurt Bitcoin.

have you  worked out any estimation of how much you lost ?

Will be seeking at least $220,000 + anything else the lawyers think (obviously court costs, lawyer fees and that stuff as well.)  I hope to see the States start taking some addition action against Coinbase as well.

Hopefully the State of California isn't cool with "Rick Rolling" folks either.

I don't think you blame them for trading on a meme about going to the moon.... Hence you lost money because the meme was wrong?  That's not enough for a case imo

Not sure about the other stuff though.... The advertising sounds a bit misleading
copper member
Activity: 2926
Merit: 2348

Personally, I could care less if their work space was known or not, as long as they don't pull a mtgox. I only need to know that my funds are safe. Speaking of which, where can I verify that my fiat on there is indeed FDIC insured? And wouldn't that be great if insurance was also extended to BTC... yeah right  Roll Eyes
My understanding is that your fiat balance is not FDIC insured (someone can correct me on this if I am wrong). What I have read is that 'Coinbase's fiat funds will be held at an FDIC insured bank' which means that Coinbase is protected (up to deposit limits) in the event the bank they hold they fiat balance at fails. My understanding is that this is different then FDIC pass though insurance where if the bank fails your portion of Coinbase's deposits are insured up to FDIC limits (assuming you do not have a bank account at the bank in question) plus segregation of customer funds (customer money is kept in separate accounts as company money).

My understanding is that if Coinbase were to fail/file bankruptcy and you had money in your USD balance then the FDIC would not step into protect you

If customer deposits were insured by FDIC against Coinbase mishaps and misdeed, they would say so on their site.  What they say instead is that their bank account is insured against failure of the bank

Moreover I have been told that, in order to get "passthrough" insurance by the FDIC, the company must inform the bank about the balances of each client.  (Can anyone confirm this?) This reporting seems quite impractical for an exchange that will make thousands of trades per hour, 24/7.

As for BTC balances, the site says tha only their "hot wallet" is insured against theft, embezzlement, and other losses.  The site also says that they will keep less than 10% of the clients' BTC funds in the hot wallet.

Add to that the claims of "first in the US", and "licensed in NY and CA".  Coinbase seems to think that marketing is more important than trust, and that misunderstandings like the above are good for business.  To me, they spell immaturity non-trustworthiness.
According to Howstuffworks(which lists paypal as their source)
Quote
Although PayPal itself isn't an FDIC-insured bank, it does keep your funds in various FDIC-insured banks across the country (Go here to see which ones PayPal currently uses). According to PayPal, your funds are eligible for something called pass-through insurance. Basically, this means that you can recover your money even if the bank fails. This insurance does not protect you if PayPal fails, although the company claims that "your funds will also be protected from any claims of PayPal's creditors and will be returned to you even in the unlikely event of a PayPal insolvency"
So in other words pass through FDIC insurance will only protect you against bank failure, not the failure of the company you have your funds on deposit at (which in this case would be coinbase).

You are correct about their hot wallet insurance, which again is really protecting coinbase, not their customers (coinbase likely has sufficient capital to absorb a theft of their hot wallet).

I would say that the assumption that coinbase was in fact licensed in CA and NY has to do with the fact that much/most of the bitcoin related media is really not qualified to be reporting the news (to put it nicely) and the MSM probably picked up on a story by a site like CCN and did not properly check their facts
hero member
Activity: 910
Merit: 1003

Personally, I could care less if their work space was known or not, as long as they don't pull a mtgox. I only need to know that my funds are safe. Speaking of which, where can I verify that my fiat on there is indeed FDIC insured? And wouldn't that be great if insurance was also extended to BTC... yeah right  Roll Eyes
My understanding is that your fiat balance is not FDIC insured (someone can correct me on this if I am wrong). What I have read is that 'Coinbase's fiat funds will be held at an FDIC insured bank' which means that Coinbase is protected (up to deposit limits) in the event the bank they hold they fiat balance at fails. My understanding is that this is different then FDIC pass though insurance where if the bank fails your portion of Coinbase's deposits are insured up to FDIC limits (assuming you do not have a bank account at the bank in question) plus segregation of customer funds (customer money is kept in separate accounts as company money).

My understanding is that if Coinbase were to fail/file bankruptcy and you had money in your USD balance then the FDIC would not step into protect you

If customer deposits were insured by FDIC against Coinbase mishaps and misdeed, they would say so on their site.  What they say instead is that their bank account is insured against failure of the bank.  

Moreover I have been told that, in order to get "passthrough" insurance by the FDIC, the company must inform the bank about the balances of each client.  (Can anyone confirm this?) This reporting seems quite impractical for an exchange that will make thousands of trades per hour, 24/7.

As for BTC balances, the site says tha only their "hot wallet" is insured against theft, embezzlement, and other losses.  The site also says that they will keep less than 10% of the clients' BTC funds in the hot wallet.

Add to that the claims of "first in the US", and "licensed in NY and CA".  Coinbase seems to think that marketing is more important than trust, and that misunderstandings like the above are good for business.  To me, they spell immaturity non-trustworthiness.
legendary
Activity: 3934
Merit: 1248
Owner at AltQuick.com
Have you consulted with an attorney?

In the process of doing so.

Got this e-mail from Coinbase today.

BayAreaCoins
Subject: An Important Message from Coinbase
JAN 28, 2015  |  04:03PM PST
Darren replied:
Hi,

We noticed your account has conducted a high volume of transactions with Coinbase. We appreciate you being an active customer!

Please know that we are required to periodically review high volume accounts as part of being a Money Service Business. To assist in this process, please provide us with the following information within 7 days to avoid disruption of service to your account:

- Please briefly describe the primary use case for your Coinbase account
- Please describe the source of the bitcoin being deposited into your account that was not purchased through Coinbase
- Please indicate the source of income for your purchases of bitcoin
- Please elaborate on the nature of your outgoing transfers and what services they are related to

Thank you for your understanding on this sensitive matter. If you have any trouble fulfilling this request you can reply directly to this email and we would be happy to assist you.

Respectfully,

Coinbase
Compliance Team


Roll Eyes

Please tell me where your office is.

Thank you for your understanding on this sensitive matter.

They obviously don't know who the largest pet snail wranger/seller is on this side of side of the world!

www.SnailsInTheMail.com

If you think Bitcoin regulation is tough... you should try flipping a snail or two!
copper member
Activity: 2926
Merit: 2348

Personally, I could care less if their work space was known or not, as long as they don't pull a mtgox. I only need to know that my funds are safe. Speaking of which, where can I verify that my fiat on there is indeed FDIC insured? And wouldn't that be great if insurance was also extended to BTC... yeah right  Roll Eyes
My understanding is that your fiat balance is not FDIC insured (someone can correct me on this if I am wrong). What I have read is that 'Coinbase's fiat funds will be held at an FDIC insured bank' which means that Coinbase is protected (up to deposit limits) in the event the bank they hold they fiat balance at fails. My understanding is that this is different then FDIC pass though insurance where if the bank fails your portion of Coinbase's deposits are insured up to FDIC limits (assuming you do not have a bank account at the bank in question) plus segregation of customer funds (customer money is kept in separate accounts as company money).

My understanding is that if Coinbase were to fail/file bankruptcy and you had money in your USD balance then the FDIC would not step into protect you
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1116
Buying on some silly meme announcement and graphic?

Not sure since when the Wall Street Journal and every other major news outlet was considered a silly meme / graphics.

Based on your post that you will be suing them, I will be sure to short Bitcoin because I believe in my heart that you will do so and this will bring the price down some.

I do not believe it will hurt Bitcoin.

have you  worked out any estimation of how much you lost ?

Will be seeking at least $220,000 + anything else the lawyers think (obviously court costs, lawyer fees and that stuff as well.)  I hope to see the States start taking some addition action against Coinbase as well.

Hopefully the State of California isn't cool with "Rick Rolling" folks either.

Have you consulted with an attorney?
legendary
Activity: 3934
Merit: 1248
Owner at AltQuick.com
Buying on some silly meme announcement and graphic?

Not sure since when the Wall Street Journal and every other major news outlet was considered a silly meme / graphics.

Based on your post that you will be suing them, I will be sure to short Bitcoin because I believe in my heart that you will do so and this will bring the price down some.

I do not believe it will hurt Bitcoin.

have you  worked out any estimation of how much you lost ?

Will be seeking at least $220,000 + anything else the lawyers think (obviously court costs, lawyer fees and that stuff as well.)  I hope to see the States start taking some addition action against Coinbase as well.

Hopefully the State of California isn't cool with "Rick Rolling" folks either.
legendary
Activity: 3598
Merit: 2386
Viva Ut Vivas
Based on your post that you will be suing them, I will be sure to short Bitcoin because I believe in my heart that you will do so and this will bring the price down some.
hero member
Activity: 688
Merit: 500
ヽ( ㅇㅅㅇ)ノ ~!!
Buying on some silly meme announcement and graphic?

You gambled and you lost Undecided

If there is any positive effect from this, it will be over a period of many months. Nothing is going to halt the downtrend overnight. Everyone around here should have learned that by now.
legendary
Activity: 1316
Merit: 1000
Si vis pacem, para bellum
have you  worked out any estimation of how much you lost ?

IIRC the news was already out on sunday that they were opening the first regulated exchange in 24 states (but it didnt say which ones )

i dont think you can blame them because the price didnt go to  the moon ,it takes people time to trust a new service

IF its good ,it will gather momentum as more people use it and then comes the snowball effect in time

it could be $500 in a month or two

legendary
Activity: 3934
Merit: 1248
Owner at AltQuick.com
So Coinbase launched and the price dropped, then you bought on the news you read on WSJ?...

Just stop thinking... you are going to hurt yourself. <3  Grin Grin

You're outta your element Donny!



I'm off to bed. Gnight fellas and thanks for understanding my frustration is NOT with Bitcoin at all or even losing $... It is the fact I feel cheated and I'm not alone.  That fake news shit is horse shit. I was so excited for Bitcoin, it was truly a heart breaker  Cry
legendary
Activity: 3934
Merit: 1248
Owner at AltQuick.com
I generally do agree with you, but these points I don't. They can't just use VC funds to pump BTC price. It might temporarily work, but eventually market will just correct itself. Instead, those VC funds are better spent for expansion and building up the company. Long term effects wins superficial price rise any day.

I didn't mean use VC funds to "pump" Bitcoin... Maybe buy 10 coins that day or something, but don't manipulate us!  Get in line to buy some Bitcoins like everyone else...  The books where near nil and Coinbase knew it would be like that.  Cryptsy had thicker books than they do.  Maybe Coinbase doesn't buy any bitcoin.  Frankly it isn't any of my fucking business and I have no interest in making it my business... that part just annoys me.  So you maybe right to disagree with that.

This doesn't effect the fact that I bought my shit personally because I was lead to believe that Coinbase had the proper shit from the State of California... Charlie has already made this clear too.

A)  The press did.

They did however post it to their page @ https://www.coinbase.com/press ... if they wanted to correct a press fuck up then it would have been just as easy for Charlie to log in and make a quick post or any other number of actions that could have been done... rather than waiting for the State of California to say "Hold the fuck on..."

If it truly was a fuck up the Charlie should be here up in arms for the California and New York customers who just got fucked by the press major MAJOR fuck up, but he's not... hasn't made a post since OCT 2014 and he pops back over here to inform us of a secret Coinbase lair with ninjas guarding it and complain at someone for not supporting the "silver of Crypto" any more.  Roll Eyes
legendary
Activity: 812
Merit: 1002

D:  Why they didn't use some of that 112 Million dollars to cushion the bid price AT ALL?  We free fell $50+ dollars at opening blast off with 0 resistance... Cryptsy has more attractive bids! (No offense horus <3)

E:  Why they use a fake mail address company?


I generally do agree with you, but these points I don't. They can't just use VC funds to pump BTC price. It might temporarily work, but eventually market will just correct itself. Instead, those VC funds are better spent for expansion and building up the company. Long term effects wins over superficial price rise any day.

And there's very little reason to visit the physical location where the employees do work. What would that accomplish that communications online or phone can't do? As mentioned, they would open themselves up for safety concerns. I'm sure there are plenty of angry people (some of which are willing to express their anger in person) from canceled transactions or being completely denied of using Coinbase's services.


Personally, I could care less if their work space was known or not, as long as they don't pull a mtgox. I only need to know that my funds are safe. Speaking of which, where can I verify that my fiat on there is indeed FDIC insured? And wouldn't that be great if insurance was also extended to BTC... yeah right  Roll Eyes
legendary
Activity: 3598
Merit: 2386
Viva Ut Vivas
I checked, they are licensed in 14 states.

That would make them a Licensed and Regulated exchange.

Where are they located?  (hint: California)

I would not get your hopes up on suing on the theory that it was that news that made the price go down from $300. People bought on rumor and sold on news. A 20+% rise in one day was bound to have a lot of sell off. I would have done the same had I not been traveling. No matter what the news was.

You could just as well blame the trolls in the Speculation forum for losing you money with their FUD. It is just as viable.

Did you even read the thread?

Anyways..

Price dumped the minute of Coinbases "launch" and Coinbase lead the way on the dump (their price dropped first and then everyone elses)

It wasn't news that dropped the price, but it was false news that raised it.

My suit won't be based on theories, it will be facts.  It is a 100% fact that I bought those contracts that night believing in my heart of hearts the news I read on the WSJ, CNBC and a number of other people that came from Coinbase.  California regulated and licences, On top of the huge news of securing $112 million, plus the NYSE helping with transparency and then they go for the Big Dirty via Rick Rolling folks.

Coinbase fucked up majorly. 

So Coinbase launched and the price dropped, then you bought on the news you read on WSJ?

What I saw was that there was rumor of Coinbase becoming an exchange, then the price went up over $300, then when they launched the price came back down to sane levels. Are you saying the news came out before the launch?

Do you have an article where Coinbase stated that they were licensed in California?

Technically they are a licensed and regulated exchange in California.
legendary
Activity: 3934
Merit: 1248
Owner at AltQuick.com
I checked, they are licensed in 14 states.

That would make them a Licensed and Regulated exchange.

Where are they located?  (hint: California)

I would not get your hopes up on suing on the theory that it was that news that made the price go down from $300. People bought on rumor and sold on news. A 20+% rise in one day was bound to have a lot of sell off. I would have done the same had I not been traveling. No matter what the news was.

You could just as well blame the trolls in the Speculation forum for losing you money with their FUD. It is just as viable.

Did you even read the thread?

Anyways..

Price dumped the minute of Coinbases "launch" and Coinbase lead the way on the dump (their price dropped first and then everyone elses)

It wasn't news that dropped the price, but it was false news that raised it.

My suit won't be based on theories, it will be facts.  It is a 100% fact that I bought those contracts that night believing in my heart of hearts the news I read on the WSJ, CNBC and a number of other people that came from Coinbase.  California regulated and licences, On top of the huge news of securing $112 million, plus the NYSE helping with transparency and then they go for the Big Dirty via Rick Rolling folks.

Coinbase fucked up majorly. 
legendary
Activity: 3598
Merit: 2386
Viva Ut Vivas
I checked, they are licensed in 14 states.

That would make them a Licensed and Regulated exchange.

Where are they located?  (hint: California)

I would not get your hopes up on suing on the theory that it was that news that made the price go down from $300. People bought on rumor and sold on news. A 20+% rise in one day was bound to have a lot of sell off. I would have done the same had I not been traveling. No matter what the news was.

You could just as well blame the trolls in the Speculation forum for losing you money with their FUD. It is just as viable.
legendary
Activity: 3934
Merit: 1248
Owner at AltQuick.com
You can prove you lost $200,000 here?

I'm not here getting my troll on... I wish I was as cool that cool though.



Plenty of other ones, but that makes me sick enough for now.

Accounts equity was above 420 BTC the minute before Coinbase's exchange launched to save BTC via "Licensed and Regulated in the state of California".

I bought that evening because Coinbase released news that was a lie.  I would still be thinking they where regulated had I not read saw the State of California's consumer warning.... (and I guess Charlies post 8 hours later)

The US is one of the most litigious places on Earth. This kind of thing was bound to happen, once corporations started trying to 'mainstream' Bitcoin

Flat out fucking lying and spreading news that damages fellow country people is probably not a good way to go 'mainstream' and not a bad thing to stay on top of.

Thank god the State of California even go around to using a alert.  

Glad to see my tax dollars work.
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1116
If they have at least one license, and they (like all businesses) are regulated. Then they are a Regulated and Licensed exchange.

Did someone at Coinbase claim anything more than that?

They obviously got the news from somewhere.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/102367943

http://www.wsj.com/articles/first-u-s-bitcoin-exchange-set-to-open-1422221641

http://huntnewsnu.com/2015/01/first-regulated-bitcoin-exchange-opens-in-the-u-s/

And then Sad...

California State government people released a statement:

https://i.imgur.com/lSanSFb.jpg

http://www.zdnet.com/article/regulator-refutes-coinbase-exchange-regulation-claims/

Edit:

Glanced over Coinbases news section and it appears a WSJ post is there too, but I can't read to see if it says California.

https://www.coinbase.com/press which links to http://www.wsj.com/articles/first-u-s-bitcoin-exchange-set-to-open-1422221641

You can prove you lost $200,000 here?
legendary
Activity: 3934
Merit: 1248
Owner at AltQuick.com
If they have at least one license, and they (like all businesses) are regulated. Then they are a Regulated and Licensed exchange.

Did someone at Coinbase claim anything more than that?

They obviously got the news from somewhere.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/102367943

http://www.wsj.com/articles/first-u-s-bitcoin-exchange-set-to-open-1422221641

http://huntnewsnu.com/2015/01/first-regulated-bitcoin-exchange-opens-in-the-u-s/

And then Sad...

California State government people released a statement:

https://i.imgur.com/lSanSFb.jpg

http://www.zdnet.com/article/regulator-refutes-coinbase-exchange-regulation-claims/

Edit:

Glanced over Coinbases news section and it appears a WSJ post is there too, but I can't read to see if it says California.

https://www.coinbase.com/press which links to http://www.wsj.com/articles/first-u-s-bitcoin-exchange-set-to-open-1422221641  which of course you have to pay for to read or have a account or some shit... *shakes head*
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