Topic: Scammed by Trustdice (Account banned and money confiscated) - page 3. (Read 1553 times)

Why are you ignoring me? why do not you answer? I apply, I apply, but you do not answer, why do you avoid communicating with me? Why don't you answer me directly to my mail, why are you silent?
https://imgur.com/a/QB9ZtAM

And to Poika5,


It has been 4 days since you first claimed to file complaints on AskGamblers and CasinoGuru, but we still can't find anything on either site. You have brought up the subject numerous times, but not actually doing it.

We in fact look forward to resolve our differences through a third-party arbitrator because it will allow us to confirm or deny our suspicion.


In another thread, you are instructing another user to do it, while yourself stay idle.


Anyone reading this case might wonder why you still haven't filed a complaint, despite actively discussing it and telling other people to do it. Is there something you are trying to hide? Is there something you really don't want the arbitrator to see? Or that you are aware, given the evidence documented from your account, an arbitrator will almost certainly support our position?

Anyone reading this case might wonder why you are more interested in arguing here than doing what would benefit you more? If you did nothing wrong and have nothing to hide, it is of your best interest to seek intervention of reputation arbitrators e.g. AskGamblers and CasinoGuru because they will likely support you, as yourself implied.


We are very confused. We cannot spend unlimited time on a single case where the other side shows no willingness of resolution. So if you decide to move forward, we look forward to seeing you there. Otherwise, we can only wish you a splendid day ahead.


TrustDice Team

Hi holydarkness,

I mean absolutely no disrespect, but I am afraid we have to refute some false accusation here, which I am sure you did not do deliberately.

Many replies before I have already directly answered why the OP's account was banned:

Perhaps I should have provided more details to prevent anyone from overlooking it. Unfortunately, such details, once shared or even vaguely suggested by an explanation, will encourage further abuse especially when the suspected abuser is actively monitoring this thread.

So let me expand on what I already have said (The details are not mentioned to avoid jeopardizing our anti-abuse detection system) :
We found OP's account had been acting in a manner that's impossible for an ordinary human player and its various signals shall be considered abnormalities for an ordinary human player. And all of such data have been well documented.

Hope this helps.

Thank you.
TrustDice Team

And if you read my post carefully, you'll understand that I am not demanding you to give detailed info about why their account got banned, just the reason, mentioned in a direct and clear answer. If you read through this whole sub-boards, you'll see that there are a lot of users complaining about similar issues with other casino or exchange or other business entity. Some cases, the casino did a misjudgment and the situation solved through exchange of evidences. Some cases, the accusers actually tried to fool people and proven to be guilty after each side gave their side of story. While some other cases, the platform did dirty things, and exposed through series of questions where they can't give concrete evidences to back up their claim.

I'm not saying OP is right and you're scamming them, there's even a possibility that they're a multi-acc abuser and the KYC they offered is a bluff, or fake ones. But there's also possibilities where you misunderstood them, or cheated them.

This is why we all are here right now, to see and prove which story is actually a truth.

And about being much better than what a lot of other casinos do by providing the clauses being triggered, I'll invite you to read several threads of issues with casinos on this sub-board, there are several casinos that go to a length to solve the issues and clear their name by cooperating. Not only they specify the reason so it can be discussed and reviewed, they also gave counter-evidence to back up their claim and get to the bottom of the issue, so err... yeah, you're actually not that much better than you imagined. This one for good example and comparison.

I'm not threatening you here, just giving a simple words from my observation, but by refusing to specify the reason like this, you actually cast an impression that you're the one being wrong here. Anyone reading this case would probably think like me, that if you have nothing to hide and sure that OP is an abuser, you'll be more than happy to provide --at the very least-- the reason why they're being banned. They offered you to complete KYC and you --unless you have an evidence that OP's claim and screenshot is not true-- banned them instead, and then just after the situation escalated to this forum you asked for KYC. If you ask me, it's kinda looks fishy. Lest it be too late and a flag raised and stir a lot of unnecessary inconvenience like the other case OP had in the past.

I see that you "have money", yeah.
1. You are scammers who do not answer e-mails, do not provide clarifications and do not want to resolve the issue.
2. In my thread, you stopped responding and getting in touch, just like real scammers.
3. I gave you permission to provide my personal data to prove that I violated, however, you did not give any evidence that I was an infringer.
4. In my thread, they sent evidence that I did not make a late game, but you claimed that I bet on it, again a hoax.
   I don't know how can you behave like this? I played honestly, I trusted your casino, I bet a lot with you, but I didn’t think that this would happen to me if I knew that you behave this way .... corny don’t answer the players ... I would just didn't play you. Why didn't you write to me after manual withdrawals? "Man, we don't really like what you're doing, please withdraw the money and don't come here again", why do you need to pull to the last and wait until there is a large balance on your account to confiscate it? Only geeks do that.

Hi holydarkness,


Please kindly understand that as per our Terms & Conditions, we are under no obligation to provide excessive details to a user who's been banned for his or her violation of the T&C. As far as we know, no such law exists in Curacao, or any other countries.

In fact, when an account got banned, providing the clauses being triggered, which is what we do, is the already much better than what a lot of other casinos do. Lots of other casinos would simply tell the player there is a T&C violation and that's it. This should be no news to you if you are a player yourself.

This is the industry's standard practice because of 2 reasons:
1. a detailed explanation will require not only manpower but also someone who is more senior and experienced, thus a significant operation cost. A casino will have to weaken its RTP/Odds to cover such cost, which in the end hurt users and ruins the business;
2. banned accounts are often abusers, and abusers abuse by looking for the hole in a casino's anti-abuse mechanism. Giving the details to banned accounts will inevitably provide needed insights to abusers, who will then further exploit based on their newly gained knowledge.

We provide T&C clauses triggered because we do care about the player's experiences, even when the player is likely an abuser. But unfortunately this is already the best we can do as a business, unless one day the majority of players start to favor a lower RTP/Odds in exchange for a detailed explanation when being banned (which don't happen for most players), and casino abusers disappear for good from the internet.

We will deeply appreciate your understanding.


Thank you.
TrustDice Team

Ahh, I see. Yes, I'll openly admit that there is a major misunderstanding from my side. The way your team explained to OP on email suggested that their account is banned due to insider info --why else would you mention this point on email if that is not the reason or related at any degree to their account freezing-- and I take that it's far from it, then? OP's account is not suspected of insider info?

Would you elaborate more on the reason? You can't give evidences due to the backlash you received on previous case, okay, arguably understandable, but certainly a casino --or any business entity-- should inform their user the reason of the banning so their user could defend themselves with proper evidence?

From what we can take from the email, the possible reasons are (1) misconduct, (2) insider info, (3) multi-alt abuse, or (4) a breach in TnC.

I think we can safely cross reason number (2) based on your own statement, and (3) because if OP is multiacc-ing, they'll quite reluctant to do KYC instead of offering them. So, point number (1) which would need you to to explain which misconduct is it because the term is very wide, or point (4) that's even more vague and widely open for misinterpretation.

I'd like to say OP raised a good point, they've offered to willingly perform KYC and you cut their way by freezing their account instead, for no clear reason if I may add. So certainly we can agree that they reserve a good degree of caution upon who they submit their info to. So, maybe all we need right now is for you to give a good gesture and tell us why you banned them in the first place. After all, as you said yourself, you have your reputation to maintain. So I think explaining why they're banned is not only a cheap price to pay for OP to do KYC and you to maintain your reputation, but also your duty on the first place.

You still didnt answer the question, why did Trustdice ban me before the KYC?

Good to know, i started a complaint(Askgamblers). Hopefully Trustdice will respect Askgamblers decision/judgement.


Try and look at this from my perspective, i was unfairly banned & my money was stolen.
Why would i send my personal information to casino/thieves who stole from me?

Hi holydarkness,


We appreciate your questions.


I am afraid there is a major misunderstanding here. As I previously stated:
So when I discussed about insider info above, I was simply answering your question about the T&C clause related to insider info. Such explanation has no direct relevance to the OP's case, or any specific cases. It was just to explain the clause.


Prior to the ban, our Risk Management team have found substantial abnormalities surrounding the OP's account and other suspicious behaviors. This means we found OP's account had been acting in a manner that's impossible for an ordinary human player and its various signals shall be considered abnormalities for an ordinary human player. And all of such data have been well documented. (edit: longer explanation added to highlight and avoid being overlooked)
However, kindly note that our updated internal policies forbid us from sharing such details in public forums, unless particularly authorized by our management and approved by the player. This is for both privacy and anti-abuse concerns. In fact, for the sake of open and transparent communication with Bitcointalk community, we had shared such details on the forum in the past, which did get us quite some compliments. However such transparency was later exploited by abusers who saw it. As a result, our marketing team has received criticism internally.
We have no problem sharing such details to a 3rd party arbitrator.


As you may have noticed on this forum, plenty of forum members have been using our platform for a long time and have no trouble playing and withdrawing. Some of them are high level users like you, with Legendary or Hero badge. In this regard, I recommend you to post a thread on Gambling sub forum to inquire what most gamblers on this forum have experienced so far.
Truth to be told, we spend much more money doing marketing on this forum than the amount being discussed in this case. As one of the established crypto casinos, and an operator who has been in this market since 2018, we have no reason to arbitrarily ban users just because he or she wins. We have more money to make in maintaining our reputation as a reliable casino and sportsbook.
With regard to "is TrustDice legit", we have prepared a page dedicated to this question. You can also take a look at the chatroom on the right to see for yourself. And TrustDice is also pretty much the best rated crypto casino on TrustPilot.



All in all, we strongly encourage OP to complete KYC procedure as requested, otherwise there is not much we (aka the marketing department) can assist at the moment. We do our best to assist every player, but if a player refuses to assist himself, our hands are tied.


Best,
TrustDice Team

To be fair, actually, you are kinda agreed to submit documents for KYC purpose if they ask you for it, written on their TnC.


Thank you for the link, I've actually read and familiarize myself with them before writing my post. And although it is true that by the TnC your user are agreeing on a clause where they have to submit KYC if needed, your explanation did not exactly answered my question. But if I may infer from your seemingly deliberate vague answer, you banned their account because they had suspicious behavior --i.e. insider info-- and thus you feel you need to check their ID? Then why did your team still froze OP's account although they already offered to complete KYC?

And let's take one step backward here on the reason itself, can you provide evidences that became the basis of this suspicion? Have you studied OP's account closely and have solid proof before freezing it or were you just ban-first-ask-later? How do we know that it is not a foul play by your platform, that you didn't just invent the situation and you won't use the same reason for other user(s) in the future?

You also wrote me the reason for the blocking. So you want to say that I was born in Kaliningrad, Russia, I am 23 years old, and I am a former professional American football player? I played basketball in the NBA? I played in Euroleagues? What nonsense are you talking about? How can such a thing even come to mind? I have scoliosis 3rd degree, and the arm does not bend completely, and I am a professional NBA player? It's just laughter.

10minutes before i got banned, i asked the support if they want to finish the KYC.
Instead Trustdice decided to ban me, and ignore my emails.



You just confessed that Trustdice decided to ban me without any real proof/confidence.
I appreciate it.

Hello holydarkness,

KYC is needed in this circumstance based on our T&C and it is imperative for a comprehensive evaluation of the situation. In the absence of it, I am afraid it will be impossible for us to comment on what might have happened with confidence, or provide any further assistance.

(Note: This is not related to this case in discussion here) Most definitely not. "personal involvement" here typically means
- the player himself or herself and individuals who are connected to the player and therefore have access to the internal info, or even able to influence the outcome of the game;
- personal presence on the field of play during the game;

18.1. Without restricting our ability to rely on other remedies that may be available to us, we may suspend and/or terminate your account, cancel any outstanding bets and/or confiscate any or all funds in your account at our absolute discretion if:
* We determine that you are using TrustDice.win in a manner that gives you an unfair advantage, for example making bets on insight or professional knowledge about a sport gained via personal involvement or participation in the particular field of sport or using the late bets strategy;

However this clause would most likely be triggered if you were in discussion with your old pal who is inside the team and paid him to access information that most people don't know about. The same applies if your old pal pays you to bet with his internal info. Unfortunately, crypto sports books like ours attract insider betting these days.

Thank you.
TrustDice Team

They are saying i broke one of these rules, unfortunately Coinbox1 wont specify the exact reason for the ban.

I think either
1. He genuinely doesnt know.
2. The reason is too absurd/embarrassing, and hes afraid of the negative feedback.

I already exposed his lies in this other thread, so he might be a little scared of me.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/trustdicewin-upd-trustdice-scam-2138-usdt-confiscated-solved-5425888

For OP, Poika5, can you provide the email you mentioned on your opening post as oart of your evidence in screenshot instead of just quoted text? It'll be more reliable that way.

---

For Coinbox1, I don't think I understand the situation correctly, so please enlighten us. First, was OP's account banned because of the reason he mentioned on the quoted email --the unfair advantage-- or because they're yet to fulfill the KYC TnC?

Second, I'll assume for now that the quoted text from OP is legit and originated from your email to them, as below,


Were you saying that an educated guess in your sportsbetting is not allowed? Suppose I'm a retired professional soccer player who spent his time compiling data and player's statistics, then analyze them and guessed the strategy their coach will utilize based on my prior experience as a professional player, and I won. This is illegal?

---

edit: tidying up the quoted post

They also asked me for a KYC, and after that they banned me, why is it needed then? not the fact that they will unban after passing the KYC

1. The reason for my ban / Or A public apology from Trustdice representative.
2. Will you unban me if i finish the KYC?

Please kindly answer ASAP.

Hello Poika5,

I learned from our Compliance team that a KYC request has been sent to you. Please kindly complete the KYC procedure via email ASAP.

Thank you
TrustDice Team

Got this email(KYC) from Trustdice.

@Coinbox1
1. Why did i get banned? Its been +24 hours.
2. Will you unban me if i finish the KYC?

That's a good thing to do and worth a praise, but if you really deserve your win there should be no condition because you've won it fairly, you are putting Trustdice in an unfavorable decision because of the condition, so let them grant you your winning based on fairness not because there's a condition attached to it that might influence the outcome of the results after you receive your winning because you deserve then proceed to donate and you'll have our praise.
Future scammers might use this kind of condition just to force casinos to have their money coming from fraud.